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12:00 AM
Well, I need a way of using some of the basic HLSL syntax: I want the file format itself to contain the various Vertex->Pixel shader bundles together. If I write it in plain HLSL syntax, I can pass it to the core D3D11Compile* functions and keep the regular HLSL technique syntax and it won't error on compilation.
 
sbi
@Pubby Wait until you have your own!
 
could not load image
 
It's just a baby gorilla feeling the cold.
 
This means I can create multiple Pixel Shaders and Vertex Shaders from a single file, like regular HLSL, without using the Effects framework of D3D
 
sbi
@DeadMG Better?
 
12:01 AM
yes
 
@sbi God, that thing is ugly.
 
I have to parse the pertinent HLSL block in order to get the techniques and stuff out of it, so, lexer to the rescue.
 
@ThePhD In D3D11 ID3DXEffect is already effectively deprecated.
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes And it's also cold! Poor child.
 
@DeadMG Yes, which is why I'm making my own Shader -> ShaderTechnique -> ShaderPass bundling system.
 
12:02 AM
... right
why not just compile the shaders and set them to the device when you need to use them?
 
If HLSL syntax is anything like GLSL then it sucks
 
@Pubby It's not. Thank god.
 
I don't like the idea of deleting individual robots. I do like the idea of having robots being taken care of automatically. — R. Martinho Fernandes 6 secs ago
 
sbi
@MooingDuck Actually, my claim is that all your claims are defeated just the same way. And I also claim that there's method behind this. Thus, your claim, defeated.
 
I needed a way to run-time create Shaders without using constant, compile-time strings to record Entry Points and other necessary information that the functions D3D11Compile, @DeadMG
 
12:04 AM
Send your robots back in the past to prevent them from being deleted
 
So I can give it an HLSL file, and it'll understand all the entry points for individual vertex shaders and pixel shaders, and also parse out the ShaderModel that the function asks for (ps_2_0, vs_5_0, etc.)
 
(that's what std::promise and future is for!)
 
I also won't have to do shitty file-pruning like I had to do for GLSL shaders, because that was dumb.
Had to create my own subset language, which then I had to delete all the pertinent lines, otherwise my shaders would compile with errors.
 
@ThePhD Link to documentation?
fucking MSDN search is worthless
 
12:07 AM
use google to search msdn :P
 
Sorry, the function name is D3DCompile
 
right
so I see the entry point and shader version arguments
but I really don't see why they require this.
if you write a new shader then just pass them as arguments?
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes Found some root yet?
 
@DeadMG Right, but if I change the function names of my shader, or I write a new shader, I have to then rewrite the arguments I'm passing, and somewhere along the line my code will have a bunch of constant "MyVertexFunction" "MyPixelFunction" splattered all over the place.
 
or
you could just always use "main".
 
12:10 AM
And what, copy-paste what could essentially be the same shader a million times over just so I can rewrite maybe one part of this?
 
sbi
@JerryCoffin You'd be wrong. I have been lying about my age all the time. Actually, I am a 22yo girl from France.
Ok, robot, I spilled it now. You can now speak openly about your new job in Marseilles.
 
what?
hardcoding the entry point name is a very far cry from copying and pasting essentially the same shader.
 
sbi
@DeadMG Like to see my boobs?
 
If a shader always uses Main, or MainVS and MainPS, then you can only have 1 set of mains per file you're loading.
 
C++ hardcodes the entry point name but it doesn't require any crap like that
@ThePhD Yes. So?
if you have common functionality then just #include like in C++.
it's not pretty, but it does work- and a lot better in HLSL than C++.
 
12:13 AM
Multiple shader passes in any graphics language, however, can be interlooped with one another to produce various different kinds of effects from a smaller subset of functions, see this.
I could make 4 files, copy-paste some of the vertex functions inbetween them, and main my way to victory.
 
sbi
@JerryCoffin The longer the chain, the weakest, though. Also, I wouldn't trust any chain that started with me.
 
@ThePhD Or you could use #include and not copy paste anything.
 
And do what? Use main as a wrapper for the function I want to call?
That also still leaves me with like 4 to 6 files now.
 
well, presumably each shader has some shader-specific logic in it, else you'd just be using the shader that already has that other logic in it.
so put the shader-specific logic in main() and that file, and the common logic in separate files.
 
yo
 
12:20 AM
That does work, yes, but it's still restrictive as to what you can do. Every file you'd have would have to adhere to the main() style with includes, and that system isn't all that helpful when it comes to runtime-debugging with Shaders. A huge part of being able to work with shaders for game development is being able to see the effect on the screen at runtime: with FileSystemWatcher down, I really don't have to watch any other file but 1 in my case, making it a lot easier to manage.
I'm not saying the main approach doesn't work - it does, and is obviously faster than building a lexer to handle arbitrary function names - but this is a robust solution that will work for myself and any artists I ask help me out.
 
do you have any shaders for which the VS integrated debugger and/or PIX were not enough?
I mean, I hear what you're saying
and it's "To handle some completely hypothetical future need, where I don't even know what the conditions required would be for this to occur, instead of simply calling my existing API multiple times in a loop or something like that, I'm going to completely reinvent a huge amount of language lexing, parsing, semantic analysis, etc."
@ThePhD Not every file, only the primary shaders.
 
