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12:15 AM
@CodyGray Example: Moderator username "Journeyman Geek" Stock SE display at any screen width <= 1439px. Same username using the CSS from the URRS at screen width 900px, at 1439px. The browser is Firefox.
 
12:56 AM
^ given the edit history and how happy they were with the product they discovered only minutes later I have a sneaky suspicion this might actually be SPAM.
 
@tink edited & commented
 
Hehe ... good man
 
 
1 hour later…
2:49 AM
@Makyen Sorry, where is this? Teachers' Lounge? I definitely use that to talk to The Original JG in Firefox on screens with total widths of 1200 (1600x1200 monitor in portrait mode), so that's definitely a viewport < 1439 px. I'm not sure how I am unable to reproduce this. I'm definitely not using URRS.
 
@CodyGray Yes. Those screenshots were taken today from SE.chat. The ones showing an issue are in a profile I use for testing which has no userscripts, no extensions, no changes to the page.
 
Interesting. I don't have any scripts running on my laptop with Firefox, either.
 
The only thing that's been done is to use the Firefox Responsive Design Mode to set a specific screen width, after playing around with resizing to multiple widths.
I find it interesting that you're not seeing the issue, as I've never not seen it when using the stock SE chat interface since the changes were made by SE last year, so multiple versions of Firefox.
 
 
2 hours later…
4:43 AM
 
5:19 AM
@Juraj The same question/answer pair was posted, closed and deleted yesterday. Strange
They just keep creating accounts (third?) for unclear posts. Might be worth mod-flagging
 
5:36 AM
I’m wondering if a moderator would mind reviewing a suspension I received due to two failed audits in the First Answers queue. The first provided a correct algorithm, but in a different language than requested (which the author acknowledged). The second was a code-only answer that was incorrect.
Neither were good answers, and probably merited a comment. (Though I likely wouldn’t have flagged either, since they were both legitimate attempts to answer the question, even if the solutions weren’t useful.) At minimum, I should have at least caught that they were both audits. That said, I think my overall record in both this queue and LQP is strong, and hope you’ll consider lifting the ban.
 
5:48 AM
@Vega yes. I don't see deleted posts on SO so I couldn't confirm if it is the same user or a new account
 
Perhaps @Makyen or @CodyGray? At minimum, I’d love your feedback on these audits in case I should be flagging these.
 
@JeremyCaney While your frustration of being suspended is understandable, it is for a reason. The best is to accept, learn and move on.
Also be aware of this room rules, we should not bother mods for this
 
Oh, shoot, I apologize for that. I was pointed to this room in the past for these types of questions, but that may have been for general feedback about borderline cases, and not for review suspensions specifically?
 
That's ok
I hate giving link only answers ;), but you might want to read about the room here: socvr.org
 
FWIW - I wouldn't have flagged either of those answers. A well written answer in the wrong language is far too likely to be declined in LQP and the usual guidance is that a genuine answer, even if technically wrong, isn't flaggable either.
 
6:06 AM
we can certainly review things which are visible to us; this room is not a way to get in touch with a moderator if that's what you actually want
the fact that some mods are here does not mean this is a shortcut to getting a mod's attention; that's abusing the room
 
@tripleee that distinction is useful, and makes perfect sense. I appreciate it.
 
if you really want someone with the privileges to lift your review ban (I think you are talking about, rather than a suspension? the terminology was changed to keep the two more clearly distinct) then either flag a post for mod attention (ideally, one which is relevant to the case, but if that's not available, any post - and explain your case in the text box you get when you flag) or ask on meta
 
@tripleee I think the change went the other way around? It’s definitely labeled as a “suspension” currently. (Which I should have used instead of “ban” in my second comment above.)
 
@JeremyCaney How on earth is that second review worth a Looks Ok. We are on Stack Overflow, right? Not on some obscure forum.
@JeremyCaney when in any doubt, Skip is an option that will never fail an audit.
 
6:31 AM
I'm sad that the first answer of that review was deleted. Yes, it's in a different language but it can serve as pseudocode.
 
@JeremyCaney You should really read the FAQ I linked to. Also, "Looks ok" should be the exception, not the norm when reviewing (unless you skip every post that's not in perfect condition). Reviewing doesn't just mean either flag or choose "Looks ok", there is (and should be) more to it.
For example, this looked ok to you? Or this? And possibly more. It doesn't look like a strong record to me.
 
@rene I should have commented encouraging them to add an explanation, which I typically do when reviewing from my desktop. But I certainly wouldn’t have flagged it, since it offers an answer. It is my understanding that reviews should not evaluate technical accuracy.
 
if it needs a comment then it is not Looks OK.
Nothing to do with technical accuracy
 
@JeanneDark This gets to the heart of my question. I have read that FAQ (though I will reread it). Plus @Undo’s A Plea for Sanity. And by my read, both of those answers are acceptable, though I certainly should have encouraged an explanation on the second.
(They’re obviously nowhere near my standards, if you review my record, but my job as a reviewer isn’t to push my own standards.)
@rene yes, that’s totally fair.
 
