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12:11 AM
@Mysticial lol!
 
12:44 AM
@jaggedSpire Would you like some wine /cc @Morwenn @Ven
 
1:36 AM
@Borgleader a whole bottle of that particular variety would be delightful <3
 
@jaggedSpire I have a whole litter of it ;)
 
@Borgleader :o
 
1:57 AM
wtf, FF lagged and I typed into the wrong box
 
FF is really fucking slow after you leave it open for a while with 50+ tabs.
 
Oh, yeah it is. I kill it on a regular basis.
 
And this is even with most scripts disabled.
The thing that pisses me off even more is even if I kill all but one tab to a lightweight website, it's still using 6GB+ of memory.
I suspect it's the JS runtime that's leaking most of it.
Whatever the case is, when I try to profile it, I can't because the code is jitted.
 
2:16 AM
@Mysticial norepro
 
@набиячлэвэли If you're on 32-bit FF, it crashes instead.
Because it runs out of the 2GB memory address space. So it just dies.
 
@Mysticial Top my FF gets to is 3.5GB, with ~50 tabs loaded
No noticeable performance hit
 
How long has it been running? Has it been less than a week?
 
I run it for weeks at a time yes
 
I can boot up 50 tabs fine immediately after restarting FF. But if I leaving running for a week, then it runs the memory up to 6+GB and becomes unusably slow.
@набиячлэвэли lies
 
2:20 AM
@Mysticial What version?
@Mysticial Bloody reality's all that is
 
@набиячлэвэли 50.1.0 But it's been this way for at least the past 5 years.
 
@Mysticial I've 52.0a2 (2017-01-23) (Developer Edition), maybe that's all the difference
 
@набиячлэвэли No, you probably love waiting so much that you don't even know you're waiting.
 
@Mysticial Nah, son
I hate waiting (beyond a reasonable timeframe that is presented by this being a network op)
 
2:34 AM
What the fuck is this bullshit?
2
A: Why does my Firefox memory usage keep rising with use and never returns to the initial level?

David SchwartzRAM cannot be saved for later. Your only choices are to use it or waste it. A system with 8GB of RAM can't use 4GB today in order to use 12GB tomorrow. So, simply put, Firefox is using more memory because the alternative would be to waste that memory. It is not returning to the initial level bec...

^^ Really? Is he a FF developer trying to defend something?
 
3:30 AM
@Rapptz fancy
 
3:41 AM
yeah
It's part of their testing suite so I'm pretty sure the guy's probably lying
 
4:34 AM
@Mysticial He could be, but he does have a point. Given that you have RAM, you might as well store something useful in it. The operative term there is useful though. The question with Firefox (and Chrome, for that matter) is how much (if any) good you get from whatever it's putting into all the storage.
 
@JerryCoffin None at all. In fact it's actually negative. All other things equal, the more ram FF uses, the slower it gets.
 
@Mysticial That doesn't surprise me. The principle remains though: if it could accomplish something useful by using more memory (and there's enough available) it should do exactly that. The OS mostly does exactly that (using all the memory it can to cache files if it has nothing else to store there).
 
That I definitely agree. Since I'm guilty of doing exactly that in my pi program for swap computations.
Admittedly, using more ram isn't always beneficial in my case. There are some minor corner cases where having too much ram actually inhibits the ability of the code to parallelize computation with disk I/O.
Consider the case where I'm streaming a large chunk of data off of disk.
The sequential algorithm runs as follows:
1. Load as much as possible into memory.
2. Do work on what is in memory.
3. Write back to disk.
4. Repeat until it's done.
 
If so, it would seems like an implementation flaw
 
In the parallel algorithm:
1. Load as much as possible that fits into half the memory. Call it A.
2. In parallel: Load up the other half of memory (call it B). Compute on A.
3. In parallel: Write A back to disk and read more data in it's place. Compute on B.
4. Repeat step 3 until we're all done.
5. Write out the final block. No overlap will be possible here.
The parallel algorithm will actually be slower if there is too much memory since you read the whole thing into memory. Compute on it, then write it all out. No overlap at all.
 
