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12:30 AM
@ChemiCalChems TCP is better for most situations because it can error correct. UDP, like concurrency, is powerful, but a headache worth avoiding until you get the chance to practice using it
 
@Aaron3468 most except for realtime online gaming
and that's about what i'm coding
 
Naturally it depends on the game. I think it's the Unreal Engine, but if you play the multiplayer shooters made with it, there are always slight desync issues because of UDP (the server hitbox doesn't always align with what your client shows). TCP is where you'll get lag spikes, but you can expect to hit what you aim at.
Anyways, good luck! Which genre did you choose?
 
@Aaron3468 rts
what i'm gonna do is check if the client is still alive using the tcp connection used for chat
1 ping every second, 10 seconds, client dead
but send game states and shit over udp
 
Cool, that's a great genre to learn optimization. You'll have a lot of fun figuring out how to scale the game logic to get another few hundred units on the field
 
@Aaron3468 fucking ell, i don't even want to think about that right now xd
 
Ell
12:52 AM
@ChemiCalChems why not just use TCP?
For everything
This is an RTS right, you can afford the latency
 
Uh no? Starcraft with lag sucks
 
@Ell and now you're blue
 
Ell
That isn't because of TCP most likely
 
what next, cats and dogs living together in harmony
 
Ell
I'm not on my screen :3
 
1:01 AM
at least my gravatar has changed from chartreuse
 
oh no now I want to binge The Batman
...
oh no my Batman obsession isn't as gone as I thought it was
I thought I crushed it with fanfiction!
D:
be back in...a bit longer than a bit
a lot longer
 
> Supermen: Batman and Superman go to the Beach and...
 
@jaggedSpire kinky :P
 
B:TAS has more than 60 episodes by itself, and Batman Beyond has 52, and then there's all of Justice League and JLU, which is is either 52 or 65 episodes and then there's The Batman...
 
user2015064
1:07 AM
fucking hate that compiler
 
user2015064
Hello
 
wtflag
2
 
@Borgleader very
 
sup
 
I mean it's a dude who dresses up as a bat and beats people up
 
1:14 AM
@xersi 今日は、xersi!よろしく!
 
I've spent 6 months doing MEAN stack development. Does it make sense for me to learn machine learning, or should I just focus on MEAN/Node development.
I'm doing the Udacity course
 
1:24 AM
There's nothing to say you can't study ML ;) It's a fun, but very heady field
@sehe I'm like 90% sure that auditor was trying to obtain and sell personal data to criminals, or was a criminal O.o
 
user2015064
@Aaron3468
こちらこそ。元気ですか。
 
お天気は今日きれいだし、とても元気だった。あなた?
 
user2015064
1:41 AM
うん、今日は天気いいだね。実は、嬉しいよ。
 
そっか…なぜ?本当、昨夜が大雷雨だからあまり寝なかった。
 
My latest android app: Trip Plan
There a few known issues, including a performance issue that I am currently working on
 
Very useful! And it looks like it has very wide android compatibility, which is always a plus :)
 
@Aaron3468 agreed
 
Thanks, lemme know if you are aware of any issues
 
user2015064
2:09 AM
そう。、「昨夜があまり寝なかった」と聞いてるのはごめん。
そして、あなたに話してるのは本当に素晴らしい。
 
Hey could anyone answer a quick question
What data type is it that stores two values together?
Like:
variable<value1, value2>
It's not variable<key, value> but actually two separate values that are just stored together.
I totally forgot the name and I dont know how to find it by googling
 
user2015064
@Pantss
 
user2015064
Are you talking about template?
 
@xersi No it doesnt look like it
 
user2015064
Or you are talking about std::map?
 
2:17 AM
Usually Pair, or Tuple depending on the language. I'm pretty sure it's std::pair in C++
 
@Aaron3468 Tuple was definitely it. Thanks a lot
 
@Pantss No problem :) On occasion a named-tuple is a great wrapper so that you don't need to keep track of which index is which value; basically a fixed-membership std::map.
 
