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11:33 PM
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Q: "Serial voting reversed" destroyed my rep

user3237465I've been steadily gaining rep for several years answering questions on Stack Overflow (mostly ones with the agda tag) and a few weeks ago I started seeing a lot of new upvotes on my old answers (one upvote per answer, all with the agda tag). I assumed that someone was looking through all the que...

 
Don't you think the voting looks suspicious (look at the time stamps)?
 
I mean, that's unfortunate, but why would you expect it to be returned if it was illegitimate? It doesn't matter if you knew it was illegitimate or not, it was still determined to be so.
 
That graph is really insane. At least from the outside, it sounds downright absurd that 3+ years of rep would all be serial.
 
I would think that raising a moderator flag on one of your questions, and specifically mentioning the voting correction would be a better route than a Meta post. Either that or using the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of the page. Moderators and CMs have more access to the tools needed to understand the circumstances of the drop in rep than most people who dwell on Meta.
 
Is it so hard to believe that over the last few years someone has upvoted every single one of their posts? That would be a 3000 rep reversal on its own
 
11:33 PM
I think it's unlikely that a reversal of this kind was performed without performing some kind of investigation by an employee with access to actual voting records.
 
BDL
The voting pattern definitely looks suspicious. You got daily upvotes on year old questions, all the upvotes happen in a very short time frame, the votes are often the only votes that ever happened on posts that have been posted ages ago. Since the correction is that large, its not unlikely that some sockpuppet net was found and all the votes from this accounts were removed. Since moderator actions that aren't targeted at you are usually confidential, I wouldn't expect a large chance to find out details.
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@Nick "I mean, that's unfortunate, but why would you expect it to be returned if it was illegitimate?" -- says who? The now-top answerer has 396 upvotes with 70 asnwers, I now have 243 with 116 and while his answers are great, mine are also not trash. I also now see that a lot of other people in that tag have lost rep (apart from the now-top answerer). I've been contributing for many years and I want an explanation.
@HereticMonkey "Either that or using the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of the page" -- that's what I wanted to do, but I stupidly failed to find that link. What's wrong with have a meta post, though?
@yivi "by an employee with access to actual voting records" -- I want to see the voting records then.
 
Losing that much in one swipe is really drastic, I can understand your frustration; just know that there may not be much that mods or meta users can do for you. Contact Us is probably your best bet unless a mod has details they're authorized to share.
 
I think it's unlikely that you will get a response from Stack. "Voting corrected" of this magnitude is usually done by staff after they have investigated an issue. While it may look like your reputation from the previous 3 years have vanished, the suspicious voting may have started before that. I don't think it's your duty to report strange voting patterns, but it's not uncommon for users to raise a flag when they notice a suspicious pattern against their account.
 
Also: It is strongly preferred that you do not ask about serial voting on a site's meta. The details of the investigation are private and will not be divulged, and there's nothing that normal users can do. Such meta posts often lead to inappropriate speculation as to the cause, who the voters are, etc., and they also tend to result in people engaging in additional targeted voting. - What is serial voting and how does it affect me?
 
11:33 PM
@zcoop98 thanks, just did that.
@Sabito錆兎 for me it is strongly preferred not to lose the effect of multiple years worth of work, so making a public post asking for public investigation seems appropriate to me. I did use the Contact Us link though.
 
There simply will not be any public investigation - the votes are private, and we simply cannot do anything about that - neither confirm or deny. If anything, I see a lot of suspicious voting patterns on your account that date back to 2016 (suspicious here means votes made in close second proximity during the same minute, usually 2 at a time). As @Scratte mentioned, the voting reversal can include those older votes. But, again, we do not know anything and can only speculate - hardly a productive activity.
 
@BDL "The voting pattern definitely looks suspicious. You got daily upvotes on year old questions, all the upvotes happen in a very short time frame" -- I just looked at the timestamps and I agree it's highly suspicious. But this has been happening only recently and I never had serial upvotes on my answers before. You basically suggest that there had been a fraud running for many years and SO completely missed that. The other possibility is that they overdid the reversal. Either way it's a fuckup and I want to see the data and an explanation.
 
nbk
sadly that happens rarely, but flag for mpd attention. and let them sort that out
 
We handled a vote invalidation yesterday that we're already re-investigating - while I can't guarantee that you'll see all of the votes returned, I'm hoping that we'll be able to reinstate many of them. Please give us some time to investigate a bit more. Apologies for the confusion and the negative impact.
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@Catija thanks! Will there be any post-mortem on what happened (regardless of the final outcome)?
 
11:33 PM
We have to be cautious about that as it can be a bit too... public of how our system identifies and invalidates votes but I'll see if there's something we can talk about to explain what happened somewhat generally.
 
@Catija I'd be happy to sign an NDA and post either "I'm convinced" or "I'm not convinced" without going into any details whatsoever after seeing the data.
 