4:51 AM
Dockerr rockssssssss!@
 
To keep the code from degenerating, the working size in memory is usually capped so that step 3 runs at least once. This also has the side-effect of ensuring that at least 50% of the computation/disk I/O is overlapped.
But there's no code that tries to auto-detect the optimal block size when there's too much memory.
 
@Mysticial Ioh man. I wish I had an idea what you are talking about. so I could share your pain :)
 
5:11 AM
@ProblemSlover The concept is very simple. I'm just shitty at explaining things.
 
@Mysticial Well the thing I understand that it's a quite low level stuff
 
@ProblemSlover It's actually high-level stuff. lol
 
@Mysticial Ok Man. Anyway Hopefully for you it won't be a long sleepless night ahead :)
 
you missed a good opportunity for a 420 joke
 
5:27 AM
@Mikhail https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/420_(cannabis_culture)
? :P
 
high-level stuff
 
@Mikhail eyyy
 
What I'm really curious about is if Firefox has actual memory leaks or just a bad memory free-ing strategy
 
5:48 AM
@Mikhail never noticed that having 32 gb of memory /:
 
@Mysticial That leads to the obvious question: how often does that problem really arise, other than testing under rather artificial conditions?
@Mikhail Given its size, a few memory leaks would hardly be surprising. My guess is the strategy is the major problem though.
 
@JerryCoffin Not very often. If you have enough memory where that is a problem, you can fit the whole computation in memory anyway.
So it's not a problem which I've cared to solve.
 
6:24 AM
Morning.
 
7:22 AM
@Mysticial Interesting. So FF causes reduces memory waste by wasting memory.
 
VPN usage will be illegal in China soon
 
8:47 AM
WTF. Trump proclaimed his inauguration as National Day of Patriotic Devotion.
 
what does it mean?
 
@Mysticial no idea, but I agree with the idea of not wasting transistors I paid for.
 
@Borgleader Now that's some wine I'd like to have :D
 
I took some videos under water with my new cam, but the videos are shaky and fishes look fuzzy
 
Ven
9:03 AM
@LucDanton well...
 
@JohanLarsson hmm, apparently it's not atypical for US Presidents to do such. Ugh.
 
Ven
J'ai vu ce projet quand la France™ voulait faire son propre OS.
 
I hereby proclaim my birthday as International Day of Awesomeness
 
tumbleweed rolls across the screen
 
@ProblemSlover from what it says there, it seems it's only illegal to run VPNs there
I struggle to understand how that will have the desired effect.
 
Ven
9:12 AM
Hi
 
@Ven L'OS Souverain ? :D
 
Ven
Le grand®.
 
I still wonder when they thought it could be a good idea.
As if making a complete & safe OS and making sure that people use it was easy.
 
user image
7
Guys, I got the numbers. Now you can be sure you don't overdo it!
@wilx I could hear the breeze
 
9:20 AM
@sehe Source?
 
@LucDanton spelling mistaké a été detecté
@wilx flowingzen.com/17640/… serendipitious find looking for an older answer of my own. Qi :)
 
In today's GitHub issues news: my childish attitude is terrible. Well, nothing new right there x)
 
I especially love how your miles may vary. They're not lying miles. Just alternative miles
@Morwenn Gosh. Please. Just ignore the troll
 
> alternative facts
 
@sehe Not sure that's even a troll, which may be the best part :D
 
9:23 AM
My dad told me that the fishes in my videos are ... plain
I am sry but most fishes in the ocean are ... plain
fishes in the ocean aren't very different from the ones you buy in the market
 
@Morwenn linky!
 
@Morwenn Link!
 
@Morwenn ...that guy has issues, lol.
Guys, it took me literally 30 seconds to find it.
Without googling.
 
@Telkitty He means you suck at using the camera.
 
9:28 AM
@Griwes Maybe.
@набиячлэвэли Yup, he took the #100 :(
 
Ven
I'm tempted to reply "There's no debate when you're wrong"
but that might be infringing on @griwes' patents
 
@Morwenn I mean, normal people don't write "yeah, I get your arguments" while at the same time proceeding with a wall of text that makes dubious assertions (about a syntactic choice of all things!)
@Ven I'll endorse it with a thumbs up. :D
 
I need to learn to steady the camera in ocean
 
Ven
@Griwes did, do, done
 
@Griwes tbh, I'm still not sure what he was trying to get to...
 
