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14:01
@JoeWatkins oh, right. I read that post already
forgot about it. thanks for reminding me
link to rasmus' stuff in there
4 messages moved to bin
@JoeWatkins yepp, I've missed his talk at FrosCon unfortunately. Was on a Sunday and I was only there on Saturday
@Gordon i think you don't know how to fix isn't that?
@maddog Now you're just getting pathetic.
@maddog yes, that must be it. It's absolutely impossible that it's your behavior because what can ever be wrong with being a help vampire?
14:06
?????????????????????///
@maddog What @Gordon is trying to say is that any and all help that you even got so far is all voluntarily given. No one has an obligation to help you, so you can't expect to get preferential treatment nor start complaining if you don't get the help you need. Ignoring earlier advice and continue saying your problem still isn't fixed doesn't help either.
@Gordon @JoeWatkins you guys are talking about the file cache option? (search "opcache.file_cache" here)
yeah that stuff @Florian
14:10
@FlorianMargaine yes, that's what is mentioned in the linked blog post, too
@Oldskool by y ma codez no working ?
though what I was thinking of was more like doing something like javac does for java files, e.g. compile my app to opcodes first, then deploy and run that, completely bypassing the opcache
yeah I read, you could deploy them ... the only issue I might be able to see with that is architecture mismatch
true, probably makes sense to do that compile step on the target machine then
So, terminology questions are fun:
                               x
┌──────────────────────────────┴──────────────────────────────┐
.menu > .item, .menu > .item.active, .menu > .item.active:focus
└─────┬──────┘         └─────┬─────┘
      y                      z
It's all a "selector", and they're all "selectors", but is there any terminology to disambiguate these from one another?
14:14
there's no easily accessible interface to these functions, they aren't exported, so we can't whip up an extension/program to precompile an application ... I think it might be cool too ...
it's only a problem if you compile on 32bit and deploy on 64bit, and I can't imagine there is anyone left doing that really ...
Would 32-bit/64-bit be the only problem, or could there be discrepancies between PHP versions or between OS?
not really OS, but versions would be another problem
might be a big problem, we make no effort to keep vm compatible between patch versions ....
Abe
Abe
@DanLugg yes, but not official terminology, afaik
still if you were prepared for those restrictions ... don't we try to develop and deploy on the same versions anyway to avoid surprises ?
The good news on that front is that servers are moving exclusively towards 64 bit. EL7, Win 2012, and I think Debian 8 are all 64 bit only
14:22
maybe directory separators would be the only thing I can think of that is OS specific, and they'd be present in compiled opcodes
@Joe - we do with our own code, but if we're using 3rd party libraries or frameworks then we'd need to compile/build an entire set of bytecode files for all dependencies too
you don't need exports either, you could use the php api
@Gordon Interesting, I think I've sorted the terms :-)
Thanks!
Abe
Abe
@Gordon TIL
14:27
x = selector group
y = selector
z = simple selector
> Regarding ^^
It says selectors are comprised of simple-selectors in a combinator expression, and I'm guessing that multi-class selectors are still simple-selectors: as in, .foo.bar.qux
user895378
morning folks o/
‾\_/‾\o
@DanLugg Isn't that already a combination of the simple selectors .foo, .bar and .qux?
@kelunik See, I'm interpreting it as not; as there's no combinator
Just like .foo[name="bar"] is a combination of .foo and [name="bar"].
14:31
.foo > .bar is, but .foo.bar is not.
@kelunik But it's not a combinator expression; it's just increased specificity
It's both.
Yea?
@DanLugg there is also a BNF further down in the specs. Might also help shed some light. I didnt read it through though
It's exactly how you combine expressions, but yes, it's only possible with simple selectors.
@bwoebi Well...
14:34
@LeviMorrison … mh?
He basically says "no" but "yes".
… in a way.
@kelunik According to the grammar, .foo.bar is a "simple selector sequence"
... [ HASH | class | attrib | pseudo | negation ]+ ...
