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10:00
@jalf That's the same @RMartinhoFernandes posted?
@LewsTherin well, understanding your code isn't just "what it does", but also "how it does it". Which algorithm is used, what is it's big-O complexity, how much memory does it use, and is there a better algorithm that could be used
@LewsTherin oh, possibly. I didn't check his link :)
@LewsTherin Yes.
@jalf Agh, I don't know all that big O stuff. Too much maths
The Golden Rule is to not do what many answers on that question do: guess.
@LewsTherin You really don't need to know a lot of math.
@LewsTherin eh, count how many nested loops you have and you're 90% there
10:02
@jalf I only have one nested for loop. But I don't think it's a n*n times
@RMartinhoFernandes The only one I know is n*n lol
@LewsTherin why not? Remember that big-O notation is only an upper bound. So it's always safe to round up
@LewsTherin Surely you know linear (O(N)) and constant (O(1)) as well, no?
anyway, see if you can find a better algorithm first. That requires you to know your code, and know something about the algorithms developed to solve similar problems
I really have no idea what you guys are saying lol
@RMartinhoFernandes I think I know linear(O(N))
And most of the time you don't need to figure out the complexity of an algorithm yourself. Just look it up.
10:05
What if you write your own algorithm?
Then you do as jalf said. Start by counting the loops :)
Not a surefire method, but good for many cases.
@LewsTherin the same applies. Figure out roughly how costly your algorithm is. Look at what your options are. Can you use something developed by others?
if you can't find a better algorithm, you have to optimize what you've got, which requires you to understand what code is actually executed, as well as how it is executed (how the CPU and RAM and other hardware handles your code)
and requires you to benchmark and profile your code to see what is actually eating up most of the execution time
of course, in practice most people don't know all the things we've mentioned. So you optimize what you can based on what you know
That sounds complicated.
So how do I know inefficient my algorithm is? It sounds stupid, but I haven't a clue
@LewsTherin you don't. Inefficiency has to be measured relative to something. If your algorithm is slow, but it's impossible to make it faster, then it's not inefficient. ;)
@LewsTherin Well, you know because the code is noticeably failing expectations.
10:09
it's only inefficient if there's a faster solution
Then you profile.
so to judge whether something is inefficient, you have to know how fast it could be
Omfg. All that sounds awfully cryptic :O
@LewsTherin yup. The point in optimization is that you usually don't have the answers in advance. If I knew what my code should look like in order to be fast, I'd have written it that way to begin with. ;)
What's cryptic?
10:11
@jalf xD yeah. Valid point...
so you typically have some code that's written to the best of one's ability, and you have to figure out if it could be faster, and if it could, how to make it so
so benchmark, profile, measure. Make a change based on your knowledge of the hardware, the algorithm, the compiler or whatever else, then measure again to see if it improved performance
@jalf I guess there are books on this. I had some books but they had too much symbols so I threw them away
@jalf If it is dependent on hardware, isn't optimization virtually impossible?
or is it dependent on hardware?
@LewsTherin well, if you want to get good at something, you'll have to learn. Sad, but true. ;)
Poor books. They're homeless now.
@jalf I wish I had a good algorithms lecturer lol
10:14
@LewsTherin yes and no. Some things are generally true (memory is slow, pretty much regardless of which hardware you're running on), and nearly ever CPU today is pipelined, has a cache and so on. There are a lot of commonalities, and so performance-wise they have a lot in common
@RMartinhoFernandes And some homeless dude will pick it up, read it and be the next Mark :)
but if you know you're optimizing for a radically different CPU then you have to understand how that works, and throw away your assumptions based on how everything else works
for regular PCs, the differences are pretty small. Code that's fast on an AMD cpu will also be fast on an Intel CPU
So sometimes there is no point in optimizing code..
But I guess one has to figure out that "sometime"
@LewsTherin what I meant is that most of the time, your optimizations will help regardless of hardware
if you speed up your code when it runs on your CPU, then it's very likely to also run faster on mine
@jalf oh then there is every reason to optimize code ha ha.
Btw, Visual Studio 2011 programs won't run on XP/Vista anymore.
10:18
Why do you say that?
No VC11Redist for Vista?
@LewsTherin I heard it was just XP that was getting cut
Vista should work afaik
Let me see if I can find it again
It's understandable that all that Underground Train thing won't work on Vista. But I'd expect the "normal" stuff to still work.