@JeremyCaney Reviewing is more than choosing either to flag or "Looks ok" which the FAQ also tells you. You can edit, you can leave a comment, skip or even vote. And not failing an audit does not make a strong reviewing record.
 
7:00 AM
@JeremyCaney hmm, thanks, I guess I am confused
 
 
8:07 AM
@DaImTo [tag:cv-pls]
 
@JeanneDark ? does it work in a comment or something?
 
again, please edit to use the standard tag, as that helps us and the tools we use
 
Im not on my own pc to day i cant install the tool.
 
you don't need any tool. just a keyboard which allows you to type the 12 characters [tag:cv-pls]
typing [tag:...] around something turns it into a tag; here's what it's rendered like:
 
@tripleee im trying to understand what you want me to do. thats all. If you would like me to add the tag as a comment then simply say add this tag as part of your comment.
 
8:10 AM
edit the messages if you still can; going forward, use that text instead of CV please
 
Its only 10 am theres no need to be upset already the day as just started :)
 
@DaImTo Just copy paste exactly that: [tag:cv-pls] (it's not rendered in this case because of backticks)
 
Oh so you mean add it to the message here in the channel. See that wasnt hard makes total sense
To old to edit i will do so next time thanks for the tip very useful.
 
People in this room use a variety of userscripts to help them manage the requests. Formatting them in this admittedly unusual and non-standard way helps the userscripts to detect and filter the requests. I'll happily edit that message for you.
 
there was another one just after
 
8:13 AM
So there was. I got freaked out by the giant eye staring at me.
 
The giant eye?
 
@CodyGray thanks. Im on my clients pc so i cant install the plugin. Its been driving me crazy that i cant ping the channel with issues. If you have any tips you are always welcome to message me or drag me into a channel.
 
@DaImTo No worries. It's easy enough to type manually once you know the magic sequence. It isn't required to include the actual tags on the question (even though many of the scripts do that, too, for convenience.)
 
@JeanneDark I was wondering the same 👀
 
Why would we want to drag you somewhere private, when we can criticize you here publicly? :-p
@JeanneDark Look to your left.
 
8:15 AM
@CodyGray always so much love from you i can feel it though the screen.
 
Jeanne Ey(r)e?
 
@CodyGray A bespectacled pumpkin is freaked out by me?
 
@JeanneDark wow theres a whole bunch of them so useful. I thought you had to use the plugin to get it to work here.
 
@JeanneDark People are always afraid of difference.
@JeanneDark I wonder if that is out of date. I have not heard of Yam, "the GraveRobber bot".
 
@CodyGray except those of us who strive to be different.
 
8:21 AM
@CodyGray It contains the correct formatting for requests in case you do them manually, so it's very useful. Maybe the part about Yam is outdated (I myself have also not come across them yet, thankfully). Also, my avatar is not new. Don't you like it?
 
@CodyGray my impression is that Sam's bots are on a bit of a hiatus, possibly as fallout from Monicagate
 
@JeanneDark I didn't mean it was completely wrong, just that the mentioned portion seemed obsolete. I do like the avatar. Perhaps even more than the previous ones. It looks quite good in the chat transcript.
@tripleee That was Sam's bot? Huh, OK. Didn't know that.
 
the trick is the regex .am
 
@CodyGray I'm glad you like it and I don't have to try out different body parts.
 
@JeanneDark Well, I will get bored of it soon, so you may still have to...
 
8:25 AM
;)
 
8:41 AM
@JeremyCaney Hrm. I see that you've moved your question to Meta instead of here. While I don't much like being pinged about it, I relish even less having to write a coherent answer on Meta instead of throwing some nuggets your way in chat.
@JeremyCaney I think the first answer was completely reasonable. It wasn't just someone cluelessly posting a solution in the wrong language. They acknowledged that it was in the wrong language, but were trying to explain an algorithm. That seems OK to me. A downvote is not unjustifiable, but deletion is.
@JeremyCaney The second answer was complete trash. It wasn't even trying to be relevant, and looks more like trolling to me. Maybe you couldn't tell because all of C# is Greek to you? That's OK; hit Skip. Don't say stuff looks OK that doesn't. I think you made the wrong call on that one.
 
The bit of text in the first answer could have been slightly improved by editing ("We can solve the problem with slightly modified k-combinational algorithm. I'm using python but you can easily convert them to javascript."), so I don't think "Looks ok" was justified there.
 