2:46 AM
Some games have a sense of humour... The item Slight Debt costs 100 to sell and slowly snowballs into Debt Hell which costs 5000 to get rid of -- If only real life had the possibility of simply discarding
 
They said it was fixed IPv6 address.
But somehow it has changed...
Or maybe I am just misunderstanding what has happened. Fixed it somehow anyway.
 
3:59 AM
@LucDanton so basically I haven't missed much
 
well, there was HoT
 
my dreams are crazier and crazier every day
today i experienced the fucking end of the world at sea on a super futuristic military ship by something similar to super deadly mega earthquake
4
and i've come to see that were something similar to that to happen, bye bye pluricelular life in a second
what didn't get me was the fear, it was the sadness of the silence that came later
i wish dreams could be recorded, cause i would repeat that one
 
4:48 AM
@LucDanton yeah that's what I said
 
 
2 hours later…
Ven
6:34 AM
Hi
 
Rok
hi
 
6:46 AM
hi
 
7:12 AM
hi
@Ramy Why are you linking that? (To me?)
@ChemiCalChems They can. It's what cineasts do.
 
@sehe how?
 
By using their imagination.
Instead of just having one.
 
your face
 
Ven
7:32 AM
would look good somewhere
 
else than here
 
7:53 AM
user image
12
I didn't know they made Scott Meyer merchandise yet
 
@sehe :D
 
Ven
dont books technically count as merchandise?
 
nwp
I'd say only if the book is about him, not sure if he published a biography
 
 
1 hour later…
9:26 AM
cable internet is not working, using mobile internet instead ...
 
Ven
$$$
 
^running away from me along with the bandwidth, yes
 
Man, Dead Space is so awesomely scary. Both the effects and the music make an awesome atmosphere.
 
Rok
I have all 3 and never managed to finish any of them because every time a new game comes out I just start playing that
 
9:40 AM
@CaptainGiraffe I love that remix too :D
 
Rok
:/
 
@Rok Heh. I have finished the first one only.
 
Rok
I always wanted to play the third one with someone but I was a bit late to the party xd
 
First two are OK, IMHO, but the 3rd is a mere shooter.
 
Rok
true
 
9:48 AM
@EtiennedeMartel Ugh. Why not?
To buy PS4 Neo or not to buy PS4 Neo?
I own no gaming console at the moment.
 
Rok
same
 
user2015064
What is the ugly picture?
 
user2015064
I mean from @sehe
 
Ven
3 hours ago, by Puppy
your face
 
sehe's avatar is an albino bear
 
9:57 AM
@Telkitty He-man? But he refers to Scott Meyers in his message.
 
Scott bleached his hair?
 
10:13 AM
@Mysticial Oh. I don't even have php in the machines that serves my sites, so I guess I'm safe from that particular one.
 
Rok
i love being in this chat despite not really understanding a lot of stuff
just thought i'd say that
 
Same
 
10:36 AM
github.com/rmartinho/nonius/issues/66 Almost tempted to reply "this is fixed by reading the second paragraph of the fucking docs"
 
11:02 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes s/fucking // and do it.
On another note, is there a word for kind of maintainer that has similar meaning to foster parent?
 
You mean like someone who takes over someone else's project?
 
Ven
Yeah if you understood all you'd hate it here
 
11:20 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, the previous maintainer is likely dead or too old, so I am providing a single update and to do that I have to become a maintainer. :)
But I want to qualify this kind of maintainership in its docs/README.txt.
It is funny how so many people die in Dead Space just when Isaac enters the room.
 
good moring vietnam
 
@wilx pro tempore?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Like "maintainer pro tempore"?
That sounds nice.
Very posh. :D
 
@wilx Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.
2
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Heh, I had to search for this on Google. :)
 
Ven
11:30 AM
good moring england
 
Ven
11:47 AM
no fucking way. y = "foo"; query(y) works but not query("foo")?!
 
user1804599
> also known as "user-defined type classes"
 
user1804599
type classes are also known as that
 
maybe query() requires a reference as the parameter or something
 
Does #define FOO(_1, _2) whatever violate some reserved name rule?
 
