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10:03 PM
@JohanLarsson I obviously just write them and get them totally correct first time because I am the spirit of perfection.
 
Ok osmosis is my friend then.
 
@JohanLarsson I've never created a truth table when using bools.
 
me neither
 
I also have never done such a thing.
 
boolean logic is pretty intuitive.
so I just write what I think..
 
10:13 PM
I don't know what I was fishing for reallly :)
 
@Rapptz it is simple when things are simple ime
 
I once saw Robyn at a festival. But the mass of screaming girls drove me away.
 
@JohanLarsson Even complex ones are easy.
 
10:15 PM
:)
 
Relative to everything else in programming anyway
 
hmm
considering adding properties to Wide as an extension.
 
as in extension properties?
 
no, I mean, as in an extension of the compiler libraries.
I figure it'll be easier to argue that my design is modular if I actually have a feature or two that I built that way.
 
10:22 PM
Is Wide widely used?
 
It's used by 1 person.
 
It kinda seems like you can only draw inspiration from C# and C++.
Perhaps you should widen your horizons a little ;)
 
nah, the other stuff just isn't really a target for phase one
 
FOUND THE CABLE
 
(and most of it would plain never work in Wide anyway)
 
10:25 PM
Aspects would be cool. Log all the things!
 
meh
 
Why do they call it "aspects" instead of "logging"?
 
There are various aspects to logging.
 
The #stackexchange data explorer is back online! We're done for the day, but will be giving it more memory later.
 
Q: What is aspect oriented programming?
A: Fancy pants logging.
4
 
10:29 PM
hmm
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I laughed.
 
I just realized that C++'s optional, as normally phrased, is somewhat substandard.
in yet another way.
 
@Puppy I think you meant something else.
It is, by definition, standard.
Or will be really soon.
 
heh
well, it just occurred to me that it has a complex copy constructor when it really doesn't always need one.
 
What's wrong with std::optional now?
 
10:30 PM
it only needs one if T is non-trivially copy constructible.
you'd have to SFINAE the shit out of it to get the proper behaviour
 
@Puppy Uh?
 
@EtiennedeMartel optional<int> should be trivially copiable
 
@EtiennedeMartel If you have optional<int>, there's no reason you can't memcpy that around. It's only composed of an integer's storage and a boolean.
 
if T is trivially copyable, then optional<T> should be too.
 
10:31 PM
You can still make a proposal though
 
nah, I'm just thinking about how I would address this problem in Wide.
 
@Puppy but does it cause lot's of runtime overhead in optimized build?
 
the reference implementation doesn't seem that complex..
 
@StackedCrooked I'm not sure about lots, but definitely some.
 
I feel like I'm missing something
 
10:32 PM
@Rapptz The actual complexity is fairly irrelevant. What matters is that the compiler views it as complex, because it's user-defined.
and being complex means all sorts of stuff on the ABI/implementation level.
 
I didn't mention "complexity"
I mentioned complex as in how difficult it is
 
right, that's what I meant with "complexity" too.
 
okay just making sure
 
Optional as return type is probably elided move. Optional as member is not very optimal anyway since the internal bool flag doubles the object size.
 
You make it seem like this is terrible but all it is is a placement new
 
10:34 PM
not.. really.
 
@StackedCrooked You can have trivially copiable types larger than 1
 
placement new requires careful placement. cpu must invest cycles in that.
 
This is the reference implementation provided by the proposal
 
@Mr.kbok Yeah, I just mean that if you want performance then compact data layouts are probably important as well.
 
right, but like I said, the actual implementation of the copy constructor is more-or-less irrelevant.
because it's user-defined, the compiler has to make special care in the implementation.
 
10:35 PM
@Rapptz Yes, and he means that : is already too much implementation.
 
for example, you can't store it in a pair of registers.
 
@StackedCrooked sure
 
Trivial copy could be enabled with tag-type overload on copy constructor, not?
 
@Puppy You can if you're smart enough, but it needs more smarts than it would with an implementation that preserved trivial copies.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You can if you can prove that the constructor body always has the same effect as a trivial copy.
and also you don't need to cross ABI boundaries like cross-TU boundaries.
 
10:37 PM
@Puppy No, at most you need to prove that it has that effect in that specific case. Not "always"
 
user1804599
> Today, the facility is being used to process and assemble NASA’s Orion spacecraft, which the agency will use to send astronauts to an asteroid in the 2020s and Mars in the 2030s.
 
user1804599
Nice.
 
