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8:00 PM
I'm not even familiar with the word kungfubility.
 
@Loktar oh cripes. Nice catch.
 
It's pretty easy to start a VPS company these days and they do fairly well, so a twist where folks can make manage their own sizing and count would be cool.
 
@ssube There are infinite KVM or openvz hosters, how does it compare?
 
I mean I don't disagree with the points you lay out @SomeKittens
just the overall point of saying not to do it is all.
 
@copy Same performance (it's KVM), less capital (comes with a dashboard), allows users to size their own machines.
 
8:01 PM
@SterlingArcher CollegeHumor, shut up
 
crl
oh man react-dnd is quite complex..
 
If everyone's selling yellow lemonade, starting a yellow lemonade business is a bad idea. Starting a pink lemonade business, on the other hand...
 
Instead of giving them X machines at Y size, you give them Y hardware and they can spin up to X machines.
 
Yeah idk I don't see web hosting quite so black and white.
Over the last 10 years its changed quite a bit
and there are still areas in the market to make money
Still so many shared hosts who just provide your standard lamp stack
 
and if you think of a niche, then you may have something
 
8:03 PM
Heroku's a fantastic example of a pink lemonade stand
 
@Luggage yeah thats what you have to do with most things, its how I was making over 50k a year with a game portal.
 
Hey I just wanted to let you guys know that room 15 is talking smack.
 
@rlemon that extension is p dank btw.
 
@nebulae ...so?
 
We know.
 
8:03 PM
so yah, battle.
 
There are tons of people who want 3 or 4 tiny machines and are willing to overcommit their own resources, but can't on a normal VPS host.
 
but if I looked at all the game portals that existed and decided not to do it, I would have missed out
 
15 isn't worthy of our time. Continue with your petty fights.
2
 
What is "15"?
 
who is room 15 even? Never heard of them
 
8:04 PM
If you give them 2 cores and 2GB, then let them spin up the 4 machines they want, they can do whatever.
 
uh, sick burn
 
in Android, 1 min ago, by nebulae
who the frick is room 17?
 
lol
frick bomb dropped
we just got fricked!
 
the Android room?
 
frick rolled
 
8:05 PM
you mean the Java-without-hardware room?
 
Android room is cool
they gave us @OctavianDamiean
 
psh we took him
 
:D
 
I'm so bored today
 
this is why we need an inter room war
bored developers just fight meta wars
 
8:07 PM
> The default CPU allocation ratio of 16:1 means that the scheduler allocates up to 16 virtual cores per physical core. For example, if a physical node has 12 cores, the scheduler sees 192 available virtual cores.
 
if only it was the ios room
then I could actually hate it
 
@OctavianDamiean BBBBRRROOOOO!
 
@OctavianDamiean If you want to be not bored, stop writing Java
 
8:08 PM
BRUUUUUU
 
@rlemon lol yea I've seen your updates
 
Java can be fun
 
I ain't writin' Java!
 
I feel bad for you
 
bloody hell man
 
8:08 PM
Some hoster's performance certainly feels like 16:1
 
OOOoOOOooOOOOoo
 
Java is only fun in Script mode
 
That's why I use Cordova.
 
so OS recommends roughly the machines that OVH sells: docs.openstack.org/openstack-ops/content/…
 
@Loktar "so when is it going to be fixed" .. uhhh.. 4 hours to 48 hours.
 
8:09 PM
Less Java more Script.
 
8 core/16 thread with 128GB
 
ouch :/
 
@OctavianDamiean I'll Java your Script.
 
Ok, I lied, I had to write a couple of lines in pure Java to initialize stuff
 
@Loktar making things even worse, to be able to test 'real world' I have spun up a vm on that server so my 'development' server is also in the cloud
I can't do any work
would take longer to get it setup offline than it will for them to fix it
:/
 
8:10 PM
@ssube oh, I've heard OVH is really good about uptime. They never crash.
 
only solution is to go home and game.
 
@Loktar I would, but clients keep calling in complaining the service is down
I'm manning the phones
 
@OctavianDamiean I'll script your java.
 
When are we going to have a Terraria hangout?
 
@SomeKittens They crash occasionally, but it's 3-4 startups between each outage, so plenty to run a VPS host from.
 
