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8:04 PM
@HostileFork There's reasons my CMake build was (and still is) hand-written. Mainly, because I used it to manually wade through the build dependencies implied by make prep.
 
@earl Given Rebol's relatively fast build, I think some false positives would be all right. I do full builds nearly every time, because I don't feel like sorting through when it missed something.
 
As an effect of that, the CMake build is currently fully aware of said dependencies, and auto-runs things to the effect of make prep whenever necessary. So you never have to do that manually. Neither do you have to do it habitually and break incremental builds.
Second main reason was to figure out how to do a good CMake build for R3, but that turned out to be relatively straightforward.
But the make prep stuff is much more important.
 
Well, people want their IDE files. That's kind of the big driver. I myself wouldn't mind switching over and giving a try to some of the better IDEs just to see. Qt Creator is okay, but just ... eh, nothing special.
 
Unfortunately, the make prep dependencies have to be manually maintained at the moment.
 
Well whatever manual maintenance is required, couldn't that go into Rebol formatted source and then generate the CMakeLists.txt so they aren't checked in?
 
8:10 PM
(As does the list of sources to be built, but I consider that an improvement more than a drawback. I'm no fan of "build all *.c you find".)
 
It's expedient at some phases of development. I'm all right with it for Ren/C++ and Ren Garden for the time being.
 
@HostileFork Yep, that dependency information should definitely be maintained in a common format. It would also be very helpful for the plain Makefile builds.
Thing is, we need it. The make prep thingies otherwises messes up most IDEs big time.
 
Well, I think that's really all we're looking for (w.r.t. CMake). And I have a third thing I'm looking for which is just for Rebol to do a full build via CALL with no need for either GNU make or CMake from the same info.
Then embed TCC, then look at the resulting thing and think about it for a while. :-)
 
There's some part in me, that vomits over the thought of make-make generating CMake something else.
But I might give it a go one day nevertheless :)
 
Well the goal is to supplant CMake here but one can't write everything all at once, and the IDE generators are just not a thing I think is worth the time to reinvent, yet what people want
 
8:14 PM
So, valgrind currently barks on ren-c. I guess I'll just turn it off for Travis CI for the time being?
 
@earl Yep, not ready.
That's the other work.
Which will be all kinds of fun to go and figure out how to reapply, but...
 
@HostileFork I'd rather we only have CMake-based builds, but that comes with its own can of worms ...
 
Meaning you don't like the idea of Rebol being able to standalone and not need either GNU Make or CMake?
 
Thing is, that generated CMakeLists.txt is probably a rather bad base for CMake to further generate IDE projects from. But we'll have to try ...
@HostileFork I think you can answer that yourself.
 
So what you meant was "Forget GNU make builds"?
 
8:18 PM
Right.
 
If there was a CMake target and Rebol could drive its own build, then those two would probably be enough.
 
TCC + CALL-based builds are a good idea. As is an eventual Rebol-written CMake replacement, obviously, if such a thing ever happens to materialise.
 
But it creates some problem for older systems, I guess the question is how old a system CMake has been made for. Hmm.
Linux, Mac, Windows (on their site)
If the system doesn't have a Rebol.
 
I was just speaking hypothetically, in a slightly more ideal world. For now, we'll just keep the plain make-based builds.
 
@earl In "review this idea and have you had it before space", I'd be interested in your thoughts on Lit-Bit. No LIT-WORD! or LIT-PATH! types, just a literal bit in the header of all values. Checking for a lit-word is two tests: literal? and word? or perhaps could still have a composite. Interesting conceptual feature: COMPOSE [(1 + 2) '(3 + 4)] => [3 (3 + 4)]
12 megabytes? :-)
Carl is turning over in his... um, chair. Or sofa. Or wherever he is right now.
 
8:26 PM
Intended to illustrate that it is available/buildable on a wide range of Linux-based systems for a very long time.
 
Well, I'd be okay if the make-a-makefile fell from grace as the most-maintained of targets and only got whipped into shape each time someone from crazy-universe felt like building it on a system that didn't have CMake.
Perhaps ceremonially updated at major release points but ignored in-between.
How would that be? Don't get rid of it, but consider it a second-class citizen and sort of move it off to the side a bit?
Then focus on the Rebol-powered build as the better solution for CMake haters.
 
I think CMake as a strongly suggested (even if not strictly necessary) pre-requisite won't fly at this point in time.
 