@MadaraUchiha quick question: I used to have the Blue Room as a chat fav. Since I can no longer enter it but also haven't unfaved it, do you get an access request each time I hit the rejoin fav rooms button?
However, arguably, it's also a selector when a "selector" is comprised of only one "simple selector sequence"
simple_selector_sequence [ combinator simple_selector_sequence ]*
14:37
moin @rdlowrey
If that's what you meant by "both" @kelunik
Not that I've seen, @Gordon
@MadaraUchiha clicked it a minute ago. so I guess it doesnt show then. thanks.
@DanLugg I meant "selector sequence" with "combine expressions", "combinators" are actually just things like >, + and ~
combinator
  /* combinators can be surrounded by whitespace */
  : PLUS S* | GREATER S* | TILDE S* | S+
  ;
14:51
9
A: Correct terms and words for sections and parts of selectors

BoltClock What is the correct term for the sections of CSS selectors that are separated by commas? Currently, these are simply called selectors, which really doesn't sit well with me. In future, they'll be better-defined as complex selectors. The entire comma-separated list is known as a selector lis...

x is a complex selector
y is also a complex selector - just part of another larger complex selector
z is a compound selector
CSS sucks :)
5
@Gordon agreed
@Gordon You forgot the illustration :P
Any Docker guys ever get "FATA[0002] Could not reach any registry endpoint"?
@Fabor nope. sorry. not yet.
@Machavity :)
@Fabor but seems like the path to your private registry is incorrect
14:58
@DanLugg sorry I didn't see the commas. x is a list of three complex selectors. y is a complex selector. z is a compound selector
Which is weird because it worked fine yesterday.
@BoltClock Ah, okay; thanks :-)
cc @Abe
@Fabor maybe some timeout? connectivity issues?
Perhaps. Someone mentioned aws having issues in the past somewhere.
15:01
Should i use ATTR_EMULATE_PREPARES?
user image
8
Best. Coaster. Ever.
@NeelIon Only if you database is physically a long distance from the machine you are calling it from.....so no.
@DaveRandom LOL
@Danack thanks man :)
posted on December 16, 2015 by nlecointre

/* by Eric */

Abe
Abe
15:09
throwing it out there: someone should write an updated php internals book. would instabuy it
@Abe what's wrong with the current one?
Abe
Abe
rofl
if someone is going to put in that much effort, they should wait until a later 7 release
painfully out of date now @Gordon
15:20
@JoeWatkins why?
I'm not having the impression Dmitry is planning any fundamental structure rewrite again
well no, but such a book should have a big ruddy chapter on a JIT, and I think it's coming ...
@JoeWatkins there will most certainly not be a JIT for 7.1.
well no, but a 7 release, almost certain there will be ...
it mostly already exists ...
what does already exist?
the jit
15:22
the zend-jit project?
well, I'd certainly shed some money for that book, too
@JoeWatkins anyway, is there any point in waiting? Whether they write the articles about the fundamental structures now or later, does it matter?
well if it's going to be online, not so much, but I like actual paper books ...
bit difficult to add stuff after if we're talking about an actual book, if we're talking about a website, then yeah sure ...
@Machavity you sure it's an internals book? title sounds more like Java for PHP developers.
15:31
@bwoebi I see you finished the stack/frame modifications
@JoeWatkins already a week ago, just made the PR today so that Dmitry can comment inline
MY PR STILL WASNT MURGED! SKANDALOUS!
@bwoebi yeah, I read it ...
mostly good ...
> this is extremely terrible!
hehe
@Gordon where ?
Would have been nice if that was just fixed in 7...
15:40
what the fuck
my god like vcs powers have gone ...
@JoeWatkins And I agree with him!
@JoeWatkins hmm?
@bwoebi can you merge gordons patch, when I try I get a bunch of vm changes in diff, liveliness related stuff, and news changes ... fuck git ...
