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12:09 AM
Well, I wrote my calculus final and I have 80% confidence that it pulled my current grade down to ~65%... I had about 82% going in.
 
ouch
 
I'd practiced calculation, but the ones on the exam were nearly all exploiting edge-cases where you can skip calculating ^^; At least I have C+ to B
 
yie
 
@jaggedSpire sup
 
@Borgleader afsdhljhgs
in the snow /cc @Borgleader @ThePhD @TonyTheLion @Xeo
 
12:41 AM
Now road side assistance has prioritized their service - if your pet or child is locked in the car, that gets the highest prority in the queue
 
12:58 AM
@Telkitty What about my child's pet?
 
Ven
@jaggedSpire OH REALLY
you dont even give me the snuggles :(
 
@Ven snuggles
@JerryCoffin what about your pet's child, or your child's pet's child?
 
@jaggedSpire Neither exists (TTBOMK).
 
@JerryCoffin well I imagine that's a relief. Separating a child from puppies or kittens doesn't seem like a very relaxing endeavor
 
1:18 AM
@jaggedSpire Actually, right now my children don't have any pets.
 
@JerryCoffin well then you're home free
 
@jaggedSpire Not even close. Pretty much every bit of floof they see results in asking about getting a pet panda, polar bear, and just about anything and everything else fluffy and furry. Fortunately, most of what they ask for is really easy to dismiss. Sorry, but we're not going to try to keep a wolf in a yard so small it only has about one square meter of grass, and even if I consented, I'm pretty sure nobody would be willing to turn a giant panda over to us.
My wife sort of agrees with them, but openly admits that she lacks the ambition to actually care for a pet (of any sort, as far as I can tell).
 
1:34 AM
I thought that they could just break the window if it's really urgent
 
@Telkitty I'd certainly expect them to if life (especially human life) were in danger.
 
car wouldn't start, but the road side assistant is free (because of insurance) and car is still under warrantee
now waiting for the tow truck
 
@JerryCoffin I suppose you shouldn't let them see sehe, then. :P
 
@JerryCoffin have them kill a few fish
 
1:52 AM
@jaggedSpire Prolly not.
 
2:25 AM
@JerryCoffin For some reason, with that new hat you got, I now always confuse your avatar with that of @R.MartinhoFernandes.
 
@EtiennedeMartel I hadn't noticed 'til you mentioned it, but the color seems reminiscent.
 
2:39 AM
I got a secret hat
 
by trolling meta?
 
@Mikhail Now a used to be secret hat.
 
@Telkitty They didn't take my hat away, but the post is gone
 
I know, they deleted my comment way before they deleted the post
 
fascists
 
3:08 AM
@Telkitty such floof
 
 
1 hour later…
4:21 AM
> Warning: This is a feature of last resort.
 
5:10 AM
oh boy
use the hell out of it
 
this article makes sleep paralysis sound worse than it really is
I would know because sometimes I have it - awake but can't get up
 
@jaggedSpire I’m the one slapping the warning on :Þ
 
@LucDanton ah well
I suppose then you can punish those who do use the hell out of it by letting them be hoist by their own petard
and use the hell out of some other last resort function
maybe you can ask Morwenn for their most recent resorting function :V
 
5:42 AM
(gdb) p ctx
$3 = <optimized out>
decomposition variables (i.e. auto&& [ctx, from, to] = …;) at -O0, joy cc @Rapptz
 
6:00 AM
Okay, I have a style question. I have these persistent setting files, if the program can't find them it makes them. I implemented this with a try{}catch() on some IO error, is that bad style?
 
why can't you put that in a if statement?
 
sometimes the library doesn't give you the option
 
Well, I could use something like boost or Qt to check. But then I'd be checking twice...
Because it is implicitly checking when its reading the file
 
C#'s System.File doesn't, actually. You can't try to open a file and check, just catch the error
 
read settings -> prepare settings on any error (making sure not to overwrite anything, presumably) -> give up on any error
is that the sort of thing you’re doing?
 