Well, then let's get the Rebol-powered build.
 
But if we get the pure CALL thingie working, we might have more leeway.
 
Sold! To the guy with the girl and the clock. So let's do it.
 
8:37 PM
@HostileFork OK if I push the Travis CI fixes right away, and enable Travis?
As you seem to work directly on master a lot, you'd then have to do git pull --rebase (and depending on the situation, maybe an additional git stash before that) to avoid useless merge commits.
 
@earl I'm going to shift to git-flow and be working on develop.
 
@HostileFork I don't think that's a good idea at this point, nor necessary.
Just be aware of what you are doing and try to avoid merge commits due to pulls :)
Mainly: git pull --rebase, if you are on master and have committed but unpushed changes. Or the full git stash; git pull --rebase; git stash pop dance, if you have uncommitted changes as well.
 
I see. All right.
 
(git-flow would only shift that problem to "develop", if there's shared development done there. And it has other problems, but that's not the point right now.)
 
Well, what it would do is it would prevent people who clone and build from getting whatever breakage was going on since the last time it got a good cross platform check
The configuration matrix here is pretty big.
 
8:49 PM
Are we at that level of support and stability yet?
(Rhetorical question.)
Good cross platform check needs to be automatic. We'll get there.
 
Well, sounds good.
 
You can also config git to do a pull --rebase automatically, whenever you just say git pull:
git config pull.rebase true
 
I'll try that.
 
(--global, if you want it for everything.)
It's the saner default, in my opinion. But rebase conflicts are more annoying to resolve to the uninitiated than plain merge conflicts.
Also, clean working directory, etc.
 
I've had some rebase merge conflict screw ups in git rebase -i where I thought I was doing it right but wound up with losing changes somehow.
 
8:53 PM
If you stick to the manual route of git pull --rebase, and ever forget to --rebase and accidentally introduce an unnecessary merge: git reset --hard HEAD^ and the merge will be gone (and because of --hard: as will be everything uncommitted in your working directory, so be careful).
@HostileFork If you do a lot of rebasing, especially of the same things over and over again, be sure to also have a look at rerere.
 
Just a short bit ago I had started a rebase in the wrong directory, then went off to the right directory and rebased. Worked a bit and then later when I went to commit it said I was in the middle of a rebase so I needed to continue or abort it. I thought "oh, hm, that rebase I started I don't need that." git rebase --abort
 
Executive rerere Summary: once you resolve a merge conflict, rerere remembers your conflict resolution. When it encounters a similar conflict situation, it'll retry your previous resolution.
 
Aaaaand my changes were gone.
 
@HostileFork git reflog to the rescue.
 
I'm gitting re flogged a lot.
 
8:57 PM
Yah, the git learning experience :/
 
If you thought reform was bad :)
 
If you get reflogged enough maybe you'll reform.
@earl Well hopefully somewhere in all this you will feel like working on it, if the build is boring don't do it. I went looking for things to put in, but if you know things off the top of your head that just need to be done then put them on. You also can just do it, you don't have to wait for me.
If it's one of those "obvious" things.
 
@HostileFork To me, build issues are things where I hardly need to think. So they make for nice "in between" fillers.
 
@earl Well in terms of building and numbering, is there a list somewhere of the missing historical builds? There's an issue now where Atronix or Saphirion picked 3.2 for Windows 64-bit but apparently there was a DEC Alpha build at some point for 2. I don't know at this point if aligning with a historical DEC Alpha numbering system is worth the disruption of bumping that to 3 or not... but...
It might be good to know what all the missing numbers are, and how Android wound up at 13
 
I think we should eventually re-start this whole numbering mess, or get rid of it at all.
 
9:08 PM
Works for me.
 
But here's a list of (most? all?) historical numbers: rebol.com/release-archive.html
Problem is, that the "major" version numbers, are used a lot in existing scripts to do ad-hoc platform detection.
To counter that, we should eventually introduce a "runtime feature capability" system (especially once the build is more modularised, as discussed before).
Until then, keeping at least the major platform numbers stable, is a sensible approach.
@HostileFork For this very particular question, I'd suggest that 64-bit Windows x86 would be probably nice as "0.3.40", as we then have all the current "major" platforms on .40 for their 64-bit variations.
 
Well, I guess the question is "who is it being built for" and that's some combination of the people who've used it in the past and the desire that it will be an appealing and useful tool for people in the future.
 