Microsoft Visual Studio is an integrated development environment (IDE) from Microsoft. It is used to develop console and graphical user interface applications along with Windows Forms applications, web sites, web applications, and web services in both native code together with managed code for all platforms supported by Microsoft Windows, Windows Mobile, Windows CE, .NET Framework, .NET Compact Framework and Microsoft Silverlight. Visual Studio includes a code editor supporting IntelliSense as well as code refactoring. The integrated debugger works both as a source-level debugger and a m...
You are right @jalf apparently only XP
A change in interface would have been nice.
Is it just me, or did the question title font change on SO?
10:38
@RMartinhoFernandes it's incredibly subtle if it did
The profiler isn't even letting me run the program. How does it work then
@LewsTherin dunno, I have no clue which profiler you're using :p
@LewsTherin this is sad. i transferred straight from xp to windows 7. xp was much better.
@jalf TPTP if it helps lol. But I thought it would let me run the program and it would profile it. It is profiling something though.
@AlfPSteinbach Disagree! I prefer 7 :)
10:41
but a surprisingly effective way to profile your code without a dedicated profiler is just to stop the program a couple of times in the debugger. Each time note the precise line of code for each frame in the call stack. Summarize the results, and the line of code that popped up most often in your samples is the first thing you should look at optimizing
Random sampling! Statistics at work.
@jalf The effort :)
Windows 7 is way better than Windows XP
@RMartinhoFernandes yup. Point is that you're looking for code that is on the call stack for a large proportion of the time (say, 50% or more). So statistically, you only need a couple of samples to find those parts of the code
@LewsTherin No pain, no gain.
Got it :)
10:45
Facepalm. No choice in the matter lmao
@DeadMG Yes!
it's kind of silly with commercial profilers which take millions of samples... Just to find the piece of code where 80% of the time is being spent. It just shouldn't be that hard ;)
Gotta go now. So take care dudes. Talk later :)
Sorry, but no. We're going to talk right now.
@LewsTherin i tried an Explorer fix thingy but it didn't help. they've lobotomized the whole OS. i am particularly annoyed at Explorer's folder listing, which jumps vertically when I select a folder, so that the next click goes to some totally unrelated place. then i get these visions of torturing and killing the responsible imbecile. and then, it forces me to think about how bad a human being i must be to think that, and so I hate the thing.
I have no idea what you're talking about.
10:48
@AlfPSteinbach it seems to be Microsoft policy to mutilate Explorer a bit more with every release
It is, of course, not particularly reproducible.
but on the whole, I prefer Win7 by far
just not Explorer
However, that and some other stuff was enough that people have created Explorer alternatives
Who uses Explorer anyway?
Anyway, try opening folder options and check 'Automatically expand to current folder'. That makes it a bit saner IMO
11:34
> I think it would be a fine language which simply took C++-with-concepts, ripped out the whole object-oriented and virtual functions half of it, cleaned up the syntax and other warts, and added existential types for when you want runtime dynamic dispatch.
Shame about the concepts, but it sounded like the entire idea wasn't quite fleshed out enough. It wasn't just that it was unimplementable in practice...
Why unimplementable?
@RMartinhoFernandes well, there's no implementation of it. The partial implementation that did exist hurt compile-times quite a bit
Oh, I wasn't probing for evidence, but for explanations :)
can't help you there. ;)
11:50
@RMartinhoFernandes Well, "practically" unimplementable, because of the complexity.
@KerrekSB in fairness though, doesn't that describe most of C++? ;)
I don't have an analysis, I just noticed that nobody could do it, and many clever people were trying. I'm not sure if there are even any studies about the theoretical complexities involved.
@jalf I wouldn't say that. Concepts add a whole new level of validation checking. Current C++ basically leaves it up to the author to write the correct thing and is happy to abort compilation at the drop of a hat.
All the existing organically grown baggage probably hurts a lot.
I think concepts would have demanded a far deeper conceptual code analysis on part of the compiler.
@RMartinhoFernandes I'm not sure. Just imagine for a moment what sort of constraints concepts would have allowed you to specify. That's basically a whole new language all on its own.
@KerrekSB Axioms were not supposed to be checkable, were they?
11:54
The very motivation for them was that current template programming exposes the user to extremely obscure errors because the compiler can only report on what it sees at the end of all the substitutions. But the very pain the user feels is now supposed to be solved by the compiler. Someone has to pay the price.
