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12:04 AM
@earl sorry, I type crap down that does not make sense quite often =).
say I invoke thread in the function body...

fn: func [x] [
y: do-some-stuff
thread x + y [add 5]
]

This would return a block... I would rather it return a computation

I know I could slap a do in front of the block like so

fn: func [x] [
y: do-some-stuff
do thread x + y [add 5]
]

but is there a way that, after invoking thread, the body could look like this or be equivalent to this(on the next invocation of thread it "remembers" what to do in the particular piece of code)
does that make sense?
 
yep
not easily possible without major hackery. (and even then: outcome open :)
 
I thought that maybe the "function memory" could be exploited here...
 
there is no function memory :)
 
but I could not think of a way to do it
You know what I mean
func [] [a: []] a maintains state
 
you're very much thinking in macrology. we don't really have macros or staged programming.
 
12:08 AM
I know I am... sigh
 
nothing bad, per se :)
a doesn't maintain state. the block that you use as a function body contains another block which is directly modified.
 
Ok, to say it another way... there is a pointer to that block within the function body
 
to say it another way:
1. we have mutating functions
2. we have an "AST"-like structure, that is directly reified in the language
 
because they are just data structures
 
evaluation of the AST does not create objects in the language, the AST itself is already an object in the language
combining these two things results in the observed behaviour: a mutating function directly manipulates the AST
two things that come to my mind that you could use to achieve something close to what you want:
1. write a special function generator, which picks out THREAD calls and inlines them.
2. pass a reference to the function body block to THREAD and try having thread rewrite itself out of that body block.
less insane, but more overhead: memoize THREAD. have THREAD keep a cache that re-returns previously created code blocks, if parameters didn't change.
 
12:20 AM
thanks for the ideas
@earl and for reading all that spam =)
 
no worries :)
 
i love the rebol channel, everyone is so helpful
I can be a ridiculous moron and no one calls me out on it
 
This is R2
Thank you
f: func [/local a][a: [y] append append a '+ 2]
Let's start with that. @JacobGood1
I am wondering why you want this to happen, though.
Usually the functions I write have this horrible behaviour and I have to try hard to stop it ...
 
I came from lisp
being able to write macros is so awesome
 
Rebol is very lisp-y
But different
 
12:29 AM
its not that different
it lacks macros though
 
And I am pretty sure Carl intended that what you can do with macros in lisp can be done in Rebol
I haven't heard anybody being blocked by its lack yet
and that includes functional people like me
You can even write function that modify other functions, so injection is kinda built-in too.
 
Rebol is awesome, however, macros would make rebol even more awesome
Red might give us macros
 
But doing the same thing in Rebol without macros makes you more awesome
 
You cannot do the same thing
 
"Real" macros (staged programming) are really very hard to do, in Rebol -- while keeping it Rebol.
 
12:31 AM
Need an example
 
look at what I just wrote
^^^
if you can read that crap I spammed lol
 
Er .. thought I did ... gimme a link?
@JacobGood1 I was going for this one
 
How do i link?
 
There's an arrow-like thing on the lower right of the message when you hover -- click it
 
28 mins ago, by Jacob Good1
@earl sorry, I type crap down that does not make sense quite often =).
say I invoke thread in the function body...

fn: func [x] [
y: do-some-stuff
thread x + y [add 5]
]

This would return a block... I would rather it return a computation

I know I could slap a do in front of the block like so

fn: func [x] [
y: do-some-stuff
do thread x + y [add 5]
]

but is there a way that, after invoking thread, the body could look like this or be equivalent to this(on the next invocation of thread it "remembers" what to do in the particular piece of code)
 
12:33 AM
OK I remember now
 
Click the small arrow drop down on the left of the message, then copy the permalink, and post the permalink as a standalone message.
 
I guess I just look at blocks as computations that haven't been done yet
 
my wording is not good
What i was asking for is code outside of a block
 
Jacob's question really boils down to how to "compile" a certain pattern down to a result, and only do that once.
 
basically
yes there you go
 
12:37 AM
That is certainly easy to do in Rebol for lots of specialised cases, such as a particular custom dialects.
 
