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user1804599
9:02 AM
For a typical 2D action game how many state updates per second is enough?
 
user1804599
For a smooth gameplay.
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
async commit
 
9:29 AM
is there anyone familiar with TeX here?
 
@BartekBanachewicz yes
 
@ScarletAmaranth I'd like to learn it
can you recommend some resources
I'm also gonna need TikZ
 
first of all, you need to install TeXStudio
 
Should I wait with learning TikZ until I learn basics of TeX or can I jump at it straight away
 
do not manually compile shit
you can just go ahead and use TikZpictures
 
9:32 AM
@ScarletAmaranth what's that?
@ScarletAmaranth installing
 
TikZ
the best approach to learning tex is to learn as you go tho, have an idea of what you need to write
 
I want to compile a small reference book for myself
I'm gonna need a couple of diagrams
and I'd like to have everything version controlled
hence why TeX and TikZ
oh right I need MacTex for TexStudio as well
 
the thing is, TeX is what it is because it's a collection of libraries; there is no tutorial to show you "everything" because it does too many things
yes you need a way to compile TeX
 
okay downloading full mactex
IIRC it all unpacks to like 10GB or something
 
yeah it is colossal if you just click full install
 
9:35 AM
welp
I guess the regret for getting a 128GB drive will soon settle in
 
Ell
Yes
I don't understand why TeX is so massive though
I know there are lots of packages
 
potentially, 256 is the sweet spot for "those 10 apps you want SSD for + OS"
 
Ell
But man
 
I managed to get working SFINAE in default template parameters while it didn't work when std::enable_if_t was in the return type... Fine, whatever.
 
> TUG recommends the full MacTeX, even for beginners. It contains all files most users ever need. Beginners using it don't face the daunting task of searching for missing components and figuring out how to install them in the TeX distribution.
 
9:39 AM
you will be using more packages than you think tho
 
I suppose so
 
you need packages even for beyond-ASCII support (stuff like Babel)
 
will that impact the builds I make?
 
no not really
 
ok
40% downloaded
 
9:41 AM
there are a few things you need to be aware of tho; never compile by hand and have TeXStudio do it for you (if you look into the process, it actually runs the compiler multiple times, and if you use bibtex for bibliography for example, or an additional compiler for some subpackage, it will run them interleaved several times)
 
ok
also WTF
SC2 takes 22GB of my disk space
 
Ven
Yeah. Quality textures.
 
Haha, yeah, the multiple compilation steps are bring with LaTeX too. I generally end up clicking the same buttons multiple times just in case.
 
Ven
How's it going, co-kretab?
 
9:43 AM
@Morwenn ye, the secret sauce is to "click the compile button" rather than trying to invoke the compiler by hand :P
 
heh
I haven't been coding too much
there are nicer thing to do
like writing books
 
Ven
Like not-Hate-ing?
 
never ignore warnings - overfull / underfull boxes often make the text go outside of the margins (those are the most common warnings you'll get)
 
@ScarletAmaranth In MikTeX it's "click the compile button several times and don't forget to interleave bibtex".
 
Ven
9:44 AM
Object-oriented key
 
oh welp HoTS is another 11GB
 
and also, if you want unicode, you have to manually eyeball the text - it will NOT warn nor error out if it doesn't display a symbol because it doesn't recognize it due to an encoding issue
 
so blizzard games on this machine are 35% of my disk\
 
Blizzard games are hyoog.
 
unicode is utter shit for TeX and you have to check all the time
 
9:45 AM
I guess I can get rid of HotS
@ScarletAmaranth wat why
isn't that like suppose to make working with text better
 
I've submitted so much shit already due to this
 
and nicer
 
once you start needing math environments interleaved with normal environments
you will feel the pain if you don't check
 
Unicode is way harder in TeX than it should be.
You would think they'd have substitution characters built-in.
 
ye because TeX ignores your shit
 
9:46 AM
... Nope. Not even once.
 