@KerrekSB but again, that statement is true for most parts of a compiler
@RMartinhoFernandes I'm not sure, but I'm sure that you could specify things freely enough to make checking a very demanding task...
even the most fundamental: "the pain the user feels when writing asm directly is now supposed to be solved by the compiler. Someone has to pay the price" ;)
@KerrekSB Wouldn't it be akin to compiling with a stub archetype generated by the compiler?
@jalf That's true, but many other aspects are far more local and straight-forward. Arguably, the whole template stuff is already the most complex part at the moment, but I think that's still straight-forward compared to concepts.
11:56
@KerrekSB Seems like axioms were not mandated to be checked.
Doing that would be insane.
(Mainly substitutions and deductions.)
Not even GHC is crazy enough to do that. We have the monad laws on paper, but the compiler only enforces signatures.
I see.
Well... what's the state of concept-gcc then?
Silly question:
0
A: How to avoid implicit calling of a one-parameter contructor

Alf P. SteinbachSimple: enum FromString { fromString }; ComponentName( FromString, std::wstring const& aName) : name( aName ) {} Cheers & hth.,

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12:04
@Fred: I finally took the time to change that blog posting to forward to the new video list on the wiki.
Just as a way to give back to SO, I'm thinking of making an app for people who use Outlook. Does anyone think an SO-enabled Outlook Social Connector would be a good / bad idea? blogs.office.com/b/microsoft-outlook/archive/2009/11/18/…
@KerrekSB abandoned, dead and forgotten ;)
even back when the decision to drop concepts was taken, conceptGCC was way out of date, and only partially implemented a very old draft of the feature
@makerofthings7 no clue. I don't use Outlook and don't really feel a need to be Connected :p But there are a lot of people using SO, so it's almost guaranteed to be useful to some
@makerofthings7 probably interesting thing to do. i once bought a book about programming outlook just because it's so rich a thing, like a whole universe (reportedly ms once meant to windows as outlook-like as possible, it was the time of "document-centric" and other impractical ideas). but i never got started on it, so it still languishes in my programming book-case
@AlfPSteinbach I had to do some Outlook plugin programming at my old job. That was just painful
but I'm sure there are less painful APIs for it than what I had to use. Had to maintain some old, crappy code
@AlfPSteinbach Speaking of Document-centric, I was impressed by OLE when I copied/pasted a chart from Excel to Outlook, changed a value in the Excel doc, and then a draft message in Outlook updated and reflected the changes. Wasn't expecting that!! Though I can't see it being a useful feature.
12:14
@AlfPSteinbach I wonder if you can make it fail by throwing some trick with ADL into the mix
or a specialisation in the std namespace would be legal too
@awoodland ?
I don't understand. What's so bad about std::map<T, T>?
@AlfPSteinbach - I was thinking of trying to make something that is different (i.e. an error) when calling the constructor from the assignment operator of std::pair
although a partial specialisation of std::pair on the ComponentName type would also be legal
if tedious
@awoodland is it? Aren't the only specializations you can make in std full specializations (and only of functions, I think?)
can't remember tbh
@jalf - I thought the rule was any user defined type could be used for a specialisation in std
it must be more than just functions though because otherwise it's impossible to do traits sensibly
12:27
hmm, I'm pretty sure partial specializations aren't allowed, at least
I'm probably wrong about functions only
don't have a copy of the standard here though, so can't back it up :)
I'm on it :)
@awoodland Specializations of traits are explicitly forbidden.
@RMartinhoFernandes I thought the whole point of std::iterator_traits was that you could specialize it as well as going via the typedefs
@awoodland Oh, specializations of some traits are forbidden.
morning
12:30
Namely, things like std::is_fundamental.
@RMartinhoFernandes that means the rules are vastly more complicated than I realised
although the only thing you could do with that specialization would be to lie
§ 17.6.4.2.1 seems to be the start of the interesting bits
"A program may add a template specialization
for any standard library template to namespace std only if the declaration depends on a user-defined type
and the specialization meets the standard library requirements for the original template and is not explicitly
prohibited"
ah
so you're not allowed to lie ;)
I still don't see what's the issue with std::map<T, T>.
nothing?
> The original problem was how to work with std::map<std::wstring, std::wstring> in a secure way because equal types of the key and the value are extremely error-prone.
So the OP is being silly?
12:47
@RMartinhoFernandes I can kind of see the point for the motivation
yep
it's silly, imo- nothing wrong with std::map<T, T>
so the objective is what, to define a wrapper type so the key can have a distinct type?
there's nothing inherently wrong with wanting to force them to be different types
but you'd have fun, imo
you'd basically be talking about duping the whole functionality
Ok, imagine that was cooking and, let's call it an accident, I made the sauce way too spicy. Is it counterable?
