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10:00 AM
@thepiercingarrow no
it's literally an assert with a message
 
nwp
@thepiercingarrow have you heard of assert?
it even does neat popups and occasionally opens the debugger
 
for one fprintf is terrible
 
@BartekBanachewicz oh yeah?
 
also yes breaking the program is better than exiting it
Also I'm not really a fan of such assertions
typically they should be unit tests
littering the code with sanity checks typically means the code has other, deeper problems
 
They're executable documentation
 
nwp
10:03 AM
also if you have makesurethat(foo == bar) you want it to print the values of foo and bar, but assert doesn't do that either
 
hmm.
Yes I just read the assert man page.
 
nwp
people use assert_equal(foo, bar) for that
 
I mean the idea behind asserts is that they are going to be disabled in release mode
 
You can just break into the debugger and inspect them
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, not if you just exit the program
 
10:04 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes eh, I'd rather commit debugger breakpoint list as a separate file I guess
 
That's why assert calls abort
 
break into debugger ... and steal the ram info?
 
well okay such a breakpoint list would deactualize
 
@Telkitty bruised ribs are nothing to sneeze at
 
@nwp No manual entry for assert_equal
 
10:05 AM
dunno
 
@BartekBanachewicz lolwut
That's a maintenance nightmare
 
nwp
@thepiercingarrow those are usually part of unit test frameworks and also may have a different name
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes NOT IF WE HAD AST CODE STORAGE OKAY
(actually it's irrelevant)
 
asserts are close to the code, and unlike comments, are likely to be noticed if the code goes out of sync
 
@sehe braised ribs ... umm
 
10:07 AM
the problem I guess is that people are gonna misuse them
 
yum yum
 
like I often see assertions on null pointers
 
@Telkitty that's unhygienic to sneeze at
 
I hope you are drooling now
Internet makes me happy, I will never be able to quit the internet
 
@BartekBanachewicz what?
 
10:12 AM
> error: user-defined operator '&&' in constraint '((bool)((![…snip…])) && <expression error>)'
new and exciting unhelpful errors
 
new and exciting syntax horrifics
 
pretend it’s ((bool)!foo)
 
Ven
Luc Danton Bool
 
@Ven and how
 
Does anyone want a keybase invite?
 
10:14 AM
@thepiercingarrow void f(void* p) { assert(p); ... }
 
I had a fully shitty day - realised domain name is still stolen, electricity separation for the new house just built was done wrong (on the paper, wiring was alright), leaking pipes/connections to be taken care of, dealing with a certifier who took the whole payment and is not doing its job, a narrow minded friend, found out eye sight might got worse
 
@Telkitty Your domain name was stolen?
 
yes
 
@thepiercingarrow trade you for nine.
 
But I will get everything sorted one way or another (unless die first)
 
10:17 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes What?
@Telkitty is it like that donald trump stole jeb bush's domain thing?
 
@thepiercingarrow I have nine
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes keybase invites?
 
Long story, web admin registered domain under his name after took registration fee from me.
then wouldn't respond to any of my emails
 
Anyone played around with kbfs?
 
10:20 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes how? I only had 8 when I started...
 
Awesomeness
 
@Telkitty who? you can start ruining their reputation by telling all of us.
What is your keybase?
 
I'm guessing newer members get fewer invites
 
What? They just took your website? jaja thats so funny XD
 
I am going to redirect it to telkitty.com.au which I got today
telkitty.com is worthless, give it back NOW!!!
 
Ven
10:22 AM
Tant va la cruche à l'.au
@LucDanton
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I got refills. I have 15 left :)
 
@Telkitty s/worse/worth/g
 
@thepiercingarrow rmf
 
Ven
can we unpin the nice puns pls
 
@thepiercingarrow thank you, too angry now
 
10:23 AM
@sehe me too, but down to 9
 
@Ven done
 
Ven
thanks :)
 
Can someone explain to me how the keybase filesystem thing works?? Can't make heads or tails out of it.
 
@Telkitty It's so worthless, I DEMAND I GET IT
 
I have a headache
 
10:24 AM
Now now, you started shouting
 
@thepiercingarrow the docs are pretty clear.
 
What does it mean if you track someone?
Wait did you mean priceless or worthless?
 
@thepiercingarrow I think they explain that in the manual
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not really. Do I have to mkdir /keybase/ or something? Do I have to ssh into somewhere?
 
