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Ell
10:02 AM
@xeo push bike or motorbike?
 
Xeo
Just a normal bike.
 
Ell
Yeah, bikes are the best
I want to get a road bike
 
It's also 6:11 AM
I should try to sleep.
 
haha
@Xeo I have a bike (bicycle), you could buy it, but we'd have to find a way of getting it to you
 
lol
 
10:17 AM
^ does that make you feel safe?
 
no
radiation
 
Gives me the impression of living in biohazard: the city.
 
US government is weirding me out.
 
@LucDanton Where is that sign? I assume not on a bio lab.
 
10:22 AM
@Rapptz that whole thing is odd, can't make out what's true and not true
 
Yeah me neither.
 
@MartinJames Municipal placards and the like. It's the city symbol thingy!
 
NSA is spying on people, but they've been doing that for years
so the new thing is, they record everyone's digital communication, and apparently large companies are cooperating
and then you have the media making it a new tool to scare everyone
 
@LucDanton Oh gawd! Did nobody notice the similarity when designing it? What is the point of having those hazard warnings if nobody recognises them?
 
At first I thought someone had added a biohazard sticker or something in an attempt at street art. But it wasn't so much stuck on the plate as part of the thing, so I was confused.
 
user142019
10:26 AM
@LucDanton Biohazard sign is slightly different.
 
^ from random blog commenting on the similarity. It looks really bad, doesn't it? It's like they are announcing the city is quarantined for a zombie outbreak or something.
 
ITT Luc has found the zombie apocalypse beginning.
@ScottW that has confused me since time immemorial
> VC++ Directories -> Include Directories sets the INCLUDE environment variable, which decides where to look for the header file. "C/C++ -> General -> Additional include directories" passes the additional include directories with the /FI switch to the CL compiler.
that is the key bit
I know, and I'm learning
yea well, apparently I never understood that till now
thanks @ScottW <3
 
What is the use of giving a name to an enum?
 
hello, can you say me pls, if i built boost libraries for vs2012, will i be able to use them in Qt or i'll need to recompile?
 
@ScottW ?
 
user142019
10:34 AM
@ScottW grass
 
@rightfold ?
 
user142019
@ScottW gross
 
What is the purpose of giving a name to an enum?
 
Ell
To make it useful
To describe it. What is the purpose of giving a name to a class?
 
user142019
@ScottW PHP
 
user142019
10:36 AM
@Ell The same as why you'd give a name to a variable.
 
user142019
Borland PHP Interpreter
 
@ShuklaSannidhya Easier to declare variables of such.
 
@Ell We can declare enum as enum foo { BAR, BAZ } I can use BAR and BAZ why do I need to use name foo...
 
user142019
@ScottW That's not real.
 
@ScottW Rightfold
@rightfold ScottW
 
Ell
10:38 AM
@ShuklaSannidhya Well if it wasn't named how would you say the type?
 
user142019
We have a new router and it's 1.4 times as fast.
 
suckaz
 
@Ell I can also declare it as enum {BAR, BAZ} and still use BAR, BAZ without requiring to name it...
 
user142019
> We suggest that you use Internet Explorer 5.5 or above at a minimum of 1024x768 resolution.
 
@ShuklaSannidhya Read what Ell said again, but more carefully.
 
10:41 AM
@rightfold lol
 
user142019
enums in C++ are retarded anyway so who cares.
 
user142019
Use enum classes always. Or enum struct if you're hipster.
 
user142019
Between?
 
the one is strongly typed
and the other is a faggot
 
user142019
enum classs and enum structs are identical.
 
10:42 AM
@LucDanton I don't get... What does he mean by "say the type"?
 
that's not what he's asking
 
user142019
Difference between enum class and enum is that the former is a new type and the latter is practically a typedef for int.
 
user142019
Yes.
 
user142019
But hey, why do we have types at all? Just have everything be string and we'll be fine.
 
user142019
That's why enum sucks and enum class sucks much less.
 
10:43 AM
@ShuklaSannidhya An enum definitions is a type definition, in addition to defining the particular enum constants.
 
@LucDanton TBH, I have seem confusion before over those signs. At Nortel, they had a health/safety fit and put hazard signs up all over the place. A 'cleaning cupboard' got a 'hazardous chemicals' sign even though there were no chemicals, (it was full of cables/routers), and my lab got a 'radiation' sticker 'cos cellular transmitters - unfortunately they put up an 'ionising radiation' sign :(
 
enum foo { bar }; foo f = bar; // <- variable of type foo
 
user142019
Go const is awesome.
 
