« first day (1297 days earlier)      last day (3666 days later) » 

12:10 AM
@TOOTSKI hehe :-P
 
:P
 
@tereško I'll never get why you need a book about a programming language.
There are always enough tutorials and docs online.
 
are you fucking serious ?
 
There's a good book about PHP? :P
 
@tereško yes. I'm absolutely serious…
 
@TOOTSKI I don't have any. I read on cloud reader, in an android app and on ipad
 
@bwoebi I guess it has been long since you actually learned a language.
people do not learn from tutorials
they scan over the text and copy-paste examples
 
@tereško last language I learned was C. 1.5 years ago.
 
you cannot learn a language this way ... but you can start to think, that you have learned it
 
@tereško so, you want to tell me I only think I've learned C because I've never read books about it?
 
12:16 AM
@tereško people that "learn" from tutorials in fact don't need to learn - they just need to solve some issue in any even stupid-and-dirty way
 
yes
 
@tereško May I disagree?
 
@bwoebi well ... you might be a bit less ordinary example , because you already have learned "programming"
what you were looking for was "quick translation from language A to language B"
 
@tereško actually I learned PHP the same way. (< my first language)
I started with some tutorial in 2009...
 
You're a hack.
Tutorials IMHO are specific things, unless you can find a series of good ones in order of appearance...
 
12:21 AM
@TOOTSKI Actually, that was my tutorial… php-kurs.com
 
Anyone worked with the Google Calendar API?
For some reason all the events i am getting from Google Calendar's API are dates back from 2010
 
@bwoebi I wish to do something similar with php.ac(ademy) :( I learned too by example... never read a php book... tho I didn't turn out well :P
 
@TOOTSKI where's that list from? Seems awfully a lot like what I did last month
 
I have posted a question here if any of you would like to help:
0
Q: Google Calendar V3 API Issues?

Elite GamerFor some reason i am getting events back from 2010 that are returning in this API call: https://www.googleapis.com/calendar/v3/calendars/myEmailHere@gmail.com/events?maxResults=15&key={KEY HERE} Here is some of the JSON from the response (Inside the Items Array): { "kind":"calendar#even...

 
12:23 AM
@TOOTSKI you didn't?
 
@TOOTSKI aha, there you go :D
It was fun to get the students to explain how an infinite iterator implemented with a generator works
 
What kind of algorithm are used in making puzzle games. Simple ones like connecting two dots without overlapping on other connected lines.
 
@bwoebi Probably better than 95% but not as good as you considering we started at the same time and I was your age when I started :P
@Ocramius I would give the same answer as one of those students :D
 
@TOOTSKI you're 23?
 
@bwoebi 24 actually. About the same...
 
12:27 AM
@TOOTSKI hehe
 
I already feel too old, can't imagine how @rdlowrey feels.
And late.
 
@TOOTSKI In which ways do you think you'd be worse?
 
24 and Zend certified .. And I am 22 good for nothing ... Pathetic
 
yeah , got to sleep , ASAP
 
@shortCircuit I got it in 2011, it was easy :P
 
12:28 AM
zend certs are important for people who have nothing else to show for
 
@tereško Good night, sweet prince
@tereško And a raise, whole $300 of it. :D
 
@tereško yeah… usually a @php.net address is much more impressive than a Zend certification :-D
 
@bwoebi Than you?
 
@TOOTSKI yup
 
12:29 AM
@bwoebi yeah
 
@tereško and a few nice php-src contributions even better... :-P
 
@bwoebi OK, you don't have to shove it in our faces :P
 
but I doubt that I will ever get a @php.net mail ... I cannot keep up with the things that I have to do
 
We can hook you up :P
 
12:31 AM
not interested
 
@TOOTSKI hehe…
 
Oh, you just saved yourself a salary.
 
3 mins ago, by bwoebi
@TOOTSKI In which ways do you think you'd be worse?
 
@bwoebi Yeah, I'm still counting :D
 
I think I practise less ... Wayyyy less .. Maybe I will get time after this B.Tech shit is over..
 
12:35 AM
@bwoebi For one, at logic and anything deeper than userland code, I'm not good with "real" OOP, I imagine it's same for you... I think I got more "real world" experience than you (i.e. a job), but you would catch up... I don't know your future plans but you should stick to making php better and aim for Google/Facebook type of companies where you could be utilized to fullest.
I prefer Value-Driven-Development. The code you write must provide real Value #vdd
I prefer fear driven, do that or you're fired :D
 
@TOOTSKI OOP is something very subjective. As long as you respect DI and don't abuse statics nor inheritance you're often already often on the safe side…
Well, yes, you still need to make sense of your architecture, but that usually comes from within…
@TOOTSKI Hehe, In this chat I've already seen enough bad code for my life… do I really still need "real world" experience? :-P
 
Hahaha, well if you're financially situated, probably not :P
@bwoebi Yup, tend to do that, what I meant is, sometimes I write something, and then later find out the name of it (pattern), there's where I'm lacking... mostly because I haven't had real need for it...
But I make shit work and not care about "trends" much...
 