I don't really need math now yet
I just need simple diagrams
well not that simple but
 
So you need to include like 6 packages
to get the symbols you need
 
modularity is good
let me form my own opinion
 
And even then I remember for my paper I had to create mappings from 1 character to another that'd actually display.
It was dumb as bricks.
 
ye, just take a look at the PDF if you want unicode, it will often not render something and will NOT warn / error
if it can't display a symbol because you have like a wrong symbol set installed, it will silently compile without the symbol rendered
 
9:48 AM
How I feel today:
 
k download finished
5.41GB full install
not that bad
 
for code use "lstlistings", for unicode use "babel" (and sacrifice a goat to Baal), for pictures as you've mentioned, TikZ - those are the basics; for anything else there is 99.99% chance of a package existing for it (proof trees? no problem, FSMs? no problem, etc.)
 
oh interesting
so maybe there's a package for things I need
 
there is a package for that 100%; TikZ is very general
 
@Morwenn :D
 
9:56 AM
okay
I have texstudio
 
Oh, LaTeX? Nice.
 
try to auto-detect your TeX installation
otherwise you need to manually set links to compilers of all sorts
 
What is the theme of the book, @BartekBanachewicz?
 
yay
I got a page with "test" on it
@wilx a guitar reference handbook
 
@BartekBanachewicz \o/
@BartekBanachewicz Oh, interesting.
 
10:00 AM
I am not sure if using Word would've been a better choice
One of the things I really want is to control which things go on which page
 
word would be a great choice, if the conversion to Pdf wasn't full of surprises
 
because the format I've chosen is a binder
so I need to be able to rebuild the thing changing or adding just some pages
I expect it to evolve over time
I have some things I'd like to put there but the list isn't complete
 
Ell
@ThePhD that's why you use XeTeX like a sane person
 
I see. Well, LaTeX is decent choice. However, it is more like programming than text editing at times. Be prepared for that. :)
 
Ell
:D
 
10:02 AM
@wilx that's fine
 
@Ell Or LuaLaTeX...
 
I think that being able to version control and collaborate trumps Word's ease of use here
 
@ScarletAmaranth toys and candy?
 
starting with LaTeX from day 0 guarantees everyone can introduce corrections easily
 
google docs is a viable alteranative too btw; great for collaboration too
 
10:04 AM
@ScarletAmaranth I don't feel comfortable using docs for projects I plan to evolve over a longer period of time
 
@LucDanton promethean style, ye
 
besides
docs support for pictures is horrendous
you can include a google picture into a google doc, but not as a reference
 
yeah google docs is probably best for more lightweight stuff
docs make word obsolete for small things and tex makes word obsolete for big things
 
@ScarletAmaranth Is it? I use Markdown for everything and generate whatever I want from it. :)
 
@wilx docs is more than just a format
it's a platform
@ScarletAmaranth Tex has a huge learning curve though
but yeah, once I learn it...
I'll still use Office for Excel :D
 
10:08 AM
I don't really think it does, you can just go incrementally and learn what you need
 
@BartekBanachewicz Well, if I may have some suggestions, go with XeLaTeX or LuaLaTeX from day 1; learn early about newcommand and newenvironment early; annotate your terms, etc., so that you can easily build indexes and/or change style easily.
Also, there is this:
 
@wilx ... this would indeed make the learning curve steep
 
@wilx I'm there already
 
But they are not Lounge, so be civil. :)
 
Playing the piano becomes hard when you try to put a 7/8 melody on a 6/8 bass.
 
10:17 AM
@Morwenn I have no idea what you just said except that something is hard to do.
 
probably a metrum
but who the hell writes songs in 7/8
except Dream Theater of course
 
@wilx Between a time t and a time t', your left hand has played 6 notes with a regular time interval while your right hand has played 7 notes with a regular but different time interval.
 
and they sync every 42 eight-notes
 
@BartekBanachewicz Nah, the difficult part is that I tried to make them synchronize every measure. So every 6 notes for the left hand and every 7 notes for the right hand.
 
...maybe that's why I play guitar and not the piano
 
10:22 AM
Brasilian stuff on the guitar is hard too.
 
