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6:00 PM
I'm also uncertain about how to install ncurses on Windows.
 
@Xeo Did you come across that randomly? I don't usually follow ycombinator/HackerNews.
 
This is what it looks like :)
 
A bunny?
 
The screenshot looks like a bunny.
…that is standing.
 
6:07 PM
It's an @ (player) trapped inside #s (walls) and .s (floors).
 
lol
a bunny room
 
yeah
having significant troubles getting ncurses
 
They whiter portions are illuminated because the player carries a light source.
 
Looks more like a butterfly pedobear bunny to me.
 
cabal doesn't DL dependencies for you, so I had to download the c2hs module manually, and now it wants some C libraries and I doubt that cabal can do that
and I don't even know if those libs exist for/on Windows
 
6:09 PM
@DeadMG Hmm, yeah, I did have to install c2hs and ncurses myself too.
 
flying spaghetti monster?
 
right
going for c2hs and ncurses wasn't that big a deal, the problem is the C libraries
 
What libraries?
 
apparently, it wants "panel" and "ncursesw"
 
That's part of ncurses.
ncursesw is the unicode version.
 
6:11 PM
right
but cabal won't download them so I have no idea what I'm supposed to do now
what's the point in cabal offering packages for download when you can't actually download and install them?
if they have external dependencies it should be included
 
It only tracks Haskell packages.
 
which is quite worthless if those packages depend on C libraries which I don't have and have no idea how to get
 
Ιs it complaining about the .h's?
 
no
it just says "Missing C libraries: panel, ncursesw".
 
dlls?
@DeadMG Oh.
:S
Guess I'll have to install Windows on a VM to try this out myself.
 
6:20 PM
I wish that developer tools didn't treat their users so badly compared to other programs
 
I'm planning to implement a time travel mechanism. Only back in time. Everything in your current square gets moved. To avoid exploiting this to get infinite items (pick up item, go back, pick it again), having duplicates come close together results some loss condition related to paradoxes or some such.
 
I have a little question about just-in-time compilers. Do they just compile the code into machine code, put that in a buffer and jmp to the beginning of that buffer?
Just to get the basic idea of how they work.
 
Xeo
@Mysticial I follow the ycombinator
 
@daknok_t Something like that. Probably call instead of jmp, and the buffer needs to be created in executable pages, but that's the gist of it.
 
Very cool invention.
 
6:50 PM
I couldn't resist mentioning my range-based for loop abuse for locks here:
3
A: C++11: The range-based for statement: "range-init" lifetime?

R. Martinho Fernandes Is this reasoning correct? If not, why not? It is correct up until this point: And so the temporary return value of boo() is destroyed at the end of the statement "auto&&r=boo()" [...] Binding a temporary to a reference extends its lifetime to be that of the reference. So the t...

 
 
2 hours later…
8:36 PM
The room has been inactive for 1 whole hour?!
 
Same :)
 
I have a question about how to build a WPF program (Is it good practise to build my UI with minimal images and define things like shapes in the XAML?)
But where should I ask it? Programmers or SO?
OK :D
 
WPF is basically Microsoft's admission that "we don't have a clue about interface design. Here are the tools to do whatever you want. Go make some crazy guis"
so why ask? Just do what you like :D
also, WPF is more or less dead anyway
 
I think most "practices" questions are being put on PSE these days.
 
why would you use it?
 
8:49 PM
@jalf Err, Isn't Metro XAML or HTML?
 
yeah, and WPF is another approach to XAML
as is Silverlight
or rather
Metro uses XAML as a markup language to define GUI
as does WPF
but they're different things
 
How different is each approach?
 
WPF was basically a more freeform approach to conventional GUIs. Metro is, well, Metro
stylized rectangles and large uppercase text that's cut off here and there, and all touch friendly
so it's not so much the approaches that are different, but rather the end goals
both use XAML, but they use it to define different kinds of GUI
 
Ahh right I understand
I've just assumed XAML & WPF were basically interchangable
 
ah right
they're not :)
WPF is a full GUI library/API/framework/platform. XAML is just the markup language :)
well, it is XML
 
8:58 PM
Why was it so difficult to just create a decent GUI library from the beginning and stick to that?
for as far as GUI libraries can be decent.
"Oh, no, everything is a window!"
I'd rather eat cobwebs with flies on them all my life than creating GUIs for Windows.
 
It's only three days until March 14th. Cannot wait!
International π day, yes. :)
 
Some gross approximation of it, yes.
 