6:06 AM
in the depths of my code at work there's a loop with a body that's only a try-catch statement because I needed to retry opening the file if it failed
 
@LucDanton Yes, without the last one
 
@Mikhail then yeah that’s sensible, imo you can’t foresee every possible I/O / filesystem condition that could possibly happen, including new and exciting conditions that will be invented in the future—so bailing on any I/O or FS error is the right thing to do
you do need a plan for when you can’t write those files though, also a handful of retries are nice although not necessary either
retry(3) { … } catch(...) { give_up(); }
 
Xeo
7:04 AM
@LucDanton no variables for you
 
also fun (but harmless this time): GDB shows a line such as auto [foo, bar] = init; as being executed twice
 
I mixed stuff and drank it, now I am sick
some herb tea & coffee, but herb tea made of a few vegetations
I wonder if I would accidentally kill myself by mixing things that produce poison
 
user1804599
8:03 AM
Ol, Durex ad on bookface
 
user1804599
> Give her an orgasm with explosive intensity!
 
8:45 AM
@LucDanton is that trunk?
I want structured bindings :(
 
@Rapptz do you find a Sphinx glossary useful? so far I’ve been using :ref:`thing` to refer to notions, linking directly whichever bit of the docs that defines or explains the notion. I could have :term:`thing` instead, but I don’t see the point if the glossary entry in turn links to the :ref:
 
I have never used it.
 
@Rapptz yeah
 
@milleniumbug doesn't matter whether it's a buffer or not. mem is a pointer. — Mark Yisri 11 hours ago
Is it me or this whole conversation is pointless
 
off the top of my head auto&& [a, b, c] = lvalue; is wrong (complains about binding an rvalue reference to an lvalue or some such), otherwise it’s quite usable
I’m scrapping the glossary for now
 
8:49 AM
neat
 
that's lol
definitely going to be unspecified
 
Back in my day we would have just #defined it
 
yeah, scroll down and there’s more :D
 
nice
> internal compiler error: Segmentation fault
still holding out for static reflection :(
maybe one day
 
8:54 AM
that reminds me, I don’t think I’ll be pursuing my TDK#-like approach
it makes me too sad
 
for what?
 
it was a generalist approach, i.e. something to write algorithms against
if you recall what we did for jsonpp it was write the (sometimes canonical, sometimes not) descriptions for the datatypes, write the algos that work on descriptions, pick & match from each
 
1 message moved to bin
 
@MarkYisri It's also not "how to align a pointer?". The answer to "is mem aligned?" is not a pointer. It's "yes" or "no". — milleniumbug 4 mins ago
 
9:18 AM
Is this an 'optimized' UB for clang?
 
what even is "optimized UB", UB that executes faster?
 
gotta go fast
 
highly optimized UBs are the best
 
9:36 AM
@milleniumbug fifteen
 
Xeo
why are Java generics so bad
 
probably because they're in Java?
 
88
Q: Why do some claim that Java's implementation of generics is bad?

sdellysseI've occasionally heard that with generics, Java didn't get it right. (nearest reference, here) Pardon my inexperience, but what would have made them better?

 
Xeo
can't write T.class or x instanceof T ...
 
> It's better than nothing!
lol
also lol Jon Skeet's rep and badges don't fit on a single line
 
9:43 AM
They do here
Probably font dependent, idk
 
@Xeo with type erasure erasure, you could forget all those horrors!
 
Xeo
...
 
that type erasure is the horror
 
The erasure of the type by M. Night Shyamalan
Although "ERASURE" sounds like a cool title by itself
 
user1804599
Yay I already learned something new today.
 
user1804599
9:47 AM
@Danh Java generics are incredibly good, because they are erased.
 
user1804599
The only thing that is bad about Java generics is the lack of HKT.
 
@rightfold I don't get it
 
@Danh rightfold has a very peculiar set of views on programming.
90% of time it's fine to ignore those.
(Some part of those 90% is actually necessary to ignore for your own sanity.)
 