8:11 PM
@KendallFrey give me a week to get my office / pc back in order
then ping me, any time
 
I've seen... 2 (or 3) major problems in the last 3ish years since i've known folks using them.
Since your average startup lasts 3-6 months, nobody will ever notice. :D
 
@ssube JOKE
 
My dataset does not come with a unique identifier ._. how the fuck am i supposed to persist when names aren't unique
 
I'm now in "farm Moon Lord" stage, so need more stuff to do
 
FUUUUUUUU
 
8:12 PM
@SterlingArcher just use Mongo
 
@SterlingArcher generate one? combine two other fields to make an index?
 
Mongo not an option :(
 
Mongo was, most likely, a joke.
Actually, mongo is definitely a joke.
 
I may be able to generate one, or I will pester my back end guy to change the API to return an identifier
reddit.com/r/AnimalTextGifs found my new favorite subreddit
 
haha dafuq
 
8:16 PM
omg unexpected jihad is still so hilarious
too soon?
 
not soon enough?
!!afk something something danger zone
I know, I'm not even trying anymore.
 
omg did Mallory Archer just say "Colonel Panic"?
nerdgasm XD
 
@SterlingArcher PHRASING!
 
@Trasiva SterlingArcher is afk: something something danger zone
 
@SterlingArcher DO NOT TOUCH OCTOPUS!
 
8:22 PM
@rlemon Why? James Bond seemed to have a good time with Octopussy.
 
Im stoked for angular 2
anyone here been playing with it?
I have a demo / prototype thing to build out, was thinking on using it for that, instead of 1.0
 
@nebulae YOU TRYNA GO M8?
 
wat?
 
(everybody but SomeKittens is over angular)
 
@Trasiva @SterlingArcher there are a good number of octopuses that are deadly on touch. unless you are an expert, wild octopus is like a 50:50 you dead after touching it
stay away
stay far away
 
8:23 PM
but 2.0 tho?
 
we're writing JS to avoid writing Java, so why would we want to write Angular/Java-for-JS? :P
 
@rlemon can confirm, we hate that.
 
@rlemon 50:50? I like those odds!
 
You can't use reduce with Map? :|
 
you're writing js to avoid java?
I just cant even compute that
 
8:23 PM
@nebulae absolutely
 
well
that's weird.
i gotta say
 
JS gets you really far away from Java, until Angular pulls all the old Java patterns back in
 
there are much better reasons to write js.
 
most of what JS is used for is an alternative to Java
you have some REST API written in who-cares-what (probably Java) and a JS client
 
or python
because easy
 
8:24 PM
or PHP
 
used to be that you piled in restlets and tempspring and god knows how many other libraries to make a shitty server-side Java UI
now you just write some magical API and JS does the rest
 
node ftw
js all things
 
\o/
 
screw node
 
8:25 PM
 
java ftw because android <3
 
js belongs on the frontend
 
@ssube orly?
3
 
js ftw because all things front end browser based
 
8:25 PM
@ssube Show that language what's what
You ain't no playing
 
because - and i repeat - the right tool for the job.
 
@rlemon yes. Put your pretend money away.
 
@nebulae You know how you feel when people who haven't done much more than "Hello world" in Java say OH EMM GEE JAVA SUX0RZ! ?
That's this room's opinion of Angular in a nutshell.
 
@ssube I will, I'll put it into my pretend house filled with pretend things that make me pretend happy. :D
 
SomeKittens, I feel it.
 
8:26 PM
I like angular. The learning curve is steep as fuck though.
 
@rlemon Well, you're Canadian, so you're not even real (according to my gf).
She's convinced Canada doesn't exist.
 
/me is also canadian
 
Still not sure why...
 
@ssube sounds like a winner.
:P
 
I had to leave and move to the states tho, because it stopped existing.
 
8:27 PM
@ssube And we're convinced your gf doesn't exist.
 
Canada is just the U.S. of Eh
 
@Zirak ooh
I am on the internet, so that's a fair assumption.
 
oh. my. lanta.
 
@ssube ...does she regularly polish her tinfoil hat too?
 
@nebulae hrm.... Saskatchewan?
100% guess
 
8:27 PM
@Trasiva She puts on her robe and wizard hat...
 
rlemon YOU KNOW ME THO
 
@rlemon You didn't track his IP.....
 