The THING is back
 
What thing?
 
9:10 PM
<-
 
@ScottW So her 42nd birthday is also on 3/14!
 
Left arrow?
 
look further to the left
 
End of screen.
 
facepalm
lol no Hoxieboy is back
 
9:10 PM
On the mobile version, it is.
 
You're a thing?
 
not A thing, THE thing
 
:P
 
I've almost got the entire dwarf fortress theme down on guitar, lol I have like 1/5 left of the song to learn
 
That's 20%.
 
9:13 PM
I can tell you learned math in school
 
@RMartinhoFernandes bitbucket.org/martinhofernandes (this one is on repos) bitbucket.org/eue (this one is on recent commits)
 
I learnt more math at home than at school. :P
 
I agree lol
 
I learnt more at home than at school.
 
Oh.
I guess I forgot about the first one.
 
9:14 PM
you guys should see the bipedal walker I'm working on XD I tried to make it walk today but it ended up hopping around and wasting all of its battery
 
I think I'll e-mail support to merge those.
 
"you guys should see" then post it on YouTube.
 
maybe pictures, the camera I have right now isn't good enough for vids :P
 
@Scott W you are not a compiler so don't complain about my grammar. :P
British English > American English
 
That's where debuggers come in hand
 
9:18 PM
@daknok_t Hey! The US has more nukes than Britain... :-P
 
@Mysticial That factors in how?
 
@Mystical how can you tell?
 
@DeadMG Τheir male genital organs are clearly bigger.
 
lol
 
rofl
naaaiss
time for some grapes, and cheese, and stuff
 
9:20 PM
Need some advice to design my magic item system.
 
omg cheese
 
@RMartinhoFernandes what are you working on?
 
fucking delicious
 
@Hoxieboy a magic item system.
 
9:21 PM
Why no cabal.
 
@daknokt for what, I'm looking at his bitbucket page
 
In the project, duh.
 
Because I never used it and I'm not taking the time to learn it now.
Maybe Sunday.
 
shits it needs NCurses, windows doesn't support that does it?
 
9:23 PM
cabal init, fill the template, done.
I like the bug where you start inside a wall.
 
Yeah, I put it there as a reminder for later.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes so the player ate a ring and shat it out and is now using it? I liek ur style
 
> cabal: journey.cabal:51: Construct not supported at this position: F 51
WTF is this?
 
An error message.
 
You borked something.
 
9:32 PM
No kidding.
I didn't put any F 51 there though. It complained about missing Main-Is, so I added it.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Left knee
 
9:45 PM
@CatPlusPlus Hmm, cabal init generates a borked .cabal file. Was missing a colon...
 
What colon?
 
After Executable.
 
There's no colon after Executable.
 
There is now. And it works.
I also get warnings about some section things and cabal >= 1.2, though, but I'm not bothering to investigate. Like I said, maybe Sunday.
 
9:47 PM
As is I can $ cabal install it.
Oh, indents.
 
@DeadMG configure the login screen
If that is too dense, lemme break it down:
Configure the damn login screen
 
Sweet, no more warnings. It could have complained about something other than "F 51".
Pushed.
Ok, so, like I was saying I need design advice. About the magical effect things.
 
Sockets and gems!
 
Reminds me of Diablo.
 
does that mean it might build on Windows?#
 
9:52 PM
You need ncurses. No way out of that.
Also, I thought ncurses was the portable library for this kind of thing, but I guess I was wrong :S
 
@DeadMG (in case you really wanted help, which you probably didn't because google would have told you), it is in the System/Administration menu, though I usually type in <Alt-F2>gnome-control-center<CR>login<CR> and be done
 
Hmm, Windows finished pirating. Time to install.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes ? windows pirates for you?
 
@sehe Wait, @DeadMG is using Linux?
 
what does it pirate
@RMartinhoFernandes He tried to, earlier, at least
 
9:54 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes For about ten minutes.
 
What happened?
 
@DeadMG World famous for his patience and eloquence
 
well, it was ridiculously unusable, so I deleted it.
 
Is 10GB enough for WinXP?
@DeadMG lol. I meant "what happened that led you to install it?"
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yep. I think you mean RAM :):):)
 
9:55 PM
my brother keeps bitching about those Android ROMs
 
@DeadMG I knew the answer to "what happened after ten minutes?" would be that.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Oh come on. All I tried to do was download the drivers for my GPU.
 