Also fuck people who throw parties on weekdays
 
template <class T>
constexpr bool operator<(const optional<T>& x, const optional<T>& y) {
  return (!y) ? false : (!x) ? true : *x < *y;
}
// scratching hair..
 
@rightfold An asteroid that they will grab and put in orbit of the Moon.
 
user1804599
10:38 PM
@StackedCrooked Rewrite please.
 
@rightfold It's from @Rapptz!
hehe
 
I didn't write it
 
you posted it
that makes you responsible
 
anyway
 
I think it's fine.
 
10:39 PM
all I'm saying is that in the proposed implementation, information is lost that needn't be.
 
It reads as "none is never larger; none is always smaller; less-than the values otherwise"
 
incidentally
 
Yeah. It just took me a while to see it.
 
and I should consider how to make it easy to preseve in Wide.
 
I wrote it the same exact way
 
10:40 PM
But it makes sense now.
 
return !rhs ? false : !lhs ? true : *lhs < *rhs;
._.
 
something like conditional default with a body otherwise would be the most obvious solution.
 
what's a word for something that is tastelessly over the top?
 
but I'm not sure if it's the right one.
 
if (!x) return false;
if (y) return true;
return *x < *y;
 
10:41 PM
it has to be constexpr
 
@StackedCrooked That's wrong.
 
I figured...
Indeed.
// I suck.
Dammit, this is the type of code that I'm really bad at.
 
50
Q: Is there a shell-independent HUD-like menu search tool for Xfce/GNOME/Cinnamon?

RedsandroThe Ubuntu Heads-Up Display (HUD) - you love it or you hate it. Personally I rather like a classic desktop, so I use Xfce or GNOME-fork Cinnamon, and I'd like to keep those menu's where they are. But the HUD is pretty awesome when your menus are complex and you forgot where an option sits. This ...

rip
 
@StackedCrooked You mean if statements?
 
@StackedCrooked Er, gee, are you joking?
 
10:44 PM
@Mr.kbok yeah
 
I guess you should write truth tables before writing if statements like @JohanLarsson suggested.
 
It should return a optional<bool> :P
 
hmm
 
user1804599
 
@rightfold lol
 
10:46 PM
BTTF time travel flavour
 
I would simply not define operator== and operator< for optional.
 
why?
 
It might lead to suprises.
 
user1804599
Defining operator== not implying defining operator!= is ridiculous.
 
10:48 PM
@rightfold I disagree.
 
Lots of dicks in this webcomic. It was linked from xkcd
 
@rightfold Committee is working on that as an opt-in feature.
 
@rightfold Stepanov says this too.
 
those expression template guys would probably not like operator!= automatically implemented in terms of operator==.
I have it in Wide and it's slated for removal.
a Boost.Operators-esque is fine.
 
Expression templates are kinda special here.
 
10:49 PM
@StackedCrooked Yeah. Like not working as-is with std::map or std::set.
 
they're general enough in terms of a language feature.
 
user1804599
Preferably I’d only have to implement something like Haskell’s compare or Ruby’s <=>.
 
@rightfold You can already just use Boost.Operators.
 
Expression templates are a hack that avoids adding proper language features because C++ has an obsession with implementing hacks stuff in the library instead of the language.
 
arguably true, but you still need to consider their existence when suggesting new C++ language features.
 
user1804599
10:51 PM
@Puppy Neat. I should look up that library.
 
they're existing code as much as any other.
 
@rightfold It's just inheritance w/ CRTP.
 
kinda surprising that you didn't already know about it.
 
user1804599
Well, the only Boost libraries I use are Boost.ASIO, Boost.Optional and Boost.Variant. :P
 
@Rapptz And the "Barton-Nackman trick".
 
10:53 PM
I thought that trick became obsolete when ADL was added.
 
user1804599
And the non-copyable stuff. Dunno which library that is.
 
I saw a proposal for ip address class where operator<(ipv4_address, ipv6_address) was implemented by converting the ipv4 address to a ipv6-compatible form. In my code I also have ip adress classes, and any comparison between ipv4 and ipv6 is deleted.
 
by the way, did I mention that I'm considering removing ADL from Wide, except for consideration w.r.t. C++ types?
 