So, like composing (or reducing, I'm using Rebol terminology here) just a part of a block?
In-place, as it were?
 
However, the general case -- to write a source-to-source pre-processor (which is what macros are) -- is often hard and ultimately (close) to impossible with Rebol as-is.
 
those parens are a powerful feature that are not easily removed
 
Right, reducing just a part, and in-place. So that when other reductions happens in the future, this part doesn't have to be reduced again.
@JacobGood1 Not without adding some other kind of delimiter.
 
@earl have you programmed in lisp?
 
12:39 AM
Yes. Still do. Scheme, rather.
 
I just use lisp as a general inclusive term for all dialects
I thought you did considering your knowledge of macros
 
So in @JacobGood1's example, the y: whatever at the beginning would disappear and its value would be in the thread call for the next (and subsequent) invocations?
 
In Jacob's example:
> fn: func [x] [thread 'x [add 5]]
When run the first time, as fn 10 say, would return 10.
And after that run, source fn would show you something like:
> fn: func [x] [add x 5]
 
yep
 
So not all spam, see :)
Glad that I understood you right :)
 
12:43 AM
but as of now the body block would be [[add x 5]] without compose or some such
 
And after each subsequent invocation it still looks the same? An add-5 function?
 
@earl yes but you had lisp experience, you cheated
=P
 
@MarkI Yep.
@JacobGood1 That inclusive usage of "Lisp" theoretically resonates very well with me, but time and experience has made me more cautious.
 
Thanks. I'll need to ponder ...
 
Nowadays, most people saying "Lisp" expect something rather specific, which is more like saying Common Lisp or Scheme explicitly.
So yes, Rebol is Lisp-y, but it in a very different lineage.
Which, in contemporary expectations, really makes it rather un-Lispy :)
Rebol is Lisp-y in the sense of a Lisp-1 with FEXPRs. It is Lisp-y in the sense of John Shutt's "Kernel". It is Lisp-y in the sense of homoiconicity, and it is somewhat Lisp-y in it's functional flavour.
 
12:49 AM
Is part of the problem that you want to change the function that is currently running?
I don't even see how you can say the first invocation returns 10 ...
 
@MarkI My fault. First invocation would return 15.
 
OK
 
Sorry for the confusion.
 
well it stand for list processing so if your language is written in lists, whether they be delimited with (, {, [, etc. does not matter to me
 
But Rebol can create functions on the fly, and rename functions that are running, it's just you want to do both at the same time ...
 
12:50 AM
However, Rebol is very un-Lispy when thinking of the strong programming language theory tradition associated with Lisp family languages. It's also very un-Lispy when thinking of the long and strong macrology tradition of Lisp.
 
@earl So, on it's first invocation it decides what kind of function it wants to be, then on subsequent invocations the 'decision' code is gone? Am I even close?
 
@MarkI Close, yes :)
In a perfect world, it's not the function that decides. But THREAD would decide.
 
@earl But only the once.
 
Right.
 
I think I can do this ... even in R3. But don't bet me ...
 
12:56 AM
R2 may be the slightly easier place to experiment. Because in R2 you can still modify function bodies.
In R3, you no longer can.
 
@earl Exactly.
Wish me luck ... gtg, dinnertime.
 
@MarkI good luck, it has been attempted many times in other languages by many people
I am just going to memoize that bad boy and call it a day
 
@MarkI Should be a great and fun exercise! Enjoy.
 
@earl if I use the refinement do and want to use the original do is there a way to refer to the global do, or am I shadowed for as long as I am in the func body?
func[/do][
;real do
do [some stuff]
]
 
>> ? lib/do
 
1:07 AM
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
USAGE:
    LIB/DO value /args arg /next var

DESCRIPTION:
    Evaluates a block, file, URL, function, word, or any other value.
    LIB/DO is a native value.

