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7:02 PM
@StackedCrooked <3 Dir En Grey
 
No indentation on a bracketless for loop? grabs a pitchforkBorgleader 14 secs ago
 
> DirectX-12-Demo von Final Fantasy 15 (Build 2015) youtube.com/watch?v=e1mwhdYZvSE
this is pretty cool
 
user1804599
-1 distinguishable from reality
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit that video ..
 
user1804599
7:12 PM
ok weekend again
 
user1804599
wat do
 
@rightfold Parser. Write a parser.
 
Can't reproduce on my machine. How do you determine if runs in infinite time? — milleniumbug 8 secs ago
 
I haven't written any parsers in the last two years or so
 
@rightfold finish a project
 
user1804599
7:14 PM
That'd be against tradition.
 
question...at what point should i round a value to equal zero?
 
zero
 
You should tell us why you think it wouldn't compile, because obviously it does and we know C++ so it's as unsurprising to us as it is to the compiler. We cannot correct your misconception until we know what it is. — Lightness Races in Orbit 2 mins ago
People who don't get that implicitly will never be good programmers.
 
@Scrubbins ideally, but C++ doesn't always give me zero. it gives me 1e-15 sometimes, sometimes 1e-12, etc.
 
I suggest zero.
 
7:17 PM
@Scrubbins dude, what?
ok, i will tell you why it doesnt work for my project.
 
@DonLarynx Go read about floating-point, now.
 
like I said, I personally prefer to round to zero when the value is zero.
I find that it maintains the optimal precision.
 
Xeo
halp, kitty occupying my belly and 1 hand
 
@milleniumbug thanks i needed that.
 
Xeo
appears to be comfortably sleeping
 
7:20 PM
plonk her?
 
user1804599
@Xeo slaughter and eat.
 
Xeo
nooo
 
@rightfold nooooooooooooooo
(transactional memory)
 
@milleniumbug the irony of this comment after four redactions... is amusing to me for some reason
 
7:26 PM
(removed)
std::move
 
I started playing mass effect
I know it was released in 2007 but jesus christ it's so ugly
 
that's because you have approximately the depth of this receipt I got for buying a food.
32 mins ago, by Scrubbins
> "This AD was prompted by the determination that a Model 787 airplane that has been powered continuously for 248 days can lose all alternating current (AC) electrical power due to the generator control units (GCUs) simultaneously going into failsafe mode," the memo stated.
 
is scrubbins cicada?
 
Xeo
no, puppy
 
7:30 PM
that is pretty insulting.
 
... did puppy get suspended?
 
Xeo
briefly
 
Xeo
30min chatban
 
7:31 PM
why's he using a clone then? I remember him using a clone once
when he was suspended
 
For what lol
 
Xeo
sarcastic reply to columbo
 
He implemented the Cloneable interface.
 
Xeo
Also, having a cat sleep on your lap is so adorable.
 
Ah, Columbo baited Puppy into it then flagged him out. Then Puppy came straight back with a sockpuppet to evade a suspension. Sigh.
 
user1804599
7:32 PM
Chuck Norris turns laughter into manslaughter.
 
Xeo
can't spell slaughter without laughter
Chaotic Fucking Nuts best alignment
 
@Scrubbins hi
 
anyway, the game is nice
my first ~4 hours flew really fast
and the universe looks explorable
looking forward to the sequels now that I got ME2 too (it's on discount on steam atm)
 
How can I globally tell my C++ program that if a value is less than 1e-12, to round it to zero?
i.e. if I had 100 functions and some of those functions returned something on the order of 1e-14, how would I round it to zero? globally?
 
Xeo
not
 
7:35 PM
@DonLarynx Don't.
 
globally? you're fucking crazy
 
@DonLarynx If you want to do it by order you could just check the signbit and the exponent
something like insignificize(my_double, -14)
 
Xeo
@DonLarynx use a type that automatically does that vOv
 
@Xeo fuck yes.
 
-1
Q: Have a #include breaks my game. I need this #include.

