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12:01 AM
@Zenikoder Not immediately, no. C++0x won't magically be comprehensively supported by all of the major compilers the instant it is standardized. It will be years before it is fully supported. (That's not to say that we can't refer to C++0x just as C++ until it has comprehensive support, but it will take some time.)
 
@JamesMcNellis Peronsally, once the old standard version is obsoleted, I think we should use the c++03 tag (together with the c++ tag) to ask about outdated C++ and c++ only for the current standard. Old questions should be left alone. The 03ness can be inferred from the age of the question.
 
@CharlesBailey The question then is, when do you call the old standard obsolete?
 
When the new one is standardized.
That is the ISO way; there is only ever one current standard.
 
e.g. Python 3 has been out for well over a year now, but if you have a P3-specific question you tag it python-3
 
@CharlesBailey The problem is that there are features of C++0x that no one really supports yet and it's likely no one will support by the time C++0x is promulgated.
 
12:10 AM
You can still ask about export right now. ;-)
 
If nothing else, the compiler tags are going to become much more important.
 
@JamesMcNellis Not sure I see the problem. You can ask about the language and most people will tell you about practical support problems in their answers.
 
Maybe.
 
The fact that the standard is published doesn't make an unsupported feature any less of a feature of the language. It just goes from being an unsupported feature of the proposed new version of C++ to being an unsupported version of the current C++ standard.
Although there shouldn't be any language features that are unsupported everywhere. I believe the committee were very keen to make sure that there were at least demonstration implementations of all features following the export fiasco of the last standard.
 
I don't think it's likely that we'll have another export on hand
 
12:20 AM
i think auto_ptr was deprecated and export removed totally in the upcoming standard, is that correct?
 
@Zenikoder Yes. Exception specifications have also been deprecated and replaced with noexcept.
 
aah I see... i didn't know about that.
 
@CharlesBailey Ok. I can buy that argument.
 
so what is the difference between noexcept and nothrow?
 
@CharlesBailey The only really big thing I know of is the concurrency memory model, and so much work has gone into that I don't think it's going to be another export-like fiasco.
 
12:24 AM
exception specifications had a dozen problems
 
@Zenikoder nothrow is the object passed to new to suppress the std::bad_alloc exception. noexcept is a new keyword and operator.
 
noexcept should be pretty simple to enforce and keep right
 
@James: aaah i see. thanks for that
 
 
2 hours later…
2:32 AM
not sure how we should go about c++0x/c++03
the C folks use c99 it seems, because c99 isn't widely adopted so it makes a difference
maybe we should do so too. aslongas compilers haven't widely adopted a specific feature, i would tag a question c++0x if that question uses such a feature.
if it uses default argument on function templates, i think it would be pretty safe to go without a c++0x tag
tho i'm not sure whether this is a good way to go
um, it's likely we will lose [[hiding]] / new for everything non-function :(
 
@JohannesSchaublitb I think the answer will evolve over time. At least from my viewpoint, you've got it about right though: "C++0x" mostly refers to things that either aren't widely implemented or at least aren't widely understood. When they're widely available, used, and at least reasonably understood, they're just "C++".
 
there are too many issues unresolved with too little time remaining so it's likely we're just going to drop "new" or [[hiding]] for non-function names. i hope we don't though. we'll need to hope for the best!
 
 
1 hour later…
4:02 AM
@JohannesSchaublitb What else can new/override/etc. be applied to?
 
 
1 hour later…
5:06 AM
@JamesMcNellis wasn't there an attribute for alignment?
 
6:03 AM
@JamesMcNellis ideally "new" can be applied to anything that can declare a name in the class
because all those things could hide a base class member name
like, ideally you should be able to do struct foo explicit : bar { enum A { X new }; }; and mark "X" as "allowed to hide something of bar"
@JamesMcNellis transition of attributes over to non-attributes broke lots of even function-only cases :( no fun
 
 
1 hour later…
7:07 AM
1
A: Declaring a function that return a 2D array in a header file?

chrisaycockJust return a pointer to a pointer. char** getArr();

 
7:33 AM
@JohannesSchaublitb -1 from me with a comment, too.
 
 
4 hours later…
11:30 AM
@JerryCoffin I don't agree with this distinction. There are things that aren't widely understood that are part of of the current (2003) standard.
 
11:42 AM
hey
is there anyone
??
 
no
and im with charls on this. c++0x refers to things in the c+00x standard.
sigh charles. sorry.
 
sbi
@codeomnitrix No, nobody's here.
 
12:02 PM
It still amazes me how many questions on SO include an error message that comes from different code to the code in the question.
 
12:39 PM
@CharlesBailey it's a big impediment, but shouldn't be that surprising: consider that people try to understand a bug, are often wrong in that understanding by the time they ask someone else, but still want to present it the best they can
those "Don't be vague, be an ace; write a proper test-case!" links to the right are worth their weight in gold
 
12:54 PM
"and so is C++'s std::map implemented as a hastabled" <- /me sad
0
Q: balanced tree-like data structure that resizes to prime sizes

costy.petrisorrelating to this: stack overflow question where I found out that .Net dictionaries resize to the next prime size that is at least twice then the current size I was wandering if there is any balanced tree-like data structure that can resize to prime sizes (similar to B-Trees or Binomial trees ma...