@sehe No, I mean disk space.
@DeadMG ATI?
 
nVidia
 
@DeadMG What stops you from bitching right back at him? Appears to me it would be your natural modus operandus
 
9:56 PM
Hmm, nVidia usually works fine.
 
nope
Ubuntu tried to open the file nVidia served me in a text editor
hardly the "double click and it installs itself" I was expectin
 
Hmm, nVidia gives executable .sh files.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Might have been a tad tricky due the fact that it was in a VBox...
@RMartinhoFernandes Take the packages from the repo. Get DKMS auto-upgrades with new kernels. Profit
 
@sehe Oh, in that case shouldn't he use some driver specific for vbox guests?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Nope. I got a .run file.
@RMartinhoFernandes Yeah, I realized afterwards that it wasn't going to work even if I could convince Ubuntu to execute the file.
 
9:59 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes Honestly wouldn't know. It seems a bit too tricky for my taste, since VBox obviously doesn't virtualize any particular brand of GPU
@DeadMG == executable shell script
 
Yup, nVidia driver wouldn't run.
 
@DeadMG Same thing. It's a shell script with binary data encoded in it. All it does is unpack itself.
 
then why won't Ubuntu execute it when I double click it?
 
You need VBox Guest Tools.
Probably doesn't have +x.
 
@DeadMG even Mac users are liberated enough to no longer think that the extension says what it must be.
@DeadMG Because you downloaded it as a non-executable file?
 
10:00 PM
@sehe Martinho just said it's an executable script. That's an executable file.
 
Nothing without executable permission bit is executable.
 
@DeadMG What is the difference. Why cannot a .run file contains text? Or a shell script? Just open it in an editor. Oh wait, you did :)
 
I'm the administrator, I have permission to execute things, and I said "Execute this file".
 
But Firefox, or whatever you used to download it didn't set its exectuable flag in the permissions.
 
so not executing the file is a defect
 
10:01 PM
@DeadMG No you didn't. You hoped you did but failed.
 
@sehe No, I just don't care about Ubuntu's execute flags. That's Ubuntu's problem.
did Firefox pop up and say "Why, sir, would you care to mark this file as legally executable?" No.
 
Even root can't execute things willy-nilly.
 
it's an executable file, I downloaded it, and then I requested it's execution. There's nothing more to be said or done.
 
Resembles people nagging about files copied from a CD/DVD backup shouldn't be readonly. Well, it's not the OS-es choice to make.
 
10:03 PM
oh
I finally found the button to make Windows shut up and do what I, the owner of the hardware and files in question, tell it to do
there's an obscure override button somewhere that I found and clicked
 
@DeadMG You disabled UAC. Meh
 
Damn, not enough space. Time to resize the filesystem.
 
@sehe No, that's completely not what I'm talking about.
 
Hi all
 
Hi @Benny
 
10:04 PM
Online resizing is awesome.
 
I'm happy to be back on the SE network :)
 
@DeadMG I had that suspicion, but since you enjoy painting 'smoke and mirrors' in our direction, I thought I'd take you up on the same level.
 
@sehe What are you talking about?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes The only caveat is that fragmentation might explode when the fs is near capacity and online resize usually requires a bit of scratch space in the source fs too
3 mins ago, by DeadMG
I finally found the button to make Windows shut up and do what I, the owner of the hardware and files in question, tell it to do
^ @DeadMG you should be aware, that that doesn't actually mean anything in real life. Other than 'I bitch about windows too'
> there's an obscure override button somewhere that I found and clicked
^ Oh, really? Yawn
 
@sehe Wasn't talking to you.
 
10:08 PM
@ScottW I envy your religion then. Seems so... manageable
 
@sehe I can always make a new volume, and move things over there to create scratch space. Never needed it though.
 
evening all.. i know this isnt the right place but can anyone help out with a mySQL problem i have?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes just verified, indeed my XP64 is taking about 15Gb with VS2010 Premium, SQL Server, Microsoft Pex&Moles and few Boost versions installed.
 
Ah, no VS or boost in this.
It's just to try building my roguelike on Windows.
The Haskell platform shouldn't be larger than 1GB.
 
Use Win3.11 + WIN32S + Borland C++ + conio.h
For great glory
 
10:12 PM
@sehe I don't think Win3.11 supports GHC 7.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Oh, Haskell :)
@RMartinhoFernandes I don't think GHC supports Win3.11 (rightly so)
 
Nothing supports Win3.11.
Except maybe Total Commander, but that's a weird one.
 