@sbi Can anyone confirm here: Am I right in thinking the version rejected by GCC 4.7 should be accepted in standard conforming compilers (as Clang does)?
2
A: How do we include a struct in a c++ implementation file?

seheYou can just drop the #ifdef/#endif entirely This is a class template and it may occur many times in several tranlation units, as long as all the occurrences are identical (One Definition Rule) Alternative Since Node<> is purely a private concern, I'd make it a nested struct. Here's a lit...

^ final note
 
@DeadMG I want to be able to change return outputcolor; to return float4(1,1,1,1) and watch my quads go white, without having to hit F7 again. This isn't a future hypothetical need: I have to recompile even when I make small adjustments to my shader, which is annoying. If I change something in #include "NymphCommonVertex.hlsl", I want to see that change reflected: if I want to see that kind've change, I'd have to do more than parse just a technique statement: ... ->
I'd have to parse everything in the whole HLSL file (which I'm not doing right now, because that's overkill) to get the used includes. As it stands now, being able to just understand language semantics that HLSL provides in the first place for aggregating shader functions and ... ->
just parse them (the language statements aren't even that complex for declaraing shader passes / techniques) works out far better for the things I want to do. None of which are arbitrary needs; they're things I need to do now.
 
@sbi Sorry, it happened again. I was just too late to edit it out.
 
12:41 AM
@sbi Luckily, no.
@sbi Are you sure you are not drunk?
 
@sbi When I saw that advocated, I believe it let you select a limitation on how long a chain you'd trust.
 
12:58 AM
{ { sleep 2 && echo 2 && exit 1 ; } & } && { sleep 1 && echo 1 && exit 0 ; }
^ This runs as a script. How do I prevent 2 from being printed after early exit by 1?
Ah this seems to work:
{ { sleep 2 && echo 2 && exit 2 ; } & } && { PID=$! && { sleep 1 && echo 1 ; } && kill $PID && exit 1 ; }
 
@Stacked having fun?
 
I'm finally figuring it out.
Statement grouping.
 
yeah I get it. I do bash on a daily basis.
 
Still toying with the sandboxing concept.
I've decide to usage the Linux facilities instead of writing my own sandboxing code.
My idea is that the webserver asks launches the user code as a different user.
 
I think I'd use trap
{ { sleep 2 && echo 2 && exit 2 ; } & } && { trap "kill $!" INT ERR EXIT; sleep 1 && echo 1 ; exit 1 ; }
 
1:09 AM
I don't want try it. I think it's a trap.
 
man bash?
It traps signals in the shell
 
user1357851
man bash ... bash the dude? :p
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked It will do something bashy.
 
Anyway, I can set user limits in /usr/security/limits.conf.
I'll limit the number of processes for the sandboxing user to 3-5 probably. This way I can even allow forks.
 
(removed)
(a) there is nothing fishy about space/tabs in shells. It's just often overlooked by morons :)
(b) it's not a trap :)
(c) you could have remembered it right :)
 
user1357851
1:16 AM
thus I don't like to use shell scripts - very frustrating to a newb shell scripter like myself :x
 
shell scripting is annoying. Programming is annoying. Only slightly less, sometimes
 
user1357851
I would still consider shell scripting programming ... just not as hard core as C/C++
 
user1357851
but if you use linux, especially own a linux server, then it is essential to know a bit shell script
 
user1804599
C and C++ ain't hardcore.
 
Hi
I found a HUGE security bug in Windows 8. Who should this be reported to?
 
user1804599
1:25 AM
@IDWMaster Sell it to Russian hackers. You'll be rich! At least, that's what I would do.
 
user1357851
@IDWMaster to us first
 
user1357851
tell us
 
user1357851
also to microsoft
 
I'm not sure if it's good to post it to the "wild" before Microsoft has a chance to patch it.
 
user1804599
Telling it to Microsoft would be a waste of money.
 
1:27 AM
Is it legal to just post it on a public chatroom?
 
user1357851
but if you don't you can be charged on hacking issues, so you should eventually before they find it out. But not too soon.
 
user1804599
Either exploit it yourself or let somebody else do it for you.
 
user1357851
@IDWMaster it is more legal than to sell it to russian hackers
 
user1357851
or you need to find Russian hackers first and sell it to them without anyone else knowing
 
Probably best to report it to Microsoft or a known security firm
Probably both.
 
user1357851
1:29 AM
sell it to security firm
 
I've already e-mailed a security firm to let them know I've found a vulnerability.
FRSecure
 
user1357851
email to all the security firms you can find
 
user1804599
@Telkitty no problem, there's probably a .onion site for that.
 
user1357851
and see which one makes the highest bid
 
I just realized the copy/assignment special members for this class were completely broken. I fixed this value-semantics bug (added Copy-And-Swap idiom) now — sehe 3 mins ago
 
1:30 AM
It's basically a bug that lets you run something in "desktop mode" from a WinRT app.
 