That's a fair point. Editing is always good. I edited it after I undeleted it, in fact.
It's difficult to think of any case in a review queue where "Looks OK" is completely justified. There's almost always something that can be done to improve a post.
I also don't really like requests to commute a review suspension because doing that correctly requires me to go through and review all of your recent reviewing history. That's... a lot of drudgery, and I'm lazy. I will generally only lift review suspensions when someone comes with their paws up and says, "OK, I learned what I did wrong, now I know what you were trying to tell me with that suspension". I don't generally second-guess suspensions applied automatically.
I will definitely echo Jeanne's remark about reviewing not being a binary choice between "flag" and "Looks OK". There are plenty of other options. Just because something doesn't need to be immediately deleted (and thus flagged/voted to delete), that doesn't mean it's "OK".
Even that second case where I said it was "complete trash" would probably not be suitable for a NAA flag. If a mod wasn't paying close enough attention, they could end up declining that flag. (There are no mod audits!) So, a custom flag is probably more appropriate, or, of course, directly voting to delete when the queue allows it.
 
9:09 AM
@CodyGray I know you’re busy, and appreciate you taking the time to reply here. Your previous review of my recent history, back when I first started reviewing, was incredibly useful, and very much appreciated. I do understand that I need to get better at commenting in NAA, but it was my understanding that we shouldn’t vote to delete code-only or incorrect answers, which is why I okayed the second one. Should I be voting to delete in those situations?
 
@JeremyCaney Ooh... I would not be someone who would encouraging you or anyone else to leave more comments under answers. Leaving comments doesn't solve any problems, so I really discourage it unless you're leaving technical feedback. Answers that are problematic per site rules/guidelines should be dealt with in ways other than commenting.
No, you shouldn't vote to delete code-only answers. I would also generally say that you shouldn't vote to delete incorrect answers. But I have a different opinion about "not even wrong" answers. That one falls into the latter category. It doesn't even attempt to answer the question, even though it masquerades as an answer by having a code block.
 
@CodyGray in that case, I’m not sure what lesson to take from this suspension. The obvious lesson was to comment to encourage more explanation (which I usually do when I’m on my desktop). I take your point about “not even wrong”, though I usually don’t evaluate the code for technical correctness when reviewing. Should I be?
My fear is that when my suspension is up I’ll repeat these mistakes. Is the main lesson to just edit small grammatical issues or e.g., extra indentation?
 
@JeremyCaney Why was "comment more" the "obvious lesson"? The lesson should be more of: (1) Pay more attention, actually reading the answer and the question, and evaluating whether it even attempts to answer the question. Although something like this probably couldn't be flagged as NAA, that doesn't mean it's an appropriate contribution or should stick around.
(2) Almost nothing in the review queues "Looks OK", so you probably need to do something. (3) If you aren't sure, or don't have the time to look carefully, then just "Skip".
Fundamentally, reading your other comments, I think you are confusing the guidance that is meant to be very specific to NAA flags with the general guidance for how to review.
Now, we don't generally want to delete answers simply because they're wrong, because (A) we might be wrong, too, and (B) wrong answers can still serve in an advisory capacity about what not to do. (Especially when they're recommending a common, but flawed, approach. If that isn't mentioned by answers, people will think it was forgotten and possibly leave more answers mentioning it. That's much worse. Just downvote the wrong answers instead; it is much more useful.)
 
9:30 AM
@CodyGray Yes, this is a point I’ve gotten stuck on multiple times before, and have considered inquiring about on meta. My thinking is that LQP, at least, should adhere roughly to NAA since that’s where NAA flags go. I’d expect recommend delete to closely track NAA. I take it that’s not the case.
 
Just for info, the actual review(s) that caused the second audit to be deleted were prompted by a discussion in this very room. I'm not saying that has any material effect on the merits of this present discussion, but thought I'd better point it out for 'legal reasons'.
 
Nah, not really. The reason we give the guidance that we do relating to NAA flags is mostly because mods are kinda dumb when it comes to handling NAA flags. We still want people to be able to exercise their judgment and subject-matter expertise when reviewing answers, deleting them when they think that the post is harmful or contributes nothing to the site.
@AdrianMole Good note. I would not say that it's the world's greatest audit. But it's rare that I find a system-chosen audit that is very good. However, I regularly find posts that I think would be great audits. Wouldn't it be nice if the system let me nominate posts as audits (both TP and FP)? Yes, I think that would be fantastic!
 
But then we'd need system-generated audits to audit your audtis.
 
Nope! Mods don't make mistakes.
Except when we screw things up. But even that doesn't count, because... reasons.
 
Sorry, I forgot. Must pay more attention.
 
9:35 AM
@CodyGray It checks out: "screw up" == "mistake" returns false in all programming languages I know.
 
@VLAZ did you check that in the JavaScript version that runs in IE5?
 
@rene Fair. IE5 doesn't support ==. Or strings. Or JavaScript. AFAIK, it's just a thin client connected to a box filled with hamsters whose movements generate what is shown on the screen.
 