Ven
@redspah it's not such a language. I'm probably just doing something stoopid
 
Xeo
12:07 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes don't think so?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Only in the sense that single underscore prefix is reserved for implementation's global variables, IIRC.
 
Xeo
@wilx global anything
 
@Xeo Right.
 
@nwp You're a Berliner?
Also, turns out I can vote, but not for the Senate.
 
nwp
12:22 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes not born, but lived there for most of my life
 
For all I care, the ballot could just be "[ ] Nazis [X] Not Nazis"
Local elections are shit.
Especially that Bezirk-local bullshit I can vote on.
I've been here almost four years, and I've lived in six different Bezirks, and worked in three.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes What if nazis grow new trees? :o
 
Suppose I had voted in the last elections. My vote would have been rendered useless in a few months, and I'd be living under the decisions made by five different groups of people that didn't include me.
 
nwp
I have barely heard of the kottbusser tor police thing, I probably should disqualify my vote.
 
Sometimes I feel like I'd vote for whoever plants more trees to replace all the ones that have been cut down :/
 
12:28 PM
Hence why I really only care about "[ ] Nazis [X] Not Nazis". Other people can choose by themselves, as long as they don't choose Nazis.
@Morwenn That's another issue I have with elections. I cannot make the choices I want to make.
Suppose the Nazis do grow new trees (as a stand-in for "good environmental policy"). I want to vote for that, but I also want to vote against their racist propaganda.
But I am forced to choose between {trees, racism} and {deforestation, no racism}.
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes But voting is the only way to at least start making a change.
 
nwp
weimarer republik supposedly let you vote for any niche party and even would put them into parliament, didn't turn out so well
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Me too. That said I live in a 7k inhabitants town: I will see the new trees, but I don't think they would be able to do much propaganda and be heard. Especially considering that most people work in the near by 150k inhabitants town and don't care (nor know) much about what the local mayor says.
 
user406009
It's pretty much the main political power individuals in a democracy have.
 
@Lalaland Neither of these options reflects the change I want, though.
 
user406009
12:31 PM
Well, one of them is surely worse than the other.
 
What I want first and foremost is to not have my votes rendered useless, and to not have my votes misrepresent my opinion.
As it stands, I can't vote for that change.
 
nwp
> "If voting changed anything, they’d make it illegal"
sounds truthy to me
@R.MartinhoFernandes there is a direct democracy party somewhere, but it is not like voting for them will actually do anything
 
I also don't want my votes misused to make decisions on things I wasn't even voting on (like things that didn't actually exist at the time).
 
In which I explain apples and pears to Boost users
 
I'm torn on whether I should consider voting as tacit approval of these things or not.
@Lalaland A power which is routinely rendered useless and/or misrepresented.
 
user406009
12:39 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think the most pragmatic view is to just use your vote tactically to support your interests.
 
Not (just) because of corrupt politicians, but invariably as an inevitable consequence of the electoral systems.
 
user406009
I always just look at the two people most likely to win and vote for the least bad option.
 
@c0pyc4t mooring*
A cuckold
:<
 
user406009
Not exactly always who I want, but it's the most effective way to use your vote in first past the post voting systems.
 
@sehe lol
 
12:41 PM
@Lalaland That's playing the game, which to me sounds like tacit approval.
 