@MartinJames lol
 
user142019
type flag int
const (
    a = flag(1 << iota)
    b
    c
)
 
user142019
10:44 AM
:3
 
In what sense is it a cleaning cupboard if it's full of cables and routers?
@MartinJames They should have handed you dosimeters obviously!
 
some help vampire is invading Android room
 
seems like a spam vampire
 
lol, check the third comment here:
 
@LucDanton Don't know. My code travelled through the cables, so I guess it should have been designated a 'dirtying cupboard' :)
 
10:47 AM
59
Q: What are the implications of NSA surveillance on the average internet user?

nitrlIt would appear as though the tinfoil hat-wearing were vindicated today, as news broke of the true scale of the U.S. government's surveillance of its citizens' online activities, conducted primarily through the NSA and seemingly beyond the realm of the law. If the reports are to be believed, met...

 
It's our fault for not spotting this question sooner — jackweirdy yesterday
ahahahahahaahahahahahah
 
@LucDanton error: 'foo' undeclared (first use in this function) codepad.org/a7jCTUZs
 
lol
 
@ShuklaSannidhya In C you use enum foo, much like if you had struct foo { int i; }; you declare a variable of such as struct foo f;
 
user142019
> This user has been automatically suspended for posting inappropriate content and cannot chat for 1 hour 59 minutes.
 
user142019
10:50 AM
Victory!
 
@LucDanton Nobody else noticed the sign error. It had been up all day until I arrived for my shift and took it down. Some moron tried to get me into trouble for it, but I just stuck to 'wrong sign worse than no sign'. Eventually, they put up the correct sign - the one that looks like a radio transmitter tower.
 
user142019
@LucDanton this enum foo f;. :P
 
user142019
@ScottW It's just an enum which requires explicit qualification and doesn't implicitly convert to and from the underlying type (int by default).
 
Ell
Has anyone here written swarm ai before?
 
@ScottW They can't have members, but keep in mind the philosophy in C++ that free functions of a type can be considered part of its public interface. Which makes doubly sense when you consider you can define operators for enum types, as long as they can be declared as non-members.
Only thing that appears in an enum definition are the enumerators, i.e. privileged enum constants.
@ScottW Oh I completely failed to notice you said enum class. What I said applies to all enum types, scoped or unscoped.
 
10:54 AM
@LucDanton Hmm... Why is sizeof(enum foo) == sizeof(BAR)? enum foo has two elements... shouldn't it be twice the size of BAR?
 
Ell
@ShuklaSannidhya I guess that BAR's underlying type is int, and enums default is int
or something
 
user142019
@ShuklaSannidhya wat no.
 
user142019
An enum is just an optionally named collection of constants.
 
@ShuklaSannidhya An enum definition does not quite read like a struct definition.
 
10:56 AM
A somewhat similar struct definition would read struct foo { /* magic */ }; constexpr foo bar = static_cast<foo>(0);
 
user142019
It's like
 
user142019
a type of which values can have one of X number of values.
 
user142019
@ShuklaSannidhya Yes, I know that. Thank you.
 
(Don't take it too literally, it's meant as a guide to help you understand enum definitions, not enum variables or values!)
 
@rightfold: I started reading that online book on Haskell you suggested me, and I love it - thank you for that! However, it seems to me it mostly shows examples and does not explain the theory behind them. So when I try doing something that goes beyond those examples and I get an error, I do not understand why I get it. Are there some materials that explain the language a bit more formally?
 
user142019
10:58 AM
An enum is a sum type of which the variants each can have exactly one value.
 
@rightfold So you mean f can't have any other value than BAR and BAZ.
 
@ShuklaSannidhya That doesn't sound right.
 
user142019
@AndyProwl Haskell specification is very formal.
 
user142019
Haskell Wiki will also help a lot.
 
user142019
And of course the library documentation, which has a search engine every language should have.
 
11:00 AM
Ok, thank you. I will try that
 
@LucDanton because you can cast any number from the underlying type of the enum to the enum, regardless if it present in the enum?
 
user142019
And otherwise you can always ask here, on Stack Overflow or in Functional Programming.
 