10:25 AM
I did RTFM it doesn't explain it.
 
it does
you're bad at reading manuals
 
Okay am I reading the wrong man page?
 
> This page is just a sampler. Download the Keybase app and use the built-in help:
man pages are worthless crap for the most part
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Did I track you? (making sure I got the right person)
 
nwp
> `void GUI_FillPolygon(const GUI_POINT * pPoints, int NumPoints, int x0, int y0);`
What would one expect `x0` and `y0` to do? WTB a manual :(
 
10:27 AM
The assailant, armed with a knife and an ax
 
@nwp probably the center coordinates
 
a knife and an ax, wow wow there ....
 
The GUI doesn't work for my OS X version, so I'm using the command-line. Does that make a difference?
 
@nwp offset for the point cloud
@thepiercingarrow The web interface is crossplatform
 
10:28 AM
@thepiercingarrow no. You just read and write to the folders
 
is telkitty.com working for anyone?
 
@Telkitty Me.
 
nwp
@Telkitty yup
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes WHAT folders.
 
thanks
 
10:29 AM
Public folders are browsabel at keybase.pub
@thepiercingarrow the ones the docs mention.
 
do you see a blog or my old app website? @thepiercingarrow @nwp
 
Public ones are for signing content, private ones are for encrypted content.
 
it wasn't working so I redirected to telkitty.com.au for a little while
 
@Telkitty I get "Telkitty digital"
 
10:30 AM
@thepiercingarrow keybase.io/docs/kbfs
 
@thepiercingarrow thanks
 
@BartekBanachewicz I know I was reading that exact page. But where does that /keybase/ directory come from in the first place? Whenever I try the example commands it says (expectedly) dir not found.
 
@thepiercingarrow It's literally the second paragraph.
@thepiercingarrow Update keybase, perhaps?
 
nwp
@Telkitty that one
 
@nwp cool
 
10:32 AM
@thepiercingarrow did you follow the installation guide
 
macbook:usaco max$ brew upgrade keybase
Error: keybase 1.0.16 already installed
Hmm maybe I have to pull request the brew repository...
@BartekBanachewicz What is your keybase?
 
The brew build doesn't ship kbfs.
 
@thepiercingarrow it's like my nick everywhere
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes when I go to the downloads page it tells me "This version of OS X currently isn't supported." I guess I'll have to wait :(
 
nwp
@BartekBanachewicz you were right
 
10:42 AM
It is a bad idea to track everyone I meet on SO (on keybase) ?
@BartekBanachewicz You are a polish haskell enthusiast?
 
you should track people you're likely to cooperate with or need to message
@thepiercingarrow I'm a Polish sad person (i.e. a software developer)
 
Okay oops lemme untrack everyone...
 
I need more water. And then more water again.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't see why.
 
What does it mean if "they're a software developer who might sign code" ?
 
10:46 AM
Older tracks are better than new ones.
 
Seriously, it shouldn't be 35°C around here, even though it's summer.
 
The earlier you track, the most useful the feature is.
 
There are people who go around signing people's code?
 
@thepiercingarrow What you running?
Works on my machine (El Capitan).
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Mavericks
 
10:49 AM
@thepiercingarrow I sign all my GitHub commits.
 
Got it last year
@R.MartinhoFernandes How do you do that?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Where do you put your gitconfig?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes eh I'd do that but effort
 
10:53 AM
@BartekBanachewicz What effort? I just git commit normally.
It takes five minutes, and happens once in a lifetime.
 
I meant key storage
 
The effort to edit his config maybe?
 
keybase has my private key
I'd need another one specifically for commit signing
 
@thepiercingarrow ~/.gitconfig is global; $REPO/.git/config if you want it to be repo-specific.
 
@thepiercingarrow just use git config vOv
 
10:55 AM
@BartekBanachewicz Wait, are you saying that if you choose that, there are no local copies of it?
 
I just realized that there isn't any new keyword in either C++14 nor C++17. That's pretty impressive considering that keywords have been seriously proposed for at least concepts, coroutines, transactional memory and reflection.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes none that I am aware of
 
@BartekBanachewicz Just try gpg --list-keys.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Okay I added those 2 lines to my config. Now what?
 
I don't have gpg on any of my machines
well okay I have it here but it's empty
not sure about the laptop
 
10:56 AM
Keybase comes with it, no?
 
