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12:18 AM
:)
 
12:57 AM
Hi guys, in what situations should i concidere use django and not another framework like cakephp or laravel, etc?
 
I think it really all depends on what language you want to work with. You can get the job done with all of them.
 
i've experience with laravel and cakephp, and cakephp is quiet good for small/medium aplications and have a good community. Laravel is very good for huge apps and have a lot of features like middleware, migrations, seeds and the native blade templating is quiet interesting/clean
so over them i can make a choice depending on what kind of project i will be involved
 
1:14 AM
So, to give you some perspective on the Python side, you can actually compare these two in the same way. Flask would be great for smaller applications, and Django for larger ones.
 
user559633
flask is fine for large applications. django just gives you more "turn key" features
 
Yes, I agree...to your point, I have had my share of fairly large Flask projects. I think it's more that Django shines when you need that turn key solution that gives you features like an out-of-the box CMS. Flask has a much easier learning curve, would be good for much smaller applications, and holds well for large applications.
 
@tristan can you enumerate some? i've never tryed django but i wanted to. I just dont know where should i begin, i mean what kind of site should i star with
 
user559633
@andre.leitao.developer read the official tutorial. as for what sort of site you should write, that's up to you
 
@andre.leitao.developer Here is the flask tutorial: flask.pocoo.org/docs/0.10/tutorial and here is the django tutorial: docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.8/intro/tutorial01
go through them, see what you like.
 
1:26 AM
thx guys ill give it a try :)
 
user559633
if you want to look through a simple flask app that interacts with javascript, here's something i wrote github.com/tristanfisher/ffi4wd . or better yet, check out the site for this chatroom github.com/sopython/sopython-site
 
SO I'm one of the 5% of Americans who had all his pertinent identity info stolen due to a cock-up at Experian.
 
user559633
Hooray.
 
Of course, I'm eligible for two years (like my SSN expires after that time) of credit monitoring -- supplied by Experian.
 
user559633
How gracious of them.
 
user559633
1:32 AM
SSNs are such a shit idea.
 
hip-hip-hooray?
 
user559633
['hip','hip']
 
Fortunately, I didn't lose any irreplaceable info like credit card numbers or bank account info -- just the easy to fix things like SSN and driver's license.
(Both T-Mobile and Experian were quick to point out the perceived upside.)
 
user559633
Hey, so we're going to assign you a number that's mostly deterministic, controls your financial safety, and then make you use it everywhere.
 
user559633
way 2 go america: u dun it
 
1:33 AM
Sounds great! Where do I sign up? Oh, wait, my parents did that when I was 3 months old? Never mind, then -- guess I'm already "taken care of."
 
user559633
I'm so glad that I cycle through an identity every 5 years or so
 
I would do that too, but tattoo removal is so difficult.
 
user559633
As someone ~30% covered, I am not looking forward to the next round of lasers, no.
 
user559633
I'm getting this done in 2 months:
 
user559633
 
1:37 AM
A picture of a snake on your snake?
 
Square pixels?
 
user559633
Haha, I don't know why I love that old Windows Python logo so much
 
You should just take up cross-stitching and use that as a pattern.
 
That could be confusing.
 
user559633
@AaronHall Oh man, rap lyrics cross-stitch would sell
 
1:39 AM
That's right! - hype hype
 
Especially to the little old ladies.
 
user559633
 
So each credit bureau can charge you $10 to freeze your credit.
And $10 to unfreeze temporarily.
It's in their interest to scatter your PII everywhere.
 
user559633
Haha. At least you got that bargain of 2 free years with the company that caused the problem in the first place
 
That's just monitoring, not a freeze.
You can get a free freeze, after you have a police report showing that it's too late.
 
user559633
1:41 AM
My credit rating is getting hurt because I don't owe enough money or have enough monthly bills.
 
user559633
Joking aside, I'm sorry that this happened to you @PatrickMaupin
 
Well, nothing bad has happened yet that I know of. Maybe 15 million SSNs is big enough to be a wake-up call to someone.
You can't unload a data cache that big all in one go. All I can hope is that mine is sold to someone completely incompetent.
 
user559633
or someone afraid of numbers that contain 449-467 or 627-647
 
All I know is what I read in the news
 
user559633
Organize a decent class action lawsuit
 
1:46 AM
I'm certain a class action will materialize, and that it will be completely indecent.
 