@CatPlusPlus My bookshelf is still holding out :)
@CatPlusPlus Oh noes, you don't honestly say that software written in 1993 still runs on the operating system of the time :)
 
@CatPlusPlus: DOSBox supports Windows 3.1 :-P
 
10:15 PM
Apparently the WinXP text mode setup program supports guest mouse integration...
 
I doubt it runs on 3.1.
 
How to do inplace Radix sort ?
 
Radix sort is inplace.
Right?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes It's likely because VBox supports virtualization of BIOS level mouse hardware
 
10:17 PM
> A least significant digit (LSD) radix sort is a fast stable sorting algorithm
LSD sort.
 
Any implementation ? In which case would radix sort be O(n) ?
 
@NiteeshMehra: Did you even take a look at the Wikipedia link I provided?
 
@Insilico Already seen. Before you gave the link :)
 
What's wrong with the C++ implementation on the page?
 
10:23 PM
@Insilico Not comfortable with STL. A basic C solution.
 
@NiteeshMehra: Well, you're not going to find a C solution in a C++ chat room. :-)
 
#include <stdlib.h>
int main() {
    system("c++-radix-sort");
    return 0;
}
 
@Insilico lol. thanks anyways. c++ will do :)
 
10:37 PM
Lisp: everything is a list. Java: everything is an object (yeah, right). C disguised as C++: everything is a pointer.
 
Java: everything is overdesigned.
 
@NiteeshMehra You could always try sleepsort.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: Java: Everything is an object (except when it isn't)
Java is the only language I know that has a cache for integers (stackoverflow.com/questions/6521067/…)
 
That's not a language feature, and hardly.
CPython interns small integers, too.
 
@Insilico That's why I added "(yeah, right)"
 
10:41 PM
Where Java fails is making == compare references.
 
@CatPlusPlus I stand corrected then
 
The optimisation wouldn't be exposed so easily if == compared values.
Which is what you want to do, most of the time.
 
Values? What's that?
 
Object.equals should be == and reference comparing should have a different operator.
 
@LucDanton Primitive types acts as values.
 
10:44 PM
But then again, it's expecting too much from Java designers.
 
Anyone?
> "MSVC 10 doesn't generate move constructors automatically, but that's a missing feature that will be added in MSVC 11." This is not my understanding. Do you have a link handy verifying this? – ildjarn 49 secs ago
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: Wasn't there a big discussion in the C++ committee involving automatic generation of move constructors?
 
Yes, it is in the standard.
 
Oh so they did figure it out in time for the FCD
 
hiyo
 
10:47 PM
It is my understanding that VC10 doesn't have them because of shipping before that was decided, but VC11 fixes it. But I have no links.
I gathered this info from people talking about it here. I don't use VC myself.
 
VC++10 uses "version 2.0" of rvalue references, VC++11 uses "version 2.1"
According to VC++'s blogs
 
And the standard has version 3.0...
At least 2.1 fixes some egregious issue. Binding to lvalues, I think.
 
Do you know which version was automatic generation of move constructors introduced?
 
@Insilico Ah, damn.
I misunderstood then.
 
How do you do quotes here on Chat?
> Rvalue references v3.0 adds new rules to automatically generate move constructors and move assignment operators under certain conditions. This will not be implemented in VC11, which will continue to follow VC10's behavior of never automatically generating move constructors/move assignment operators. (As with all of the not-yet-implemented features here, this is due to time and resource constraints, and not due to dislike of the features themselves!)
 
10:52 PM
Prefix with > (space not optional).
@Insilico Thanks for checking that for me, btw.
 
No problem
Another link to the "don't use f*ckin pointers" PDF: tinyurl.com/dont-use-pointers
 
So I can use it on SO questions without being flagged to death
 
Anyone know of any good linear equation solvers?
 
If I google for "Haskell platform" google serves me an ad for Peugeot 508.
@JohnSmith Boost.uBLAS?
(or something like that)
 
10:58 PM
@JohnSmith: Any matrix manipulation library will do the job
(like Boost.uBLAS)
 
Oh mothereff... I am in the wrong chat
I am looking for something in Python, not C++
 
apologies
 
Just replace C++ with Python in Lounge<C++> :-)
Lounge<Python>
Although you might get linker errors because we haven't defined it yet
 
10:59 PM
No worries. At least you didn't barge in with "Anyone know of good linear equation solvers in Python? I tried the other rooms but they're empty, so I'm asking the C++ folks, for no reason other than them being here".
 

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