2 days ago, by Joe Watkins
I'm basically a god of version control right now ...
@JoeWatkins looks like you tried to do a merge from a PR based on master into PHP 7.0?
I did try to do that first, then I tried to do it in master
15:43
so I'll just leave that here sebpearce.com/bullshit
@Gordon this patch should go into master because of the small tooling break?
@bwoebi I don't know where it should go to.
I dunno why I suck so hard at git .. it makes me feel so dumb, that's why I don't get involved in PR's normally ... it's so annoying to have PR's open so long
probably safest for master actually
okay, going to merge into master to be safe
\o/
I am php-src committer then
15:46
@Gordon yes, a t-shirt, and cape, will be on the way in the post ...
@JoeWatkins I wish :(
I didn't have it :(
@Gordon @JoeWatkins done
@JoeWatkins what? No PHP7 Elephpant … err… more than I had hoped for
@bwoebi yay! thanks.
@Gordon I wish too
although... I have a black elephpant
@FlorianMargaine I have two. amsterdam phant and sf2 phant
15:48
Abe
Abe
guys, a very simple php7 c extension i can use as reference? any idea? :B
@bwoebi originally wanted to say "got"
@Gordon sf 10 years for me
@Abe there's one or two in the /ext directory ...
I don't have a black one ... they are cool ...
@FlorianMargaine I guess they are the same ones then. got it from the sf conf earlier this month
@bwoebi thnx
Abe
Abe
15:50
@JoeWatkins they are all too complex for me to understand them :\
@Gordon yeah this one
Abe
Abe
@JoeWatkins lol, i'm watching the video right now :D
the only thing is it doesn't use properties @Abe, so if you're using properties there are some changes to make ... you can just holla when you come to it ...
I'm still trying to track down anyone that has a spare sf2 elephpant they're willing to part with
15:51
@MarkBaker only got this one. sorry.
@Abe good :)
I don't know of any others written for the purpose of show and tell, that's probably the only one at the moment ...
Abe
Abe
it's gold! and now i can even copy paste! (hard to do that from a youtube video)
going painfully slow because i'm trying to understand everything i read... i'm thinking that's the wrong approach :B should just write stuff, build, ship like there's no tomorrow
meh. I usually try to not copy paste and reinvent the wheel to actually understand things. then I proceed to using the libraries that actually already do it.
lotsa blue guys around this morning. are we generating that much flags ?! p
hmm, regarding internals: could use the new Stack Overflow documentation site when it hits GA
user924016
aah home from work =]
Mornings 11
16:06
O/ @RonniSkansing
user924016
\o
Morning @RonniSkansing
user924016
=) I am really looking forward to a small xmas vacation
@RonniSkansing Again??
apparently, falling asleep at your desk with your eyes partially open is hereditary ...
2
user924016
16:09
PeeHaa yep, when you work with Yii, you need a lot of vacation
@JoeWatkins hehehe
how old is he?
yeah pretty funny, it's from years ago, he's about 2 there ... 6 now ...
the facebook memories thing showed it to me ...
@RonniSkansing :P
Abe
Abe
@JoeWatkins zend_object_value doesn't exist in php7 right?
@Abe right
user924016
16:11
btw how are you, still able to make a living yourself? @PeeHaa
Abe
Abe
[insert ralph "i'm learnding!" video]
@RonniSkansing Yeah. Although also time for a vacation or two
@Abe hehehe
Abe
Abe
youtube.com/watch?v=PKg2ZzPKl2M just can't not link it
Hey. SQL related question. If I order by a certain column and have two rows that have the same value, is there a way I can select a secondary column for them to sort by?
@Purify order by col1, col2?
16:13
oh, that works?
well that was simpler than I thought. Thanks @Gordon !
@Purify you're welcome
@JoeWatkins That thing is scary sometimes. makes you realize how fast time flies
Abe
Abe
solved :B
user924016
What did you make?