@CodyGray Well, shit. In that case, I may well have a spotty track record after all, as I’ve deliberately tried to remove my personal judgment from the process in that effort to adhere to the NAA guidance. There are plenty of low-quality answers that I’d prefer to delete, and especially when I have some subject matter expertise. And especially when there’s already a good answer with more explanation or strong community validation. (I usually skip those.)
 
Yeah... duplicate, no-value answers are something else that it's OK to delete when reviewing.
I mean, why should review be any different from what you would do when reviewing posts brought up in here?
@VLAZ Wait, when did they get rid of the hamsters?
More importantly, what happened to the hamsters?!
 
Hamsters are considered a security risk. They are known to exploit the Rodent Trojan Misalignment.
 
9:43 AM
@CodyGray Have you heard of people saying "Don't develop for a dead platform?" It's a bit more literal in IE5's case.
 
Aww. Those poor little guys.
 
@AdrianMole IE6 replaced the box of hamsters with a box of snakes. I assume they are more secure but I'm not an expert.
 
@CodyGray I worked on an early version of MSIE. After Microsoft retired the product, I adopted the hamsters. I’ve since been using them to power my Stack Overflow reviews. THANKS A LOT HAMSTERS. (But they’re so cute.)
 
As in, you actually worked for Microsoft in the development of IE?
Or you wrote a Flash intro that had to run on IE 6?
 
I like intros.
 
9:49 AM
@E_net4thecurator Hi, I'm Cody.
 
@CodyGray Hello Cody, I'm [insert display name here].
Speaking of which, I managed to break Higgs with it.
 
@CodyGray Nah, I was in an ancillary role on the marketing side of IE3. (I mostly worked on membership systems and community software before Facebook gutted most of that market.) I’ve worked on plenty of ill-fated projects, but at least had the good sense to stay away from Flash.
 
@JeremyCaney So, you would say that you are to blame for the rise of software like Facebook?
 
@CodyGray Hi, I am glad I found you here. Can you please let me know - if you do - what is going on with comments? My comments are removed within seconds now. Do you know who to complain about that?
 
@CodyGray I actually do feel some responsibility, yes. A lot of features Facebook introduced (such as “share”, article previews, likes) I thought were really promising innovations at the time. Certainly, I could have seen myself and my colleagues taking a similar path as Facebook and being blindsided by the emergent phenomena of these features, had we been as successful. The only reason we were better is because we never reached their scale.
If nothing else, it’s been a humbling lesson for those of us who worked on software like this without foreseeing what now seems inevitable. As a product manager today, it makes me much more sensitive to thinking through these types of issues.
 
10:01 AM
@WiktorStribiżew I'm not nearly fast enough to remove someone's comments within seconds. I'm not sure what's happening. I will look at it.
OK, so... Two problems. First, you are right, a series of your very recent comments were all flag-deleted by a single user. That's definitely not OK. But the second problem is that you were trying to leave comments that don't really need to be posted, telling people to accept your answer.
 
@CodyGray Thanks, I just thought you might know if there's been some "enhancements" to SO bots, maybe some specific heuristics has been added. I observe it for several days already, and not only me.
 
If comments contain certain keywords that match a regex, they can be deleted by only a single flag. That's what happened to you.
 
@CodyGray No, I am not asking to accept my answer. I say "Please consider accepting the answer that worked best for you by clicking ✓ on the left (see How to accept SO answers) and upvoting (see How to upvote on Stack Overflow?) all answers that turned out helpful to you."
@CodyGray Besides, the OP confirmed my answer worked for them.
 
I don't think that's a useful comment. The system already informs people about accepting answers. It's their choice not to do so.
 
I'm pretty sure that "accept" is one of the trigger words for single-flag removals.
 
10:04 AM
Yeah
 
Just weirdly ironic that Wiktor's comments are being removed with the help of regex.
 
Heh
 
Guys, I never tell people to accept my answers. Once I get a comment saying "Thanks, it works", I add a comment to let user know that an answer can be accepted if it worked for them. But now, all these comments, with OP's confirmation - are deleted in the flicker of a moment.
 
Yeah, like I said, the same user is flagging these comments. In that user's defense, you are making it easy. You keep re-posting the same comment over and over, so they don't have to look very hard for them...
 
@karel there is a mistake in the link that makes this leading to a "page not found"
 
10:07 AM
I will grant that you probably aren't meaning to bully anyone with these comments, but they just seem like noise to me. That's why they are insta-deleted with a single flag.
 
@CodyGray Going back to the review suspension, I now understand where my rubric was off—thinking in terms of _NAA_—and what I need to fix in the future. I’m retraining the hamsters as we speak. I’d really like to get back into reviewing if you’d consider lifting my suspension. Otherwise, I understand, and will wait patiently for the two weeks.
 