@Danh Very easy, take anything rightfold says and invert it to get an accurate view of the situation. Example: "gentoo is good".
12
 
Xeo
> I think Java would have been way better off if 1) it had not added generics but 2) instead had allowed implicit casting from a supertype to a subtype. Let incorrect casts be caught at runtime.
"Throw out the type-system!"
 
user1804599
10:04 AM
@Danh Look up parametricity.
 
I BEG TO DIFFER.
FOR ONE THING, YOU RELIABLY GET YOUR CAPS LOCK KEY STUCK. YOU'RE HUMAN, RIGHT?
 
user1804599
 
@Danh It's not. Unless you think performance is a feature
@CheukKinSing wp
 
user1804599
If you need reified types, you need downcasts or reflection, which mean you're doing it wrong.
 
user1804599
Don't use downcasts, they scream.
Don't use reflection, they scream.
We want reified types (to do downcasts and reflection), they scream.
 
10:07 AM
this is a fine
this is fine ... of $190 infringement notice
 
user1804599
@Xeo Dart does that 😂😂😂😂😂
 
user1804599
@sehe Happy kerststolstice!
 
Dat solar punt
 
> Generating cmake for generated codes:
this is both grammatical and technological horror ;_;
 
Glutton Morgen.
 
Ven
10:22 AM
@rightfold they changed that (or are going to)
PROGRESS
@Griwes i agree with her this time tho :p
 
@Ven You agree that Java generics are good? Gross.
 
Ven
@Griwes No, I agree erasure is good and it lacks HKT.
 
@Griwes lol generating CMake source
 
40 mins ago, by rightfold
@Danh Java generics are incredibly good, because they are erased.
 
meta-meta-meta build engine
 
10:28 AM
Notice how this says that Java generics are incredibly good.
@milleniumbug All wrapped in a set of bash scripts that have "Maven" in their official name.
This build system is cancer.
It takes minutes for the generated make to figure out it had nothing to do.
And currently I'm trying to figure out why the main.cpp takes 45 goddamned seconds to compile.
 
user1804599
@Ven what about covariant everything
 
Ven
@rightfold dont remember
@Griwes oh cmon, don't be like that
 
@Ven Like what? Reading what's written? :D
 
Ven
10:43 AM
Your brain should know to plainfully ignore those statements.
 
This is the point where discord is better, because I could add :noel: somewhere there.
 
Ven
@CheukKinSing tu vois ce que t'as fait
On a perdu griwes au 15-18.
 
you're banned
 
Ven
Quite so indeed
 
now you're banned twice
 
Ven
10:48 AM
Luckily third time's a charm
 
you're banned thrice, then
 
@sehe This is true.
... How do you keep changing your gravatar like that.
Isn't it e-mail based
Do you have to change your e-mail, or...?
I managed to implement overloading and bottom-up type derivation, but I passed out before I could write the final report and send it in.
I made the presentation, however.
fun two () {
	return 2;
}

fun main () {
	return two();
}
Pretty neat that that works entirely as expected....!
 
alert, ThePhD is turning into rightfold
abort experiment immediately
 
undefined reference to experiment::abort()
 
Xeo
11:06 AM
@ThePhD IP based if you have no mail or sth
 
@CheukKinSing I'm not gonna keep doing this.
I'm just happy at least two features work properly.
(Even though I can't subtract two numbers BUAAHAHA.)
 
It begins like that and then you wake up in the morning saying "I had this wonderful idea".
 
@ThePhD So, you will continue with this project even after you pass the class?
 
I'll continue it in another form.
And probably be using C++ since it's where LLVM lives and I can invoke and control and work with things more directly, even if the API is a pile of garbage.
 
On a different note, buying shit over the Internet is so easy! Also, it costs money. :(
 
11:10 AM
Either that, or I'll actually go work with people who already have a compiler
 
@ThePhD The API being a pile of garbage isn't the problem; the problem is the API not being stable. :'D
 
so I can learn things better than the hacking on it constantly
 
meh
 
@Griwes Supposedly, the C API for LLVM is the only thing that's supposed to be stable. The good news: they have version control and previous builds for all that stuff, so it's not as if its impossible to feature-freeze a submodule or just stick with a specific version.
 