But that would probably inspire someone to use .40 as feature detection mechanism for 64-bit builds, so the 0.3.2 "hump" is maybe even a good thing.
 
@earl That's one way to look at it.
I guess a question would be about if anyone out there has a good successful versioning model worth emulating.
 
Platform-wise?
That's such a big mess, I think a "capability" system is the only way to go.
 
9:14 PM
Across both axes of platform and versions of the software itself
There's the database of code to taxonomize the reasons why people look at system/version/4 and system/version/5
After looking at it, what do they do?
 
didn't read the above, but can we put in some code for whoever's version we are using?
 
Such a system should aim to allow you to express your questions directly: think features/linux?, features/64bit?, features/has-compression?, features/has-sha1?.
@GrahamChiu Yep, definitely needed.
 
What does that mean?
 
Main question is if we want to keep system/build stable as a date!, or if we can axe it.
 
And is there a capa like function?
 
9:17 PM
@GrahamChiu Don't know of any, at the moment. Though @henrikmk has something similar in mind (at least in spirit), for his "VID Junior" thingie, I think.
>> ? system/build
SYSTEM/BUILD is a date of value: 29-Oct-2014/16:14:25
 
I'm used to knowing what people are talking about but if it says "can we put in some code for whoever's version we are using? And is there a capa like function?" my comprehension level goes down. :-)
 
I think a binary should provide several build-related bits of information:
 
I guess it just says which protocols are loaded
we used to get that at startup, eg audio, view, https, etc
 
Some reference to the commit it was built from (Git or Mercurial commit ID, SVN revision, etc + the repository it came from).
An identifier for "who built it".
 
CAPA comes from the SMTP dialog
 
9:19 PM
The build date, we already have. The version number we already have.
 
as to whoever's version .. I was thinking company name, or whoever
 
So the thing I have in mind, is something like:
>> ? system/build
SYSTEM/BUILD is an object of value:
   date            date!     4-Mar-2014/4:54
   source          url!      github.com/rebol/rebol/commit/25033f8
   builder         url!      rebolsource.net
@rgchris I may totally misremember, but don't you have a tool somewhere that provides some basic schema-like validation dialect for Rebol blocks and objects?
 
perhaps system/build can includes scheme names
but yes, you can access that if you remember the path to whatever the current system module is
 
object! [
    date: [date!] {Timestamp this binary was built}
    source: [url!] {Reference to the sources this binary was built from}
    builder: [url!] {Reference to who built this binary}
]
 
your system/build/date is missing the timezone :)
 
9:28 PM
That's because it is +0:00 :)
 
@earl Sort of—more for blocks of [word value] pairs than objects.
 
Ren/C is now also built on-commit via Travis CI for the Linux/x86/32 (0.4.4) and Linux/x86/64 (0.4.40) targets; all green: travis-ci.org/metaeducation/ren-c
@rgchris Ah, cool. That's what I had in mind, thanks. Does it work with set-word!s as well? Then it could just run on the BODY-OF an object, for starters.
 
It doesn't, but it should. I guess it does, at least in later versions of QuarterMaster (renamed VALIDATE)
 
@earl and published where?
 
@GrahamChiu Not published. Just checked that it builds at all.
@HostileFork I'm not too big fan of this badge hysteria, but maybe we should include a link to the Travis CI state in the Ren/C readme, to at least have a quick indication for someone looking at master, if it's currently in a state that at least builds?
 
9:35 PM
@earl I'm for it.
 
The other thing I'd like is for help/doc to point to a different location
Preferably a community maintained one
 
Call me old fashioned, but I still want this stuff at rebol.org
 
I doubt http://www.rebol.com/r3/docs/functions/ this is being maintained
We should point it to github or somewhere
 
@rgchris Does that work with the R3 "escapes" already?
(Well, I can just try myself :)
        item: form :word
        either any-function? get :word [
            foreach [a b] [
                "!" "-ex"
                "?" "-q"
                "*" "-mul"
                "+" "-plu"
                "/" "-div"
                "=" "-eq"
                "<" "-lt"
                ">" "-gt"
            ] [replace/all item a b]
            tmp: rebol.com/r3/docs/functions
        ] [
            tmp: rebol.com/r3/docs/datatypes
            remove back tail item
(The relevant code from HELP, for reference.)
 
9:40 PM
@HostileFork I got to moving a whole bunch of stuff from rebol.org (including AltME, created a model for replacing the script library), needs some input from elsewhere...
@earl I guess I didn't...
 