ARGUMENTS:
    value -- Normally a file name, URL, or block (any-type!)

REFINEMENTS:
    /args -- If value is a script, this will set its system/script/args
        arg -- Args passed to a script (normally a string)
    /next -- Do next expression only, return it, update block variable
        var -- Variable updated with new block position (word!)
 
so slap lib in front?
 
yep, lib/do will refer to the original do. unless you also shadow lib.
 
im going to shadow everything!
jkin =P
 
system/contexts/lib/do, if you fancy even more typing.
 
ohh I could look like I know something with all that typed out
@HostileFork in rencpp I cannot seem to make a hash... to-hash []
@HostileFork ah you renamed it to map?
good stuff
 
 
2 hours later…
3:05 AM
@HostileFork is there a way to have a code block as a key in a map? map [[1 2] [some stuff]]
 
@RebolBot
alive?
 
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
; rebol.com/r3/docs/errors/script-no-value.html
    *** ERROR
** Script error: alive? has no value
** Where:
** Near: try load/all join %/users/try-REBOL/data/ system/script/args...
 
@Rebolbot alive?
 
@Rebolbot
do thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
@rebolbot delete
>> thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
 
3:11 AM
@MarkI Please continue.
 
>> do thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
 
Grrr.
 
@RebolBot delete
>> thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
 
@kealist That's very interesting.
 
huh...
 
3:12 AM
Works for me, what's up Rebolbot?
 
@RebolBot help
 
I respond to these commands
Note: [] means optional input or shows expected datatype, (|) means choice:
(do|do/2|do/red|do/boron|do/echo) expression "evaluates Rebol/Rebol-like expression in a sandboxed interpreter. echo repeats exact command sent to r3"
(hi|hello|goodnight|goodbye|bye|[good][night|morning|afternoon|evening]) some-text "returns a greeting to the user who greeted bot"
cc id "retrieves curecode data"
delete [ loud ] "in reply to a bot message will delete if in time"
do/ideone which-lang [word! string! integer!] expression "evaluates a source expression for the specified langu
 
@RebolBot do [thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn]
 
@MarkI What?
 
@RebolBot do print "hello"
 
3:14 AM
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
hello
 
** Syntax error: missing "[" at "end-of-block"
** Where: to case load do either either either -apply-
** Near: (line 1) thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
 
@kealist hey there, would you happen to know how to use a block as a key in a hash map? if this is not possible how would one search for a block within a block?
 
RebolBot do [thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] [fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn]
 
@JacobGood1 Give me a few min
 
alright
 
3:16 AM
@RebolBot alive?
 
OK!
@RebolBot do [thread: func [y][reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] [fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn]
 
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
== [thread: func [y] [reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] [fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn]
 
SO close ...
@RebolBot do thread: func [y] [reduce ['add :y 5]] fn: func [x] [fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x] source fn fn 10 source fn
 
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
fn: make function! [[x][fn: func [x] thread 'x fn :x]]
fn: make function! [[x][add x 5]]
 
3:17 AM
Yay!
Should work in both Rs.
 
@JacobGood1 you mean something like this?
>> next find/only [[1 2] 4] [1 2]
 
; Brought to you by: try.rebol.nl
== [4]
 
I haven't really used map in Rebol much, and didn't have success with my first attempt :)
 
@JacobGood1 Is that near what you wanted?
 
@kealist thanks, I was trying to use a map for memoization but I guess ill use a block instead... I hope that in the future blocks can be used for keys
@MarkI no, nice attempt though... what I want, if it were to be the same power as lisp, would be

func [x] [thread 'x [add 1 add 2 add 3]]... after a nice compile...
func [x] [add add add x 3 2 1]
 
3:25 AM
@JacobGood1 You can make my :thread return any kind of block with the 'x (:y) in it. I am sorry, I don't see the difference?
 