I should've said "electric guitar" right
 
is math metal a thing?
 
It is.
 
so basically any word I put in front of "metal" is legit
cunnilingus metal
 
10:25 AM
Even though the « math » qualification is random and means « hard and not what you expected to hear » and doesn't generally involve much math.
@ScarletAmaranth That'd be porngrind.
For example this band somehow qualifies as math metal:
 
@Morwenn this is horrible
 
It's fun :D
> Mathcore is a rhythmically complex and dissonant style of metalcore.
Also known as « fuck your ears metal » by the plebe.
 
this is super fun
not sure why the first paragraph inserts the indent though
is that like a rule of the style thing I have?
 
yes, you can do \noindent
 
By default it indents the first line of every paragraph except the first of the section/subsection IIRC.
 
10:32 AM
@Morwenn by everyone sane.
it's horrible
 
You have no taste :(
 
@BartekBanachewicz You have two paragraphs under the Introduction section.
 
@Morwenn yeah I consider that use of guitar extremely meh
 
Some spaces are significant in TeX.
 
wanking over the fact that she fills 3 melodic lines by herself
 
10:33 AM
The second paragraph is indented per the usual book style.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't know, I like to watch people play several melodies at the same time on a guitar. It's quite impressive.
 
@Morwenn well guess what any electric guitarist with a looper can do that
 
Any computer can do that too, but that's not really the point ._____.
 
Guitarists are the only people who will appreciate that
 
@Morwenn This was actually quite nice.
 
10:34 AM
@BartekBanachewicz I'm not even a guitarist.
 
maybe in classical music that is broad enough to "everyone who was forced to practice like a robot"
@Morwenn see above
in typical electric guitar music no one gives a fuck though
do whatever sounds good
I like that attitude much better
YMMV
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yeah, I learnt to play it a few years ago. It's tricky at first but in the end the 7/8 rhythm is quite interesting.
@BartekBanachewicz I don't think I qualify either then.
« Whatever sounds good » is the best way to make music :D
 
so yeah when I listen to classical guitar it's always kinda nice for a few minutes
and it's like "oh isn't it nice how the melody is laid out"
also in more important news
my GF wants to go to Enduro OFFensive with me
relationship goals <3
looks like a great place for a date doesn't it
 
@BartekBanachewicz Looks like a great place if you want to donate your organs, yes. :)
 
@wilx wat
it's pretty safe really
you know why? Because there aren't any fucking car drivers around
 
10:43 AM
:)
 
In all honesty though I don't think it's more dangerous than say skiing or snowboard
 
@wilx there isn't much left to donate once you crash on a motorbike
 
@ScarletAmaranth Depends. If the biker just hits their head or break their spine... :)
 
do you say that to your family and friends when they go out for a bicycle trip
 
@ThePhD <3 Last one is you 'n me
 
10:47 AM
I mean it kinda rustles my jimmies
Sure, enduro motorbiking is dangerous. It's an extreme sport. Extreme sports tend to be more dangerous, that's why they are called extreme.
 
@rightfold ^ ...spot the difference... v
 
But we all know that
 
And repeating only the "dangerous" part over and over... what purpose does it serve? Do you want to turn people away from doing that? They're having fun. And they are probably more aware of the risk than you are.
 
nwp
@fredoverflow the arrows go to different a places
not a good change in my opinion
 
10:49 AM
@fredoverflow Sexy arrows :p
 
nwp
make them all hit the center
 
Not trying to sound too aggressive, but it kinda paints you on a moral high horse in dangerous life choices
 
@nwp You win 100 imaginary Internet points.
 
nwp
woooot! I'll use them to buy an internet cookie
 
and at least enduro bikers ride where they can't really be a danger to others
 
10:50 AM
@nwp Clicking is a faster way to get cookies (in more ways than one). just saying.
 
Good one :p
 
@nwp Okay, maybe it wasn't such a good idea after all...
On the other hand...
 
You can group them separated near the beginning instead of distributing them all along the width.
 