@melak47 ye
 
4 mins ago, by rightfold
a type of which values can have one of X number of values.
 
@rightfold I would, but I'm a bit afraid of asking really stupid questions or questions that have been asked 2000 times before and I couldn't find them because I'm a noob
 
11:01 AM
@ShuklaSannidhya It's not wrong, but it's not precise.
 
Why is this right then - enum foo f; f = 5?
 
e.g. enum foo { bar = 1 }; constexpr foo baz = static_cast<foo>(0); is correct. That's what I meant by 'privileged constants'. There can be other ones.
 
Also, I think foo x = foo() value-initializes x to 0
 
@ShuklaSannidhya There are implicit conversions at work which make it harder to keep track of what's going on.
 
user142019
@AndyProwl Doesn't matter unless on Stack Overflow.
 
11:03 AM
@AndyProwl I would expect it to. I would expect it so much that I won't bother looking it up, too!
 
also, what happens when enum bla { a = 1, b = 1}; bla b = static_cast<bla>(1); ? :/
 
@melak47 Not much. If you're wondering, both b == a and b == bla::b hold. (Latter is C++11 only.)
I'm assuming that the language lets you get away with that b definition though, I really have no idea.
 
@LucDanton I think it is specified in 8.5 (scalar types are value-initialized to 0) and 3.9 (enums are scalar types)
@rightfold That's what I meant yes. So on Functional Programming I can ask that kind of questions?
Like, boring dupes as "why is i = i++ UB?" would be in C++
 
@LucDanton it does
 
user142019
@AndyProwl sure.
 
11:08 AM
All right, thank you
 
user142019
You'll be praised for making the room more active. :P
 
Hey anyone know which compression type i should use to be able to extract easily from c++ without relying on user software?
 
@DavidKron .txt :D
 
@melak47 Lol i dont know any software allowing me to compress to .txt
I am talking about a small file structure here
 
@rightfold Indeed it doesn't seem like there's much life in that room :D
 
11:13 AM
Is there anyway i can avoid external dependencies like calling system(), win32 or built in unzip tools in windows dir?
 
I'm still in Haskell even though it's been frozen for months.
 
It says - " A variable with enumeration type stores one of the values of the enumeration set defined by that type."
 
Ell
@DavidKron I think you need to use a library
Which you should just package with your application
 
Then why is this not an error - codepad.org/XoNkX4Hs
 
Ell
@ShuklaSannidhya enums aren't strongly typed
 
11:19 AM
@ShuklaSannidhya Not every error is required to be diagnosable, i.e. some of them you're not told about.
 
Ell
unlike enum class s
 
user142019
@LucDanton There's a new room.
 
user142019
I made it more general so it would attract more people.
 
user142019
But apparently nobody wants to chat about functional programming.
 
user142019
 
user142019
11:29 AM
This Google Chrome plug-in is everything I've ever wanted.
 
11:40 AM
.NET BCL is really badly designed!
wait, wrong person
Direct Draw?
 
Ell
I'm on linux
So no :/
 
ddraw.dll ?
 
why does your project depend on it
 
user142019
Is there a library for doing transactions on a file system?
 
user784668
11:57 AM
@ScottW mingw has
 
12:13 PM
Damn, VLC sends this laptop in a spiral of death. Not even for video, just audio. I'm guessing this thing is toast.
 
user142019
12:49 PM
Coool.
 
user142019
PHP 5.5 will have yield.
 
user142019
PHP > C++
4
 
Ell
1:29 PM
xD
 
1:42 PM
ITT @rightfold loses his mind
 
Xeo
@rightfold I want the yields :(
 
@rightfold Gotta lotta bottle.
 
user142019
I would use Flask but that doesn't support Python 3. :(
 
user142019
Bottle's close enough.
 
Ell
1:52 PM
Bottle? o.O
 
user142019
What about it?
 
Ell
I'm trying django at the minute
But I would like to use python 3
 
user142019
Django works with Python 3.
 
user142019
What's stopping you?
 
Ell
oh.
that's probably why I hadn't run into any problems yet:P
 
Ell
2:14 PM
Yay I got interleaved attributes working finally
I just don't understand why
 
Xeo
Pasta with pesto, nom nom
 
@Xeo Fuckin tasty.
 