Ven
9:32 AM
@набиячлэвэли pls upvoet me
 
@Ven exquisite
 
@Ven Fucking savage :D <3
 
Ven
pretty much.
 
10:21 AM
@Ven Well, it is no different from things like GCC or Cygwin which force your to sign a copyright assignment. clojure.org/community/contributing
Ah, I forgot @Ven has me on plonk list.
 
Ven
@LucDanton this was an actual (documentation) bug.
 
11:12 AM
@wilx but there are other repos that require CLA signing but will still accept pull requests (if all contributors signed the CLA as checked by a bot)
 
11:27 AM
lol, this is ridiculous.
Remember the Codility test I have done yesterday? How I have admitted in the source code that I have copy&pasted the second task? Well, I just got an email from the HR person handling the job application and they said I got 100% and 94% on the second (copy&pasted!!!) task.
 
@wilx I.e. don't take the job?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't know, man. If they offer similar pay as I have here, I will probably go there. I honestly want to get out of this system testing automation stuff in Java.
I have been here 7 years now. It was not whole 7 years of testing automation but still...
 
@wilx Are you too desperate to try elsewhere in the meantime?
Don't get a job that you will want to get out of again unless you're desperate.
(Though in fairness, my current company's test was terrible and the interview changed my mind, so don't just drop it)
(Also, I have since convinced people to change the recruitment test)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No, I am not desperate, yet. But I do not think there are that many other opportunities that would be interesting. I am being offered embedded development and/or automotive development at least once a month due to my previous job. But I do not want to go there. Few years with eVC4 and Windows CE was pretty masochistic already.
 
I hate android.

http://thehackernews.com/2017/01/hummingbad-android-malware.html
 
11:42 AM
@ProblemSlover I am sure the iThing would get the same malware if anybody actually owned one.
 
@wilx Actually, sadly, iPhones are much better at this, because they don't have terrible update policies.
 
This is scary, this is totalitarian, this is America under Trump. Try justifying this. https://twitter.com/biocuriosity/status/823717770009292800
> government wants to control a government agency
> this is totalitarian
what's wrong with those people?
> sent anonymously to an anonymous congressperson
 
nwp
@Abyx I thought having a press department and forbidding every other employee to speak for the company/agency was standard procedure.
 
but now it's under Trump!
 
Dow Jones (US stock market) and USD are still very high, I love to watch people gather for warmth before the whole village burns down
 
11:48 AM
@Abyx I usually disagree with you, but unless it gest much more sinister than this, I have to agree with your sarcasm.
 
@nwp FWIW, they forbade press releases.
 
market is influenced by only 2 things: hope and fear
but judge by history, people are not very reasonable with their hope and fear, neither are they very accurate with their judgement
but who cares, I live on a large farming island that's rich in minerals
I just hope the people who runs the country are not overtly retarded
you reap what you sow
 
I sometimes feel that one has to be a bit insane to want to run a country. So many responsibilities.
 
democracy at the best </sarcasm>
 
@wilx His picks for the new people in charge are pretty bad, IMO.
 
11:53 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I agree. I mean only this single instance.
 
Also the 12% budget cuts.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, they are trillions in debt and got much more in debt with Obama.
 
@wilx 12% of the EPA's budget is nothing, really.
 
but let's face it, news are never boring now trump is the new US president
reality show: how to ruin a nation
 
@Telkitty Heh, yeah. We live in interesting time!
 
11:55 AM
It's 0.2% of the military budget, which he promises to increase (as in, a promise featured on the White House page, not like the wall).
 
Ell
@Telkitty it was already ruined :V
 
exactly, especially when the fire is across the ocean
@Ell not yet
but will be very soon
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes well currently america only has as many air craft carriers as the rest of the world, that simply isn't good enough. The fact they could literally take ever other one by drowning them in their ow wake isn't good enough, they must out number them
 
I fully expect the FDA and the EPA to be reduced to meaningless shells this year.
 
Why increase the military budget when you want your troops to leave the rest of the world?
 
Ell
11:59 AM
I wonder what budget the NSA gets
does that come under military?
 