RussNichollsIf I #include "GameScreenLevel1.h" in my "teapot" header I get this error for this. I'm at a loss to why this would even break. Please someone know this error.

 
user1804599
7:40 PM
hahaha
 
Should not compiler/IDE authors provide "click to post detailed high quality question on SO" button? :) Would really help a lot quality of many questions... — Alexei Levenkov 1 hour ago
lolwut:
@RobertHarvey: It's common in JSP stack trace messages. It's not something that happens often, but it can occur. — Makoto 3 hours ago
"it happens all the time but it hardly ever happens"
 
@DonLarynx Depending on your problem, you can: a.) stop using floating-point and use more appropriate type b.) round on output c.) do special stuff and actually acknowledge having limited precision without limiting it even more.
@DonLarynx XY problem so much.
 
@milleniumbug might not be possible to do a or b if he's doing trig
Since trig is floating point by default
 
@Cinch We're not limiting ourselves to standard library.
Symbolic computation is a thing.
 
@milleniumbug I don't even.
 
7:46 PM
@Cinch .... have a clue what you're talking about
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit well duh but I try
 
Hold on you guys, I'm going SSCCE here
1 sec
 
Well it's been more than 1 sec.
Still waiting.
 
ideone.com/oCefy9 that's my function (including debug statements. here's the output (the determinant is zero, clearly). Now here's the output (shown below in pictures). The number on the order of 1e-15 at the very end is messing me up, I want it to be zero so my program works correctly. I know this bug will appear elsewhere if I don't round globally numbers on the order of <1e-12 to zero.
 
Ah, floating point errors.
I keep encountering those in comparison operators. My workaround there is to convert the floats to strings first and then compare them. But that doesn't apply here.
 
7:56 PM
@DonLarynx there is actually a lot of good research on how to do matrix multiplication and other linear algebra bits (like gaussian elimination) stable numerically, nothing is perfect.
This is floating points, an off-by 1e-15 is acceptable usually, the problem is what happens if you iterate.
 
@DonLarynx IOW round on output (setprecision and stuff)
 
Ell
or just use a rational library vOv
or whatever they're called
 
You can use decimal that'd work @DonLarynx but it'll perform much slower.
 
@DonLarynx Forget about global, one size does not fit all. Adjust where you need it.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'd second the recommendation for a decimal type
 
8:01 PM
oh god! I forgot just how far pop corn goes :\
I only wanted a wee snack
 
@Jeremy I'm not recommending it, I use doubles.
There are ways to make doubles numerically stable in multiple calculations usually
 
@DonLarynx Use Matlab
 
Ell
that agar game is so fricking annoying
I still haven't eaten anyone
 
Symbolic computation will tell you: Warning: System is inconsistent. Solution does not exist.
 
@Ell lol
I was top 3
 
8:09 PM
@Ell order pizza
 
No, not the pizza
 
yes, the pizza
 
Nobody will be able to deliver it today.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Yes, but from what I see in Don's example, performance shouldn't be a real concern. Personally, I'd happily trade some performance for not relying on the developer to keep stuff about numerical analysis in his/her head.
 
@milleniumbug some deliver here today
which is good because w/o that I would not have had any food
 
8:10 PM
It's national holiday today here.
 
yes, it's the international workers day
 
@Jeremy oh, I'm actually working on super fast matrix multiplication right now so I really can't sacrifice that much :D
 
not all deliveries are open
but some are here
 
@Jeremy wanna see what I'm giving a lecture on on Sunday (I think I posted it here already)
?
 
what teh fuck why big cells can jump
 
8:23 PM
@milleniumbug no they split
 
@LucDanton I'm doing this.
 
user1804599
they can split
 
user1804599
not jump
 
pub time bye
 
Gotta love Java
 
8:35 PM
since you posted the fucking game I can't stop playing it....
 
@deW1 Just get 1st place, stay 1st place for at least 30 mins, and you will become un-addicted.
 
I was thinking of doing something productive today
 
Source: me
 
Have anyone downloaded GCC 5+ yet?
Is there anyone here?
 
@JaredBurrows 5+? Is that a new programming language by Google?
 
8:43 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum sure
 
@Columbo Probably just as bad as the others.
 