Ell
2:30 PM
I'm going to a party tonight
I'm not very excited
 
user142019
2:43 PM
I'm gonna barbecue today.
 
user142019
And I'm going to a party tonight too.
 
Ell
I can't decide what my text interface should look like
 
I'm gonna eat sandwiches today.
 
user142019
Yum.
 
Ell
I ate a carvery already earlier
 
user142019
2:44 PM
@StackedCrooked Met wat? Gerookte ham, gesmolten kaas, ei en peterselie? :3
 
Ell
and I discovered that bread sauce just tastes like porridge
 
You ate a car?
@rightfold hm.. that doesn't sound bad :)
 
user142019
Fuck you @rightfold now I want a sandwich with smoked ham, molten cheese, eggs and parsley.
 
user142019
Much better than BBQ.
 
Fucking OpenID... no wonder it had no success...
Basically no documentation for Ruby. How am I supposed to work with this.
Oh, hai lads
 
Ell
3:23 PM
Hai
 
@Jeffrey That file ensured me again that Ruby is an awful language.
 
@Griwes I like Ruby, I don't like gems that don't have documentation. It's frustrating.
 
Ell
I love ruby
It is so expressive
 
end end end end end end sure is expressive
 
Ell
You could also have }}}}end if you wanted :P
But that code could be improved a lot IMHO
Eg a hash for names, using each_with_index
Not using printf
 
3:39 PM
@Griwes }}}}}}} sure is expressive
 
user142019
3:54 PM
@Griwes Yes, because that's really relevant.
 
user142019
It's about how easy it is to express your intent.
 
user142019
Does end (or }, for that matter) prevent the code from expressing your intent well? No.
 
Oh, yet another crappy feature proposal on std-proposals :D
 
user142019
LINK!
 
user142019
4:08 PM
OP forgets that move semantics and tuples exist.
 
user142019
Because seriously just use that instead of retarded out parameters.
 
It may be the worst proposal I have seen since break break break.
 
user142019
@Morwenn haha :D
 
@Morwenn break break break? huh?
 
@cHao To break out of multiple loops at once.
 
4:15 PM
heh
they couldn't even think of break 3?
 
Xeo
That came up aswell
 
(not that that's any better, imo...but eh.)
 
Labeled break also came up.
 
if people have to avoid a goto under penalty of death, a labeled break would be better... i guess...
though it's so far from the label that goto would make the destination clearer :P
 
Well, just wrap your nested loops into a function and use return.
 
4:18 PM
@Morwenn lol
that's awesomely retarted
 
The only use I know of for goto is state machines.
 
goto has its uses. the main rebellion against it in the past was its ability to arbitrarily jump pretty much anywhere, and most of that power is gone
 
Xeo
12
Q: Is this a valid (ab)use of lambda expressions?

XeoLike we all know, it's not that easy to break from a nested loop out of an outer loop without either: a goto (Example code.) another condition check in the outer loop (Example code.) putting both loops in an extra function and returning instead of breaking (Example code.) Though, you gotta ad...

:D
Also, hi @Andy!
 
@Xeo hiho :)
 
Putting the loops in a new function is a good idea provided the function makes sense alone.
Otherwise, goto, or bool + std::exchange for condition checking.
 
4:23 PM
@Morwenn What is std::exchange?
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl post-assign
i.e., assign var to new value, but return old value
 
@AndyProwl non-atomic equivalent of C++11 std::atomic_exchange.
 
@Xeo Is it a C++14 thing?
 
Yep.
 
Oh, I see
damn, I'm behind already
 
4:24 PM
I would have commited it to libstdc++ if I had found how their legal stuff before comitting works.
 
Xeo
if(std::exchange(ran_once, true)) ...
would be an example usage
 
Why is it stdio.h?
 
Oh, I just received a mail that gives me the legal form I have to print and sign, then snail back if I want to contribute to GCC.
 
why doesn't c++ have inner functions, anyway?
aside from lambdas in variables, of course
 
What do you mean by inner functions?
 
4:28 PM
functions that are defined, and only accessible by name, inside another function
 
Xeo
@cHao Would they have access to stuff in the outer function?
 
In computer science, a closure (also lexical closure or function closure) is a function or reference to a function together with a referencing environment—a table storing a reference to each of the non-local variables (also called free variables) of that function. A closure—unlike a plain function pointer—allows a function to access those non-local variables even when invoked outside of its immediate lexical scope. The concept of closures was developed in the 1960s and was first fully implemented in 1975 as a language feature in the Scheme programming language to suppor...
 