Abe
Abe
holy macaroni it works
16:22
@Abe now add cheese
Does JetBrains WebStorm consume less RAM than the PHPStorm?
Abe
Abe
@RonniSkansing learnding C
user924016
ah very cool. I have tried and failed.. or atleast stopped at some point
@Leigh there is an initial commit at github.com/amphp/websocket … To use: $ws = yield \Amp\websocket(new class implements \Amp\Websocket { ... }, new Handshake("ws://foo.bar/example"));
@dimoff It's the same engine so probably not. Do you have less than 8GB of ram? If so turning on "power save mode" might be appropriate (though reduces the usefulness of the IDE).
16:24
I have one machine with 8 and 4 respectively
One 8 and one 4
@Danack I think the latest version actually use less insane with mem consumption @dimoff
does anybody work with satis?
composer satis
or toran proxy ?
Abe
Abe
i'm probably missing something though because the thing gets compiled but nothing appears in userland :B
printf is your friend.
16:40
@underscore I use satis internally at work
i'm gonna use it for the module based application architecture
Awesome screenshot incoming....
user image
13
user924016
yeah =] hehe
@Jimbo awesome… indeed :-D
Abe
Abe
aw, still no worky
user895378
16:53
awesome
Abe
Abe
warning C4047: 'function': 'zval *' differs in levels of indirection from 'zval **' wat
@rdlowrey such enthusiasm, you're now famous :P
Abe
Abe
@Jimbo link to your talk?
Abe
Abe
found it
17:04
That's mental, I actually look professional
Abe
Abe
ahahaha
also andrea's is up?
posted on December 16, 2015 by nlecointre

/* by tresorclub */

@Abe Not yet, think hers is next
Apart from mine, there are some really awesome talks from there (I enjoyed the job queues and workers one)
Abe
Abe
will watch yours later this evening :P
@LeviMorrison welp. isn't this enough to define an interface? the thing gets compiled but the interface is not available in userland
zend_class_entry tmp_ce;
INIT_CLASS_ENTRY(tmp_ce, "Augend", augend_functions);
augend_ce = zend_register_internal_interface(&tmp_ce);
augend_ce->interface_gets_implemented = implement_augend;
\o/ Jimbo finally your video is out..
17:23
@Jimbo YOUR VIDEO IS U- oh
@Jimbo SCREAMING
@AnmolRaghuvanshiVersion1.0 You're wearing the hat wrong
I think it has to be down-side
:P
I know sajad but thats looks more funny to me
moin
@AnmolRaghuvanshiVersion1.0 agreed, it seems more funny
Hi guys. How to allow external access on XAMPP using mac? I am trying to test my iOS app on my phone, my website backend on my laptop within the same network but my mac isn't reachable in my local network. IF i host xampp on windows all works fine... How to?
17:36
hi all, I need to create an ecommerce website with product with editable price in front by customer ( and only one product to sell which will be virtual), is there an ecommerce framework / cms that someone can recommend?
thanks
@BoA456 edit the configuration to listen to all ips.
@SuperNoob where do i find that configuration? i googled and checked the httpd-conf but here isn't anyhting
@BoA456 There should be a line like 127.0.0.1:80 change it to *:80 -- google is your friend here
I'm not awesome with apache, I'm used to nginx, so I'm not sure
Wait, Xammp? there's a button to open config file I think
wait, im checking it
ok, i found the complete config file now
searching for 127.0.0.1:80 now
@SuperNoob i only found the line "Listen 80" there is no explizit listening to "127.0.0.1:80" still it doesn't work to connect to mac but works like a charm to connect to mac..
17:43
@BoA456 can you visit localhost on that computer?
@SuperNoob sure i can access localhost on my mac, from my mac. All my webapps run easily. no problem. Just accessing them from my iPhone doesn't work. neither in safari nor via my app i programmed
how are you trying to visit the mac on your phone? Ip?