@earl Very hip. :-)
 
user image
2
Yet another point that needs discussion (@HostileFork mentioned it before, in a related context): version number policy. Ren/C is currently at 3.0.99, which I consider almost as unfortunate as mainline or community R3's 2.101.0.
I saw a "Needs: [3.0.99]" passing by already, so we should do something about that rather sooner than later.
One simplistic, conservative choice would be to reset to 2.102.0 for now, until we work out something better.
 
posted on July 19, 2015 by hostilefork

From @GrahamChiu, this request works in the Atronix build: read https://stackoverflow.com/users/login In Ren/C however, you get: ** Script error: message: word is not bound to a context ** Where: alert-close-notify parse do-commands if foreach switch foreach switch -apply- wake-up either while -apply- wait while sync-op either read ** Near: alert-close-notify ctx

 
@earl If it's what you think is best, works for me.
 
9:51 PM
"best" is relative, because tuple!s really kinda stink in their inflexibility for a general version identifier.
But let's fall back to 2.102.0 tomorrow, if we don't hear any objections until then.
 
"best under the circumstances" where we're trying to hopefully coax as many wayward Rebols to use it and have least frustration. :-) I think you can go ahead and do it now.
 
Ok.
Does HTTPS work for anyone at all, in the current Ren/C build?
 
I had it fetch something once early on but hadn't gotten back to it since just trying to get the build going.
So maybe it did work and broke, or maybe whatever I tested in that moment was a rare case that works.
Having never installed the Atronix build and used the HTTPS I didn't know what to expect. But I'm looking into fixing it now.
 
@HostileFork Done, Ren/C is 2.102.0 now, for the time being.
Published, versioned future releases can increment the third component, until we come up with something better.
(So 2.102.1, 2.102.2, ...)
@rgchris ^^ Take note, you'll have to adjust the Needs header in your curl wrapper.
 
@earl Thks.
 
10:04 PM
@moliad As far as I know, the current module system precisely intends to do (and it already does) the things you mention ("code hiding", "code protection"); it does them so strictly, that many (myself included) have had to fight a lot with it, to be able to use it at all.
 
@earl In terms of "things I've thought about" I've wondered about passing Rebol command line parameters of the --switch form and wondering exactly why it is that Rebol should take its configuration options like that. rebol --options "[{ } () foo: bar]" seems more liberating.
 
However, the module system completely lacks documentation (both, design and usage); has a few outstanding issues which aim to improve usability; it's original designers are both not around at the moment; and it has no tests at all.
 
I haven't been looking at the shell lore lately since Ren Garden's dialect, but don't the shells have ways to throw variables into strings anyway?
 
So it's very hard to really figure out what the module system intends to achieve and how it is intended to be used. We will have to fix that, somewhen.
2
Maybe, BrianH finds some time somewhen, to help more comprehensively paint the picture of what's already there.
@HostileFork Please, don't. Let Rebol be a good citizen in integrating with shells, make it easier to do so, not harder. It's already broken in so many ways :/
It's not so much about "throwing variables into strings" but about all the escaping mess that this entails.
 
Well perhaps it could support both forms, but I just feel like sometimes if you want to say something configurey it would be nice if you could do it with the smoothness that the --do "[{...} ...]" has
 
10:10 PM
If that configurey thing ends up in system/options, and boot phasing works for you, then you can have the smoothness of --do already (via --do! :).
But of course, both is certainly fine with me. I just want to make Rebol a first-class Linux scripting citizen as well, which requires proper command-line integration.
(And stdio, including stderr piping, and signal handling, and ...)
 
@earl, oh speaking of git kung fu
1
Q: Why does a no-op filter-branch create divergence, and how do I fix that?

HostileForkI have a situation where I merged a couple-years-worth of commits into a repository. One of the commits had a comment which was a paste of an Address Sanitizer log related to the fix. That doesn't sound so bad, except address Sanitizer logs look like this: ==10856==ERROR: AddressSanitizer: hea...

So you've probably noticed Shixin popping up on every issue
There's the why and me trying to fix it
And finding suggestions to use sed, and remembering something I already knew which is... sed sucks
Wondering if Rebol could be re-engineered a bit to perform the stream-rewriting role with some kind of minor effort, with some kind of dialect. PARSE isn't quite about rewriting where the default is "pass through but munge this pattern if you find it"
It seems though even if it just went line by line, people use that.
 