@Xeo that depends on your pov. i'd say no, that'd be the use for lambdas...but it could go either way
 
user142019
@CHRIS Standard I/O.
 
Xeo
@cHao If you allow it, you have the upwards funarg problem.
 
4:33 PM
giving them access to the outer function's variables would complicate calling conventions, though
 
Oh, most of the c++14 library changes may be available in the next verison of GCC.
 
user142019
@Xeo Surprised there aren't any comments about moving it to Code Review. :P
 
Appart from std::optional and std::dynarray.
 
user142019
Is std::optional well-designed?
 
Xeo
@rightfold Did you look at the date I posted that? I don't think Code Review existed back then
 
4:34 PM
@Xeo yeah..that, among other things, is why i'm leaning towards no
 
@rightfold No idea.
 
Does ISO also specify coding style?
 
Yes, you must use:
if  (x)
{
}
// this is forbidden
if (x) {
}
2
 
user142019
If std::optional lacks map and monadic bind, it sucks.
 
@StackedCrooked Citation needed...
 
4:39 PM
@ShuklaSannidhya I said so.
 
user142019
@ShuklaSannidhya No.
 
@StackedCrooked You are not ISO.
@rightfold Citation needed.
 
user142019
Uhm.
 
user142019
I can't cite something that doesn't exist.
 
4:40 PM
PEP8 forbids it.
 
@rightfold Excuses!
 
user142019
PEP 8 is awesome.
 
Citation or GTFO.
:P
 
I once read PEP8 and realized I already had the recommended coding style.
 
@rightfold Citation needed for - "No"
 
user142019
4:41 PM
I CANNOT CITE ANYTHING ABOUT CODING STYLE BECAUSE THE STANDARD DOESN'T EVEN MENTION ANYTHING ABOUT IT
 
user142019
AS I ALREADY SAID
 
user142019
SEE THE STANDARD
 
@Xeo thinking about it, it could reasonably have access to static variables, but auto ones would be a pain
 
The standard does not say anything about coding style, how can I cite this?
 
Xeo
@rightfold Of course it does
 
user142019
4:44 PM
It sucks!
 
Xeo
fmap and bind make no sense for it in C++ as long as you can't easily pass function names
 
user142019
New OS X leaked http://t.co/TCEo4zTKyo
5
 
user142019
Haha.
 
Xeo
lawl
 
okay... noob question- Is the complete draft of this standard available anywhere on the internet? As a pdf maybe...
 
4:47 PM
@rightfold lol
 
@ShuklaSannidhya n3485.pdf
 
user142019
Ropes are awesome.
 
@Morwenn Thanks. Found it...
 
user142019
 
@rightfold What does "ftttt" mean?
 
4:53 PM
@ShuklaSannidhya it's the farting sound jesus is making with this hands :P
 
user142019
An onomatopoeia (sometimes written as onomatopœia) (, from the Greek ὀνοματοποιία; ὄνομα for "name" and ποιέω for "I make", adjectival form: "onomatopoeic" or "onomatopoetic") is a word that phonetically imitates or suggests the source of the sound that it describes. Onomatopoeia (as an uncountable noun) refers to the property of such words. Common occurrences of onomatopoeias include animal noises such as "oink", "meow", "roar" or "chirp". Onomatopoeias are not the same across all languages; they conform to some extent to the broader linguistic system they are part of; hence the sound of...
 
Can't wait to receive the last albums I purchased online...
 
user142019
Haha.
 
user142019
A guy I know kissed a girl for the first time and now he is ill because the girl was ill.
 
4:58 PM
@rightfold You have that a lot in Japanese. Like doki doki means heart beating.
 
Damn it.
Damn damn damn it.
 
user142019
Dammit.*
 
user142019
Also: owned.
 
I have a month old branch that I need to merge.
 
@rightfold He kissed you? You should've told him that you were sick... ;)
 
user142019
4:59 PM
Haha. Owned.
 
And in the meantime, there were large restructuring in the project (lots of moves and renames and refactors).
So it conflicts like hell.
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked Biribiri :D
 
user142019
@StackedCrooked klo-puh, klo-puh
 
user142019
kloppen!
 

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