> Saskatchewan
 
@Trasiva no, she german's it
 
is that a real word?
 
8:28 PM
badum-tsch
 
its not fair I probly told you that sometime in the last 5 years
 
@SterlingArcher no
 
@nebulae couldn't remember. 10% chance
still not bad
 
but some people thing saskatchewans live in the woods
 
@SterlingArcher US is just Canada's shorts
 
8:28 PM
!!afk violently demoing app to VP
 
but yah, saskatchewan
 
get back in room 15 neb, these people will corrupt you ;)
 
@Zirak I always assumed BloodNinja was a guy, but damn if I could be wrong!
 
@KendallFrey shorts are where all the good parts live
 
if youre canadian you pronoince is skachwan
 
8:28 PM
saskatoon
 
dont tell me what to do esku.
 
> you pronoince is skachwan
 
I'm canadian, I pronounce it saskatchewan
 
@eski Afraid of losing another member of your echo chamber?
 
ya i typeo, i don't fix em, so wat?
 
8:29 PM
wew lad
2edgy4me
 
Isn't javascript just Java for scripting anyway
:p
 
I wonder if people will ever realise there's no difference between scripting and programming
 
Ok I'm done trolling, I'll go back to my hole
 
@Zirak There is to a playwright.
 
8:30 PM
I'm still trolling.
 
@Cereal You know what, just for that, I'm going to write that in the commendation section of your file. There is certainly plenty of room there. "Does work adequately."
 
xxtroll, find me on reddit.
 
@Zirak there used to be a very loose difference, in that scripts are almost never compiled ahead-of-time
 
@Zirak scripting makes you sound more 'haxxor' programming sounds legit
in my company, we have an engine that interprets customized 'scripts'
so one guys writes the scripts (scripting) and I write the program that interprets it
 
Buh... how do you check that something you are using Object.keys on is an Object with keys before hand, if everything is an object?
 
8:31 PM
@rlemon We have the same
 
@ssube Plenty of legit languages had interpreters, and besides, what's "used to"? JITs have been around for forever now
 
it sucks
 
@rlemon D00d, w3're t0ta| haxx0r5. W3'|| fuk u up m8.
 
if somebody says they're writing Lua for a game, you'll probably think scripting. Java for a bank website, programming (and later suicide).
@Zirak JIT != AOT newb
 
It's a term of belittlement or endearment
 
8:32 PM
"serious programming" is compiled AOT
 
Oh, my apologies
 
that's the difference between scripting and programming IMO
 
"serious programming" iz srs busns yo
 
So .Net and JVM aren't srs bsns
 
with programming you compile things?
 
8:33 PM
@Zirak they're both AOT and JIT compiled
 
Object.keys('Hello')   // => ['0', '1', '2', '3', '4']
Object.keys([1,2,3])  // => ['0', '1', '2']
Object.keys({ 'Hello': 'Goodbye'})  // => ['Hello']
So annoying to deal with
 
and folks did definitely criticize them for that, early on
 
> Comment by OVH - Monday, 02 November 2015, 21:30PM
We still don't have an ETA regarding the repairs on the existing fiber.

However, it's been confirmed that 2 out the 3 new pairs of the Eastern route (which were being setup) are now usable. We are working with our providers in order to get a full connection as quickly as possible: the only cross-connect linking OVH to our provider (in Montreal) is currently missing.
 
Drat, let isn't scoped to case statements (not that it should be, but would be nice for the current snipped I'm working with)
 
@ssube So to you the difference is simply the medium of getting the code around?
Because js is also compiled AOT before any JIT enters the scene
 
crl
8:34 PM
someone dealt with react-dnd? seems bit over-complicated for a simple thing..
 
@Zirak it was always a rough impressionist sort of difference, tbh. Scripting was JIT/interpreted and for little things that didn't change the world, programming took 20 minutes to build and was for serious stuff.
 
And that's also implementation dependant, of course
 
Hence the game-Lua vs bank-Java example
 
@rlemon If it's a fiber bundle, GOOOOD luck. I'm certified in fusion splicing, but bundles? Them's a bitch.
 
@ssube Great, so now there's no need to make a distinction, right?
 