@Columbo HA
I love the sarcasm
 
user1804599
@JaredBurrows Hey, no use of the J word in here.
 
user1804599
You've been warned.
 
if (r >= |0.0 - EPSILON|) This is unnecessary; if (r >= EPSILON) suffices.
 
user1804599
8:45 PM
Only the H word is allowed.
 
HolyPuppy?
 
user1804599
Haskell, obviously.
 
@DonLarynx Make sure it’s refactored into a function and you can always tweak it to your needs.
 
posted on May 01, 2015 by Raman Sharma

As you may know, Visual Studio now supports building Android and iOS applications using Clang. We realize the need of our users to write cross-platform apps and we know that C++ offers massive benefits in the cross-platform arena. Clang has made impressive...(read more)

 
@LucDanton Yep!
I did private: /*...*/ const double tolerance = 1e-12;
 
8:47 PM
I am guessing most of you are Visual C++ devs
 
@JaredBurrows No, we're Auditory C++ devs
 
user1804599
I luckily amn't.
 
I love how they're trying to depict Clang as being not that much better than VC++ lol
They should kick VC++ out and make Clang the default compiler for all apps
Because VC++ is where abuse starts to be funny
 
@Columbo the rules would require your to specify that the buffer used must have been created in the constexpr function itself, otherwise it is equivalent of writing to the global state
 
@FilipRoséen-refp That's fine!
 
8:50 PM
@Columbo since such approach is rather limited, I reckon that's the reason for not allowing it - and it would make for more complex implementations of constexpr if such was allowed (from the implementations poitn of view)
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Yeah, the latter probably
 
:23047037 placement new potentially writes to the underlying buffer (in an implementation specific manner), meaning that you'd have to make sure that the underlying buffer is only available inside the constexpr itself
 
(Just realized that the char array itself is an object)
 
@Columbo it will be harder to reason about the semantics of such approach (from the implementations point of view), and its usecases are very limited
 
@FilipRoséen-refp I'm currently writing a little container library for constexpr.
 
8:51 PM
I'm the last one in the fuarking CS lab....
 
That's why I was thinkin' abou it
 
this has never happened before.
 
@Columbo there are several approaches that you can use, if you'd like some input - let me know
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Go ahead
Currently I am default-initializing the internal array
 
@Columbo the next article in the smeta series is going to be published soon, and I reckon some of the contents in there will be of interest (even though you might not want to use the technique, a lot of relevant points are brought up)
@Columbo you are writing C++14, right?
 
8:53 PM
@FilipRoséen-refp Of course.
 
@Columbo using an internal array will not make it rather quirky of having infinite number of elements, so you should work on that
 
Trains are delayed for two hours! Guess who's not getting home?
 
inf number of elements is, of course, just a dream - but I think you know what I'm saying
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Well, this is primarily to be used for Strings.
Or POD types in general.
 
@Columbo I'd be happy to code-review such implementation if you'd like, but as always we have vastly different opinions of things - so expect.. well, the usual
 
8:55 PM
@FilipRoséen-refp lol
Wait, I'll work on it and give you a link tomorrow
It's in a very early state atm
 
@Columbo you are more than welcome to.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp :o)
You'd throw standard quotes at me, wouldn't you? Say that you would!
 
@Luc it works, thanks.
 
@Columbo in the context of "well, do this instead" - sure
 
Xeo
oof, that was a good meal. gnocchi quattro formaggi with ham and extra mozzarella
 
9:04 PM
@Columbo time to hang out with the girl, and if you'd want to proof-read (and through standard quotes in my face) tomorrow I'd be happy to email you a link to the draft of the article.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Go ahead, columbo(at)gmx-topmail(dot)de
(I'm paranoid of mail bots now)
 
@Columbo yeah, you done fucked up
;-)
 
Xeo
plottwist: @FilipRoséen-refp is a mail spam bot
 
lol
 
Xeo
he's just really good at the social engineering part
 
user1804599
9:06 PM
Spam bots are irrelevant.
 