Well, my comment was too late again ç_ç
 
10:57 AM
why can't github support SSH auth over HTTPS again?
 
Because SSH is so hard that even less people would be willing to migrate from svn to git.
 
nwp
@fredoverflow it is extremely annoying though
I added submodules
if you add submodules via http you cannot push via ssh auth
if you add them via ssh people cannot download without an account
you have to add them via http and then locally change it to ssh without pushing that change
I'm probably doing it wrong
 
@fredoverflow wat
are you trying to say that key auth is harder than password auth
really
 
Submodules do not play nice for a scenario where you will be making changes inside the submodule.
You need to manually edit .git/modules/submodule/config, and add pushurl = blah@blah:blah to the [remote "origin"] section.
@nwp ^
 
@BartekBanachewicz Pretty sure that's what I read somewhere a couple of years ago.
 
11:11 AM
...
 
SSH is pretty trivial to use.
Generate a key once, never give a fuck again.
 
svn stores your password in plaintext doesn't it
 
SSH agents on Windows are hard
 
Fwiw, I've always used svn with ssh.
 
TIL to nest in Latex you use \subsubsubsection
 
11:15 AM
If you're going that deep, you're probably doing something wrong
There's like five hierarchical levels above that
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow nice
 
wat up homebois
@BartekBanachewicz Understanding generation and where the key is stored can be hard at first if you know nothing about it
 
OTOH storing password is fine?
 
11:38 AM
ueh
seems stuff like transposing tables is hard
 
12:10 PM
hello!
 
12:36 PM
Hey.
> The second part can be accessed through a hardware modification: a “Closed Shell System”. This is serious. This part of the Charter Web contains Illegal Content, experimental hardware information ("Gadolinium Gallium Garnet Quantum Electronic Processors"), but also darker information, such as the "Law of 13", World War 2 experiments, and even the location of Atlantis.
 
12:58 PM
ughwut
in order to include SVG you need inkscape?
 
nwp
1:17 PM
std::string s1 = "something";
const char *data = s1.data();
std::string s2 = std::move(s1);
assert(data == s2.data);
technically UB, practically will always work?
 
SSO
 
SS optimization
Nazi C++
 
lol
 
nwp
:(
dammit
I thought they banned SSO
 
No, they banned COW.
 
1:21 PM
must be indians
 
This
fucking enum is going to trigger the shit out of me
vendor_t::intel
vendor_t::AMD
vendor_t::NVidia
WOULD YOU LIKE TO BE CONSISTENT SOMETIME? :V
 
@ThePhD IT'S CONSISTENT WITH THE PREFERRED STYLING
@ThePhD INTEL IS NOT STYLED SO IT'S ALL LOWERCASE
@ThePhD AMD IS STYLED AS ALL-UPPER
 
intel_corporation, advanced_micro_devices_inc, nvidia_corporation
 
@ThePhD NVIDIA IS STYLED AS NVidia
 
1:29 PM
team_blue, team_red, team_green
 
@набиячлэвэлиь Who the fuck cares how it's styled!
 
I do, because I wrote them!
 
Those shit are enum values, and they don't even effect how they goddamn print. This isn't C# FFS.
 
Also, try all-lowercasing 3D-Now! into something that doesn't look like complete and utter shit!
 
3d-now!
 
1:34 PM
no, that's not a valid ident-name
 
Also iware::cpu stuff is built wrong; what happens with multi-cpu machines?
 
You can ask GetSystemInfo() that question
 
Found on the floor after class in a middle school: a relationship contract between 8th graders. (He signed it) https://t.co/SPmDjNdjVi
> You can't be looking at these hoes.
 
nwp
@Morwenn not bad
 
1:41 PM
Yeah, it sounds like Perturbator or Carpenter Brut.
24 issues open. I'm only productive at opening issues .______.
 
@Morwenn Can relationships have a bug tracker
I'd be up for resolving them around 3am
(for other people)
 
Not sure.
Too many heisenbugs.
 