@RMartinhoFernandes yoghurt/cream might help counter it
or just dilution
12:56
Oh neat, in that hypothetical situation I could add more cream then. Thanks.
:)
as if people need an excuse to add more cream :D
13:16
are minor typos in n3290 worth pointing out anywhere?
Dunno. But you can compile your own version free of typos :)
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@RMartinhoFernandes I know that yogurt helps. Cream I didn't know.
@sbi Yeah, it did help :)
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Carbohydrates (flour) helps with too much salt, BTW. Unfortunately, it also helps against all other tastes. :(
13:31
hmm does OpenGL specify how it handles NaN in e.g. glVertex3f() or a VBO?
in a VBO, it'll be handled however the shader program specifies
in glVertex3f, who cares? nobody should be using it anyway
@awoodland why would it handle them specially? If a vertex ends up with a NaN position, then it obviously won't be projected into the viewport
Here's an example of how much I suck at handling knives. I cut myself while washing one.
I'm looking for a way of drawing what usually would be a GL_LINE_LOOP, but occasionally might be missing some data
when the data is missing I want to see a gap
you can't
unless you handle it, specifically
13:35
so the easy way would be just to stick NaN in where the data is missing and avoid that special case
GL will certainly not magic it away- that's not how 3D graphics works
so is the behaviour of it defined then if it does get NaN thrown into the mix?
the vertex will probably get clipped
but how, exactly, I don't know
hmm I'll do it in a fragment shader I guess then
Any arithmetic with NaN will yield either NaN or a floating point exception.
The easiest way is to not produce NaNs in the first place.
13:38
true, the biologist that produced this data has fairly good experimental reasons for missing some values
realistically, you would have to manually partition the good data into several lines
and render them separately
> The result of providing a value that is not a floating-point number to such a command is unspecified, but must not lead to GL interruption or termination. In IEEE arithmetic, for example, providing a negative zero or a denormalized number to a GL command yields predictable results, while providing a NaN or an infinity yields unspecified results.
Maybe GLSL has isnan or something.
ok
how do I parse precedence and associativity?
chainr and chainl? Oh wait, you need to write them first :P
13:40
In >1.30.
lol
well, I got as far that an expression is basically going to be (literal | identifier) *(operator literal | identifier), give or take
but beyond that, I'm not sure how to write it
I write it with several levels, which works nice if the precedences are fixed.
expr = orExpr
primaryExpr = choice [qid, literal, between lparen rparen expr]
multExpr = primaryExpr `chainl` (choice [times, divide, modulo])
addExpr = multExpr `chainl` (choice [plus, minus])
relExpr = addExpr `chainl` (choice [less, greater, lessThan, greaterThan])
eqExpr = relExpr `chainl` (choice [eq, neq])
andExpr = eqExpr `chainl` logicAnd
orExpr = andExpr `chainl` logicOr
13:56
hmm
could I structure the functions just like that?
I think all you need to write is the chainl combinator (and chainr for right-associative stuff).
yeah
right-associative stuff is
thisExpr = otherExpr shit thisExpr;
and left-associative stuff is
thisExpr = thisExpr shit otherExpr;
and precedence is defined by which Exprs go in which order
hmm
I need a new strategy for dealing with left associativity
or maybe not
the full rule would have to be thisExpr = thisExpr shit otherExpr | otherExpr; right?
Right, the operator and one of the sides is optional.
14:04
right
so what I'd say is
while(lookahead(shit)) { parse current token as thisExpr; } ParseOtherExpr();
For left-assoc, yes.
Well, better.
The body of the loop is ParseOtherExpr.
You don't really need/want the recursion.
did I mention how much I hate pointers to pointers to pointers ? char*** == hatred
And the order is wrong, as that won't make the operator infix.
@IntermediateHacker Why do you do it?
Besides argv, I'm a single star programmer :P
hmm, I don't get it
@RMartinhoFernandes Because 5 months ago I was a fool.
My past code base is embarassing.
14:09
that's what I've got for another left-assoc rule and it worked just fine
@IntermediateHacker That's normal. That's good, actually.
2
and that rule comes from the form thisShit = otherShit | otherShit '.' thisShit;
which is right-associative, I guess
so I refactored it into thisShit = otherShit *('.' otherShit)
Did I also mention how much I like the STL? especially std::vector , it's a life saver.