You'd really hit the jackpot if you had a volkswagen diesel too...class action all the things!
 
user559633
All auto manufacturers lied/lie. I think VW probably just didn't bribe well enough.
 
Not that I think Volkswagen deserves to get off scott free by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm always bemused by things like this. I hate diesels with a passion, you smug putz. How the fuck can you stand there and tell me this thing doesn't pollute? Here let me hook you up to the exhaust.
It's the same as with Ford Exporer and Firestone. Firestone tires had been killing people for years -- why was it all of a sudden newsworthy?
 
user559633
The EPA/vw scandal is amusing because the process is/was "run the tests yourself and tell us what numbers you saw"
 
^^yes! that was the really funny thing in all this. The goal was to prove how clean it was...and then...uh oh. NOPE
 
1:51 AM
The only surprising thing to me from all this was that hey! Maybe BMW actually did manage to build a fairly clean diesel.
 
I think both mercedes and bmw came out on top with actually passing their diesel emissions. right?
 
I dunno about the Mercedes -- apparently the people who uncovered this wanted to test one but couldn't get one (according to several quoted sources at wikipedia).
Apparently the BMW had shown discrepancies in Europe, but was within range in California, which is more stringent. Go figure.
This says the NO emissions from the BMW were a bit high on hills. I guess that could account for some discrepancies.
@tristan Well, if they're afraid of numbers in that range, they'd still have to be incompetent to buy them without asking the seller to scrub them first :-)
 
user559633
I was mostly just trying to figure out if you were born in Texas :P
 
user559633
What size are ints in Texas? I heard everything was bigger there
5
 
Yeah, I figured. OTOH, It's no secret. Yes, ints are bigger here, although that's not a commonly used euphemism.
 
user559633
2:12 AM
Plane about to board. Have yourself a good weekend Patrick
 
You, too, Tristan!
 
 
2 hours later…
4:43 AM
cbg
 
4:59 AM
cbg, Antti
(if you're still 'round)
 
 
1 hour later…
 
5 hours later…
11:31 AM
@Tristan have a star for that :)
 
12:07 PM
@RobertGrant careful with starring stuff - don't upset Kevin! :)
 
Oh wow, where are the Kevin stars? I don't see a single one.
 
cbg
 
Exactly...
wb @idjaw
 
Interneting on my new balcony! Finally got my internet set up yesterday in my new house! Too many boxes. I'm hiding on the balcony to ignore the chaos this morning :P
 
Sounds like a good plan
 
12:15 PM
@idjaw that'll be me in a few weeks :)
Hide from chaos in the internet
 
You know we've got problems when we consider the internet a safe place :P
 
Umm... not sure if the internet or something called "reality" I've heard about are scarier
 
I stand corrected.
 
...said the man in the orthopedic shoes
 
did you hear about the guy who got is left side cut off? He's alright now.......*room goes silent*
 
12:23 PM
Did you hear about the award given to the scarecrow? He was outstanding in his field.
waits for rapturous applause
 
I don't think the room can handle these jokes in a short period of time. We might cause a riot.
 
@RobertGrant applause - is that the option under your user name that says "kick-mute"? :p
Ooo - Dr Who again tonight
 
How many life points do I lose for never getting in to Dr. Who?
 
12:39 PM
cbg
 
wb @BhargavRao
 
hi @idjaw
How are things at your end?
 
Great! Had a successful move in to my new home, and now I'm spending the morning programming with a cup of coffee on my balcony....happiness += 100
 
how about you?
 
programming and coffee!
 
awesome
@RobertGrant what do you use for your testing?
 
I'm just starting, so I don't know :)
 
Did a grave mistake in the morning, fixed the bug. Now enjoying coffee
 
I'm trying to test a Flask app, currently with nose and selenium
 
12:42 PM
Interesting. I've been playing around a lot with mock, flexmock, pyhamcrest
 
@Robert testing!? Huh... isn't that what the end-users are for? :p
 
and for Flask I actually used their fake client for testing. Works beautifully
 
@idjaw spose it depends if you're needing to execute javascript to test certain functionality...
 
^^very true
couldn't you depend on js-based testing frameworks for that?
 
I've written a couple of unit tests, which were easy, but I guess the hard bit is all the web based stuff where you run the server and drive it using selenium or whatever
 
12:47 PM
Dem the client again has problems with my code :-( Why can't they just stop testing it?
 
@Robert as @idjaw mentions - that may well be overkill... use the test client if you can get away with testing basic html responses...
 
