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5:11 AM
Wow, I kinda went all out on this one: stackoverflow.com/a/44213172/52738
Time for bed, I think...
 
 
3 hours later…
7:58 AM
Hello everyone
Could someone explain me what the goal of the function input() is in this context?
% Simulation times, in seconds.
start_time = 0;
end_time = 10;
dt = 0.005;
times = start_time:dt:end_time;

for t = times
    % Take input from our controller.
    i = input(t);

end
 
 
4 hours later…
11:50 AM
@LuisMendo bifurcation diagram \o/
on nom nom chaos
I'll take a closer look later today
@trilolil that seems to be a shadowed version of the built-in input function (the original doesn't accept numeric input). Probably something specific with the Dunno What Toolbox that's needed for remote control
 
@AndrasDeak hmm... they don't provide their definition of the input function, so it s kind of tricky to guess what they tried to do on that line.
 
12:05 PM
Yeah, I checked that first
But it needs to be specific to your application anyway
Perhaps it's sort of a placeholder
You can always ask them :)
 
 
1 hour later…
1:27 PM
@guys anyone else still seeing the double feeds issue? It stopped for me. I updated my meta bug report.
I'd love it if the problem was intermittent and related to the flux of incoming questions, but I find this unlikely
 
@AndrasDeak double feeds? Do you mean the ones that appear here in chat?
 
ok, I'll pay attention when new questions are posted
so that I can check if they appear duplicated
 
Thanks. It'll take a while due to the weekend. First I thought that my mobile firefox behaved differently; I had to camp in chat for half an hour to see a post pop up
 
1:47 PM
that awkward moment when you wait for new questions on Stack Overflow...
 
hehe :D
 
2:36 PM
@AndrasDeak here
it took a while
:P
yeah feeds are definitely duplicated...
I'm using Firefox 53.0.3
just for reference
 
huh, thanks
 
same here:)
will update soon (kitchen stuff first)
 
haha
 
2:51 PM
I featured your screenshot
 
cool
I hope that they can get it fixed on the next 6 to 8 weeks
:P
 
 
3 hours later…
5:32 PM
@AndrasDeak ^ one duplicated, one not
 
same here, thanks :)
 
Hello, i would like a clarification if it is possible. I have this
case 'tanh_opt'
d_act = 1.7159 * 2/3 * (1 - 1/(1.7159)^2 * nn.a{i}.^2);
Which is the first derivative of the optimal tanh in Matlab. How can i get the first derivative of tanh? Where is the difference?
 
I tried to look at the events of the feed as they come in but apparently the console in firefox doesn't show those
@wdika don't know what "optimized" means, because the derivative is uniquely defined
probably some numerical trickery for stability
(tanh x)'=(sinh x/cosh x)' = (cosh^2 x - sinh^2 x)/cosh^2 x = 1/cosh^2 x
 
@AndrasDeak matlab uses as default the tanh_opt, which is an optimization of tanh.. I thnk 1.7159* 2/3 does this optimize.. I am trying to figure out how to make it for tanh without optimization..
First derivative of tanh is dtanh(x)/dx = 1 - tanh(x)^2
 
yes, 1/cosh^2 x = (cosh^2 x - sinh^2 x)/cosh^2 x = 1 - tanh^2(x)
so what's your question?
you can try tanh_opt vs 1/cosh^2(x) vs 1-tanh^2(x) and see how they compare in 1. speed, 2. precision
note that I wouldn't expect anything "optimized" to contain nn.a{i} :P
 
5:43 PM
my question is how from this d_act = 1.7159 * 2/3 * (1 - 1/(1.7159)^2 * nn.a{i}.^2); can i get the first derivative of tanh without the optimization
 
why do you want to get it from that?
 
nn.a{i} is just from the code i have.. assume it's the h
 
and what do you mean by "from that"?
 
x* not h
i want to make a case for 'tanh'
different from 'tanh_opt'
 
OK, you need to provide more information because at this point your question doesn't make any sense to me
 
5:48 PM
I am really struggling with DeepLearnToolbox. You can check here if you would like github.com/rasmusbergpalm/DeepLearnToolbox/blob/master/NN/…
maybe you will understand
 
well context always helps
especially if explicitly requested :P
 
That's true, i just tried not to charge a lot someone with my question :P
 
yeah, it's hard to strike a balance for a good MCVE
but since your question is inherently related to the context (how is it optimized? why do you want to write it without optimization? what is the input?), we need more
 
There is a school project where using this toolbox i need to make some tests with tanh, i have made them with tanh_opt and sigm, and now i am trying with tanh..
I think the correct type will be d_act = 1 - 1/(1.7159)^2 * nn.a{i}.^2;
Just wanted to be sure.
 
that formula doesn't seem to be the approximate derivative of tanh
even the value is off near 0
 
5:56 PM
But that's what it says on the file where the type d_act = 1.7159 * 2/3 * (1 - 1/(1.7159)^2 * nn.a{i}.^2); is , "% Derivative of the activation function".
 
assuming that nn.a{i} stands for x, which seems to be the case
@wdika no shit
something's not what you think it is, so you need to find out what that line should exactly do, before trying to modify it
 
what i am looking for is this if i am not wrong
 
If nn.a{i} stands for tanh(x) (which the other cases seem to contradict), then there's some scaling and a 2/3 factor which I can't account for. If nn.a{i} stands for x in tanh(x), then your "optimized" version is a second-order polynomial which will surely be crap except for values of x close to the Taylor expansion center
@wdika that's what I plotted but the "optimized" version skewed the scale
We both agree that the derivative of tanh x is 1-tanh^2(x), so what is your question?
it's hard to convey emotions through chat so I'll note that I'm growing impatient
 
@AndrasDeak Ok maybe i am not understanding well, i am sorry for wasting your time. I think my question is how can i get from the optimized "tanh_opt" to the "tanh" first derivative, always on what the logic on that toolbox is.
Thanks again for your help, i will try to figure it out and not keep asking.
 
Well, if you figure out what "x" is in "tanh(x)", you just need to do either 1./cosh(x).^2 or 1-tanh(x).^2. What "x" is is another matter...but looking at the cases of logistic map etc. I'd think that nn.a{i} plays the role of x. Unsure about this, considering the weird "optimized" version. There should be some theoretical background here that you're missing.
if the documentation is missing it, perhaps this is a widely used thing in machine learning (just like the logistic map or the sigmoid)
 
6:10 PM
I think it's the toolbox the weird, i will try to understand better how it works here. Thanks again.
 
no worries, if you run into any specific questions feel free to ask
 
6:37 PM
@beaker @AndrasDeak same here, some feeds are not duped
 
yeah, definitely server-side
thanks for the feedback
 
the meta post is even featured right now
we might even get to 100 views :P
"featured" as in "on the hot meta posts bulletin"
 
yep, this deserves its 15 minutes of fame
hope that it gets more than just 15 minutes :D
 
needs more hand-drawing
 
6:44 PM
hahaha true
I've always dreaded hand-drawn circles
specially those from meta
ugh...
 

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