Sticking a module to say LLVM 3.9 isn't a viable dev model. :P
 
11:12 AM
Probably not.. but.
That's just how it is with any third-party source code, right?
You're always at the mercy of their design decisions.
 
You could just (gasp!) not use their API.
And actually generate LLVM IR code by string concatenation.
 
user1804599
@Ven Perl 5 is so beautiful <3 glot.io/snippets/elfrcxm11y
 
@Griwes That sounds dangerous, but was ultimately what I wanted to do for this entire project. ~_~
 
11:27 AM
That's the only sensible way to do this, unless you're part of the core project.
 
When you have a blood test and they somehow managed to touch a nerve.
Well, not sure what they actually managed to do, but it sure hurts.
On the other hand, I now know that my testosterone level fell from 8.15 ng/mL of blood to 0.26 ng/mL.
But my forearm my hurt for a few weeks :/
 
11:48 AM
Everytime I try to print a float
it prints 0.0000...
Whatever, integers alllll the way.
 
Ven
@rightfold you just need to escape """" :P
@ThePhD how do people keep asking me about my avatar
 
Uh.
I dunno. It just seems magical. And I think I keep forgetting the answer. :x
 
Ven
Feb 17 at 17:32, by Ven
I do not have an email address set, so gravatar generates one every time. Since they're cached, it'll update to a new generated one every few hours (8-16h)
 
@Morwenn Man up! :D
 
@wilx It's not a problem of enduring the pain, but making sure that things won't go worse.
Nerves mostly need patience and rest to heal. I even avoid painkillers to make sure that I know when I'm forcing when I probably shouldn't be.
 
11:59 AM
@Morwenn ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
 
@Morwenn There is nothing wrong in taking painkillers for short while until it settles.
 
Plato and other ancient authors used the word "idios" to distinguish between the knowledge levels of laymen and experts. Its meaning eventually changed from a neutral designation of a private individual unskilled in a particular domain - such as medicine or warfare - to a general condemnation of an individual's intelligence.
everyday, I learn something
 
@wilx I mean, it will probably settle faster if I know when I'm forcing. Pain is a decent way to convey that kind of information.
 
ur gonna die anyway :P
 
Also it doesn't look like the kind of pain for which painkillers would work.
@StackedCrooked You'll die first :p
 
12:02 PM
probably :)
 
@Morwenn Well, try anyway.
 
It's ok as long as I don't stretch my arm.
 
@Morwenn Don't take the pain meds, Thibaut! FFS! :D
 
@wilx Using my given name will only trigger hate and unwillingness to do things.
 
@Ven hey what’s up with your avatar you beautiful violet
 
12:08 PM
Now you're making me wonder if there's a seed that generates a svastika gravatar.
7
 
@CheukKinSing lol
 
way to blame me for your instinctual urges
 
user1804599
@Ven cba
 
@Rapptz I tried fighting this again, but I don’t think sphinx really supports it ._.
 
Ven
12:27 PM
@LucDanton <3
@Morwenn my, my..
> By having a more complex language design. You can't deny that lifetimes and the borrow checker make Rust a much more complex language than C
JUST BECAUSE THE COMPILER DOESN'T HELP YOU WITH IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU CAN IGNORE IT
 
@Ven Yeah, sometimes I type a word whose pronunciation is close, even though it doesn't make sense. As if my brain and my fingers weren't correctly wired.
 
Ven
@Morwenn i think that's pretty normal
 
I almost never have that problem when I write French though.
 
Ven
you think you don't
 
And that ends that....
Now I need to do a few more things.
 
12:38 PM
@Ven D:
 
@Ven Where'd this come from?
 
