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1:00 PM
I use chrome AND FF, at the same time
 
@jalf was it? I thought FF 5 was where we got the new UI
 
Well, 5.x has introduced the plugin processes, right?
 
5.0 put the tabs on top… major visual change, but minor semantic change
 
Plugin isolation was introduced in 3.5 or 4.0.
 
@Potatoswatter no, that was in 4.0
 
1:01 PM
oh you are right, I was confused since 5.0 came not long after 4.0
 
4.0 was the huge change
 
@jalf Ah, you're right
@CodeMonkey See this is exactly what I'm talking about :vP
 
but yeah, with 6 week release cycles, it's kinda hard to keep track after a while :p
 
WebSocket is a technology providing for bi-directional, full-duplex communications channels, over a single Transmission Control Protocol (TCP) socket. It is designed to be implemented in web browsers and web servers, but it can be used by any client or server application. The WebSocket API is being standardized by the W3C, and the WebSocket protocol is being standardized by the IETF. Because ordinary TCP connections to ports other than 80 are frequently blocked by administrators outside of home environments, it can be used as a way to overcome these restrictions and provide similar function...
 
I can remember what was in 4.0, but the rest of them kind of blur together
 
1:01 PM
Version numbers do mean something to the user base, apparently!
 
I just realized I am on 6.0! Sheesh
 
Version numbers were always arbitrary. It's funny to see people rage about Fx versioning scheme.
 
damn I am so outdated on web technologies... first time I hear about websocket :(
 
Especially that "enterprise can't use Firefox because we test against version numbers" rant.
 
@CatPlusPlus hehe yeah
 
1:03 PM
well they do need to maintain baseline images
 
LOL is there some natural disaster which can make PHB's extinct?
 
so you have to decide on a version at some point
 
Build number can make as good version number as any.
 
Well, consider IE, where the major version number is revised whenever they add an emulator for the last major revision.
 
I used to work at a company where the year was used for the major version number so 6.0 for 2006, 7.0 for 2007, etc. Version 1.0 of the product was actually 6.0 because it was developed in 2006. That has quite an effect on users who feel that higher version numbers mean that it is more mature of a product
 
1:05 PM
Won't work so well in 2069, though.
 
I'm going to start incrementing my versions by 42 every time.
 
in other news, cmake's scripting language really is remarkably ugly
 
the first public versions of pcbs and software I make are always 2.x
people fear 1.x stuff
 
user53670
You guys use google reader?
 
@CatPlusPlus Wise words.
 
1:13 PM
Hugh Hefner has 831k followers and he follows only 7 people. Those people are his family, official playboy twitter and a couple of playmates.
bad ass
 
user53670
who is Hugh Hefner
 
what?
 
user53670
@hexa I'm not in us , is he a famous coder?
 
I believe he owns Playboy
 
1:25 PM
@jalf Use scons. It's awesome.
 
@kbok sure, just convince the company I work for to rewrite their entire build system
 
@jalf Ah. It's another story..
Well, still better than autoconf.
 
@kbok yeah, except autoconf is still being used in a few corners of the codebase
 
Ouch.
 
but we're porting that to cmake when we come across those
since right now, our biggest task is getting a windows port up and running, a cross-platform build tool is pretty essential ;)
 
1:29 PM
Sure.
For cross-platform building, scons is not as good as cmake, I have to admit.
 
ah
 
I actually use cmake a lot because of that. But I find it's quite hard to get things done.
Also the boost module on windows is broken.
 
ah, luckily that was sorted out by someone else :)
no clue how much of it they had to rewrite, but it works for us
 
Well, you just have to read a replacement script. Not a big deal.
 
several other modules are broken on Windows too though. I had a ton of fun fixing (hacking around, really) the XMLRPC one
 
1:32 PM
lol
Last year I had to get a phone firmware written in Qt to compile and run on windows. Craziest job ever if you ask me. But it was actually fun.
 
:D
 
Nivea got a lot of heat because of this ad
 
CMake helped a lot.
 
 
@hexa lol, I can imagine
 
1:33 PM
lol
 
Seriously, how stupid can a company be
 
looks fine to me
hilarious, even
 
aww, incredibuild broke
 
Reminds me of this french ad
 
either that, or all other machines are busy or switched off
 
1:36 PM
anyone see the fight between the Chinese and US basketball teams?
 
"Mois" (Month) can also be read as "Moisi" (Rotten)
 
lol
 
So the ad basically reads "This is the rotten effect". Great.
 
@CodeMonkey Poor chinese?
 
@StackedCrooked I just thought it was funny that the Chinese think they could take on some bunch of basketball players from the "hood"
apparently they do this alot, Brazil got into a fight with them too
this is college teams
 
1:38 PM
So they get beaten up a lot?
 
apparently they are better at kungfu than basketball
 
@CodeMonkey so they win their fights too?
 