@sehe But that has an involuntary component which is not the case. :)
 
Hence me not voting.
@Lalaland It's not just first-past-the-post, really.
 
nwp
@Lalaland This is not completely a "Winner takes all" type of election
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, I would rather play the game than have Trump as president. There are priorities.
 
nwp
and in those I never understood why people consider voting for someone who doesn't make it "throwing the vote away" and voting for the winner as "making it count"
 
12:43 PM
@Lalaland It's the fact that my vote is carte blanche to make decisions on any and all matters for X years, regardless of where I am living or working or how my opinion changes or pretty much anything about me, really, during those X years.
 
nwp
the big parties will get into parliament anyways, voting for them is as much throwing the vote away as voting for parties that don't make it in
 
@Lalaland Yeah, but that's a single instance thing. There isn't always a Trump.
21 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
For all I care, the ballot could just be "[ ] Nazis [X] Not Nazis"
@Lalaland Also regardless of how anything related to those same matters changes in those X years.
 
nwp
the hidden assumption is that your opinion doesn't change too dramatically within 4 years and that the time in which you are not happy with your choice anymore is short enough to not cause problems
 
I'm planning to move (within the city) next year. I don't know where to yet, but most likely not within the same Bezirk I am in, which is the only Bezirk I can cast a vote in. It's also not the Bezirk I work in. This effectively makes my vote worthless for me after four months, and leaves me slave to other people's votes for forty-four months.
@nwp Sometimes you can't even have an opinion when you vote, because the matter simply isn't a matter at all.
 
nwp
also you are not voting for a matter, you are voting for a party to handle the matters, whatever they may be, and it is not too hard to guess how the parties will handle things in general
 
12:50 PM
@nwp Oh yes, it is. What's the Nazis stance on trees?
 
they’re okay because you can plant them in swastika shapes
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'd say good german oak trees are good, foreign trees should be cut down
 
What's the Greens stance on self-driving cars? We're going to need legislation soon.
 
nwp
why does it matter?
 
The forest swastika was a patch of larch trees covering 3,600 m2 (4,300 sq yd) area of pine forest near Zernikow, Uckermark district, Brandenburg, in northeastern Germany, arranged to look like a swastika with their light colors. == History == Reports say the larches were planted in 1938. It is unclear how the trees came to be planted and arranged in such a fashion. A theory is that a zealous forester convinced local Hitler Youth members to plant the trees in commemoration of Adolf Hitler's birthday. One source maintains it was planted by a warden, either out of support for the Nazi regime, or...
 
12:52 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes why do you call them Nazis?
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes cars are evil, ride a bike
 
@Abyx Call whom?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes those racist tree-planters you mentioned above
 
@wilx oh. that's a first
 
@Abyx Because that's what their party is called.
Only Abyx would object to using "Nazis" as a stand-in for a party that incorporates racist ideologies.
 
12:57 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes did I object?
 
But you would.
 
no, why do you think so?
imagination much?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes anything specific other that pointing to all my messages here?
 
1:17 PM
@Morwenn Sorry for improving my algorithm :P
 
1:29 PM
@Abyx Yes. Engage brain and critical thinking. Then revisit the search results. You won't be disappointed. Bye
 
@orlp Had you improved it only a bit, it wouldn't have been a problem, but now it means that the results for pdq_sort, verge_sort and spread_sort are incorrect :o
At least. I don't remember whether it's used as a fallback algorithm anywhere else.
I'll also have to update the stolen benchmarks apparently :p
 
@nwp Because I want to have my vote count in that matter. Because all of these parts of the system that make my votes worthless or worse, misrepresented, are antithetical to democracy.
 
nwp
Well, you are screwed then. We have a representative democracy, not a direct democracy. I doubt that will change before the next world war.
 
@nwp What I want isn't a direct democracy.
This representative democracy is not democratic.
(And I know I'm screwed; I started off with that)
@nwp None of what I want excludes representation.
 
I want cat++ to rule sweden
 
user406009
1:42 PM
@JohanLarsson Since it worked so well when Cat++ was room owner? I think he would immediately step down.
 
user1804599
https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=⊸
 
user1804599
those results WAT
 
@rightfold Bad link.
 
@Lalaland Yeah likely, but cat >> democracy don't you think?
 