If I wanted what you wrote I would just define fn that way in the first place
func [x] thread 'x [blah blah]
 
Not seeing it. My eyes are really bad though :(
 
its ok, lisp macros take a long time to grok
 
The compile is in the reduce. That's the "macro".
 
the fact that you have to write reduce is the problem
 
3:28 AM
OK But you have to write macro.
 
yes but once written it may be arbitrarily applied anywhere without needing any extra tweeks to work correctly
 
Is thread a common name for a macro function in lisp?
 
you would have to remember to use thread that way no matter where you sued it
 
I'm tweekin'?
 
in lisp there is no extra cognitive burden, if i wrote thread for you you would not need to remember to make sure it gets "pre-invoked"
in any case memoization will get me part of the way there, if only I could use blocks as keys
@kealist thread usually denoted as -> or ~> is a function that allows one to avoid the prefix soup that occurs in languages like rebol and lisp
fa 1 1 fb fc 2 3 a b fd... where is the function and where is the arg? With thread it is easy to see...

thread fn 1 [
fa 2 3
fb 4 5
]
the computation of fn is "threaded" through the first arg of fa and fb
 
3:34 AM
In Lisp, macros work on the S-expressions themselves before they reach the evaluator.
In Rebol, you have to do the same, with blocks, to get the same functionality.
I am still not seeing it, wishing @earl was here ...
 
try to invoke thread in an arbitrary fn
deleted
 
Define thread for me! At least give me a signature ...
 
ack I am not done writing it
 
Sorry, I'll wait
 
I screwed the source code trying to get it to memoize
 
3:43 AM
How about I try some basics, to make sure we are talking about the same thing.
You want a function1, that calls another function2, and the return value of that call becomes the body of function1.
Are we agreed so far?
 
It's been a while since I used Scheme, so I may have to look back if I ever actually learned something about macros or not
 
4:24 AM
G'night and thanks everybody. I look forward to more Lispbol discussions ...
 
 
3 hours later…
7:26 AM
@JacobGood1 There does not appear to be a way to use an any-block! as a key in a map. I know little about the decisions guiding map...and when I have looked at it always tended to feel it wasn't particularly well thought out. It would be nice if someone wrote a general treatise on it. (also: map is not my term, it was already a Rebol3 thing)
We have discussed here whether people actually like the "verbing" of MAP and OBJECT, and how far that should go...just because it was done with FUNCTION makes one question if there should be a TYPENAME [...] ([...],...) constructor for it. Or if that is misguided, and taking away nouns from being able to say things like DATE: 12-Dec-2012, where you are using nouns for variables instead.
It seems set in stone that F: FUNCTION [...] [...] is a necessary evil over something which might permit you to write FUNCTION: MAKE-FUNCTION [...] [...] and then call your noun named FUNCTION. But maybe not. I think when you're going over every line item you can ask these kinds of questions.
For Rebol programmers who find such things to be too long, I ask if the true optimum of brevity has been reached; if it might not be better to make the baseline system as "correct as possible" and then go in and have shortcuts in your own code that are even faster.
@GreggIrwin Thanks Gregg! Perhaps it will inspire you to get into some of the design tweaks questions... I just made a start: github.com/hostilefork/rencpp/tree/develop/examples/workbench/…
Stuff I think is worth looking at. While some people are afraid to change it too much, the differences between languages other people are willing to make between versions to improve them are significant. They have much more established legacy codebases, but do it and remain relevant anyway.
Even something as simple as a PRINT statement is not compatible between Python2 and Python3!
28
Q: How to write Python 2.x as much compatible with Python 3.x as possible?

TadeckThere are many ways to include Python 3.x features in Python 2.x, so code of Python 2.x scripts could be easily converted into Python 3.x in the future. One of these examples is replacing print statement with print() function: >>> from __future__ import print_function Is there any list or reso...

They broke every print statement.
 
8:01 AM
The real trick is to be able to make it as painless as possible to change these conventions for old code. Not so much because there's a lot of important old Rebol and Red codebases out there that need to be preserved. Rather because if they're ever going to become important, then people are going to want to do similar kinds of changes with their own constructs.
 