@JeremyCaney Two weeks?! Meh. That's... on the long side.
OK, system had a bit too long of a memory there. Your last suspension was for 32 days, but it was back on April 3, 2020. I would have expected more back-off there.
 
@CodyGray Yeah. I had a few suspensions back-to-back when I first started reviewing. That was over a year and 16,000 reviews ago. But that half-life is still haunting me. If it were just a two day review I’d have licked my wounded pride, asked for feedback, but not asked for you to lift it.
 
@JeremyCaney Yes, right, OK. Let me see what I can do about that. Would you believe that I cannot at the moment find a button that allows me to lift a suspension? I have to go hunting.
 
@CodyGray Ok, that means more questions with no accept mark will be out there.
 
10:12 AM
Yes, I think we're all prepared to accept that.
 
@AdrianMole Then, I guess "That works, thanks" is also part of that super-wise regex.
 
Short comments saying little more than "thanks" are insta-deleted by flags, too, yes.
Also deleted by mods on sight.
 
@CodyGray I sure appreciate that. I’ll also be sure to write up an answer for my Meta question summarizing your feedback here and the lessons I’ve learned so that it can help future reviewers with similar confusion.
 
@JeremyCaney Kind of a mixed blessing. I've re-issued a 1-day suspension to reset the escalation of the suspension periods. Which means you'll have to wait 1 day before reviewing again. But it means that next time, you won't be suspended for 32 or 64 days or something, which I clearly don't think is appropriate for you.
 
@desertnaut It was too late to correct the broken link so I reposted it three comments down from the original broken link. The question that I'm referring to has already been closed as a duplicate.
 
10:27 AM
@CodyGray I think that’s more than fair. Thank you. Though it does mean I won’t be able to run for moderator next year. (I’m clearly not ready yet, but it is something I’ve considered doing in the future, since I enjoy the upkeep, and am really good at dealing with frustrated people.)
 
@JeremyCaney Ah! No, it doesn't! That rule only applies to real suspensions, not review suspensions.
The kind of suspensions you get in the form of private moderator messages when you do something bad, like run a sockpuppet network. You haven't gotten any of these, so, of course, you don't know what they look like. :-)
Unless you've gotten them on other sites, which I wouldn't be able to see. And that's fine, please keep your unsavory behavior contained to other sites! But it would mean that you'd be ineligible to run for mod, because the rule is suspended anywhere on the network within the past year.
 
@CodyGray Wait. You mean I went and got myself suspended for nothing, and now have no excuse not to invite public scrutiny and humiliation next year, all for the unlikely reward of unpaid labor and extra responsibility? That’s bogus. I’ll have to try harder.
(Thank you for your service.)
 
Sometimes, out-smarting Cody on the sarcasm/snark front can induce real suspensions!
 
@JeremyCaney That's correct; you're cleared for the humiliation treatment.
@AdrianMole Or real votes for moderator. Worked for Ryan M.
 
10:36 AM
{ignores snarky riposte}
 
That's OK, you still have time to work on your campaign platform.
 
If all those who have either threatened to run, or have been encouraged to run, in the next election, do so, we're in for some fun!
 
I can't wait.
 
11:06 AM
 
11:44 AM
@CodyGray Sorry to bother, but what was the problem with my comment at stackoverflow.com/q/69767420/3832970?
 
@WiktorStribiżew you deleted that one yourself, it looks like!
 
@CodyGray Really? I am going crazy :) (I am all red now...)
 
@WiktorStribiżew Looks like it to me. I suppose you decided to promote it to an answer.
Haha, no worries!
 
@WiktorStribiżew Well, when you've fully gone crazy, consider applying to become a Room Owner! ;-)
3
 
12:00 PM
Morning
 
 
1 hour later…
2:01 PM
 
3:04 PM
 
3:20 PM
It's another day that ends in Y, so naturally I've found another old question with a bunch of really bad/non-answers... i.stack.imgur.com/q90sb.png sigh
 
you mean a very popular highly useful/valuable question with great answers?
 
@KevinB with one good answer
 
i... dunno about that
> Changing color works, just not font-weight.
 
@TylerH I've had some success getting poor answers cleaned up with a mod flag referencing this answer on meta. I don't do it nearly as often as I'd like to, for fear of wearing their patience thin! meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/284026/…
 
@miken32 I'm very close to 20k rep, so I'm basically just waiting until I hit that. Then I will delete vote them all
with the occasional request here, perhaps, for the worst ones
but yes I have mod-flagged some positively-scored bad answers before with some success in getting them deleted
 
3:30 PM
should stackoverflow.com/q/69028830/4826457 be closed? From the answer, it looks like a support issue...
 
well, it's not a programming question, so,
 
3:56 PM
@SurajRao I made the mistake of opening the cloudflare tag
Bring your shovels to [cloudflare] -api is:q
 
That tag needs burnination
 
Nah, rename and cleanup may be enough.
 