@RMartinhoFernandes - maybe you were right:
@IntermediateHacker Welcome to Modern C++ :D
14:11
in Tavern on the Meta on Meta Stack Overflow Chat, 5 mins ago, by Popular Demand
Was there a font change ~12 hours ago?
OMG, I'm not insane.
I'm wondering now if I don't have the new font on my system or something
so left-associative, I'd refactor into thisShit = *(otherShit '.') otherShit;
@DeadMG I don't get it. How does that succeed for "identifer dot identifier"?
well, you start with identifier, and then as long as there's another dot to consume, you know to expect another identifier to consume
14:14
I don't see the "start with identifier" part.
the second and third lines
I start by adding the current token's string value to the vector and then incrementing past that token
Shouldn't you have a test against Wide::Lexer::TokenType::Identifier as well?
no
the only way the parser knows to call that recursive function is if it already checked that token to be an identifier
if it was something else, why would the parser call that function?
14:16
Now that makes sense.
so all functions can assume their first token to be valid
you know, I wanted to write a recursive ascent parser, but my current grammar is looking more descent :(
or maybe I'm just being biased because ANTLR was LL and it supported the clean regex syntax, and the other stuff didn't
lols!
pointers , pointers and pointers.... that's all.
14:19
right
now I have a bigger problem
how can I lookahead(shit) when it's going to be way more than one token?
How so? Aren't your operators single tokens?
Google Code's git branchy visualization thing is pretty cool!
uh, not all of them, but that's not what I meant
I meant more it's going to be way more than one token until I find it
if I'm doing addExpr and there's a mulExpr first, then it's going to be more than one token until I find '+'
Ah, but if you call the mulExpr parser first, it will munch everything and stop at +.
right
I guess that for a rule of that form, you can guarantee in a well-formed input that it must start with one mulExpr
since you can't exactly have + mulExpr; on it's own, for binary infix anyway
14:23
Exactly.
so I know that there must be a valid mulExpr there
just like I knew that the thing had to start with an identifier
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@IntermediateHacker If you look back at code you wrote 5 years ago and do not have the urge to throw it all away and rewrite it according to what you have learned since, you have not learned enough in the last five years.
@sbi Hell, that happens every six hours for me
What about hello worlds?
:P
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@DeadMG I was considering whether five years isn't too long for you young ones. :-/
Looks like it.
right
now I feel a tad more confident, now that I know that I basically already wrote this shit before, just this shit needs a few more options, and that's it
@sbi Does that mean I am not as stupid as I thought, and even expert are embarassed of their past code?
could it be that I am finally going up the intermediate level?
should I change my name to advanced hacker?
@IntermediateHacker - I have some terrible code hidden in my closet
everyone has shitty code written when they were a learner
even I, though it embarrasses me greatly
14:34
@IntermediateHacker Having learned and improved since you wrote that code isn't something to be embarassed about
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@IntermediateHacker I wouldn't know about experts, but I can't remember ever looking at old code of mine and not thinking "hey, why didn't I do it this way?" Of course, the more you learn the older the code has to be before you think that. (I'm not sure whether that's because the learning curve is asymptotic or because I become to rigid in my thinking.)
and the experience you gained from writing bad code and subsequently realising it was bad is 100x greater than reading any book
it is
I found it to be a much more effective tool than many other forms of learning
@sbi by experts I meant you.
hey
14:35
@DeadMG Don't feel left out, maybe he meant "you" in the plural.
(there's a lot of people in this room who I'd consider to be more knowledgeable than myself when it comes to C++)
i meant @DeadMG too.
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@IntermediateHacker Careful. After dragging my students (in ~15 lessons and as much lab work in a semester) all the way from "Hello, world!" to factorial<5>::value, I always told them that they now know enough to apply for novice status.
if he releases the source code of WideC.
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14:36
@IntermediateHacker I know, and I answered accordingly.
I will
right now, I've been thinking that I'll release it as "Pay what you want"
it's been a very successful business plan for small games, etc
any thoughts on this - is it even possible to comply with the standard here?
0
Q: Excluding std::pair constructors that use explicit construction

awoodlandFollowing on from this answer, it seems these constructors: template<class U, class V> pair(pair<U, V>&& p); template<class U, class V> pair(const pair<U, V>& p); are forbidden from participating in overload resolution when they would require an explicit co...

Will it be available in colors other than black?
do you want to see an instructive Windows program?
I wonder what the people who wrote windows 2000 feel like when they look at their past code? suicidal?
14:37
will what be available in colours other than black?