8:34 PM
@Zirak not really, no
 
There's no "scripting language" vs. "programming language"
HEY, @ssube AND I AGREED ON SOMETHING
That's the first time ever
 
intermediate representations and JITting runtimes kind of got rid of the differences
 
@SomeKittens Workaround: put your cases in braces
 
Workaround: don't use case.
 
@Zirak I think we've been cynical together before.
 
8:35 PM
@KendallFrey but cases in braces might cause stasis
 
@corvid I'm sure I've suggested it before... but lodash/underscore pretty much eliminates any need for Object.keys
 
@Trasiva I've done 0 work today due to this
 
@Retsam Let him stay on the wagon. We had a very long convo earlier about avoiding lodash/underscore.
 
all of our crap is in the Montreal hosting center
 
@rlemon And you're hourly too, right?
 
8:36 PM
@Trasiva fuck no
 
Oh, well then.
 
salary + profit sharing
win!
 
@ssube Ehh, and I disagree with you on that. I think lodash/underscore is really useful, and don't undersatnd all the hate.
 
@Retsam same issue as jQ
 
Nah, bro.
 
crl
8:37 PM
I don't know why I don't like the @.. class decorators
 
they're heavy and obsolete. There's a better way built-in now.
 
That comes from the mistaken belief that lodash is primarily a polyfill library. It isn't.
 
what can lodash do that es2015 cannot do? (seriously, don't use lodash)
 
lodash polyfills some good things and adds some really bad ones, like iterating over objects
 
what can humans do that es2015 can't?
 
8:38 PM
@towc poop
 
objects are not key-value stores for iterating, those are maps
 
Looping over objects, grouping arrays of objects, making certain conditions more readable...
 
also, don't use humans, that's against the chart of human rights
 
@towc your mom
 
using objects as dynamic KV stores breaks tons of opts
 
8:38 PM
@KendallFrey I got some script just for that ;)
 
> making certain conditions more readable
that is loaded.
got an example?
 
if(_.any(arrayOfStuff, testFunc))
 
array.some ??
 
Yeah, fair, there is that.
 
the only things that _ makes more readable are things you probably shouldn't be doing
 
8:41 PM
@ssube Which, sadly, can only be iterated over with for...of
 
I'm not dismissing _, like I said I've never used it.
I'm honestly curious if there is stuff it offers that we cannot do with es2015
 
Whenever you put a _ I read that as an "mmm", which sounds...weird.
 
We used _ heavily for years across a bunch of products, then thought about getting rid of it and did an audit.
Found a half-dozen functions we were actually used that couldn't just search-replace to ES5.
mostly pluck, actually
 
!!google lodash pluck
 
8:42 PM
@rlemon I'm salary, but I don't get profit sharing.
 
pluck is foo.map(it => it[name])
 
ohh that looks handy
 
Lodash also does lazy evaluation which can make things more performant.
 
If you're touting lazy evaluation, at least ramda it up
 
Things like _.groupBy are only occasionally useful, but a bitch to polyfill.
 
8:43 PM
lodash is the laziest most half-assed-est version of lazy eval
@Retsam groupBy is trivial to polyfill
 
Because in those regards and in composability ramda takes lodash by miles
 
so lazy-lazy-eval
 
crl
I'm a bit resilient on ES6/7
 
must work better right?
 
8:43 PM
@crl why?
 
Ramda is probably neat, I haven't had a chance to look at it; but Ramda being potentially neater doesn't detract from the argument that lodash is neat.
 
crl
the @decorators is one reason, I prefer to have more 'predictable' things
 
@Loktar I'm not a huge fan of slack for any project
feels like a heavy half thought out chat
 
I think its a better webchat than SOs
but I think IRC is > all
 
yea, but you don't need much to be better than SOs
Miaou > Slack imo
 
8:45 PM
@Retsam groupBy(data, field) { return data.reduce((p, c) => (p[c[field]] = (p[c[field]] || []).push(c), p)); }
 
crl
slack = limited history.., IRC too (there are bots)
 
@crl ?
IRCs history is based off of yours or someone elses logging
also you get unlimited messages if you pay for slack
 
crl
messages history
 
@crl what do you mean?
 
@ssube Sure, when I said "bitch to polyfill", I meant "inline". If you want to maintain your own set of lodash-like polyfills like that, I guess you can.
 