I don't use installed keybase
I only use the web version
 
Also, you can tell git to run keybase instead.
@BartekBanachewicz ...
 
what
I try to keep as little sensitive local data as possible
if I store anything locally that I need I'm gonna sync it to the cloud anyway
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No I think you have to separately install it (gpg isn't a dependency)
 
@BartekBanachewicz Keybase does that.
 
10:58 AM
My policy is that a device loss should mean absolutely 0 data loss
@R.MartinhoFernandes welp, maybe I'll install it today
 
Losing a device is the perfect way to lose data that you didn't want to keep but never managed to delete because you're sentimental.
 
@Morwenn so true
 
@Morwenn I have a separate backup for sentimental data
 
Burning your house works the same way for physical items.
 
except keeping sentimental data is pretty much free
 
11:02 AM
@BartekBanachewicz Also, YubiKey.
 
> The opportunity is with a well-known company that is making exciting waves in the tech world with the software that they produce; certainly a well-known name within the tech community in Cambridge! They’ve being described as the best company to work for in the area, too, with a great working environment, who put their people at the forefront of the business. They also pay quite generously, as well.
 
throw it in a zip with 20% extra check data, encrypt, post to Glacier
done
 
I don't even know if this is scam or not
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Eh it's annoying to have it plugged in to a laptop constantly just to be able to commit; I don't have a dock here
@Columbo probably not
 
"They have being described"?
 
11:03 AM
@BartekBanachewicz No, I mean I assume you don't backup your YubiKey secret (because, well, you can't; it's write-only), and this is on par with that.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yes okay that's a notable exception
I also don't back up secrets on my phone
cue my last phone :P
 
Good thing I deleted all the nudes before my phone got stolen.
 
(Actually, you can; I have a backup YubiKey, but I cannot make any other because I need to generate the clones at the same time as the original)
 
@Morwenn who cares what was on it? if it's encrypted it doesn't really matter
of course assuming your phone doesn't use your unlock pattern for encryption key password
 
I have no idea.
 
11:08 AM
phone encryption is pretty sketchy anyway
I think not using the pattern lock is a good first step
unless you are sure that the other password is used for encryption
 
I generally have no idea how security works (apart from some extremely basic stuff).
 
security doesn't "work"
security is a property
 
You know what I mean, duh. Don't needlessly play on words.
 
@BartekBanachewicz What's so bad about the pattern lock?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes remember my last attempt to crack my phone? I found a reddit thread that showed that some phones transcribe your lock into a series of digits and use as a key passcode
 
11:15 AM
So?
 
if you have such a phone, it's trivial for the attacker to attempt say all patterns up to 5 or 6 dots
it's 6!
 
Wait, what?
@BartekBanachewicz That would only be true if there were only six dots.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes most people have 4-6
 
@BartekBanachewicz No, I mean total dots.
 
oh sorry
it's 9!/(9-6)!
which is still really small
I mean hell 9! is ~300k
 
11:18 AM
My phone does 49 dots.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh right some phones have more
but most of them have 9 IIRC
that's what stock android does as well
@R.MartinhoFernandes but then I assume your phone has another password for encryption anyway
 
Yeah but that's the same criticism as for having short passwords.
Like four digit PINs.
 
sure, if 4-digit pin is used for encryption it's also bad
also there's still this silly hole in KeyMaster
 
@BartekBanachewicz I'd have to take a closer look, so far I've been following the ones from Intel
 
11:39 AM
@Borgleader BTW why do you want to learn Vulkan? Just to get closer to the GPU, or do you have plans to use it?
 
Ell
The sun is so goos
 
goose? :p
 
Ell
XD good :P
 
what
what's XD good
eXtra D good?
 
11:50 AM
x = ><
 
@Ven eh I dunno
 
If a guy's best friend is gay, how likely that I could convince him that he is gay as well?
 
sure that 3310 was durable
but it was also awfully limited
frankly my biggest gripe with phones is battery life
oh apparently you can buy hydrogen fuel cells already
 
If I could convince this guy that he's gay, then I have found a long term bushwalking/hiking buddy
 
Kraftwerk is "to be delivered August 2017"
 
11:56 AM
because I would rather him to stay as a buddy then be romantically linked
 
Ven
Don't worry kitty, your face is the best contraceptive you'll ever have.
8
 
@BartekBanachewicz Both
 
do what if someone put a paper bag over my head, then I would still be in danger?
 
oh hmm this thing appears to be for sale though
 
12:05 PM
going for jog
 
@BartekBanachewicz where you the guy who went from geek stuff to expensive stuff buyer?
 