@TOOTSKI me too. That's no problem. You don't need to know patterns to write them.
 
<3
 
The main thing is architecture. Not patterns.
And I give a shit on MVC. Maybe my code is some sort of MVC without using these names explicitly, maybe not; I don't care.
I just want an architecture you can work with.
 
12:48 AM
And every sane developer/architect/manager would prefer that over what's popular on Twitter.
MVC to me is Request > whatchamacallit > Response, heh...
More important is that it's clean and separated and maintainable etc.
 
We see it often enough that people just misuse patterns. They think they should use that pattern and then adapt it to their needs… It's better to just start with what you think it's best without thinking in a little black box of patterns.
 
Yes, and those things change rapidly, what you use today could be frowned upon tomorrow, but sane code would always remain that.
 
@TOOTSKI Sane is subjective here. Here are some pattern masters who surely think we're the insanes.
 
@bwoebi Sane as in low count of wtf per 100 LoC :D
 
12:52 AM
@TOOTSKI we might have wtfs where others don't and vice-versa.
 
When I used Symfony for a short time, my head almost exploded...
And people consider that to be the best, so it's subjective like you say.
I consider it bloated...
 
I'm happy with using no frameworks. (Maybe the little microframework Arya, but that's from @rdlowrey, one of the most sane people on earth and I also influenced him a lot when he developed its API :-D)
@TOOTSKI Do you use any framework? (Don't say Kohana!)
 
@bwoebi That guy makes the best PHP code I've seen :D
@bwoebi Haha, nah, used Kohana at the time (2011ish).
vendor>ls
autoload.php  composer  kohana  nikic  symfony  zendframework
This, mostly :)
Just components and I do the "(H)MVC" part to suit my needs.
Database stuff gives me most of the troubles, hah.
 
@TOOTSKI I don't know the framework nikic :-P
 
Symfony2 as a framework is such a crap...
@bwoebi Hah, just this thing FastRoute.
 
1:01 AM
@TOOTSKI hehe… I use it as a part of Arya
 
HTTP components from Symfony, Cache/Db from ZF... etc.
Used ORM from Kohana, Doctrine would be overkill for simple things.
 
HTTP components from Symfony? Bye! Use rdlowrey/Arya.
 
Right! Will do from now on, I haven't written anything non-work related to be honest :D
Have so much ideas and things, but... I go with "don't have time" lame excuse...
 
@TOOTSKI I still find something to criticize in most of his commits :-P
 
You love that, don't you... I'm wouldn't be surprised if his hiatus was because of you :D
 
1:04 AM
@TOOTSKI actually you seem to have enough time to be here in chaat for hours :-P
 
@bwoebi That's my entire social activity :P
</nolifer>
 
in Two Crowns, Apr 27 at 15:06, by rdlowrey
@bwoebi All that said, your questions always force me to make sure what I'm doing makes sense, so I appreciate them :)
 
@followchrisp @taylorotwell I've never once felt bad about using the Response and Request facades in my controllers.
@laracasts @followchrisp or any other facade for that matter :)
 
@TOOTSKI He wants to be criticized (in a positive way)...
 
@laracasts nobody said you can't use them effectively. The key is to understand tradeoffs. Not telling off anyone that disagrees.
 
1:08 AM
@bwoebi He's lucky to have you :P Really, you start to question things you wrote... I'm sure you know that feeling.
 
:-)
 
I have no idea what they are talking about @ircmaxell :D
My buddy @bwoebi and me are just making shit work :D
Ah perfectly aligned ................................... message.
 
hehe
 
Look what PHP-Parser made me do... I now align every -
thing.
Up yours @NikiC!
 
Look at the thread.
Specifically the tweet "laracasts" replies to.
 
1:12 AM
Ah, didn't see that link.
That's Jeffrey Way, right?
 
No idea
 
Yeah, he was main editor for NetTuts+, now running laracasts.com
Let me ask you @ircmaxell, can you tell me, why I need this "Laravel Facades"?
 
@ircmaxell Actually… since Auryn I don't see any reason to use facades anymore.
 
These people are good in making buzz.
 
In order to not use isset I could disable error_reporting(E_ALL & ~E_NOTICE)and do $obj = new stdClass(); var_dump(is_string($obj->a)) instead of $obj = new stdClass(); var_dump(isset($obj->a)&&is_string($obj->a)). Is disabling e_notice good reason in this example?
 
1:15 AM
@tootski the same reason you don't want to unit test your code
Your core architecture sucks.
 