It's basically enabling weak-typing IMO.
 
user1804599
Comparing URLs in Java does a DNS lookup if the hostname isn’t an IP address.
 
10:54 PM
@Puppy It works with ADL.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm probably thinking of a different trick, then.
 
I think it relied on some other feature before ADL, though.
 
yeah.
 
user1804599
scala> new URL("http://rightfold.org/") == new URL("http://rightfold.sexy/")
res0: Boolean = true
 
Barton-Nackman is just an abuse of friend to add stuff to the ADL set.
 
user1804599
10:55 PM
:P
 
@StackedCrooked I disagree. IMO implicit conversions are fine as long as they're lossless.
 
friend name injection.
 
ICs complicate things
 
IYAM there's nothing wrong with implicitly converting an int16 to an int32.
 
@rightfold Ew, so broken.
 
10:57 PM
string and int comparison is not lossy if the int is "upgraded" to string :P
But I'd rather not have that.
 
@rightfold Is this meant to be a good thing?
 
user1804599
@Mr.kbok Of course not.
 
@StackedCrooked I kinda disagree because you're making assumptions about e.g. the base of the string, and the result of the IC is a semantically totally different thing.
it's not lossless because if you convert an int to a string, and then add it to another int converted to a string, you don't get the same result as if you added the two ints originally.
 
@StackedCrooked So "A" == 10? Or "10" = 0xA?
 
user1804599
If you convert two int16s to int32s and add them the result might not be the same either because overflow is different.
 
11:01 PM
My reasoning is that IPv4 vs IPv6 comparison can be intended or unintended (the result of a bug in your code). I'd rather have the library require me to be more explicit instead of assuming one.
@R.MartinhoFernandes A+ = 10
 
@rightfold Yep I just considered that.
 
user1804599
Throw on overflow. :P
 
user1804599
A colleague always pronounces deprecated as “depreciated.”
 
I appreciated it and now I don't
 
@rightfold It's relatively common I think.
 
user1804599
11:05 PM
He also pronounces Apache as “apahsjuh.”
 
user1804599
It’s terrible.
 
12
Q: The Difference Between Deprecated, Depreciated and Obsolete

Mark OtarisThere is a lot of confusion about this and I'd like to know, what exactly is the difference between depreciated, deprecated and obsolete, in a programming context, but also in general. I know I could just look at an online dictionary, and I have, even at many, but they don't all agree, or there ...

I pronounce Ruby as Rudy.
Ok, that was a joke.
 
I pronounce Ruby as Shit
 
hmm
 
Shit on Rails
 
11:07 PM
Google Helpouts description.
 
user1804599
Shit on Sails
 
"Prime Master of the Universe and especially all things C++"?
 
I'm gonna make a language called Rehs
 
why?
 
Because you're bad at jokes
 
11:08 PM
@rightfold and post it on Facebook
 
well, I expected that it was a joke, but I was unable to get why a name of Rehs should be a joke.
 
It's one letter away from Shit
I DIDNT SAY IT WAS A GOOD JOKE
 
Ruby on Raizu
Sushi on rice
 
May 29 at 20:08, by Cat Plus Plus
Wide on Whales
 
user1804599
11:11 PM
INTERCAL on Interstates
 
Snakes on a Python
 
user1804599
C++ on Cisterns of Chicken Shit
 
C++ on multiplications
 
welp I'm off to bed.
nighty night
fuck it's so hot here
 
user1804599
Haskell on Horny Hookers
 
11:36 PM
Time for you to go to bed.
No hookers.
 
@milleniumbug Pythons on a Plane
 
7
Q: Skype EULA pops up at every startup

lmontrieuxEverytime I boot my computer, Skype starts automatically after login. The problem is two fold: * it keeps asking me to accept the licence agreement * it keeps forgetting my password That's quite annoying. Does anyone have any idea of where the problem might be coming from? It's been like that fo...

Skype on Linux is so bad.
How can software be this awful?
 
user3010322
11:59 PM
Tee hee.
 
user3010322
@Rapptz I got meow.x = 5 working in lua.
 
user3010322
But I don't have x = meow.x working just yet.
 
user3010322
@Rapptz I also got rid of ONE WHOLE VECTOR in userdata
 
user3010322
But I also added 2 unordered_maps. ._.
 

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