0
Q: Which Language I Should Learn After Python?

GeekWithLensI'm 14. I'm currently learning Python Language. Now What Should I Learn After Python ? Here are the options: C++0x C# or .Net Java or any other like Scala, Groovy, etc. D Sorry For First Post. Plz Help me this time.

 
 
1:44 PM
Seems like today everyone wants to learn a new language.
 
Yeah, I'm thinking Russian
 
I taught myself C# and Compact Framework using books. Not SO.
Books apparently are a lost art
 
Sometimes I see people that ask for "tutorials on the web, not books plz".
 
@CodeMonkey Was that a couple months ago? Maybe basketball is just China's hockey…
 
@Potatoswatter Just the other day!
 
1:46 PM
The problem with books is they're always out of date by the time they get published
 
@CodeMonkey Huh. I seem to recall another similar incident a while ago.
 
@Potatoswatter Brazil vs China maybe
 
@awoodland Yeah, sure, and random tutorials on the internet are always up to date.
 
@CodeMonkey That's what I meant by a couple months ago. I'm reading the news story about the US fight right now.
 
The problem with books is that you have to buy them.
 
1:47 PM
true, but the official reference and materials surrounding that usually are for most things worth learning
 
Some of best help to my obscure problems have been on blog posts found in the bowels of the internet
 
@CatPlusPlus That I understand.
@awoodland That's not the kind of things I lump under the term "tutorials".
 
Tutorials not written by people maintaining language/implementation are usually shit.
 
1
Q: Why do we love using i?

GregMaybe this questions seems to be extreamly stupid but I wonder why we use i as variable in most cases in for loops (and not other letter). This might be a historical cause. eg. for(int i = 0; i < 10; i++)

 
I liked i before it was mainstream.
(I prefer idx, more visible).
 
1:51 PM
honestly though other than index or maybe j, there really isn't a good variable name for an index variable.
other than i
short and sweet, most people know what you mean
 
llulz
 
It's short for "iterator" and has a double meaning as "it" the pronoun.
 
My next 3D loop will use he, she and it.
 
1:52 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes interesting approach
 
> Because "i" refers to "index". By the way, I'm never using "i", it's too academic and it doesn't follow any naming convention and/or good practices, as what's "i"? "a"? Variable naming should follow some semantics so everyone will understand your code.
 
> Variable naming should follow some semantics so everyone will understand your code.
What's that guy smoking?
 
@kbok "too academic", lol.
 
@kbok Try harder.
 
1:53 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes except i isn't an iterator
 
@CatPlusPlus lol
 
But I use iterators.
 
in a for loop
 
> it doesn't follow any naming convention
 
@kbok Markdown doesn't work for multline messages. :P
 
1:54 PM
(well, most of the time.)
 
> Long ago, when computers were not that fast and memory and storage space was expensive, it was important to keep your source code small, so that it would fit in memory and the compilation process would run faster.
 
Ha !
 
What.
 
<sarcasm>well, you know if you used it instead i , it required one more punch card, so I would understand that</sarcasm>
 
That doesn't explain the i.
I'd go with z for that.
It takes the same amount of space, and is less likely to conflict with some other one-letter variable, if you use the first letter of things for them.
 
1:56 PM
I'd go with ψ.
 
@CatPlusPlus You don't have for loops in APL.
:P
 
i implicitly means index in many people's minds.. more important things to worry about in SWE :)
 
I don't know APL, I'm not crazy.
 
I love i because I'm narcissistic.
 
Let's use I as index variable. And then listen to people complain they can't tell the difference between I and l, because they're using shitty fonts.
 
2:00 PM
I want to know why Eclipse calls things "Perspectives"
 
I learned recently that some programmers code with variable-width fonts.
 
whatever happened to "window"
 
Too platform-specific for Java.
Also, SWT is weird.
 
By weird, you mean horrible.
 
I'm trying to learn Eclipse RCP now - by using a book no less
 
2:02 PM
You mean 💩?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes are you serious?
 
This room topic is very handy.
 
@hexa Sadly, I am.
 
Visual Basic "programmers" I suppose?
 
No.
Almost serious programmers.
You know, they'd be serious if they didn't use a braindead font.
 
2:04 PM
Are they using Word?
 
> There's renewed interest in an old blog post by Maas-Maarten Zeeman, in which M-MZ made the case for programming with proportional fonts, citing studies that show proportional fonts can be read 14% faster than fixed-width fonts. Try it for a couple of weeks, he suggests, and you might like it too. Nowadays, Lucida Grande is M-MZ's font of choice on OS X, and he uses Lucida Sans on Windows. Helvetica, anyone?"
Yay, you read 14% faster.
Everyone knows reading code is all about reading speed.
.
 
omg, that proportional font hurts my eyes
 
The example is awful.
 