So there is this beautiful gem as the highest ranked answer to a C# question. int? c = a > b ? a ?? b : b ?? a;
 
@CaptainGiraffe wtf
 
stackoverflow.com/questions/29985069/… Why not max(a, b) covers this is beyond me.
 
oh, int? is maybe int
 
Yep, nullable value.
 
9:15 PM
@CaptainGiraffe Because most SO users are like nerds near the water dispenser.
They don't upvote what's good, they upvote what's shiny.
 
user1804599
> A module called "bits" was added
> Namespaces are one honking great idea -- let's do more of those!
 
@milleniumbug To say that one-liner at the water dispenser would get you reprimanded for loitering.
 
In the corner :c
 
user1804599
Another Python zen violation.
 
user1804599
Good job.
 
9:16 PM
@Jefffrey You're screwed.
 
i dont get how it works
 
I moved near the gree thing
 
what happens when you're on top of someone?
 
And survived more than I should have
But then I ended up eating the green thing, and became an easy target
 
did agio freeze?
 
9:17 PM
That was well played on :D part though
 
agar.io freeze?
awwwwww
 
so apparently contrary to popular belief MS does have ASTs inside CL
 
they're on their way there
 
no apparently they have them
it's part of their new Link time code generation
 
LTCG and CL are different things, and LTCG is not new.
 
9:22 PM
say 18 or 19
 
STL himself has said they don't have an AST
and is the reason why there's no constexpr or expression SFINAE
and that they're working on it
 
constexpr will be in RTM
but not SFINAE
 
buggy and incomplete constexpr will be in RTM
 
also WTF is c2
I think they are shipping a version of clang...
 
c2 is their code-generation backend.
I think they are basically shipping Clang but swapping out LLVM ?
 
9:32 PM
looks like you have that choice yes
be kinda interesting if they gave you the choice of frontend
use MS's with their extensions for some
and clang for the rest
 
Recently found this live recording by Rage Against the Machine.
It's on a recent anniversary release of the album.
They delivered a pretty good gig.
 
Ell
I don't understand how they can not have an AST
what do they have in lieu of it?
 
A list of rules I suppose.
It's all if/else.
 
generate bullshit as it goes
 
Ell
generate code as source is parsed?
 
well
the super super interesting question is whether that means I could drive clang/c2 with Wide.
 
Not sure what that means, but I think you should look at xml. It's nice.
 
Ell
I actually don't hate xml
I like that tags have names
 
you're inferior though
 
The hate against xml is a mostly consequence of its hype a few years earlier.
 
9:50 PM
@StackedCrooked The Rage against the machine performance was a lot more enjoyable than Solange. The Solange vide sounded like a poor reenactment of early 90's pop jazzy style.
 
XML is responsible for the killing of many cpu cycles.
 
But you can compress the XML response!!
 
Yeah, that'll bring back the cpu cycles :P
 
I'm quite certain that if stackoverflow launched 4 years earlier the jQuery joke would have been an XML one.
How do I add two numbers in xml?
 
honestly I really don't like jQuery.
 
9:53 PM
JavaScript could have been so much better.
 
it's like, "We apologize that the browser sucks, let us make it very very slightly better".
 
It's such a shame it was mutilated in the last week before its release.
 
jQuery selectors: LINQ but shit.
 
@Puppy I think the value of jQuery is immeasurable in man-hours.
 
Still haven't looked at jQuery.
 
9:56 PM
@CaptainGiraffe What, the number of man-hours wasted because they didn't implement a selector that was exactly what you needed?
 
user image
6
 
Underscore is considerably better.
 
They're making me drink beer :)
 
Ell
I really dislike javascript
@sehe is one of them robot?
 
@sehe Are you the right guy?
:D
 
9:57 PM
yes but you're inferior
wait, wrong reflex.
 
Yes and yes
 
Ell
I imagine robot to be the middle one
 
@Ell The one in the middle
 
Ell
I don't know who the guy on the left is
 
A few years ago I wrote a little function for quickly generating DOM nodes. E.g: node.createChild("td/i/a");
Can jQuery do this as well?
 
9:59 PM
@StackedCrooked I bet mine was faster
2 mins ago, by Puppy
wait, wrong reflex.
@sehe You remind me of volkard.
 

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