@Almis no. You could maybe use the @, but using isset() really is the best solution.
 
disabling is always sux
 
@almis: no. Errors exist for a reason. Don't try to work around them. Listen to what they are telling you and fix your code...
@bwoebi: please don't suggest suppression.
 
@ircmaxell meh. I think you don't need to unit test code, but you should make it unittestable.
 
ok guys thank you.
 
1:18 AM
/me gives up. Your right. This whole unit test thing is a sham. Nobody really knows what they are talking about, and those of us with experience who have seen the benefits of testing are diluted.
</sarcasm>
 
I added a bounty to my question about the Google Calendar API
0
Q: Google Calendar V3 API Issues?

Elite GamerFor some reason i am getting events back from 2010 that are returning in this API call: https://www.googleapis.com/calendar/v3/calendars/myEmailHere@gmail.com/events?maxResults=15&key={KEY HERE} Here is some of the JSON from the response (Inside the Items Array): { "kind":"calendar#even...

 
@ircmaxell I never said you shouldn't unit test. But it should be at the very least testable.
 
@ircmaxell I can't understand the difference between this static Response::view("admin/index") and e.g. Kohana statics... they're saying this is not static AFAIS.
 
Seriously, I give up.
 
@ircmaxell Actually if the unit tests would write themselves I'd be happy to use them. I just don't like to write unit tests.
 
1:21 AM
Oh, noes.
 
Wow
 
You'll never work at Google now @bwoebi.
 
@tootski: there is none. Still global state.
 
Me neither, haha.
@ircmaxell Right.
 
@TOOTSKI huh?
 
1:23 AM
@bwoebi If you were to work somewhere like aforementioned, you'd be forced to write them.
 
I'm wondering why there is no tool which analyzes all the possible branches and then auto generates unit tests for these...
 
@bwoebi such a tool would be pointless
 
I am not too crazy about writing them, and writing tests isn't easy.
 
you don't need that sort of tool. Because generating tests for existing code would simply prove that the existing code does what it says it does (which is literally what it does).
 
How could you possibly foresee everything that might go wrong?
 
1:26 AM
Instead, you write a test for what the code is supposed to do
and test that
that way your tests actually prove the code is correct. Not just "sit there looking pretty"
@TOOTSKI writing tests is the easiest thing you'll ever do. Writing code is hard (solving problems). Reading code is harder (understanding solutions). But the test is the easy part.
 
@ircmaxell you're describing TDD.
 
And if the test feels hard, it's because you either 1) Don't understand your problem domain, or 2) Your core architecture is fubar
 
I wanted the unit tests more to verify that nothing is broken when I make changes later....
 
@bwoebi actually, no. That's the definition of any test that actually has any value to you
@bwoebi such a test can never be written, because you'll always break some kind of edge by very definition with a change. Even if it's a "this method doesn't exist before, but does now".
What you're talking about is preventing regressions. And you do that by verifying behavior, not implementation
 
@ircmaxell Probably... I'm not saying I'm happy that I don't test much of the code.
 
1:29 AM
You're right, I'm more a fan of integration tests.
 
@bwoebi Have you watched vimeo.com/80533536 yet?
 
@ircmaxell nope, will have a look tomorrow.
 
Everything is a scam and sucks. Bah...
 
@ircmaxell I meant that nothing I didn't want to change is broken.
 
@bwoebi which means that you need to actually put some inteligence into those tests
which means autogenerating them isn't an option
 
1:36 AM
This is too much for one developer to know.
Tests are just one part of everything, and it's a science now.
 
@ircmaxell I agree...
 
By the time you "learn" all of this it will get potentially outdated and you'll never write any code in the process.
 
@TOOTSKI which is why if you're not growing, you're dieing
 
Michael Bolton, not the singer, not the office space actor, the third one :P
 
:-)
 
1:42 AM
@ircmaxell Yeah, stagnation is not an option, it's boolean :)
 
@taylorotwell I will be happy to be a sacrifice to the majestic dragon of laravel
 
I don't even
 
I hate having to write posts like this: reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/24njep/…
/me is off to bed. Good night
 
morning!
 
good night. I'll try again to sleep. (It's 3:54 am here)
@ircmaxell I've read it… mhm. But at least I'd wish to have a nice UI which helps me filling out boilerplate for checks so that I really quickly can decide what to assert for. I know it's not so trivial as I might make it sound but I'd maybe really like it)
 
 
2 hours later…
4:04 AM
@ircmaxell So, Laravel is a fanatical religious cult now. Maybe if the nonsense perpetuates, we can get them registered as a hate group.
 
@DanLugg interesting approach
"Clean code slayers"
though they're still doing a lot of good compared to others ^_^
 
4:22 AM
Honestly, I'm looking through Laravel again; I don't understand why it's so popular. It has to be a combination of marketing and unprecedented fanboyism (unprecedented with exception of Apple)
There isn't anything great about it. I mean it's not terrible beyond usage, obviously. It's probably not even bad (except for some major scabs) but I just don't get why it's popular.
 