Hah! They said that in the late 80's. At least back then monitors were small enough that getting the extra code onscreen was worthwhile.
I remember THINK Pascal on my Mac Classic. Proportional width did work out nicely there.
But the C IDE from the same vendor defaulted to fixed width. So, some languages are more serious… and some things never change.
Heh, I'm getting rambly. Time to call it quits. Bye everyone!
 
2:11 PM
Bye.
 
@TonyTheTiger NICE HAHAHA
 
Proportional fonts might work well with case-insensitive Cobol: "Add 3 to y store in x." reads rather well.
There's an std::quote?
 
2:18 PM
-1
Q: What is the best way to write a part of buffer with quoting?

vladimarFor exaplme, I have some buffer : const char* buf with next content: __-=Bill's car=-___ and i need to write to ostream only words with quoting. So, result should be next: Bill\'s car I know, that << quote << will make quoting and ostream.write(buf,len) will write part I need. ...

 
no truer thing was said
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I am confused by that question
 
@TonyTheTiger I think there were truer things said.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes now he's talking about mysql.. sigh
 
@CodeMonkey And there's an answer suggesting a regex.
The thick plottens!
@TonyTheTiger You know, things like: "A sentence is a sentence."
:P
 
2:28 PM
@TonyTheTiger Or you're better with understanding than explaining.
Ooh, new PyPy.
 
now I LOL'd seeing this...
wtf you need that sign on there for???
 
It's because of that movie
 
Because 1) troll 2) people are stupid.
 
Pick one.
 
2:34 PM
with McGregor
jesus you kids
Trainspointting
 
VERY INTENSIVE NSFW GROSS: youtube.com/watch?v=IJrWlHRT-18
 
>If sex between three people is called a Threesome and sex between two people is called a Twosome...
Then why is Handsome still a compliment?
 
:))
 
I think, the tone is a bit too childish. Sometimes there's a point in that in itself. But I fail to see it here.
I was not the one who flagged, but I was one who did not clear the flag.
 
2:46 PM
What are you talking about?
 
@hexa Tony's last post
 
So, people flagged because it was too childish? I was thinking they did because it wasn't appropriate for children, for some definition of "appropriate".
 
I think he's saying there is a time and place for everything. Took me a couple times reading it to understand.
 
lol, ghosh SAD FLAGGERS
GET A LIFE PLEASE
I know what he's doing
 
"Porn-sourced or not, it is a good, clear picture of the human anus, moreso than the existing image"
LOL
this guy know what's he's talking about
 
> While we're at it, why not put up an explicit picture of the anus expelling feces since this is its main function. That would surely be beyond valuable to the reader.
 
Sometimes it feels like they're doing this for the aliens.
 
For shits and giggles.
2
 
3:15 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes you know, that's funny but true
 
@kbok That's essentially what the Norwegian oil-painter Odd Nerdrum did. He's very good, regarded as a genius. Unfortunately, just sentenced to 2 years in prison for tax evasion.
Some Nerdrum paintings: goo.gl/qIl9F
I think there's something wrong when a rapist gets some months in prison or even goes free, while someone who sells his own painting without reporting it to the state, gets 2 years
 
I want a device that will slap people over the Internet for using word 'bloat'.
 
if you can find an example of a rapist only getting a few months or goes free, then I'm very concerned
 
why? Never seen it used very much
 
in the UK, I believe they get 5-10 years
 
3:22 PM
@AlfPSteinbach Not all crimes are equal, but in the US rapes get more time
 
Well, I think there's something wrong when a rapist.
 
Rape = Wrong
 
Where is sequenced before defined in the FDIS? I can't find it.
Does it mean it comes before in a release sequence?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes which one? I don't see it in C99
 
FDIS is Final Draft International Standard. In this room, given the topic, it is generally used to mean the latest C++11 draft.
 
3:26 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes Mah comment on that! It's good.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Sorry, yes I know what FDIS meant I just wasn't sure
 
"Pricasso" is the name of an Australian artist that uses his dick to paint. SRSLY Y U SO WEIRD PPL
 
Wait, is this about sequenced before thing about sequence points?
Maybe it's time to read that FAQ.
 
[dagbladet.no/nyheter/2004/10/26/412462.html] is an example of a 4 months prison for "date rape", which is the version where one does not notice the girl saying "no". However, the average prison term for a rape in Norway, is 9 months. I'm not sure that that's too low, but I think in comparision 2 years in prison for a 68 year old man who has "illegally" sold his own painting, it's sort of absurd, and evil.
 
Ah, found it. Stupid case-insensitive search.
 