 
6 hours later…
1:50 PM
@HostileFork I don't see why not!!
If you make it a kickstarter / crowdtilt / whatchamacallit project then I'd certainly be happy to donate to this it.
BTW... been trying to compile Ren Garden on Mac today (Mavericks). Hit a problem compiling rencpp though :(
I think these patches maybe out-of-date? gist.github.com/earl/4c77430ff27b62147883
Some of them could be applied... some couldnt :(
rencpp would compile with or without (partially) applied patches. make always stopped at 45% giving following error...
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/src/rebol-binding/rebol-value.cpp:65:39: err
      implicit instantiation of undefined template
      'std::__1::array<ren::internal::Loadable, 2>'
    std::array<internal::Loadable, 2> loadables = {{
                                      ^
/Library/Developer/CommandLineTools/usr/bin/../include/c++/v1/__tuple:69:65: note:
      template is declared here
template <class _Tp, size_t _Size> struct _LIBCPP_TYPE_VIS_ONLY array;
                                                                ^
typo... thats "rencpp WOULDN'T compile with or without.."
 
@draegtun Hey! RE: error... yes, patches are out of date, and unrelated to that. Try putting a #include <array> as the first line of the file (rebol-value.cpp)
 
anyway check back later. Can show you what the patch REJ files show.
what in rebol-value.cpp ?
 
#include <array> insert at first line of rebol-value.cpp, yes
 
OK onto next error....
oh that done a funny hole on!
[  2%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/rebol-binding/rebol-value.cpp.o
[  4%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/rebol-binding/rebol-words.cpp.o
Linking CXX static library libRenCpp.a
/Library/Developer/CommandLineTools/usr/bin/ranlib: file: libRenCpp.a(rebol-os-lib-tab
/Library/Developer/CommandLineTools/usr/bin/ranlib: file: libRenCpp.a(rebol-os-lib-tab
[ 47%] Built target RenCpp
Scanning dependencies of target function-1
[ 50%] Building CXX object examples/CMakeFiles/function-1.dir/function-1.cpp.o
 
Hmm, strange.
I put in a patch to try and work around what stopped it on the last OSX build
 
2:05 PM
Perhaps do rencpp without any patches?
 
Yes, please try that for starters
 
and just add include <array line?
OK give me a mo
 
Yes, that should be there, it's a mistake.
But due to the internal dependencies of standard libraries in some compilers, one implementation will implicitly pull in headers another doesn't
So you can get away with not including sometimes, and not sometimes. Oddly on GCC and Clang on Linux/Windows that one didn't cause a problem.
 
Hmmm... it may have done it? There are some warnings...
 
We turn most all warnings up to errors, but the proof would be if you can run the parse-1 example
 
2:08 PM
[~/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp]$ cat baz
[~/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp]$ make
Scanning dependencies of target RenCpp
[ 2%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/context.cpp.o
[ 4%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/engine.cpp.o
[ 6%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/function.cpp.o
[ 9%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/helpers.cpp.o
[ 11%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/runtime.cpp.o
[ 13%] Building CXX object CMakeFiles/RenCpp.dir/src/value.cpp.o
OK I need to load QT library first.
 
Well you can check to make sure the test-rencpp is running and passing
Not bad if there was just one (recent) error in the unpatched version!
 
OK QT library is going to take a while to download :(
@HostileFork Yep... plus I've scripted everything (in Bash) so can build from scratch at any point :)
(or use in docs)
OK how to run test-rencpp ?
 
Wherever you configured Cmake to build its products, there will be a test directory with a test-rencpp file
 
0
REBOL MAGIC!
===============================================================================
All tests passed (65 assertions in 12 test cases)
:)
So looking good.
 
Very good! Yes, the next hurdle is the Qt configuration...and if you are keeping notes and want to upgrade the Mac instructions (which we integrated the changes needed from the first try for) then that will be great.
 
2:15 PM
Yes I will send you a PR for docs once I've got this all working!
 