We look at patterns when we analyze cases of potential voting fraud. That can be a bit like reading tea leaves; it's not an exact science. In this case, someone with a bit less experience reading tea leaves handled it, and they didn't read the tea leaves in the same way that others with more experience probably would have. So, the team is following up on this, reviewing it again, and the results will probably change (some votes will be returned, but not all). This is about all we can say, NDA or not. You don't need to be convinced; this is already something being looked into.
Nobody admitted to anything like what you're claiming. They admitted to interpreting patterns differently, in a way that wasn't in your favor. Nor are you entitled to any reputation whatsoever. The team was going to do you a favor by looking into this again. You aren't exactly winning any favors with your comments. We don't owe you anything.
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I didn't delete your comment; it was deleted by a single flag from a community member due to the abusive language that you used. (And... so was that last one.) There's no "objective truth" when it comes to reputation; it's an inherently subjective metric. So, no, I don't understand what you are claiming. The double-checking is happening now, as has already been mentioned numerous times. You are not owed anything. You are not entitled to reputation.
 
@CodyGray "They admitted to interpreting patterns differently, in a way that wasn't in your favor. Nor are you entitled to any reputation whatsoever. The team was going to do you a favor by looking into this again" -- you do understand that there's only one objective truth that is not dependent on any "pattern-reading" or the style of my comments, right? Suggesting that a dramatic change was made by a person without enough experience and no double-checking was performed identifies a process failure, regardless of outcome. You do owe me an apology.
@CodyGray "The double-checking is happening now" -- after I went to the trouble of reporting the issue and worrying about it. I owe me an apology for that, not for the lost reputation, which who knows was legitimate or not.
 
Actually, no. We were already looking into it before you submitted this question. Your worrying didn't factor into it. In fact, given the way you've engaged in the comments here, were we doing it merely for you, I would have insisted that we stop doing it. But you are not the only person involved here.
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@CodyGray "Your worrying didn't factor in to it" -- my worrying factored in my state of mind, I don't care about your broken processes. I'm asking for apology for letting the world see something disturbing that you're not sure in, that's it. "were we doing it merely for you, I would have insisted that we stop doing it" -- you can restore upvotes of others and not restore mine, that would sure indicate that you have a well-setup process in place.
@CodyGray "were we doing it merely for you, I would have insisted that we stop doing it" -- I just wish I'll never achieve this level of professional incompetence. "We're not sure if we did the right thing or not, but since that guy is too pissed, let's ignore this process failure and not investigate it".
 
11:33 PM
If your state of mind is that tightly tied to an arbitrary number displayed on a website, then you might want to rethink your worldview. As I've repeated several times now, we don't make you any guarantees regarding reputation. "Letting the world see something disturbing"... are you kidding? Letting the world see that your arbitrary score on a website decreased? Oh no! Do note that you can apply for a full refund of your purchase price here: stackoverflow.com/contact
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@CodyGray "If your state of mind is that tightly tied to an arbitrary number displayed on a website, then you might want to rethink your worldview." -- that's none of your business. As I said, that number is in my CV, which potentially can impact a lot of things. "As I've repeated several times now, we don't make you any guarantees regarding reputation" -- you don't seem to hear me. I do understand that. What I'm unhappy about is that SO cancelled several years worth of my work without being sure it's the right thing to do, which I could understand if there was a simple "sorry", but instead
I only got some condescending tone, which is what made me change my tone as well. "Do note that you can apply for a full refund of your purchase price here" -- do you compensate for time spent writing 258 answers as well?
 
The person who did it was sure that they were doing the correct thing. The person who reviewed it raised an objection, and asked for a re-assessment. So...we're doing that. Not sure why you keep insisting that the process is broken when the process we have is precisely the process that you wish for us to have. You're right, it would normally be none of my business, except that you are making it my business by continually complaining about it. It seems you are the one not hearing me. If we don't make any guarantees about reputation, you have no right to complain when the number changes.
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"Not sure why you keep insisting that the process is broken when the process we have is precisely the process that you wish for us to have." -- modulo one detail: reassess major changes before releasing them to the world. Such changes may not matter for you, but they matter for me, accept this simple fact. There are literally people making SO accounts and selling them, an SO account is an asset and mine lost 27% of value due to a single decision by an apparently "someone with a bit less experience". Saying "sorry" would the first thing I'd do.
 
@user3237465 diamond mods are not SE - they are elected community members. You also already got an apology from Catija who is a staff member (a community manager). There is no reason to disclose to you the private information that, I suppose, includes the IP addresses of the voters, yet you keep insisting on that. There is also a problem of a very entitled tone which doesn't usually go well with the community. On top of that, I have to agree with Cody here - if you put the "top answerer" on the freaking CV, and your well-being actually depends on it, you really want to rethink your approach.
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@OlegValter "You also already got an apology from Catija who is a staff member (a community manager)" -- and I said "thanks!" and "I'd be happy to <...>", which is proposing, not insisting and after that I haven't said anything about investigation or data or anything. I'm perfectly happy about Catija's response. All my complaints afterwards were about "You don't need to be convinced; this is already something being looked into". Cody first admitted they made a premature decision and then suggested it's none of my business even though it directly impacts years of my unpaid work.
 
11:33 PM
I avoid mentioning my involvement with Stack Overflow when corresponding with potential employers to avoid, "Man, this dude spends too much time on social media." employment downvotes.
 
I didn't make any mistake. I couldn't care enough about reputation to bother. I was trying to explain what happened to you, because you seemed to be concerned. Apparently, you don't want an explanation, you want an apology. That's not going to be forthcoming.
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@CodyGray "I couldn't care enough about reputation to bother" -- keep me updated. "I was trying to explain what happened to you, because you seemed to be concerned" -- speculating what I need and what I don't was not necessary.
 

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