3:29 PM
@AlfPSteinbach norway is pretty liberal; doubt that would happen in the US
 
I can't speak that language
but it also came up with "404", for which I do not require a translator
 
@AlfPSteinbach No officer, I didn't hear her. I had ginormous earplugs, and heavy rock music. Nevermind that I drugged her.
Then the case suddenly turns into a evidence rally trying to prove he could hear her.
They take him to a hearing test, at which they ask him what sounds he can hear.
 
"Can you hear me?" "Nothing at all."
It's Norwegian (read: Chinese) but at least it doesn't 404.
 
This is ridiculous.
 
3:35 PM
Zomg. I google translated that. It's so effed up.
 
doesn't Ken Thompson participate on SO?
 
Negligent murder. No officer, I didn't know that stabbing him 13 times would kill him, I seriously thought his screaming was him showing signs of ecstasy.
 
Wow, he puts both Vim and Emacs under harmful. I wonder why.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes too complex
 
C less harmful than C++? Lol.
 
3:38 PM
Harmful: Apache, lighttpd. Alternatives: thttpd, OpenBSD's fork of apache 1.3, nginx, or best of all: don't use HTTP.
 
I didn't know Vala was considered harmful.
 
Vala is considered silly.
 
Now with emphasis: don't use HTTP.
 
Even Ruby is in the list.
Is that table aiming to be the one troll to rule them all?
 
Boost is under those things that "are so superfluous and useless that require no alternative"
 
3:39 PM
Plan 9 fanboy detected.
Ahahahah, Tk less harmful than Qt.
 
@CatPlusPlus I lol'd at this one.
 
I love that movie.
 
I think this guy is a half-troll (Yes, as in Dungeons & Dragons)
 
libc less harmful than anything, rofl.
> even CVS or plain old tarballs would be better than svn.
Good grief.
 
Plain old tarballs?
I don't like svn, but saying tarballs are better is...
Nevermind CVS.
 
3:42 PM
> ALSA -> OSS4
What.
 
> SQL databases.
 
Who's the author?
@CatPlusPlus They're not webscale.
 
And alternative: plain old hierarchical filesystems.
 
Not sure if those are webscale.
Wait, what?
Filesystems are an alternative to relational databases?
 
Relational filesystems ?
 
3:44 PM
Are filesystems webscale?
 
Because relying on ext4 to optimize access time is so awesome.
No wait : ext4 is harmful. Use ext2 instead.
 
You know what else is simple? Bra*nfuck.
 
> plain old portable makefiles.
 
As an alternative to actual build systems.
 
3:46 PM
What is a portable makefile?
 
Whoever wrote it, is full of 💩.
@RMartinhoFernandes The one you spend three months writing and testing, and then nobody can change because it depends on exact character count inside it.
 
There's people running around, especially on programmers.se, linking to this site. I'm relieved to learn that I'm not the only one to think this is bullshit.
 
Isn't "portable makefiles" the reason GNU autoconf/automake and CMake exist?
 
@kbok it represents the unix philosophy (it prefers combining simple tools to get the job done instead of using one complex tool)
 
@kbok Rest assured there isn't much wisdom in that site.
 
3:49 PM
@kbok I understood half-elves, but half-trolls. Man someone is desperate.
 
@kbok Btw, I don't mean to defend it.
 
There's an obsession with some stupid rule or philosophy, but no wisdom.
 
@Xaade Trolls aren't known for asking for permission.
 
@Xaade Hey, not everyone can get the nines.
 
@CatPlusPlus And most cultures that old would have killed a baby that was half monster.
 
3:50 PM
The 'UNIX philosophy' seems to be 'write half-documented software that doesn't work on any other system and requires 15 other programs to actually be useful'.
 
I have nothing against the UNIX philosophy, but this site basically says "older is better".
 
No, it says "Plan 9 is better".
 
Well, it's getting old.
 
@kbok Wait till they get their hands on x86 assembly.
 
Plan 9 is the best bad movie ever.
 
3:52 PM
These kind of people are spending so much time on ideology that they even aren't able to get things done.
 
I don't care about the software.
 
C and UNIX damage brains.
 
@kbok Sounds Greek.
@kbok Time for "This is SPARTA!"
 
I'll blog later about how much this guy sucks.
 
"We've heard even those 'boylovers' have turned you down"
 
3:54 PM
But right now this is the weekend. Later !
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: Ha! closed as exact duplicate programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/102353/…
 
Lol, I've seen "c# - Why do we love using it?" on the tab, and then proceeded to be confused why question about some variable is a duplicate.
 
Sick.
 
that is disturbing
 
Requires pepper.
 
3:57 PM
yikes
 
0
A: Why do we love using i?

Interesting question i think i means index

 
i might think that, but what do u think?
 
The term "Interesting question": Spontaneous uninformed answer follows.
 
he'll never see it
 
Note: Politicians often follow an interview question of importance with "Interesting question".
 

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