And I will with near 100% certainty accept that PR
 
:)
OK I'll check back later... its going to take a while to download this QT lib (gosh its 599MB !!)
bye for now
 
@draegtun If you don't use the web install, then it brings down every optional component...so the web install is recommended. But even then, the debug built DLLs are very big with all the symbol information in them, and you're getting dynamic link libraries for a web browser implementation as well as things like the International Components for Unicode
On windows, the data file for ICU DLL is alone 20MB even in the release build...and not the only DLL. However, I downloaded that and configured a build and got it down to where it wasn't "the kitchen sink" with every feature for every global language.
Managed to get a working Ren Garden with only the needed DLLs that added up to under 10 megabytes on windows.
And that includes all the widgets and all the networking and graphics/painting code
Because it's not statically linked, as that is a nuisance.
 
3:06 PM
@HostileFork OK will look into more when I get there. QT downloaded but running installer requires me to install Xcode first :( Up till now I've been getting by with just the Command Lines Tools. Xcode is going to take even longer to download than QT !!
So leaving that downloading at moment. Will check back this evening most likely.
Oh for everyones amusement...
1
A: Shortest Unique Substrings

draegtunRebol, 136 bytes f: func[s][repeat n length? b: copy s[unless empty? x: collect[forall s[unless find next find b t: copy/part s n t[keep t]]][return x]]] Ungolfed: f: func [s] [ repeat n length? b: copy s [ unless empty? x: collect [ forall s [ unless f...

0
A: Ordering an array of negatives, zero and positives integers with one iteration

draegtunRebol - 149 142 140 a: to-block input i: j: 1 n: length? a while[j <= n][case[a/:j < 0[swap at a ++ i at a ++ j]a/:j > 0[swap at a j at a -- n]on[++ j]]]print a This is a direct port of the Dutch national flag wikipedia pseudocode. Below is how it looks ungolfed: a: to-block input i: j: 1 n:...

 
@draegtun Hm, you shouldn't need XCode...
Worth seeing if it can be done without, in any case.
 
3:50 PM
posted on January 30, 2015 by SWhite

I did watch the video.  For those not familiar with C, I am wondering if someone could clarify the terminology, specifically, "a C++ binding for Rebol or Red."  Does that mean a way for a C program to call a REBOL program?  Or a REBOL program to call a C program?  Or something else?  Thank you.

 
4:50 PM
@HostileFork Well it did at least stop QT complaining about it once it was installed :)
though I did have some issues with Xcode / Command Line tools.... resolved by running Xcode and accepting license !!
So done. However couldn't find any workbench executable? So went back to cmake stage and did...
PATH=$PATH:../Qt5.4.0/5.4/clang_64/bin ../cmake-3.1.1-Darwin-x86_64/CMake.app/Contents/bin/cmake -DRUNTIME=rebol -DCLASSLIB_QT=1 -DGARDEN=yes
That worked fine. However make produced lots of errors just after 48% :(
PATH=$PATH:../Qt5.4.0/5.4/clang_64/bin make
 
@draegtun gists or lists of errors and I'll take a look...
 
[ 46%] Building CXX object examples/workbench/CMakeFiles/workbench.dir/replpad.cpp.o
In file included from /Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/rep
In file included from /Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/rep
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/fakestdio.h:153:50: error
      implicit instantiation of undefined template 'std::__1::basic_istream<char,
      std::__1::char_traits<char> >'
class FakeStdin : public FakeStdinBuffer, public std::istream {
thats just snippet of them
goes on for a couple of screens after that
ending in...
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/replpad.cpp:336:39: error
      cannot initialize object parameter of type 'const QAbstractScrollArea' with an
      expression of type 'ReplPad'
        verticalScrollBar()->setValue(verticalScrollBar()->maximum());
                                      ^~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
fatal error: too many errors emitted, stopping now [-ferror-limit=]
20 errors generated.
make[2]: *** [examples/workbench/CMakeFiles/workbench.dir/replpad.cpp.o] Error 1
 
Interesting, wonder why your clang is catching it and the rest of ours isn't. The istream is a similar issue to before...put #include <istream> up at the top of fakestdio.h right above the #include <ostream> line
 
clang --version
Apple LLVM version 6.0 (clang-600.0.56) (based on LLVM 3.5svn)
Target: x86_64-apple-darwin13.4.0
Thread model: posix
This comes with Xcode 6
Remember running on Mavericks (Chris was on Yosemite).
 