Which client is that? Sorry, total noob to this in Python
 
@RobertGrant Have you read this by any chance? flask.pocoo.org/docs/0.10/testing
 
Yeah, reading it now. That's what I linked to ^^ :)
 
I'm looking through a project that was recently open sourced at my work place. We use Flask. I'm going to see if I can find a nicely set up example.
 
12:51 PM
Thanks man
I'll get started with that page as well
 
ah here we go
If you want to see a real-world example, check this test script
 
Thanks!
 
np!
 
I know this won't be a popular thing to say, but using Edge is really nice at the moment
I installed Chrome and it just looks a bit old-fashioned now
Not that that's everything (or most things), but Edge does just look quite cool
 
I'm very open to giving Microsoft a chance :) But unfortunately my only Windows machine is now sitting behind my tv as my gaming box.
I think MS is going in the right direction though. I mean, hey, Apple finally "invented" the iPad Pro, right? :P So that says something about Microsoft's Pro
 
1:06 PM
Yeah :)
Well the surface is a proper PC, not a mobile OS
Lesson: don't make the COO the CEO
 
hahah yeah, don't let the guy who says linux is a cancer be in charge....things took a turn for the better VERY quickly upon said individual's departure :)
 
Yeah I watched Despicable Me 2 yesterday and it reminded of Ballmer
 
1:23 PM
Wow...there really is a resemblance, I never noticed until mentioned.
 
What I don't like about these big tech companies is their shady business decisions make techies want to work for nothing, as they give making money off software a bad name
 
So we basically spend millions of man-hours making stuff that's free for other people to charge a fortune for
And the idea was that once it's free, it's free for future techies, which is awesome until all the devices tie to a cloud to work properly, and then half of it doesn't work even with the free components
 
On a related note, I'm still bitter about Jetbrains decision to go subscription based...That really pissed me off.
November 2 is quickly approaching :)
 
1:39 PM
Hey up all
 
hey hey
 
@idjaw they have a perpetual fallback licence though.
 
I need to validate my comprehension (or lack thereof) in this question. stackoverflow.com/questions/32920972/…
 
So it's not really that different to their previous model, where you had to have an active licence to receive upgrades.
 
1:41 PM
I just don't understand why they are trying to extract conditions from a text file...I'm baffled...
@Ffisegydd I think it got much better once they revised their plan after the backlash.
 
Ah ok, I didn't realise it wasn't always like this.
My student licence is about to run out ;_;
 
I miss student perks :P
If there is one thing I miss from school, it's that
 
Yeah :) my sister in law, who earns a fortune and gets one day a week to study a legal qualification, thus gets a student discount
 
Then again I do contribute to open source projects so I could probably get a free licence through that.
 
Truth. Same here actually
 
1:45 PM
is there anyway to convert my reps to certificate or money or cheese or burgar?
cbg :-)
 
re-cbg all
 
SO currency. You're on to something @AvinashRaj . Should implement a loan system for poor rep people like myself :P. Even includes a collector that comes after you if you don't pay back.
 
£200 for 2 years sub to every IDE they have is not that bad at all really, if you use them regularly.
 
Yeah it's good
And PyCharm community edition is still pretty awesome
I think the only feature I'd like from pro is to be able to debug code hosted in a VM
 
I only actually use PyCharm and Webstorm, so could get away with getting those two for £68 for 2 years.
 
1:50 PM
Massive bargain
Makes me want to cancel my GitHub subscription, which is way more
 
I've integrated myself to PyCharm that I will just end up paying whatever. I think my frustration point was more that I am sucked in to how great the IDE is that I will just have to pay whatever model they decide to use..... :)
 
I've got an existing GH sub as a student.
 
I'd do just as well with a free bitbucket account, as I don't have more than 5 people per project
Except I don't know how well it handles bug recording etc
 
I'm enjoying my paid GH....also using IFTTT with trello works great!
 
2:03 PM
IFTTT?
 
IFTTT is great
 
Ooh yeah I have seen that before. Haven't got into it.
 
it's pretty fantastic. Especially when they introduced support between trello at gh
 
If I haven't even got around to moving from GitHub (costs money) to bitbucket (free) then you get an idea of how lazy I can be
 
For a while I wasn't paying for dev tools...but then I realized....if there is a tool I like to use and it helps me work faster, then it's worth the money investment to keep me productive.
 
2:10 PM
Yeah indeed
 
user559633
Good morning lovely people
 
heya
 
ahoy!
 