@DanLugg the average php developer is pretty much the typical wordpress developer, or a 9-5 coder, a so-called ghost who codes. Those people want to do it fast and want to do it in whatever way. Laravel is good at that, and I'd personally not see anything problematic in building a website with Laravel (if it has NO business logic). I don't see the advantages over using a more robust Silex or a more minimal Slim though.
 
Skimming that article, and re-reading your message, it all became crystal clear: Wordpress == Laravel.
Not in code, not in quality, but to whom it caters quite specifically.
Spot on man, spot on.
It's the cheap liquid egg of the web dev world. You'd never use it in a large fancy meal, you probably wouldn't eat it yourself, but to crank out omelettes for people you only give a quarter of a shit about (the quarter that's paying you) it's perfect.
 
Well, some people just don't know any better either. How many times have you heard "java is crap" here?
 
Well yea, Java isn't crap.
 
I believe java is doing it quite right for many many things, so yeah, it's really just a bias
 
4:36 AM
Saying "X is crappy and Java has X" is fine, and there's probably a lot of X's and Y's, and Z's in Java. There's a lot in PHP too, arguably more. But none of that matters, because it's the extension to "...and therefore Java is crappy too" that's wrong.
I'm a firm believer that there are no good production capable programming languages; some are just less worse than others for certain things.
 
I think lisp is production ready
but only because it is so minimal :P
hrhr
 
Haskell too.
Fucking MS Paint, I wanted to rotate the text a bit to align it.
 
Morning, room!
answer the my question got it if you don't know so please don't irritate me — user3579862 4 mins ago
lolwut
 
php interger round up to nearest value

eg.
1. 11920 it should round up to 12000
2. 10250 it should round up to 10000
3. 2500 it should round up to 2000
4. 2501 it should round up to 3000
 
> 2500 it should round up to 2000
THAT'S IT, I'M OUT
Good night gentlemen.
 
4:48 AM
nite
/me heads to office =_=
 
5:04 AM
 
Yea, don't do that here.
<-- Take a guess.
lol, seriously, I personally don't give a fuck, but that shit is inappropriate. You'll find yourself kickbanned quickly if you keep it up.
 
user50049
@user3597526 Enough with the racial innuendo.
 
^^ Like that.
 
Seems like that spell worked!
@user3597526 Byebye
 
5:18 AM
I tried to warn him.
 
morning @Joe
 
morning
the first word I read this morning was proper offensive
 
5:21 AM
oh hey bob what's this email you ccc'd me on ?
 
@JoeWatkins hmm? which one?
 
user50049
An interview with the original Scumbag Steve -- (was just oddly reminded that one existed)
 
@bwoebi I dunno got it @live last night, something to do with readline again
 
@JoeWatkins sent you nothing…
 
CC'ing Joe as he's author of the change (I just merged these phpdbg commits to php-src at that time)
+#define PHPDBG_VERSION "0.3.2"
 
5:23 AM
that was Remis mail?
 
@TimPost: looks like this user's repeating the same behavior in other rooms as well.
 
I've forwarded it two days ago?
 
I got it last night
nvm then, just checking
 
@JoeWatkins time dilatation…
 
stackoverflow.com/questions/3055515/… Why escape metacharecters with \\&$ ?
 
lol pulling up a song on YouTube only to get a commercial only to like the song in the commercial only to Google the commercial to listen to the song in the commercial and no longer listen to the song you went to YouTube to begin with for.
 
@shortCircuit \\ is just an escaped backslash. & and $ are just usual characters (in that context).
 
yeah, programming error in the matrix probably ...
 
@shortCircuit Assuming you're talking about this line: patterns.push('('+i.replace(metachars, "\\$&")+')');
 
5:33 AM
Indeed
so its kind of arbitrary?
 
What do you mean "arbitrary"?
 
Could I have used \\ab or something like that instead
 
-1
A: NSAttributedString crashing my app

Yorrick HuntCAN YOU FUCKERS STOP DOWNVOTING MY QUESTION

 
user50049
@DanLugg Yeah, umm, short fuse much?
 
@TimPost Tell me about it, "cuz".
 
5:45 AM
lol
 
Damn. "A lot of your recent flags have been declined. Please review them first." :-(
 
so ... do we work today or what ??
is it holiday in USA today ?
my HR department (misses) is still in bed ... HR will know what I'm supposed to be doing ...
 
How's her tooth?
 
infection has gone right down, her face was actually pretty swollen with it but it's normal now .. she's still not eating proper food, on yogurt and soup ... I think another couple of days and back to dentist ...
 
5:59 AM
Bummer, at least the infection is gone. Hope she's feeling better soon.
 

« first day (1297 days earlier)      last day (3666 days later) »