@Morwenn need to pay for their flights home
NASA is separate budget to military, and is less than 10% IIRC
 
@Ell Snowden stuff showed 52b.
@thecoshman s/10/3/
 
nwp
if the FDA disappears things will get easier for me and much worse for patients
 
lol, well I'm not wrong :P
 
nwp
though I very much doubt that functionality will just disappear
 
12:03 PM
@Morwenn cough cough
> We should reform FDA so there is approving drugs after their sponsors have demonstrated safety--and let people start using them, at their own risk, but not much risk of safety. Let’s prove efficacy after they’ve been legalized
@nwp Trump's pick for heading the FDA said that ^
 
Ell
well, there are people in terrible situations that would love to use experimental drugs but can't right?
 
Well... that is a more American view I guess. It's up to people to decide if they want to take random shit that has no proof of working. Personally, I want that trusted body to very that drugs work safely, but I respect that some idiots don't care
 
No, they have to be safe and to work.
Otherwise it's quacktown.
 
Ell
@thecoshman they're not always idiots
 
Homeopathy would be the best example of a problem with this policy.
 
Ell
12:07 PM
some have no other options, so they figure "why not?"
 
I'm ok with such a law: more results for the rest of the world, yay.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes there are people that benefit from homeopathy though right
 
Sugar pills are pretty safe. But treating <whatever you have> with sugar pills will just make you worse.
 
Ell
I'm not saying physiologically
 
@Ell Yes, salesman.
 
Ell
12:07 PM
but people get peace of mind etc.
it's like faith
 
@Ell Not if they get sicker, no.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes right
they usually go to a hospital or doctor in that case
 
I.e. bar a few conditions that just go away, like colds, homeopathic products are likely to be harmful by virtue of replacing proper treatment.
@Ell You'd be surprised how often that doesn't happen.
Or how often that happens later than it should have.
 
Ven
@rightfold do you still ahve that mongo jdbc driver that did Math.random
 
It is really important that efficacy has to be proved before being marketed to prevent that.
 
12:11 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes ha
and thirsty people
 
@Ell So what, though? That they'd love to do it doesn't make them work.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes except low blood sugar :P
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes I agree
but people love to do lots of things that "don't work"
or are negative to health
it doesn't mean we should stop them
 
We should stop them.
 
@Ell It does if that means it doesn't make it harder for everyone else.
In this case, it does.
 
12:13 PM
@Ell Actually, it would be interesting to follow such people :p
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes what do you mean by "make it harder"?
 
Normalizing quack "medicine" hurts everyone.
 
Ell
It doesn't all have to be quack stuff though
What about medicine which is 3/4 through medical trials?
I mean, I know the problem then becomes where do you draw the line
 
@Ell Has efficacy been proven by then?
 
4/4 is where you draw the line
 
12:15 PM
Exactly.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes in this hypothetical let's say it's been proven in chimps or something vOv
@R.MartinhoFernandes they have to be tested on humans at some point
 
@Ell That's not reliable.
@Ell And they are. So what.
 
Ell
I'm saying let more humans choose to be tested on
 
That's just stupid.
 
@Ell we are not on about when to test it on humans, we are on about when to make it generally available
 
Ell
12:16 PM
And I'm saying if an individual is sick and they want to take a chance on a drug that is 3/4 through medical trials, then why not let them?
you could argue that this helps the general by accelerating the speed of medical trial
at the (possible) cost of the individual of course
 
If I cam up with some pill that could cure a cold in a few hours, I'd first have to test it on a few humans (after some previous basic testing obviously). I'd have to show that those that did take the pill cured fast and those that didn't take it, took longer. I'd have to show that taking this pill directly correlates to curing your cold faster
 
Ell
I'm not saying have doctors prescribe homeopathy or anything like that
I'm saying that some patients are willing to take more risks than others
@thecoshman you wouldn't first test it on humans
humans are the final stages of clinical trials
 
Yes, and companies are willing to exploit people, and that is the sort of thing governments are meant to help protect you from
 
Ell
I would think it would be years before you test it on humans
 
> after some previous basic testing obviously
 
Ell
12:19 PM
@thecoshman it's not basic testing though
my point is, for the vast majority of the public, 99% confidence would be the lower limit
but for some patients, that limit will be lower
 