I have this feeling that cat++ wants nothing to do with the lounge any more
 
user1804599
1:44 PM
Let people vote what they want and let a logic system deduce the laws from those constraints
 
@nwp Most of the problems I mentioned are a result of the system being designed to solve problems of scale, not a consequence of representation. Holding general elections every other week would be a nightmare at any time before recent years, so compromises had to be made.
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes AFAIU you want to vote for each matter individually. There doesn't seem to be much point in having someone represent you.
 
I don't think those problems of scale still exist anymore.
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes How would you scale up elections?
 
@nwp Maybe I can pick a different representative for different matters.
 
nwp
1:47 PM
there is still hope that a post-scarcity society will make elections and politics obsolete
 
I think yesterday, someone came to dump an article about how the stackoverflow was failing, I was like 'yeah, yeah, like everything else'. Think about it - if Stackoverflow got shut down for whatever the reason in the near future, we would all be 'homeless' on the internet ...
 
@nwp I’d vote against that
 
user406009
@nwp Well, in theory communism would solve that.
 
user406009
The ideal version of communism.
 
nwp
@LucDanton why is that?
 
1:49 PM
@Lalaland There are nations that have experienced good results transitioning to electronic and online voting.
 
nwp
or, to put it in other words, what useful things do politicians do besides manage limited resources?
 
@Lalaland there is a play / movie with your name
 
Ell
electronic voting scares me a little bit
when things aren't open source
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes The main issue with electronic voting is that it is fundamentally less auditable than physical voting.
 
1:50 PM
@Ell that scares me even more
 
user406009
Physical voting is very simple and easy to audit.
 
@nwp Gay marriage isn't a limited resource.
 
user406009
Even my grandparents could do it.
 
user406009
You simply watch the stupid ballet box all day.
 
user406009
And watch it when they count.
 
1:51 PM
@Lalaland I think that's a bigger issue than concerns about security.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes useability?
 
But it's a problem that time will erode.
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes hmm, true
guess people will always be a limited resource in a way
 
Ell
eh idk how to spell that
 
@Ell Yes. It exacerbates certain inequalities.
 
user406009
1:52 PM
I'm not too worried about the usability of electronic voting. I just care about the ability for normal citizens to audit the system.
 
Ell
I don't think it would be any worse than physical voting
you could always have a physical to electronic voting booth
 
user406009
@Ell Yeah, but how do you prove that it's fair?
 
@Ell That doesn't solve the problems of scale.
 
user406009
How do you watch the electrons?
 
user406009
With physical, paper ballets this is very easy.
 
Ell
1:53 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes it doesn't exacerbate it
hmm
 
@Ell But it gives no benefit.
@Lalaland I don't think that's not an insurmountable problem, and like many other things, it doesn't have to be perfect, just good enough.
 
Ell
it gives benefit for those which don't have to use the physical voting
I see the conclusion of this though
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes With paper ballots though you get almost perfect ability to audit though.
 
user406009
It helps the citizens have trust in the system.
 
@Ell That's a mere convenience thing. It doesn't let the system solve the problems it has for struggling with scale.
 
user406009
1:55 PM
And it is important for the voting system to be fair or democracy falls apart.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Given how badly this is handled now (especially in the US) I'd be pretty happy with "not really good enough, but at least somewhat better than it is now."
 
nwp
You could have the voting machine print your vote so you can check it and put it in the ballot. You get the benefit of instant counting and if you don't trust the machine you can recount the votes on paper afterwards.
 
user406009
@nwp Using machines for instant counting is fine. You still need a physical ballot box though.
 
user406009
And you need to check a statistically random sample of the ballot boxes.
 
@nwp That doesn't solve the scale problems.
 
nwp
1:57 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes why not? assuming the voting machine doesn't screw up all the time you would basically never recount
is the scaling problem with the papers or the ballot boxes?
 