Ven
@ThePhD HN
where else
> Same here, go feels "fun" for some reason.
Maybe its the well-thought standard library, maybe its the way the compiler helps you. Maybe its because we can actually catch bugs at compile time instead of those runtime errors and silent drops of javascript
Please dear god, please never let me work with someone who comments on HN.
> In my career I worked on three C++ projects with about 100 developers, and OOP proven to be useful. If the codebase is so large that not a single person knows it as a whole, OOP allows to express the structure of the code.
Hello, this is dog.
 
1:00 PM
I will say
making a compiler is really fun
I can see why @rightfold gets addicted
 
@Ven I am dog's owner
 
KOF
Anyone can recommend a good book for c++11 or C++14?
 
user1804599
Cool, SQL has setuid.
 
user1804599
It's called SECURITY DEFINER.
 
Ven
@KOF He-man's
@Telkitty Fix your dog
 
1:01 PM
~_~
 
Ven
Does anyone have the number of UB cases in C/C++? I can't seem to find the answer via google
 
KOF
@Ven what? I am new to this Lounge
 
Ven
@KOF sorry. scott meyers' book
 
KOF
@Ven
you mean effective c++?
 
Ven
effective modern c++ (you can edit your message with the up arrow on your keyboard)
(also please use the reply feature, the arrow on the right when you hover over a message): imgur.com/5zrvaV1
 
nwp
1:04 PM
4263
Q: The Definitive C++ Book Guide and List

grepsedawkThis question attempts to collect the few pearls among the dozens of bad C++ books that are published every year. Unlike many other programming languages, which are often picked up on the go from tutorials found on the Internet, few are able to quickly pick up C++ without studying a well-written...

 
KOF
@Ven thank you!
 
1:17 PM
Honest Trailers - Mortal Kombat makes me want to watch the film again.
It was awesome.
Also, hats!
 
The beauty of getting spammed in a foreign language
 
you're going to write chinese from now on?
BAZINGA
 
on the receiving end of spams
also just realised a persistent spammer has changed name, spammer rebranding, how lovely
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Interesting. Now, will the member states respect that decision?
 
1:55 PM
> Le maire de Tassin interdit un rassemblement syndical d’agents de maternelle pour cause d’état d’urgence
 
@wilx I hope so.
 
Man, I dislike Christmas. So much pressure to buy something to too many people at once.
 
🐙🐙🐙🐙
 
@LucDanton Les agents de maternelles, cibles critiques du terrorisme
 
2:08 PM
je dormirai en toute sécurité ce soir
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol, nice
 
inb4 "Mohamed al-Islam (les noms ont été changés) bombarde un stock de pâte à modeler"
 
@wilx Then don't!
Embrace the recluse life
 
@Rerito Can't. I have kids.
I had a lapse in reclusion and it ended up like that. :D
 
Freezers are a thing gosh it's 2016. It's time you get one
 
2:13 PM
That's what you get for getting your weenie in the babbyhole
Didn't you get the manual
 
xmas story
I ordered a ps4
Package got stolen
 
well presents are for others so things worked themselves out really
merry christmas
 
Stolen from where
 
Well I instructed the vendor to deliver it to a relay
And not directly to my home since delivery staff is untrustworthy at best
 
So naturally they delivered it at home?
 
2:21 PM
I receive a notification that the relay I chose was not available for delivery (which was wrong of course)
And 10 min later another notification stating the package was collected
By an individual named Marco Paulo Farias
 
Encore un arabe
 
Sounds portuguese? Well you guessed right, it's a football player from Portugal
 
So where did they deliver at, exactly
 
Nowhere, the delivery guy must have been in on it from the whole start
Chose a relay that suited him and had someone collect the stuff or something
iunno really
Fortunately I ordered on amazon so I got refunded
 
Why a Portuguese football player would steal a PS4 in a random French relay is beyond me
 
2:24 PM
ikr
 
So Amazon loses money, nice
 
I would have given him for just a selfie right
The best thing in the story
There was this warning on amazon when I made my order
It stated I was the only one able to collect the package
Nicely done :')
Just imagine a minute I had ordered on cdiscount
I'ld be so fucked right now
 
Pays en voie de développement la phronce
 
c bagdad wesh
oh and the "backup relay" was located in a project in my town
Known for drug trafficking and the like
The dude from amazon sales service: "it might be an update error". Yeah right ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
#pasdamalgame
 
It's tiring to get stolen from
All the more reason to never come back
 
2:29 PM
Well at least I got a refund
And I managed to get a better deal in a local shop in the end
So that's p nice
And I made some portuguese footballer happy for xmas. That's the spirit right ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
 
I hate theft
For basic necessities I can understand
But a PS4, seriously. And for Christmas. 0/10.
 