@HostileFork Yep, that would be nice.
 
rebol --linerewriter "[...rules...]" < input > output
 
Proper stdio + PARSE with COLLECT.
 
Anyway, @iceflow19 was looking at the problem from the address sanitizer logs and did this: chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/291?m=24534054#24534054
 
10:20 PM
Heh.
 
In any case, I think the "commented on an issue" pingback spam things seem like they're some kind of permanent thing we'll have to ask GitHub to delete
 
Which is equivalent to git filter-branch -f --msg-filter "sed 's/#//g'" -- --all is it not :) ?
 
But, rewriting those # things out of the history and affecting all the history up through current Ren/C branches isn't a bad thing to try and get those numbers out before asking.
See the answer to my question above
 
@HostileFork Hmm, should I quickly try and do that?
 
@earl If you would that would be great. Though as I mention, I think really fixing it will involve talking to GitHub
It's actually not just one commit also, it's several in that little time range.
 
10:22 PM
@HostileFork No idea if issue references automatically vanish, at some point in time, if the commit is "garbage collected".
 
It doesn't happen instantly, at least.
 
Ok.
$ git log --pretty=oneline --abbrev-commit --grep=asan
69dba1a Fix a crash caused by integer underflow
9323829 Fix an alloc-dealloc-mismatch
667561c Fix a memory leak
21dae6b Fix a heap-buffer-overflow
84c101d Do not increase tail before extension
 
Think I got the shape right...
Hm, that one didn't work :(
 
@earl Let me know when to hold off on committing...
 
@HostileFork What to change the # to? Just remove it?
 
10:37 PM
@earl That seems fine.
 
Or .... Unicode ... № :) ?
 
That seems less fine. :-)
 
See the fork in the middle?
 
@GrahamChiu Doesn't seem the best 'C' to be emulating (unless you're dabbling in some classing games).
 
10:45 PM
Back to our roots
 
@rgchris In case you missed it: polygon.com/2015/7/16/8983359/…
 
apologies to the Spectrum, BBC micro, and Amstrad users
 
@HostileFork You stating your preference for a more shapely 'C'?
 
@rgchris Nope, just we were talking about inspirations. I like it as is
 
Ok, I think this one is similar to your hacked 'C' just tidying up the edges/shadows.
 
10:51 PM
Good good
Hum, rebol.net is down and where Google would previously have brought up pages from it it is not bringing them up in search. For instance "Rebol Parse Project" isn't bringing up the usual page, "rebol logo docbase" brings up nothing for me.
Is Google turning into "instant disappearance from the cache" for things that are down?
 
@earl I did originally have Needs: [shell] but that croaked.
 
11:06 PM
@HostileFork What are you looking for?
 
@GrahamChiu Oh just was looking to go see the logo docbase page. Nothing important just noticed that it didn't come up, when it used to be first page for "rebol logo". Then I saw rebol.net was down and wondered if being down was insta-penalty from Google to where you don't even know about it to check the cached page
Which seems to be suggested by not being able to find "rebol parse project"
 
well, as of 2 years ago
So, it's my broken mirror
 
@GrahamChiu 5 years of bad luck
remaining.
There's a lot of stuff to go through, and especially CureCode
Documentation needs cleanup for "nobody needs to bother with this" as much as code does.
I guess I should go ahead and myself mirror the Rebol Logo Design page for personal relevance (with the pictures).
Bing has "Rebol logo docbase" bring up the non-functional page as top hit, and has a cache. If Google is really going to real-time not show me what sites are down that are more persistently relevant, then I will be giving serious thought to search engine default switching
 
@HostileFork wayback machine??
 
Wayback machine does not generally seem to make my pages much of a priority to hold onto.
 
11:18 PM
$ git cat-file -p 20b9cd59c6c6a1a2bccfb2ddb9af68c083a28698
tree dee80bcd856b23aceb8946473bf64d9aef0fe629
parent b12dc8b9388dc0a2ae34563426043a612d296195
author Delyan Angelov <delian66@gmail.com> 1355477802 +0200
committer Delyan Angelov <delian66@gmail.com> 1355478447 +0200
encoding cp1251

Add the -m32 option for the Linux x64 target to the linker-flags.
 
Is that a particularly interesting historical commit, or one that did something strange?
 