It's the ballot boxes, really. (A machine could easily count the papers in the existing purely physical systems)
 
user406009
The other main issue with electronic voting is the lack of a secret ballot.
 
user406009
You could for instance sell your vote or be pressured to vote a certain way.
 
user406009
Mail in voting has the same issue though.
 
nwp
@Lalaland only if the machine gets compromised
 
user406009
2:00 PM
Mail in voting is not very secure.
 
user406009
@nwp Well, I should clarify.
 
user406009
"The problem with electronic voting from your home is the lack of a secret ballot."
 
@nwp Or if someone is behind you when you vote.
 
nwp
@R.MartinhoFernandes that is not a voting machine problem
 
user406009
In-person voting has very strict rules about who can go into the voting booth and what you can do in there.
 
2:01 PM
@nwp But voting machines don't scale better than voting booths and boxes.
 
user406009
You can't take a picture of your ballot.
 
But I think you can still reduce the issues with scaling without getting rid of physical in-person voting.
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes Maybe. With machine counting.
 
(Btw, you can vote from home in Estonia)
 
user406009
But I think they already do that to some extent.
 
2:03 PM
@Lalaland That still requires tons of people to go to a place to vote. Terrible turnouts ahead.
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, it's still really scary though to implement in your own country.
 
user406009
@R.MartinhoFernandes There are other ways to deal with turnout. Voting holidays, having less voting days per year, etc, etc.
 
user406009
I would also want to eliminate a lot of things from the ballots.
 
user406009
I don't want to vote for judges.
 
user406009
We pay our legislature a significant amount to govern. They should do that. I don't want to deal with minor minutia like judges.
 
nwp
2:08 PM
high judge positions are super important, at least in germany, but no regular person can tell judges apart
 
@Lalaland I, on the other hand, want to be able to decide what I want to deal with and what I want to entrust someone else to deal with.
And to be honest, I almost prefer a less secure vote that counts, than one that is totally secret and impossible to tamper that doesn't count, or counts contrary to what I want.
Maybe that's selfish because making my votes public carries little risk to me.
 
nwp
until some big guys come and tell you your life expectancy would decrease dramatically if you didn't change your voting habits
 
@nwp They don't even have to be big guys.
 
@sehe I won't hold my breath ;)
 
@nwp I'm just not sure which is the biggest tragedy.
I find throwing my vote away terrible.
 
Ven
2:19 PM
@Borgleader bad mood? :o
 
nwp
2:30 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I find that making an educated and responsible decision who to vote for and which side to take in political matters is very difficult and basically unfeasibly time-consuming
putting a half-way decent person in charge for a time seems to be the best option
except that there doesn't really seem to be an at least half-way decent person to vote for
 
Did you run your code into a minifier or something? — Borgleader 14 secs ago
 
2:48 PM
@nwp And there's no way to know that.
@nwp Which is why representation is a good thing, and why I think direct democracy is a terrible idea.
To give a specific example, I'd like to delegate decisions on genetically engineered crops to scientists, not to lawyers (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Schmidt_(politician))
 
I just wanted to send you a quick note here instead of
calling you. I came to your TelKitty DIGITAL - The Business TeleComunicator page and
noticed you could have a lot more traffic. I have found that the key to running a
popular website is making sure the visitors you are getting are interested in your
website topic. There is a company that you can get keyword targeted traffic from and
they let you try their service for free for 7 days. I managed to get over 300
targeted visitors to day to my website
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes IRTA I'd like to delegate decisions to genetically engineered cops
 
lol personal spam, haven't received one of these for ages ...
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't have PHP in my website at all. I don't even know how PHP works server side anyway. What I did see is that a bunch of piles with .php extensions started showing up in random directories and the .htaccess file was modified to run them.
 
@Mysticial But your host has PHP installed.
 
2:58 PM
> Christian Schmidt [...] member of the centre-right Christian Social Union (CSU)
 
To do the same on my site, you need not only to put the php files there, but also to install and configure php to run them.
 
hey a person destined for his job
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ah
 
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