^ Isn't it great when you inherit bugs from the OP's code and still get to fix them :)
 
OK. I've contacted both FRSecure and Microsoft.
Probably the legal thing to do.
I'm running some automated tests just to verify.....
 
@IDWMaster noble/ethical
 
user1804599
@IDWMaster nope.
 
user1804599
They will sue you for writing malware.
 
1:33 AM
@Aardvark Even for reporting it to them?
 
user1804599
Of course, suing is how they get most of their money!
 
Hmm.
I'll just keep it to myself.
 
user1804599
Stop taking me seriously.
 
Tell them it wasn't actually a bug.
 
user1357851
they won't sue you
 
user1357851
1:35 AM
I am sure Aardvark was just joking
 
And I'm not sure if a program that has a button that says "Click for notepad" and when you click on it it opens notepad
 
user1804599
Just go ahead and publish it on a .onion site and nobody will be in danger.
 
I'm not sure if that would count as malware
 
user1357851
how is that a security breach?
 
Because you're not supposed to be able to do that from within a Windows 8 app and have it pass inspection
It's supposed to be "sandboxed".
 
user1357851
1:36 AM
if I make a button to run certain program for me that I have privilege to
 
user1357851
then it supposed to open that program for me
 
But the thing is you don't have privileges to run that program
Your app doesn't have those privileges
Most functions from user32.dll are supposed to be blocked
Same with shell32.dll
 
user1357851
unless someone else from the other side of the internet can have access to those functionalities, i.e. by accessing your programs in the background
 
user1357851
then I would not consider it a very serious security breach
 
user1357851
if your family or your company owns the computer
 
1:39 AM
@Telkitty I would since they advertise the sandbox as a security feature in windows 8.
 
user1357851
I am wondering whether they are thinking of opening the market place on PC like they are on the phones
 
user1357851
thus introducing the sandbox feature lol
 
user1357851
sandbox feature sux btw, every time I open photoshop, it gets sent to sandbox
 
Ell
hey guys
 
> Using unused virtual functions to defer instantiation traps is incredibly clever... If my understanding is correct :)
@R.MartinhoFernandes @Xeo @LucDanton ^ Interesting discussion there dramatically improved template error messages (was: C++11 decltype/SFINAE puzzler)
I fear it would degrade the type to non-POD and encumber it with unnecessary vtables in some cases, but of course, the technique is still interesting for classes that had been designed to be runtime-polymorphic anyway
> It's a good trick, but I don't think it scales.

Just apply more force. (E.Niebler)
 
1:50 AM
Fuck it. Fix the compilers.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Better in all respects.
 
user1804599
Man.
 
user1804599
I had such a funny joke about amnesia, but I forgot it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes So, can I ask you to review something? I've been fixing little things like, forever, in this answer: stackoverflow.com/a/13435782/85371
I hope I have left no more flaws hanging (or actually, the OP had many many more, but I tried to straighten it out :))
 
user1357851
@sehe I thought that is the whole point of OO
 
1:52 AM
What?
 
@Telkitty Cough. Missing the point by a few continents, mate
 
user1357851
abstraction -> inheritence -> polymorphism
 
@Telkitty Okay, friend. Here's the deal: we like "elite trolling". We don't like ignorance. If you have no clue why that is nifty...
(maybe I should go to bed for reason of tired)
 
    end = ((end? end->next : front) = std::move(Ptr(new Node(data)))).get();
@sehe Oh gawd, is this a joke?
 
user1804599
@Telkitty the right tool for the job > anything
 
1:55 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I explained that below :) Yeah, it is
 
user1357851
true
 
user1357851
thus a good software developer should know at least 1 scripting language, an OO language and a web language really well.
 
user1357851
that's the minimum
 
user1357851
I am sure most people here know a lot more
 
user1804599
@Telkitty wut? Web language?
 
user1804599
1:57 AM
You mean HTML?
 
user1357851
PHP
 
user1357851
perl/CGI <-- not a language BTW
 
user1804599
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA‌​HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH‌​AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA‌​HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA‌​HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA‌​HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA PHP
4
 
Ell
a systems programmer may have never touched php in their life
 
1:58 AM
> Someone talked some sense into me regarding the push() method
 
@sehe You fucked up the Markdown.
 
user1804599
@Telkitty PHP isn't a language either. It's an over-engineered template engine that sucks.
 
user1357851
?
 
user1357851
PHP is a very popular language for server side programming
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Erm. Thanks...
 
user1804599
1:59 AM
A good software developer knows the languages he needs to know to get the job done, and if he doesn't know them, he'll learn them.
 
user1357851
and have been for the past 10 years
 

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