@CheukKinSing lol wut
 
@CheukKinSing hey I’m on to you I know you want to back out but you’ll have to show how much of a scrub you really are
 
My GF's cousin works as a townhall employee
She's on sick leave like 1/3 of the year
I'm so amazed
 
And then people blame it on the refugees
 
2:38 PM
(1/3 is a lower bound)
 
I've had a similar experience with most townhall employees sadly
"alors j'ai un créneau de libre le 4 mars prochain"
"mais je vois que vous avez un créneau la semaine prochaine à 15h30 ?"
"non ça va pas être possible"
She just wanted to finish early
 
that’s what she said
 
My gf needed to update her social security profile or something so she needed documents from her previous jerbplace
She had to take 3 appointments and threaten the HR whale to get them
 
...and I signed a middle finger a little bit while cooking. FML.
 
That whale had like 3 hours lunch breaks
 
2:42 PM
Whaling is hard.
 
Gotta earn that 200kg body yeah
No pain no tartine
 
Did you know that whales are the largest known mammals after your mom
 
nwp
@CheukKinSing kinda sorta
2
 
2:59 PM
Wanna hear some banker joek @CheukKinSing?
 
Go ahead
 
3:23 PM
So there's this investment banker. He just got a good bonus and decided to show it off with a brand new ferrari.
He arrives at the office, full of himself. That's gonna be a good day. While he steps out of the car, wham! The door is slammed by a truck passing by
So the dude calls the police and rants endlessly to the officer taking his statement
"This is a brand new ferrari ffs!"
The officer is astounded... The banker realizes it "what's wrong officer?"
"you bankers are incredible, you're so materialistic"
"you would be pissed as well if it was your car!"
"yeah, but you didn't even notice your left arm is gone"
"SHIT! MY ROLEX!"
6
 
 
3:38 PM
@Rerito mdr
@CheukKinSing as part of s5 anet has reworked how the match 'top stats' work, and has made them matter as well for rewards. it’s working well, as you might imagine
 
what is a dryer lint trap
 
the place where lint collects as part of normal dryer use
from time to time you have to empty it. lint is a fire hazard so you don’t want a build-up
 
ah, that explains
never had one, only a drying rack
 
@milleniumbug yes, we already knew you’re European
 
4:04 PM
@LucDanton a wild mdrtor appears
 
I don't know what to make of this Abusing C# More title
 
user1804599
What's the current state of .NET on not-Windows?
 
user1804599
Does it actually work yet?
 
You know, we have "More Effective C++", C# devs have "Abusing C# More".
Greatly highlights the difference in mindset IMO
 
@milleniumbug Is C# some abreviation for "Children"? /cc @CheukKinSing
 
4:18 PM
@Rerito Programming languages seems to be last things in current year that white men can still abuse openly, but I'm sure some good people will explain the author how 'problematic'(TM) and 'oppressive'(TM) word "abusing" is in tech nowadays.
 
4:47 PM
UB is something that happens at runtime, template functions such as this do their work at compile time. As for "will it delete $HOME" see Chandler's talk — Borgleader 15 secs ago
 
@Borgleader there's compile-time UB.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well not the kind of UB OP is referring to though? Right?
 
Depends on how underlying_type is implemented.
        if (memcmp(Mt + TMCG_SAEP_S0, g12, TMCG_SAEP_S0) == 0)
        {
            memcpy(value, Mt, TMCG_SAEP_S0);
            throw true;
        }
    }
}
throw false;
 
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