But with your idea, sure, why not? I have half an idea this chemical might cure a cold, so let me just go to market with this thing that may or may not cure the cold, but also may or may not really hurt you. You choose to take the risk by buying it, I'm not responsible
 
Ell
@thecoshman that's not what I'm argueing for
I'm not saying you should deceive people into buying drugs that you don't know if they work or not
If you synthesised some random chemical, then you would have 0% confidence that it would cure a cold
and when patients are given the option of drugs, of course they won't take yours
 
Exactly, you have to prove it works, and that is what the likes of the FDA do, well, they ensure that proof has been provided
Why not though @ell?
 
Ell
@thecoshman because there is 0% confidence that it will work
whereas fluids & bed rest has 90% confidence
 
Speaking of quack medicine, I have sent a email to all of our Chamber of Deputies urging them not to normalize Traditional Chinese "Medicine" in law. So far I only got two thank you replies.
 
12:22 PM
Ell is just advocating ahead-of-schedule tries for e.g somewhat terminally ill patients for drugs that are in the latest stages of tests.
 
I am becoming a keyboard warrior, email activist! :D
 
Ell
@Morwenn right
 
Which they already do
 
Ell
I'm saying give the patient more of a say
anyway I gotta work vOv
 
They do have say, but they just don't get offered any old shit the people think might maybe help
 
12:30 PM
@Ell It doesn't accelerate anything.
@Ell You know, they don't test these things on healthy people exclusively.
Hard to establish efficacy if you have only healthy subjects.
@thecoshman Actually drug makers are not fond of "let's make approval easier".
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well I'm sure most aren't. The reputable ones put a lot of effort in proving their shit works, they don't cowboys to come along with a "cheaper better" drug
 
Because developing real drugs is expensive, and if you allow flooding the market with things that don't have to be shown to work, it becomes harder for them to make a profit.
@Ell And they will have to suck it and not exercise their desires in order to prevent harm.
 
... yeah...
 
@Ell The patients are not qualified.
@Ell Hahahahaha.
@Ell See, if this was the case, we wouldn't even need an approval process at all. Quackery would just naturally die off.
@Morwenn But what does that mean? Trials are already a thing, and again, they don't just use healthy people for them.
 
12:46 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Latest stage drugs occasionally use healthy people just to make sure that they're totally safe if I remember correctly.
 
Unless you want to allow selling such things, this seems more or less indistinguishable from clinical trials as is.
@Morwenn just.
Meaning, sick people take part in the trials.
 
Well, there was a problem last year in France with a drug trial: a volunteer died and three other became seriously ill.
 
Yes, that's why they're trials.
If it was known that it was safe, they'd be selling it, not doing trials.
(And that's exactly why the line for selling can only be drawn at after the trials)
 
But people won't complain about the price if they're dead :D
 
-9
Q: Design a class FileDemo, open the file in read mode and display the total number of line, word and characters

mojojoDesign a class FileDemo, open the file in read mode and display the total number of line, word and characters

@Mysticial vampire of the day (see comments)
 
1:03 PM
hahaha
@Borgleader not the first time apparently
 
nwp
1:24 PM
I've been looking for interesting questions for a few months now and my rep didn't change. Turns out rep whoring answering trivial questions is the way to go for internet points.
I feel dirty now.
 
haha
just take solace in the fact you can help toss bad questions where they belong now, in a more effective way than before.
 
Haha, Stroustrup is still using Stroustrup_case to name his concepts.
 
if I had a case named after me you bet I'd use it all the time
 
nwp
@Morwenn What is wrong with that? I name all classes like that.
 
@nwp Until right now, I thought he was the only one to use such a mixed case.
Pretty much everyone in the committee opposes that case for standard concepts IIRC.
 
nwp
1:39 PM
I would oppose it for a standard concept too because the standard does not capitalize class names.
 
Well, they do intend to use ThatCase for concepts.
 
nwp
I would rather have them stick to snake_case.
 
1:55 PM
I've got no problem with a new case for a new kind of entities.
 