If you just paste a gist of the long error list I'll look and see if there's any other smoking guns.
 
4:58 PM
OK let me try your extra line first...
thats a lot better :)
(in terms of number of errors!). Now at 51%.
[ 51%] Building CXX object examples/workbench/CMakeFiles/workbench.dir/renconsole.cpp.
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/renconsole.cpp:962:28: er
implicit instantiation of undefined template 'std::__1::array<ren::Context, 2>'
std::array<Context, 2> contexts = {{
^
/Applications/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/Toolchains/XcodeDefault.xctoolchain/usr/bin
template is declared here
template <class _Tp, size_t _Size> struct _LIBCPP_TYPE_VIS_ONLY array;
^
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/renconsole.cpp:998:58: er
hmmmm... fixed font....
########################################
  ##################################
[ 51%] Building CXX object examples/workbench/CMakeFiles/workbench.dir/renconsole.cpp.
/Users/barry/code/GitHub/RenGarden/rencpp/examples/workbench/renconsole.cpp:962:28: er
      implicit instantiation of undefined template 'std::__1::array<ren::Context, 2>'
    std::array<Context, 2> contexts = {{
                           ^
/Applications/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/Toolchains/XcodeDefault.xctoolchain/usr/bin
      template is declared here
template <class _Tp, size_t _Size> struct _LIBCPP_TYPE_VIS_ONLY array;
 
@draegtun There's another missing include; it looks like the _LIBCPP_TYPE_VIS_ONLY thing may be some kind of trick added to catch this. Which sounds great to me. #include <array> right above #include <vector> in renconsole.cpp
 
success :)
0
REBOL MAGIC!
===============================================================================
All tests passed (65 assertions in 12 test cases)
 
@draegtun And you have your first commit! :-)
And we've seen that before... but perhaps some of the things demonstrated in the video will work for you and not crash... find workbench the executable
 
Yes I can wrap those changes up for you + docs changes in a PR commit later!!
 
(Renaming coming when I break the code out into the Ren Garden repository, but just haven't wanted to create any more barriers to building than necessary until everything is streamlined...)
 
5:09 PM
So run ./rencpp/examples/workbench/workbench.app/Contents/MacOS/workbench
or something else?
 
I don't know. Did the mac bundling "just work" and put the dependencies in the app folder?
If so you might be able to launch the .app ... Chris didn't mention how he ran it (or if he did, I forgot what he said)
 
possible!
yep... double click on workbench(.app) starts it :)
 
A good sign...
 
  for n [1 thru 10] [print n]
that worked fine :)
 
The video is a demo of most of what it does so far. I did forget to say something about the very beginning effort of autocomplete. e.g. ap and tab
I tinkered on the UI for it but realized I wanted the actual complete logic to be a Rebol-based helper
 
5:14 PM
shell [ls] just crashed it :(
 
That wasn't working for Chris either. Crashes on an assert.
 
shame
 
The way shell works is it kicks off the shell and gives it an instruction to set the prompt to something "highly unusual".
(I should make it more unusual by generating it instead of having it literally in the source code, lest it occur by virtue of just listing the source code to the shell code.)
And it expects the last letter of that weird prompt to be the last thing it sees in a sequence after a command is finished.
If there's more input after that, it asserts. I think Chris said that was the assert.
If so, I have to figure out why the shell had something after the funny prompt.
 
watch works fine
tabs are working
 
Watch works until you watch something that prints output or infinite loops. :-) Expect it to have a lot of rough edges. But I have plans for how many problems can be addressed.
(e.g. I know the watch issue can be addressed because I can redirect the streams for evaluations, and run them on a thread, it's just a matter of the UI showing which watch is hogging up and offering a cancel button on it... and also a UI for getting access to a buffer used to capture the stdio watch output if it had any...)
 
