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12:33 AM
in fact, I asked this question because of an argument I had with someone
which was about exactly that: they suggested that the RS snoops the linear address writeback bus in order to predict when the load will arrive (of course, splits are only one small thing, cache misses also cause a change in latency)
my guess is that the linear address never leaves the load unit, but that even no signal leaves: the replay is just detected in a generic way any time a replay occurs: by noting that the result didn't appear on the bus (or probably a dedicated bus containing the physical destination ID) in the expected cycle
so i expect all replay behavior to be more or less the same regardless of the trigger
it's interesting that the split latency is 11 cycles
I don't know if that's limited by the replay behavior, or it takes that long to resolve a split, I would have expected it to be more parallel
my original theory was 11 was just 5 + 5 + 1
like 5 cycles, then a cycle to detect the need for a replay and another five cycles, driven by the replay, but of course I guess the load unit itself handles the split load: it doesn't need to wait for the RS to send another load uop for the second half (and here we confirm there is no second p23 uop)
 
1:04 AM
hi @AndreasAbel :)
 
1:19 AM
@BeeOnRope Perhaps the 2nd load is dependent on the first in some way, as a way to make sure that the 2nd load gets valid data from the other side of the line-split register? (aka buffer, the buffers that when you run out of gives you counts for ld_blocks.no_sr.)
 
@PeterCordes - yeah maybe
IIRC correctly on some earlier uarch like SNB this may have been as fast as 9 cycles
hence under the 5+5 limit
Andreas Abel (uops.info guy) stopped in for a second, heh
 
@BeeOnRope But presumably there's some way to get memory-level parallelism if both sides of a split miss; you don't want the 2nd half to wait until the first half is ready if that includes a miss. I haven't tested that, though.
 
i have
up to L2 misses it's 2x latency
so 11 cycles for L1, ~24 cycles for L2
after that, the pattern changes, it's like L3 + ~10 cycles for L3
since that's also the same pattern I saw for replays, I thought it had something to do with replays
@PeterCordes - maybe it doesn't want to waste a request if there is no split SR?
so it sends out the first half, then the second half when it comes back
that doesn't explain why the pattern stops with l3 tho
 
@BeeOnRope Huh, last time I tested, split loads did give extra counts in uops_dispatched. But apparently I'm dumb and tested with dependent loads. I just re-tested with times 4 mov ecx, [rdi + 63] and +4094 and you're right, no extra uops even for a 4k split, just a throughput penalty.
Same deal with split stores: no extra uops for port4 or p237
 
i also tested it the same way
that's why for the last two years i've been saying load uops replay
I thought maybe you said it because i said it even
but this whole time it has been the dependent ops replaying
it makes sense in a way: how would a re-dispatch help? the load unit is already doing its thing
it is just taking longer: it's not really a replay
** Running group memory/load-serial-crossing : Cacheline crossing loads from fixed-size regions **
Benchmark Cycles Nanos
8-KiB serial loads 10.99 4.24
16-KiB serial loads 10.99 4.24
32-KiB serial loads 11.18 4.32
64-KiB serial loads 22.39 8.64
128-KiB serial loads 24.16 9.32
256-KiB serial loads 24.79 9.57
512-KiB serial loads 40.58 15.66
1024-KiB serial loads 44.16 17.04
2048-KiB serial loads 45.79 17.67
4096-KiB serial loads 59.10 22.81
** Running group memory/load-serial : Random serial loads from fixed-size regions **
Benchmark Cycles Nanos
16-KiB serial loads 4.00 1.54
24-KiB serial loads 4.00 1.54
30-KiB serial loads 4.00 1.54
31-KiB serial loads 4.00 1.54
32-KiB serial loads 4.00 1.54
33-KiB serial loads 6.17 2.38
34-KiB serial loads 8.22 3.17
35-KiB serial loads 10.14 3.91
40-KiB serial loads 11.98 4.62
48-KiB serial loads 11.98 4.62
there you can see the pattern: 11 cycle (exactly) for split L1, ~24-25ish for L2, then about nominal + 10 for L3
that pattern holds beyond that
 
1:38 AM
@BeeOnRope Seems clear in hindsight, like so many things :P. I assumed that another load uop was needed to initiate the request for another line, and so the first load could get out of the load port's pipeline and make room for later loads. But if that was the case, then why would a page split be more expensive than any other line split? (Also, re-dispatch wouldn't be TLB coherent; you need both sides of the split to come from the same physical page, old or new but not torn, on non-page split
 
yeah, exactly, obvious in hindsight
@PeterCordes - maybe the L3 and ram results are explained by adjacent line prefetching
maybe, internally, it really is two serial loads but adjacent line saves it
 
@BeeOnRope Can we test that by having the other hyperthread keep it too busy with demand loads for that prefetcher to activate? But not so busy that it makes demand loads much slower? Probably not, might have to disable that PF for testing.
 
i am just turning off the prefetcher
but after writing the last messages I just

git stash pop

my active work, which i had pushed to get the reuslt sabove so now i'm fixing compiler errors
it will take me a couple minutes
no that wasn't it, same timing with next-line PF off
with all PF off, to be precise
 

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