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@RMartinhoFernandes From a guy with the nick "DeadMG"?!
it'll be available in whatever colour your IDE likes to colour it as
@sbi I fail to see the connection.
@IntermediateHacker I always thought of windows 2000 as the first sane version of modern windows
14:38
@awoodland No, IMO that was NT 4
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@RMartinhoFernandes In my culture, death is usually represented by the color of black.
Windows 2000 was horrible...
@DeadMG You know, I have this assignment (also a parser) pretty much done, with a shitton of extras, and now you're making me want to write it again.
lol
why?
Because I'm itching to write some more Haskell parsing code :)
14:39
lol
I still don't know if my parser is recursive descent or recursive ascent
They can be mixed.
lovely :P
@sbi sometimes, the reason you think "why didn't I do it this way about old code is simply that you've forgotten all the reasons why it won't work ;)
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@IntermediateHacker Actually it wasn't. I switched to Win2k (from NT4) the first time I saw it, and despite the fact that XP was published only about a year later, I refused to use it until I was forced to due to drivers for 2k betting hard to come by. (I don't think I switched to XP before 2007.)
I also don't really know why I care so much
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14:41
@jalf No. For me the obvious answer usually is that I didn't know that way back then.
@DeadMG Because you're careful?
@sbi yeah, that too. But sometimes you try the obvious way, and find out it won't work, so you have to do it the hard way instead. And then a year later you look at the code and go "why didn't I do it the obvious way?"
@DeadMG When I write it by hand, I really don't give a fuck. It's readable, works well, what difference does it make how it's classified?
@sbi I am?
@RMartinhoFernandes Tis true, I like mine, it's way better than I expected
at least I do that
unless I'm clever enough to leave myself a comment saying why the obvious way won't work
// I'm clever!
real comment found in the WideC codebase
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14:44
@jalf TBH, I don't think I know that feeling.
along with
// Dear Future Me: don't even think you can eliminate this loop
// by frobbing the quxes. I tried and it won't work.
// Tiny bits of credit go to @RMartinhoFernandes.
// A grain of credit on a beach.
// A tiny sliver of a needle of credit in a haystack.
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14:45
@DeadMG You know, when I find comments like I'm clever! in a codebase, that's a big read warning sign. Or, actually, this reads "run!"
lol
normally, I expect that it would
but I normally litter my codebase with such comments whilst I'm waiting for my BF3 server to change map
@sbi very nice paper on operator overloading in c++-faq , gave me more deeper insight , thanks
so it's not indicative of much
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@user411102 Oh, so the flurry of upvotes a minute ago were yours? :) Thank you for the praise.
@DeadMG See, there you just provided a perfectly fine reason to run from such code.
lol
it's not usually written then
I just go back and do it because I can
then every so often I look and it looks ridiculous so I clean them all out
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14:48
@DeadMG See, another reason.
well, I guess you could argue that the fact that code was written by me is an excellent idea to run away from it
although on another note, it's also hard to argue that I've got a "codebase" here
it's like, 5-600 lines
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@DeadMG Of course I could, but why would I embarrass you like this in public?
My lexer clocks at 178 lines, with 126 being basically lists of token values and their string representations. The parser has 643 lines with 160 being lists of AST node type.
I habitually embarrass myself at virtually every opportunity, so
The grammar is now as big as the C++ grammar (in size, not insanity).
14:53
damn, I very nearly just wrote ExpressionAST* lhs, rhs;
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@DeadMG Yeah, that's one thing I would agree with you about you being an absolute genius.
@DeadMG Have u coded a C++ or C Api for WideC yet? I really need an easily embeddable language.
haha
I once wrote a language that was intended to be easy to embed, but I stopped when I remembered that C++ sucked
@DeadMG Oh, focus.
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@DeadMG Are you laughing at @IntermediateHacker?
14:54
and therefore I couldn't implement what I wanted
yep
and WideC is not an embedding language
damn, guess I'll have to resort to Lua .....
some Lua binding frameworks make it survivable to use
@sbi In any case, I don't expect you to recognize my genius until it's compiling and executing in front of you :)
sbi
sbi
@DeadMG It's actually executing in front of me all the time. (I mean, when are you not wasting your time here?) That's why I have such a strong opinion about it, after all.
true true
technically, I'm not wasting my time here when I'm either learning something, which is pretty rare since it's usually you guys learning from me, or I'm asleep
sbi
sbi
14:59
@DeadMG Why do you think we learn from you? Most of us are past the bragging phase, already.
for me, I doubt it'll be a phase

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