@HostileFork Whitness the encoding cp1251. That's another (the?) culprit for your seemingly innocuous identity rewrite to create havoc.
 
Windows-1251 is a popular 8-bit character encoding, designed to cover languages that use the Cyrillic script such as Russian, Bulgarian, Serbian Cyrillic and other languages. It is the most widely used for encoding the Bulgarian, Serbian and Macedonian languages. In modern applications, Unicode is a preferred character set. 2.4% of all web pages use Windows-1251 in July 2014. Windows-1251 and KOI8-R (or its Ukrainian variant KOI8-U) are much more commonly used than ISO 8859-5. In the future, both may eventually give way to Unicode. == Code page layout == The following table shows Windows-1251....
2.4% of all web pages in 2014, hm.
 
msg-filter gets the raw message, no encoding meta-information. So even when you use an 8-bit transparent msg-filter (such as a plain cat), the re-created commit won't contain that encoding meta-information.
 
@GrahamChiu I do happen to have the images...
 
11:23 PM
(That's slightly imprecise, because the filter gets the encoding information, it could read it via the GIT_COMMIT env variable. It's the output, that doesn't control encoding. At least I don't know how. Anyway, now that the culprit is identified, it's easy to work around.)
 
@rgchris one more unfinished project of mine :(
 
@rgchris @GrahamChiu I have a full scrape of rebol.net from somewhen as well.
 
@GrahamChiu Mine too—I still have a work-in-progress media-wiki->make-doc/adoc processor.
 
but at least mine is online :)
 
@earl If you can't use msg-filter is the workaround to set a branch and start there? I was trying to figure out how to get it to start its rewrites at the commit before the address sanitizer commits but couldn't get the syntax right.
 
11:28 PM
@GrahamChiu So's mine, but I challenge you to find it :)
 
@HostileFork The workaround I'm trying is to control where the rewrite starts, yes.
That might not work, because of the shape of this commit graph, though. Haven't yet tried.
@HostileFork Has Atronix ever merged with rebol/rebol or rebolsource/r3?
Or is your merge the first commit that that ties those two subgraphs together?
$ git merge-base zsx/atronix rebolsource/master
$
Nope, never merged.
 
@earl Atronix's repo says it's forked from rebolsource on GitHub, but my tying in was the merge of the atronix branch.
 
Ok, so let's try to rewrite just from Atronix/Saphirion's origin.
 
And I did filter it to get rid of all the embedded binaries and stuff
 
Yep, a good deed.
 
11:37 PM
Because it was taking noticeably longer to clone and rather large
But in doing so, likely making many more of the pingbacks with new commit IDs
(I hadn't noticed the issue yet)
 
We could also graft a proper history together, as I once did for Saphirion. But that was a bit annoying, as far as I remember.
ab75c8f96df17c170477484504baab518b4b5dec is the initial commit of the Atronix/Saphirion lineage.
 
I think my ultimate thought on this is that I would be okay in the whitespace rewrite with flattening Ren/C down such that it only includes enough distinct commits that actually wind up in the repository. Some sort of flattening where you'd get the blame view as it would be with the full repository, but nothing else.
 
Ah, I don't think we need a rewrite for the whitespace changes.
Most Git commands have whitespace sensitivity toggles, blame included.
So a plain commit should do just fine.
But I also think that holding off on this for a while is prudent.
 
I do rely upon GitHub for these things, I dunno if they have a switch for the whitespace.
A lot of things are about sending links, and I like to be able to link to things.
 
?w=1 does the trick for diffs, haven't tried it with blame.
Doesn't seem to work for blame.
 
11:55 PM
Well, if it's not just me then compromises are fine if it helps it be not just me. Though from my point of view, I guess it's a tradeoff and a question of how many people will want to talk about commit IDs across repositories by their numbers and have them not change. I am thinking I'd pretty much unhook Ren/C from Rebol so it's not forked from Rebol any longer, so basically delete repo and recreate anyway. So I'm discouraging design discussions in the issues or anything persistent.
And flattening it all out so it clones faster, but has a blame view for who wrote what, is enough. I don't really think there's all that much great knowledge in the history that is lost, and so it's fine by me that if someone wants to go back beyond the "who wrote what line and what was the comment on that commit" surface that they use another repository to do so.
As long as all that's happening, a whitespace rewrite seems like "you might as well".
A large number of commits would just vanish in such a process, if a commit only touched the GUI code but nothing else.
 
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