@ChemiCalChems lol yes
I still buy some geek stuff though
 
@BartekBanachewicz if it's expensive, i assume
 
@ChemiCalChems "expensive" is a relative term
 
@BartekBanachewicz more than average price
 
12:09 PM
@ChemiCalChems average price of what
 
@ChemiCalChems Under a normal distribution half the prices are above average.
Not a great deal of information conveyed by that definition.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes for me that is what expensive means
 
do you really mean "all things one could possibly buy ever"?
that's so meaningless
 
When I compile printf("%03d", 7) with MinGW and -std=c99 it just prints 7. Anyone know what the deal is here?
 
@BartekBanachewicz no no, in the same category
 
12:15 PM
in what category
 
and i'm talking about the relationship between price and quality
any
this charger is expensive because it only charges 1 phone at 0,5 A but is 50 bucks
 
but it's chemical
that's the point
 
@BartekBanachewicz ?
 
what charger are you talking about
 
@BartekBanachewicz any fucking charger, i'm generalizing
it's an example
take a random charger
 
12:17 PM
you're super bad at examples
 
compared to the rest, it's more expensive if it does less for the same price, or it does the same for more price
 
@ChemiCalChems that has nothing to do with "expensive"
 
yes it does
 
no, not really
 
you would be willing to pay a lot for something good without saying it's expensive
 
12:18 PM
there are cheap things with superb price/quality ratio
and there are expensive things with superb price/quality ratio
 
exactly
 
it's orthogonal
 
the better the quality price ratio, the cheaper it is in my definition
 
then your definition sucks
 
you have a mansion for 2 buks
CHEAP AS FUCK
you have a piece of candy for 2 bucks
EXPENSIVE AS FUCK
 
12:19 PM
that's comparing apples to oranges
 
yet it's the same price
 
no wait that's comparing candy to mansions which is even dumber
what are you even on about
 
@ChemiCalChems What if it's made of truffles?
 
i'm saying being expensive is dictated for the quality / features of the object / service you are willing to buy, not only by it's price
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's another case
 
@ChemiCalChems Not really, unless your previous definition also assumes that quality is the same across.
 
12:20 PM
what i'm trying to convey is that my bad quality headset costing 20 dollars, is about average
 
@ChemiCalChems I'd say "expensive" only relates to relative price.
and that's all.
 
if they sold tritton headsets for that price they'd be cheap
 
@ChemiCalChems The average price has nothing to do with that, though.
 
if they sold earplugs for that price, it'd be expensive
 
12:21 PM
What if they're custom made?
 
@BartekBanachewicz relative price to elements in the same category, as a function of quality
 
no, not really
cue sennheiser ie800
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes that would be one more feature, which increases the value of them
 
@ChemiCalChems no, there's no quality involved in this at all
 
@ChemiCalChems And again, the average price has nothing to do with that.
 
12:22 PM
things that are expensive cost more than products in the same category (which is a very broad term)
by changing the category you can change the average price and thus the classification
 
@BartekBanachewicz but you would be willing to pay for a more expensive product if it's of better quality
 
still nothing to do with quality
@ChemiCalChems doesn't make it less expensive
A premium, expensive product I am willing to pay for is still an expensive product.
 
@BartekBanachewicz yes it does, cause if you compare it with its brothers (products of the same category and quality) you could decide whether is cheaper or more expensive than avergae
@BartekBanachewicz i'm talking personally here
 
@ChemiCalChems You only need to compare prices to know that.
 
i don't buy solely based on price or quality, but a combination of both
 
12:24 PM
@ChemiCalChems Now your definition has just blurred down to "things I think cost too much".
 
@ChemiCalChems do you mean that you're using your own personal definitions of words by saying "personally"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes possibly
 
@ChemiCalChems sure, but that's also irrelevant
 
Which kinda is what everyone else seems to use, just for different Is.
@BartekBanachewicz Everyone is.
Cue Humpty Dumpty.
 
ok you win, i don't know how to define words, and the current definition of expensive doesn't convince me
now kill me
it's hard to argue with intelligent people when you are used to dealing with dumb people
it's the first time in some time that i feel this rush of OH FUCK WHAT DO I SAY NOW
thanks guys
do i lose karma or kudos for losing a discussion?
am i regarded as being dumber?
 
12:51 PM
@ChemiCalChems Youre supposed to drag us down to your level and beat us with experience ;)
 
@Borgleader lol
 

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