5:20 PM
Yes I just tried x: does [print "1"] and then watch x and console got out of alignment until I changed x: 1
though now I'm seeing two 'x in watch panel
 
The output issue is not unsolvable...or at least I have some solutions that are going to be better than the baseline I know of with GDB
 
how do you get multiline entry again?
 
Nor is input unsolvable. I was thinking anything asking for input would get an EOF or error of some kind, and you could have an option to feed it a fake dialogue of input each time. The stdin/stdout hooks are C++ iostreams.
Shift-Enter
 
LOL - User error: "foreach is now each"
tried the wrong multiline example :)
 
Try undoing and fixing it...
 
5:25 PM
How do you "undo" ? Clicking on it show "undo" but grayed out
 
Hm. Command-Z doesn't work?
There's the Ctrl/Cmd mac/Linux/Win distinction.
 
Command-Z worked
 
Menu might well be broken, I haven't used it possibly ever :-)
 
yep... looks like it
but Command-Z is nice :)
 
File bugs, feature ideas, or otherwise at github.com/metaeducation/ren-garden/issues
(And even better, fix them / write them... :-P)
 
5:28 PM
Ah... if only I knew C++ :)
What you need know is a good Ren Garden logo :)
 
Maybe this is one someone else can draw for a change... I'll wait a bit on that one...
Might recycle the Freebol theming. Wind farms, wind garden... cultivating personal power and independence.
 
sounds good idea
Anyway this looks really cool. I'll try and put together a PR later on but it may slip through to weekend.
 
Cool, great! Look forward to what you might find to do with it. It really is possible to wire up so you just kind of bridge to C++ for a bit of necessary behavior with a lot of the logic in Rebol
 
I think just having multiline entry is a big boon! watch will come in very hand. Look forward to having shell working.
Obviously early doors... but theming (change fonts, colors, background, etc) will be handy to. Who knows perhaps syntax highlighting!!
have to go now... catch yer later
 
Later!
 
5:58 PM
I envisioned a square zen garden with little Hanoi towers in it. Also, little 人 walking around.
That would make for a good stage for a video game or a good artwork, but not a logo though :p
 
6:15 PM
I thought of just having there be sand with the rake having made a ren shape, but it might be too spare. But too many details would be too much
 
Well, just a zen garden with a ren shape could be good.
 
Rebol and Red icons sitting inside as in the positions of the two top rocks above could be interesting, need the rake to understand what it is. Don't want the rake crossing another item, too much. Garden frame and rake could be rich brown wood, and perhaps have ren symbols on the side in some sort of engraving. (Gold? White? Sivler) Make it mroe square aspect ratio and taller the ren symbols might be visible.
 
Hanoi-style zen garden :p
 
A round pattern from Rebol meeting a square one from the Red :-)
 
6:39 PM
So Ren Garden is the new shell that makes all other shells obsolete. Good work Brian and Morwenn
 
I only helped with the C++ pedantry things. All the interesting thinking comes from @HostileFork :p
 
@Morwenn C++ pedantry is interesting thinking, to some :-)
 
@HostileFork It sure is interesting but it only makes things a bit better. It does not create applications by itself.
 
So imagine something organized roughly like the above, but with a richer wood box, more along these lines:
The ren symbols might be able to stand out as engravings the way that hole does
 
While I lack the idea, I fear that there are too many elements for a logo :/
 
6:54 PM
I think it could work. The Rebol/Red logos might have to be turned into stones
So as not to clash as much. And if the box were a simpler looking component it would reduce the overt symbol count
The ren logos would have to fade back and be subtler etchings vs. labels
Perhaps change the angle so it appears only once in a more prominent direction facing forward
Changing the angle would help in general also because it can't be square enough at that angle.
 
Better try first and choose after having had a few sketches.
 
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