@SuperNoob i went to preferences -> network, copied the local ip address from there which is something like 192.168.178.22. Then i compiled my local app for development with that ip. Also simply accessing that ip in safari doesn't work
Well it's a trial-and-error thing. Keep google'ing and check all settings. It's not really something anyone can walk you through because there are a ton of unknowns with your personal situation. Plus, you'll learn something while figuring it out.
@SuperNoob :S Thanky anyway
well i am getting an NSURLErrorDomain with "timed out" ^^
17:56
There is no way to send an IP packet manually via PHP?
@bwoebi What crazy things are you doing there?
@NikiC trying to spoof an IP address… wanted to do it via PHP, but if that doesn't work, I'll access the primitives via python…
@NikiC btw. what exactly is the forth $address parameter doing on php.net/stream_socket_sendto ?
@MadaraUchiha Maybe I didn't put it across well but I was inferring one of the main positives you gain from it
@Jimbo Yeah
@bwoebi no idea
18:01
@Andrea SCREAMMM
Also "Automatic dependency injection can handle the object graph for you instead of the framework"
Shouldn't it be the framework that does this?
(I mean, that's literally the framework's job)
I showed how frameworks can do it, but I'm pretty anti 'full stack' framework and more component liking
@NikiC I hate navigating through the stream layer APIs :-(
So it would be a component that can handle it not the FW
@Jimbo Oh, don't get me wrong, me too.
But if the framework doesn't handle the DI for you, what's the point of the framework anyway
I'm not talking about crapware like CodeIgniter and CakePHP
18:04
I got my main points across though :-)
@Jimbo Oh, yeah, absolutely. The talk is very good.
Current frameworks don't handle DI, really - they offer service locators :P
Or the long winded register all the things way
@MadaraUchiha well, frameworks are there to "give architecture"
@tereško No, frameworks are there to make my life easier.
Java's Spring, with all its faults, definitely makes my life a lot easier in many senses.
18:07
@MadaraUchiha you are confusing the creators intention with how people use frameworks
@tereško I honestly don't give a flying duck how people use frameworks
I care about how much time, effort and money they can save me (and my organization)
good for you
@tereško Don't you?
@tereško What do you care about when using a library/framework then?
18:10
that's an invalid question
@tereško How so?
you assume I care about using frameworks
besides, did you really think it through:
3 mins ago, by Madara Uchiha
@tereško I honestly don't give a flying duck how people use frameworks
3 mins ago, by Madara Uchiha
I care about how much time, effort and money they can save me (and my organization)
that's what an oblivious project manager would say
@tereško I don't see any other arguments, really. It all eventually comes down to how much headache writing code gives me.
If there's a library that can alleviate some of the headache (because it's well tested and trusted and solves a particularly nasty pain), then I'd use it.
Or cost
@MadaraUchiha that's actually a completely different argument
18:13
If the library only adds complexity, pain, or headache, I would not.
@MadaraUchiha 3 years ago when I started out I heard someone talk and I learned so much and was so inspired that afterwards I told him how I want to be in his shoes helping people learn. I had someone come up to me afterwards and say how it really made him want to do more research on the topic and it was really helpful and he wants to speak at a conference on what he cares about some time. I felt like the circle was complete :D
@tereško It's not, really. Time, effort and money are all headache factories.
@Jimbo Heh, I remember when you first stepped into this room
I am way too hungry to participate
18:14
@tereško Go eat some pizza
Or something
because for some reason I am really angry at what you wrote, but I dont really find any of it objectionable
heh
I just want to argue .. or preferably beat up someone
/me needs food
@tereško I provide services in exchange for currency.
@Jimbo does Auryn allow for a combination of configuration and code? Say, I want a lot of default configs, but conditionally load different objects in different environments?