@Braiam rename to what? ?
 
4:17 PM
@rene cloudflare-api :D
 
M--
4:27 PM
@TylerH shall we race to 20k? lol
 
@Braiam underwhelming ... ;)
 
@M-- Sure, why not? :-) You are about 180 rep behind me but seem to answer more frequently so there's a good chance you'll get there before I do!
I get an OK amount of passive upvotes from existing answers but spend a good portion of that rep "income" on bad answer downvotes I see each day. Oy vey i.stack.imgur.com/Xovur.png
 
4:52 PM
@rene Despite what it may seems I prefer boring and predictable.
 
5:14 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but accepted answers cannot be deleted by their authors, right? Can they be deleted by non-diamonds?
 
They can't be deleted by their authors.
 
I'm not 100% sure, but I think downvoted accepted answers can be deleted by three ordinary users. But I may be confused.
 
@VLAZ They can be deleted by 3 ordinary delete votes.
 
Also see Makyen's chat message: "It's not the fact that it's accepted that requires moderator intervention. It's that the post has a positive score. If the answer has a negative score, then it can be delete-voted by >20k users or deleted from review, regardless of it being accepted, or not."
 
Can the poster cast one of the three delete votes?
 
5:17 PM
Now that's a good question.
 
Shall I post it as a question on Meta?
 
@IanCampbell OK, thanks. I saw a del-vote on an accepted (negatively scored) answer. And I thought that wasn't possible, since authors couldn't delete, I thought nobody could.
 
I needz da reps.
 
@AdrianMole I can...science it, if you want.
 
Do you have any negatively scored accepted answers? I don't think I do.
 
5:18 PM
I probably do ...
 
Now you can even retract it after you're done science-ing
 
Nope. I am unable to del-vote my own negatively scored accepted answer.
 
... my very first ever answer. Accepted and 1 downvote. Clicking the delete button brings up a pink popup: You cannot delete this accepted answer.
 
@AdrianMole Ha! Mine is at -2 and has 1 del-vote already. I'm better than you!
 
5:21 PM
Hmmm... maybe we can take care of that for you.
 
Well, it's also not my first ever answer.
 
@AdrianMole Mod flag. We'll generally delete accepted answers as long as you were the one who posted it
 
So, nett rep. of +11 is nice; nett rep. of +13 is unlucky for some?
@Machavity You're assuming I want it deleted.
 
That negatively scored answer of yours is a lot better than I was expecting. Ha.
 
@AdrianMole I just glanced at your comment and assumed. My bad
 
5:23 PM
Meh.
The question has a score of -4 and 1 delete vote already ...
... now 2 delete votes.
 
It's the SOCVR effect.
 
AKA The Facebook Effect?
The second DV was from me, BTW.
 
Looking at a lot of the questions I answered as a brand new user, I would now downvote a lot of them...
 
Sorry if this is a bit vague - but, then again, so is your question! Eek - did I really write that?
 
BRB suspending Adrian for being a troll :P
 
5:28 PM
I'd edit that out, but it'd bump a terrible question.
 
@AdrianMole OK, in fairness, I do find it funny.
 
Sometimes it's best not to revisit the past.
 
I was new. I was expecting to be the newest, most bestest expert on Windows graphics in the whole shop. And I had this wonderful thing called MFC, which nobody on Stack would ever have even heard about.
 
5:42 PM
Anyone know how to get to one's "Custom Filters" on a mobile?
 
@AdrianMole "with great difficulty"
 
hehe
 
I actually can't remember. I do remember looking for them multiple times. Let me try again.
Ah got it. 1. Make sure you're on the full site (bottom of the page, there is a link) 2. Go to questions (from the hamburger menu on the top left) 3. In the sorting button things, (Newest, Active) there is More with a dropdown. You can find your custom filters there.
 
Bear in mind that I'm still learning the basics of how to use the dang thing.
@VLAZ Thanks. Once I got the "full site" link, things started to become less unclear.
 
6:01 PM
@AdrianMole I really don't know why it's still not the default.
 
@VLAZ Very small text.
 
I mean the default mode of the site. I've found that basically any time anybody has a question about visiting SO/SE on mobile, the first step is always "switch to the full site". I've seen this mentioned by staff as well. And the mobile views have been deprecated, too. Yet the site still opens with the mobile view by default, rather than using the responsive design.
It's doubly baffling as the responsive site is slowly being converted to just only be a larger version of a mobile site.
 
6:18 PM
@AdrianMole Pinch gesture temporarily and font size change in phone settings permanently could take care of it, right?
 
@Vega Meh. I have a big phone! :)
 
Oooh...
 