I used to use different cases for different types of identifiers, but lately snake case has been creeping.
 
nwp
Bjarne said in one of his talks that people want something screaming like >>>>CONCEPT<<<< for new things because they are new and confusing and you need to pay extra attention to them. But then the newness wears off and people want the elegant/short syntax instead. There is a struggle every time to convince people to use the same short-ish syntax for every new thing.
Maybe I should send him that talk.
 
@nwp Idiotic_case is an abomination that no-one should've invented, ever.
 
Lol
 
Ven
2:26 PM
 
nwp
I have a sol::state that I need to reset. Assigning a default-constructed sol::state doesn't do the trick. I would need to call ~sol::state manually and then placement new a new one into its place. That can't possibly be correct.
 
user406009
@Ven Do you actually use steem? Isn't it a pyramid scheme?
 
Ven
@Lalaland A pyramid scheme¿
 
@nwp Have an optional one and assign it none and then an empty one :'D
 
Ven
@Lalaland It's streem, not steem.
 
user406009
2:30 PM
Oh, now I feel like an idiot.
 
user406009
Oops, sorry.
 
Ven
Of course steem is a pyramid scheme.
streem is a stream-based proglang by Ruby's author
 
nwp
@Griwes I thought about using a unique_ptr to replace the silly syntax with an unnecessary dynamic memory allocation, but that also seems silly.
 
@nwp optional's better at that
 
Gute Neuigkeiten: Die Pünktlichkeit unserer Züge liegt heute bei 120 Prozent. #alternativefacts https://t.co/ZM8nIeSGUp
("Good news: today the punctuality of our trains is 120% #alternativefacts")
 
2:37 PM
funny that trump worded it like that
alternative facts is a joke, there was a decent opportunity for him to label the opponents facts as 'media facts' or w/e
 
@JohanLarsson It wasn't Trump.
It was his adviser.
 
ok
still a missed opportunity :)
The adviser guy is going to have four hard years I think
Picking up messes where trump drops them.
 
@JohanLarsson It was a woman.
:P
 
pretty sure they'll get rotated as they burn out
 
Ok, I'm mixing things up then
 
2:40 PM
#alternativefacts :D
 
@Ven lol repeating yourself instead of using d = malloc(sizeof *d);
 
Saw an interview with some blonde man.
Saw as in a couple of seconds
 
Ven
@milleniumbug true, but that's how the rest of the codebase does it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't need them, I'm just wrong when I'm wrong.
 
2:41 PM
@JohanLarsson I know, just couldn't resist.
 
thanks
If you feel like it you can ping me with trump madness as it rolls in.
@R.MartinhoFernandes She handles it pretty well overall imo.
Reporter also did a good job, he was fast in attacking alt facts.
 
I don't think throwing red herrings counts as handling it pretty well.
 
> We have probabilistically increased the amount of presortedness present in a sequence by using a random shuffling technique that requires little computation.
Like, how is it even possible.
 
I'm about to devour this alt-salad. #alternativefacts https://t.co/EZKdmDN1RP
 
2:49 PM
that tweet made my day yesterday
 
Chances are a ~real salad on mcdonalds contains more meat than a big mac
I have a feeling alt facts is going to be huge the next four years, probably was the last year already.
 
@JohanLarsson in a meme sense yes. In a real sense I don't think so, although Faux News might disagree
 
Twitter something late, then the news don't have much choice but reporting it in the morning.
I don't think trump has patience to wait for things to actually happen.
Faster to take a selfie in front of his tower and write that the wall is great
 
@JohanLarsson he's a narcissist
 
2:56 PM
for him there is no we only I
 
He seems special, the kind of special one becomes when there are people around you who have financial incentive to say that you are special for all your life perhaps. :)
 
@JohanLarsson the kind of special that can be manipulated easily too
 
maybe I bnutchered that english trying to be fancy
 
@Mgetz yeah, putin is probably not going to have problems
both making trump feel comfortable and make him feel like putin's ideas are his own and that they are great
 
2:58 PM
@JohanLarsson he never was, he has no compunction about killing to stay in power. Or faking his own country's version of 9/11
Trump is just icing on the cake
that said both Russia and China will likely make moves in the next couple of months to test him
I would expect something like an invasion of Ukraine
 
he does not like china right?
 
no
but he doesn't have the balls to fight them either
 
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