@tereško You sound like the code equivalent of a football lout right now :P
18:17
when I am hungry, I get easily irritable
Also, after PHP, I got the habit of wrapping nearly all of the libraries I use with my own decorators
There's a snickers advert in here somewhere.
I took that habit with me to JavaScript and it saved my ass more than once when I wanted to get rid of lodash or jQuery.
@Fabor all the advertisements won't make it taste less like shit
lol
18:18
besides, since I dont have a TV, I dont really get exposed to food advertisements
@MadaraUchiha yeah, teresko tried to get me to give up the bastard :P
@Jimbo I think it's a beautiful thing. I remember the kind of nooby questions you've asked when you first joined
And here you are delivering a rather advanced talk like a pro, in a conference.
Well done!
Still asking them and proud!
@MadaraUchiha well you could use an abstract factory, and tell Auryn to use the correct factory for the given environment. That's how you set it up to use it though
@Jimbo tip for next talk: When someone asks you a question, repeat it before answering.
You have a mic, they do not.
I love that, on every talk that mentions reflection, there's someone who pipes up to say "But reflection is very slow", no... it... really isn't....
It's several orders of magnitude faster than database I/O, so if you have that in your app, reflection really isn't your bottleneck.
moin
@MadaraUchiha I see you've become mod. Congrats.
18:33
@Leri Yes, I have. Thanks :)
Has anyone here had to turn down 5 months project? It feel f top lol
@Jimbo now I just have to wait for PHPNW to release my talk video :(
Abe
Abe
internals around? would you mind welping me with this? github.com/WesNetmo/php-popov/blob/master/popov.c i could compile it but the interface is not available in userland. what am i doing wrong?
@Abe ah, I see this is the source code to @NikiC
Abe
Abe
lol
(P)hp (OP)erator (OV)erloading
18:39
@Abe what do you mean by "the interface is not available in userland"?
Abe
Abe
Fatal error: Interface 'Augend' not found in
i don't notice errors about it during compilation, i'm getting the dll out of it and gets normally loaded by php
must be something i'm missing to actually enable the extension
it's probably about thread safety, i'm compiling that (i guess)
using php as apache module
thanks for looking at it, brb in 10 min
@Abe Did you restart the server?
Abe
Abe
@LeviMorrison of course i did, lol :B
18:59
If you got Spotify, you have to drop everything NAOW and listen to play.spotify.com/album/7vHHpcOnYCjZhYq0caS1qE
3
@Gordon If you didn't get Spotify, you should get it for 1€ for 3 months. I think the offer the same thing as last year currently.
@Abe Is it in php -m?
@kelunik I got a premium account. thinking about upgrading to family
Abe
Abe
@NikiC no idea what that means
@NikiC no, it's shared
If it's not in -m you did not load the extension
Add -dextension=pwd/modules/abc.so
Abe
Abe
19:08
you mean in php.ini ?
extension = php_popov.dll
of course i did it
Wut dll
Abe
Abe
yeah, trying it on windows
You're on your own then
Abe
Abe
lol :(
it must be something simple
why would you do such a horrible thing as compiling php on windows?
Abe
Abe
19:10
have you checked config.w32?
@NikiC because i'm a bad person
i need to learn one thing at once. can't do linux c and php internals in one stint :B
it takes me ages to do anything in linux
My wifey smoked too many cigarettes last night (a non-smoker, she was tipsy) and now feels like a puddle of ass. Is there any cigarette-hangover cure/relief anyone knows of?
Abe
Abe
lot of water @DanLugg
That's what I told her.
Abe
Abe
flavored with earl gray, perhaps? :B
lol, I told her that too, I think.
Abe
Abe
19:17
^ the most english thing i ever said
Hi all. How do I need to escape various characters to make this work?

find . -name '*.php' -type f -exec sed -i 's|require("$incDir/header.php")|require("$incDir/header.php");\n\necho '<article>'|g' {} \;
Abe
Abe
19:39
shall i submit make test results?

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