Any Pythonistas about who can help with this. I'm happy to edit the English text, if it's a valid criticism of (and improvement on) the other answers. But does it offering anything new, really?
... just seems to me like they skip the first iteration, cuz that won't be odd. Which is already in another answer.
 
The question asks already from 1 to n
 
Yeah. So the new answer I linked is really a comment on one of the others?
 
6:24 PM
@halfer But is that programming question?
@AdrianMole Seems yes
 
@Vega Actually, maybe it's saying that the code in the question is wrong because they don't lose the first iteration. Grrr ... think I'll have to skip it.
... it's in Late Answers if any Python Peoples want to review it.
 
@Vega It's a fair objection - however I don't think Server Fault will take it, and I am not sure Super User feels right to me - Apache is developer-oriented software
 
It looks also too broad and OB?
 
it will be just at useful to someone looking for that info as an apple pie recipe question would be to someone looking for an apple pie recipe
 
@AdrianMole return [x for x in range(0, n+1) if x % 2 != 0] line is in the answer, not in the question
 
6:32 PM
@Vega See - that's why I needed to Skip. Just 2 too many off-by-one errors.
 
I think I'm still a bit code-blind with Python. If that were C, I'd have seen it all at the very first glance.
 
@Vega but they want to know which one is "best" for their scenario, not what the difference between them are
 
@KevinB If it was a code, then it would be for code review site. Here it is OB. Then if you make it less OB, the dup is ok. I say let's leave it close (sorry for the double ping)
 
i was mostly being facetious
 
7:28 PM
 
@halfer this appears to be primarily opinion-based
 
i don't think it is, there's only one method that would have the least impact while still doing the needed job
but... it's still, not programming,
some form of server management/administration?
 
8:00 PM
 
@TylerH I see why you say that, but "best" here is possibly a false steer - the OP is asking how to do something (or, more specifically, whether stopping+starting a server will lose traffic - which is answerable). I suspect the question won't successfully reopen anyway, and the answer is essentially contained now in the comments, so 🤷‍
 
8:22 PM
Hm, someone is going through years-old questions about low-level programming concepts (e.g. non-debugging questions) and flagging them all for the CV queue, many by the same OP
 
@TylerH You suspect a serial voter?
 
@VLAZ Well no, unless you mean "user targeting" by "serial voting"
They were flags, not votes, and they were for "close" anyway, not up/down
 
If someone is targeting another user with CVs, mod flag
 
It wasn't until I had seen like 10 or so old questions in the queue that I realized several were asked by the same user.
 
IMO, serial is serial, regardless if it's up/down or close.
 
8:30 PM
@Machavity Can mods see who raised a close flag?
 
That would be interesting, considering that most cv's need a consensus.
 
@VLAZ Well, some mods encourage user targeting for reasons like cleaning up off-topic questions
 
BTW, remember that on small tags, the pool of users is pretty small
 
So... I dunno
 
It's pretty common that two users end up voting for each other if they monitor the same small tag.
 
8:31 PM
@TylerH That one is tricky. We can see everything except up/down votes in the timeline (even if it's still pending), but we don't have any native tooling for patterns in other types of votes
 
@Braiam In this case they were fairly large tags, like "C" and "Assembly" and such
 
Would take involving a CM to check CV targeting
 
I'll mod flag one now for you @Machavity
OK, flag submitted
 
@TylerH I'll take a look at it in a bit
 
8:55 PM
Should I retract flag on this one now? stackoverflow.com/a/69774568/1839439
It's just a bad copy from the link
 
@Dharman I'd go with retracting the flag and making a del-pls.
 
@Dharman I made it at least clear it is a quote
 
9:13 PM
So, I'm looking at this review. I know it's an audit but the reason given, opinion-based, seems a valid reason for the question.
 
Heh. I skipped, so I guess I'm chaotic good.
 
Wish more stores sold good D&D shirts...
 
@TylerH I saw shirt with a d20 with the 20 on top and a sign "That's how I roll". I'm not sure I've seen other good D&D shirts.
Although, in honesty, I've also not seen many D&D shirts. Not my choice of attire to shop for.
 
9:28 PM
@CodyGray: Thank you again for all of your time last night reviewing my suspension. I've summarized and excerpted your most relevant advice as an answer on my Meta thread so, hopefully, others can learn from my mistakes.
 