8:47 PM
with IRC if you want unlimited messaging history, log it
 
crl
@Loktar like the transcript here
 
there are tons of loggers out there.
 
@Retsam we do, because we have like 3 of them
 
crl
@Loktar well sometimes I turn my laptop off
 
thats the beauty of IRC if you want something from it its A). already made, or B). possible to make
 
crl
8:47 PM
get a server to do so, yeah..
 
Thats how I connect to IRC
I just ssh into my server at home which is always running
and my friends who run the channel servers have bots log everything anyway
 
@crl vps man
$15/year for an IRC bouncer
 
You could pretty trivially make a custom build of lodash with just the functions you wanted, if you're really concerned about the size of the library, even if it's just like 3 functions.
 
One feature that Slack doesn't have (or really, any chat I've tried other than here) is lack of direct replies.
Zulip has something analogous but not identical.
(haven't tried Zulip, just heard about it)
 
I use whatever platform you guys use. Otherwise I'd have no friends.
 
crl
8:51 PM
@Loktar unrelated, have you dealt with react-dnd? looks good, but complex for my simple mind
 
Wait, Miao has that
 
I just use Google Hangouts... am I a bad person?
 
@Retsam lodash is modules already
 
it's equally free, you can use an account you already have... it stores history...
 
@crl haha I was just looking at that actually like last week
 
8:51 PM
there's a project where we use only the modules we need
 
I just needed some simple sorting
 
@Codeman false, you're using stack overflow chat right now
 
crl
hehe, I used Rubaxa/Sortable too (can work with angular and react) and is more simple
 
I ended up settling on a mixin instead because I'm on a short timeline and DnD had a hgiher learning curve than I wanted
 
@rlemon SO chat works equally well for open source projects, IMO
only problem is SO chat is usually for a general topic
 
8:52 PM
@SomeKittens what do you mean?
 
user4639281
Is there a trick for stopping form submission using chrome's Dev Tools?
 
^ not like that I assume right?
 
and most SO chats are focused on using libraries, not building them. So the NodeJS chat will be largely idiots like me asking HOW DO YOU EXPRESS
 
crl
@Loktar ok
 
@Loktar I'm so glad you're here
I have some react questions
 
8:53 PM
@Codeman find me a chat that is all experienced developers.
 
@Nick I can try to help
 
@Loktar In the docs, they have <input type="text" ref={(ref) => this.myTextInput = ref} /> and then they explicitly use the DOM api to focus the input element. -- Can I use the DOM api like this, or is it an antipattern?
 
@Loktar instead of a general @Loktar, I'm able to reply directly to message # 26639141
 
I feel liek such a noob lately man.
@SomeKittens ahh gotcha
 
Very useful when there's two conversations or things get off topic (which never happens)
 
8:54 PM
@SomeKittens Miaou does
 
I think you need to focus that way. If it was declarative, it'd re-focus on render.
 
@Nick hmm not sure what you mean, are you taking about using the ref callback?
 
I'm getting the hang of it pretty quickly, until you need to have components cross-communicating. It can get messy, and I want to make sure I do it right
 
3 mins ago, by SomeKittens
Wait, Miao has that
 
@SomeKittens what is miao?
:D
 
8:54 PM
shuddapa yo mouf
 
crl
and Miaou has svg
 
yeah cross communicating components is annoying, thats when you pretty much have to implement something like flux
 
crl
there are many circles/dots there ------------>
 
unless your communications are simple enough where parents just communicate with children
 
@Loktar Well, they're setting a property of "myTextInput" on their compnent, which is the DOM element. Then they use the DOM api to modify the element instead of using state/etc.
 
8:55 PM
@crl Android room thing
don't question it
 
crl
lol
hey pink, ok purple
 
@Nick oh thats fine, doing something like focus is totally fine
 
@Loktar What would be not okay? An example; I need to uncheck a lot of checkboxes if I click on a certain element
 
the checks should be in state
 
for that, you use props/state
 
8:56 PM
or handled with props ^
 
@Loktar How do I get the actual react component from a ref?
or wait... let me try something
 
you using 14?
this.refs.refName <- the dom node in 0.14
 
#rekt
 
Xfinity rep commits suicide
 

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