@набиячлэвэлиь cpp-sort of course
 
I'm not coming anywhere near that
I'd cut myself on the templates
 
1:45 PM
You don't say :D
 
So many angle brackets
 
Most of them are along the lines of « super template wankery » and « how come it still compiles? » anyway.
 
Typical french girls, wanking off the next template that walks past them
 
The one about additional measures of presortedness doesn't involve too much template stuff, but it involves finding, reading, understanding and implementing algorithms straight from research papers.
 
@Morwenn This is why I always have a secret camera attached to my shirt when I talk to people. Makes it easier to show them why they're idiots retrospectively
 
1:49 PM
@Columbo Not sure it helps solving problems though.
You should force them to have such a camera and watch it afterwise. That would make them more responsible.
 
@Morwenn They first have to develop an understanding of why they're idiotic. E.g. changing appreciation about a work of art based on knowledge of the artist. If they do it consciously, all hope is gone, but if not, you can show it to them
It helps destroy hypocrits' egos, too
 
Everything only talks about the number of cores.
Why can't I get any information on the number of physical processors?
@Mysticial Have you ever needed to query how many actual physical CPUs are on a board?
 
@ThePhD quantities_t::packages
 
Are you planning to support more than one CPU?
 
Yes.
@набиячлэвэлиь ... Why is it called packages
What the hell.
 
2:02 PM
@ThePhD It's virtually always 1, for one thing. And for two thing, unless you're writing your own task scheduler, there's not a huge reason to care. Arguably, you should probably also not care all that much about number of cores either.
 
The whole point of this library is to make available all CPU / GPU information.
So it's actually all of my business.
 
> My hobby: destroying people's ego.
 
hmm
so I'm not sure I see where Tex is better than HTML
sure it has all of those fancy packages and stuff
 
@ThePhD Ask WinAPI
 
but frankly looks to me like it's just markup with weird syntax
 
2:11 PM
Does HTML support proper page layout?
 
HTML for print is kinda weird
 
Well, that's pretty much it: LaTeX aims to produce printable documents.
 
@набиячлэвэлиь I'm going to change it to cpu_count
Because WTF IS PACKAGES.
 
Its out-of-the-box math notation is cool too.
 
@ThePhD Dunno, I copied the nomenclature from WinAPI
 
nwp
2:13 PM
@BartekBanachewicz latex is great if you say "here is some text, format it". Latex will give you some very decent formatting with minimal effort. If you are unhappy with the result of the presets and want to specify where what goes it takes ridiculous amounts of effort.
 
I wanted to write "tutorial" and ended up writing "utotirla". Not sure how.
 
You're high on life.
 
@ThePhD It's called a package.
 
@ThePhD I'm (almost) never high at this time of the day.
 
@KretabChabawenizc I've never seen that nomenclature in my life.
It must be a well-guarded secret.
 
2:19 PM
14
Q: What is meant by the terms CPU, Core, Die and Package?

loveshNow this might sound like too many previous questions, but I am really confused about these terms. I was trying to understand how "dual core" is different from "Core 2 Duo", and I came across some answers. For example, this answer states: Core 2 Duo has two cores inside a single physical pack...

 
gotta love the userlist
 
@KretabChabawenizc Well, that's enlightening.
 
from what I've seen it's really really mostly about text
maaaaaybe HTML would be better on that front
 
@KretabChabawenizc Youre reminded me of the "evil universe" from Community
 
2:22 PM
your face is mostly about text
 
I need to specify a basic set of things I want to represent
 
@Morwenn Should've been an utortilla! (with cheese)
 
and then do that in both
and then compare
otherwise it's just speculation
 
your face is just specuulation
 
I am also wondering about running JS or Lua code as part of the generation process
 
2:24 PM
@KretabChabawenizc Sorting tortilla. With additional spaghetti code.
 
a sortilla
 
Sounds like something I'd eat.
 
2:42 PM
Wonder if you can get "number of caches".
Oh wow
It's hardcoded for syscntl
Up to 4 caches
 
well one thing about tex is that it's certainly fresh and exciting for me
 
2:58 PM
@ThePhD Yes, it's not easy.
 

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