9:42 PM
@VLAZ Agreed; baffling to me as well. I've never used anything but the "full site" on mobile. The other site is, as you mentioned, deprecated, featureless, and inferior in nearly every way.
@JeremyCaney Thanks! Now let's see how many people disagree with you, me, and Jeanne combined.
Also, I noticed that I failed to capitalize the "(a)", but capitalized the "(B)". :-(
@DalijaPrasnikar Incidentally, cc @JeremyCaney, this is a good example of something that someone with competence in the subject-matter can reasonably delete, either from within or outside of the queues. Dalija was perhaps a bit too brief in her delete reason (just because an answer is incorrect is not sufficient to delete it), but that can be forgiven. The real reason to delete it is because it's an extremely low quality answer which is also incorrect.
Thus, it adds no value, even to the extent wrong answers might add value as a precautionary tale of what not to do and/or sparking an illuminating correction in the comments.
Ooops... Aaand, forgot that you aren't 10k+, so you can't even see this example. That'd make it less useful. Here is a screen capture: i.stack.imgur.com/8tcTs.png
This isn't necessarily an example of "not even wrong", but still nevertheless an example of a case where it makes sense to delete. (Yet, would not make sense to NAA flag.)
 
@VLAZ I prefer t-shirts, and new ones are always nice :-) I've seen a few about alignment, e.g. "Chaotic neutral: Might save your life, might steal your wife" and other similar pithy remarks
but not much else
 
Have you tried checking on the Internet? I hear there's a lot of stuff for sale there.
 
Well, there may be some on those t-shirt only websites but there's so much blatant IP theft there that I just avoid them out of habit
though yes I'm mostly speaking of retail shopping
 
Meh, I think the Internet is a hoax. Think about it - dozens of people at being connected? Doesn't make much sense.
 
there's simply not enough string for that to work
 
9:59 PM
@TylerH More seriously - you can try RedBubble. They are on the more legit side from what I've seen.
 
hm...
 
@CodyGray just out of curiosity, do you mind me asking what happened with this "project"? meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/404799/…
 
@desertnaut I'm sure it's my fault. I've been very busy, and dropped many, many things on the floor. Can you quickly remind me what I was supposed to be doing there?
 
@CodyGray Actually, you did capitalize the "(A)" and the "(B)". I'm afraid I misquoted you. (I had started to convert it to an ordered list, then second guessed myself because each line was so short, and got sloppy in my fix.) I apologize for that. I've fixed it in the answer.
 
@JeremyCaney Oops! I just assumed you'd copy-pasted it, and that it must have been my mistake. :-)
 
10:02 PM
@CodyGray not sure about you personally; the idea was to give away our off-topic ML questions to Cross Validated, and the community seemed not to object
 
@desertnaut You also checked with Cross Validated? If both communities are on-board, then you will need a CM to get involved.
 
I'm asking you as you were involved, at least in the thread
 
I clicked some buttons. You are being too generous with "involved". :-)
 
@CodyGray no, I was against it :D
 
Haha. Then... why are you asking??
 
10:04 PM
@CodyGray I said, out of curiosity
never mind... :)
 
Things don't happen by default. Someone has to push them through.
 
Yes, for good or bad
 
@CodyGray Thanks for the screenshot and the example. That's really useful for me.
 
For the good stuff, some extra pushes are often needed. For the bad stuff, the existing system works well. :-)
 
@CodyGray I was very surprised when I first discovered that :D
 
10:06 PM
@JeremyCaney Sure thing. I thought it might be. Unfortunately, it brings up that other sticky problem... subjectivity. And, in my experience, programmers hate that.
 
@CodyGray: Indeed. (Which is funny, because so much of programming is an art, and hardly deterministic.) And, yet, it's also the reason I've avoided reviewing questions, because I find they are so much more subjective.
 
 
1 hour later…
11:19 PM
Errm, this is complete nonsense, right? stackoverflow.com/a/3246025/2943403
 
@mickmackusa In that it's an absolutely awful idea from a data-validation perspective, perhaps, but I think the idea is that you'd encode the values as colon-separated values, and then explode them back into an array on the server.
 
... passing two value attributes as if case-sensitivity matter. <OPTION VALUE="1" value="1:2:3:4"> 1-4
and no closing </option>.
...and 4 upvotes!
 
oh, uh, yeah, that was probably a copy-paste error and they meant to not have that first VALUE="1"
...and the closing tag
People definitely upvote answers that had a useful idea even if the code's clearly wrong. I see this in Android fairly often. Code that there's no way could have been used but still highly upvoted because with a minor tweak it would be.
 
super misleading to researchers
 
Yeah, agreed. I don't have the confidence to fix that one, because I definitely don't know HTML well enough, but it might be worth an SME fixing if they're confident it preserves the intent of the answer.
 
11:35 PM
@mickmackusa This was a typo.
 
@Dharman Nitpick: you may want to explain in your edit message why you changed the code
Also flag the comment if you haven't already.
 
I changed the edit summary
 
Nice, looks great.
 
@mickmackusa Aren't many closing tags optional? I believe <option> is an inline element so the closing tag is optional, but I think @TylerH would know more about this.
For example, you don't close <p> and <li> tags
 
11:53 PM
@Dharman interesting, you are right. stackoverflow.com/a/38184305/2943403 I've never not closed an option tag in any of my applications.
 

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