 
Neo
a simple php question how do I make 0.5 show as 0.500000 ...I want my numbers with six digits after the decimal point?!?
 
@FredNurk Are they? Do the people who need to read them actually read them? I don't think many question askers visit chat.
 
@CharlesBailey: so point them out in comments
I meant the material itself, not being included here
in fact, I'm tempted to take an interest in people that haven't even tried (mostly because they don't know how) to ask a good question, and just copy-paste those links
right now, I just move on, too much effort for most of that kind of thing in the past, though some of those people really do just need someone to point out a few key things
 
1:57 PM
woah
Rin is back!
"You don't know shit about c++ class"
"asshole, this wasn't the question you big noob"
"You people can't produce a whole program that could compile, you just pose here and ask people more when they gave you all, stupid noob poseurs"
@FredOverflow apparently you "don't know anything about class" :-/
 
2:21 PM
@marcog "Daily vote limit reached, come back in n hours."
 
@CharlesBailey same here
 
I presume that the "penalty box" is designed for behaviour like this, but I don't know if it's automatic in some way.
 
I've been asking in meta's chat room, apparently it's not
flagged it for mod attention though
 
A shame really. Given his level of knowledge he could have learned a lot.
 
indeed
 
2:28 PM
22h ago, awarded "Scholar" badge; that's almost ironic :) .
 
@marcog Who said that where? Link please.
 
@FredOverflow: Prepare to lose all your "offensive comment" votes.
 
@CharlesBailey What are you talking about?
 
can someone flag the last comment under my answer and oli's (if you have left)
@FredOverflow our friend Rin we were trying to help yesterday went wild
 
2:31 PM
@FredOverflow The question that @marcog linked to.
@marcog A lot have his comments have already disappeared due to reaching the right number of flags.
 
@CharlesBailey Yup, he keeps posting more though
"OK, so let me understand this, this answer gives him +1 point and me posting the whole program gives me -9 points. WOW, thats is really really WOW. Says much about you, what kind of persons you are."
 
I would really like to understand the meaning of "sid, wq, zu, wa means that you don't know anything about class" before I mark it as offensive... I have absolutely no idea what that comment is intended to mean
 
@FredOverflow There are better comments to mark as offensive on that page and they are still coming... that comment is just non-sensical.
 
@CharlesBailey "daily vote limited reached" there we go
 
@FredOverflow Told you ;-) .
"So you lick each other ass to get points for misleading people, causing a program to not compile all in the name of boss gives other boss points."
 
2:41 PM
@CharlesBailey LOL
I think we should stop feeding the troll, this guy must be bored to death.
 
I want to be offended, but I just don't understand it!
4
 
"@FredOverflow i posted the whole program, i can't post more. What did you post me (the asker) ?? All you post is questions, but i can't give you more. It is my own choice how i name things in a program."
sigh...
 
Normally you can tell when someone's in the penalty box (without going to their profile) because their reputation score suddenly drops to 1. Not going to make a whole lot of difference here...
 
@marcog I gave one last reply to that.
 
@FredOverflow I hope he turns around, but I think that's unlikely now
 
2:59 PM
> I am not here to teach you, i am here to be taught by you. So you don't like or you don't know what i want, but fact is anybody that knows the answer knows what i am talking about when i posting the whole program.
@marcog I give up.
 
@FredOverflow Yes, not worth it. English is clearly not is first language and that's getting in the way.
let me give it ONE attempt
 
@marcog Sure, if you want... C++ programmers are stubborn by nature, after all :-)
 
@FredOverflow Have you any evidence for C++ programmers being stubborn by nature? Oh wait, here: stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/c%2b%2b
 
@CharlesBailey C++ programmers put up with STL error messages. Nuff said.
3
 
@FredOverflow my one and only attempt added
 
3:14 PM
 
@marcog Unfortunatley Bill the Lizard just deleted the question so it was futile :) . Oh well.
 
@CharlesBailey Phooey
I hope he contacts him to give him a warning / something
 
 
4 hours later…
6:51 PM
"asshole, this wasn't the question you big noob" ahaha
 
lol
 
@marcog "OK, so let me understand this, this answer gives him +1 point and me posting the whole program gives me -9 points. WOW, thats is really really WOW. Says much about you, what kind of persons you are." ahaha lolled so hard
wow my sleep shedule is odd! just got up at 19:00. now i'll try making it through up to tomorrow 22:00 xD
 
lol
I did that once when I was in my first year of uni
was awake 7pm to 5am
 
because everybody else went out and partied at night
it was actually quieter at night thn during the day
wait
I mean, quieter during the day than at night
 
sbi
@JohannesSchaublitb The last time I did this was before the company I worked for had to deliver an alpha release to an important customer a few days before Christmas. Together with a coworker I worked for >30hrs in one go, in order to slip in a feature at alpha-level quality.
The feature was later pulled by the customer.
 
owch
 
7:23 PM
that sounds like it must have sucked
 
sbi
When you're working for a small (<25 people) company, delivering software to one of the big 20 international companies, this is one of the things that happen.
 
what software do you work on?
 
sbi
document processing
 
 
4 hours later…
11:20 PM
@JohannesSchaublitb and I thought I've been bad these past couple months sleeping at 4-5am :)
once i did a 72 hour programming contest + 3-4 hours documenting our submission after, and slept only 9 hours during the time
i lasted surprisingly well
 

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