1
A: How to get result of "reduce" at every step in Python?

vote539I found the right function: in Python, it's called accumulate. >>> from itertools import accumulate >>> list(accumulate([3, -1, 2], operator.add)) [3, 2, 4] It appears to only be available in Python 3. But everyone has upgraded by now, right? :)

Very optimistic guy :D
 
Hi .. all .. CBG
 
2:19 PM
hello!
 
def insert(self, data):
new_node = Node(data)
new_node.set_next(self.head)
self.head = new_node

I am trying to implement linked list in python.
I found two resources https://github.com/johnshiver/algorithms/blob/master/linked_list/linked_list.py
and https://github.com/joeyajames/Python/blob/master/LinkedLists.py
They are good but they move the head ... so its like linkedlist tail is head.
 
Isn't that a circular linked list?
 
no it isn't
 
Cabbage.
 
I was wondering if I can somehow retain the head of my list at the start :)
 
2:23 PM
Okay :)
 
cbg knowledge
 
user559633
If you append to a list, your 'head' won't be moved.
 
good idea ... tristan!! ... never thought of that!! ... :) ... i'll try this immediately
but yeah ... not so trivial to append a class ...
 
cbg @AnttiHaapala
 
2:26 PM
cbg antti :)
 
cbg @AnttiHaapala
 
@VineetKumarDoshi you'd naturally keep a reference to the tail
or even consider a double-linked list
 
great idea!! ... looking into it :D thanks
 
if you don't keep a reference to the tail then what you'd have is the most awkward datastructure ever :P
though..
the "keeping the tail" would mean that... you'd also need a doublylinked list, or else removing the tail would be expensive :D
all in all
 
what's with all these cabbages? :-)
 
2:29 PM
Does anyone know how to solve problem about sphinx autodoc with decorated classes? stackoverflow.com/questions/32828446/…
 
user559633
@S.R.I a harmless bit of fun sopython.com/salad
 
@S.R.I Cabbage. Salad language.
 
@AnttiHaapala @tristan ahh, headslap Laurel
 
user559633
@S.R.I ha :) you don't have to use it -- not even all the regulars do
 
user559633
there's also some terms that used to be there, but aren't now. e.g. MTFL - malevolent typist for life, which is a play on BDFL
 
2:32 PM
hah, the MTFL is the guy who's forever recording meetings?
 
@S.R.I MTFL is the guy who typoes 40 words a minute
@tristan where did that go?
 
heh, I was more after the BDFL and he's doomed to record every utterance of "Ni, Ni, Ni"!
 
user559633
@AnttiHaapala My profile text or the MTFL entry. For the latter, it was decided it wasn't really 'salad'
 
user559633
i don't think i understand this -- if async def NAME is a special token combination, does the line i quoted above just refer to def NAME where def has been parsed as a coroutine?
 
2:46 PM
Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but your code runs fine (both Python 2 and Python 3). — vaultah 1 min ago
 
@tristan what are you asking :P
 
user559633
^ words, what mean
 
it says that the tokenizer keeps track of the indent/dedent tokens
and if the tokenizer thinks it is within a block started with async def
it will yield ASYNC and AWAIT instead of NAME
so:
async def foo():
    async

async
 
user559633
OH. thanks @AnttiHaapala
 
the first and second async will be tokenized as ASYNC and the third is a NAME token
list(tokenize.tokenize(iter(b'async def foo():\n async\n\nasync'.splitlines()).__next__))
 
user559633
2:56 PM
where it's referring to tokenizer.c, i had stopped thinking of the return
 
though ...
is it not allowed to nest an async def within a def :D
 
This concludes my morning. rbrb all!
 
rbrb idjaw
> This question has an open bounty and cannot be closed
ugh
 
@vaultah ?
 
I understand that it's the expected behaviour but this question is asking for resources and is quite broad. Starting a bounty there is a poor idea imo
 
user559633
3:43 PM
I'm really not liking Python in the 3.x ecosystem. I say this as someone that uses 3.x for almost everything.
 
user559633
Backwards compatibility is breaking, we're at 3.5.x and syntax and names are still not solidified.
 
@tristan wtf? :D
 
user559633
So it's like backwards compatibility with 2.x is broken. Fine, major changes, most of them good, fine. Some new magic (e.g. super), but generally okay. But with the frequency of releases, introducing async and await in 3.5 and planning to remove them by 3.7?
 
@tristan in python 2.5, syntax and names were still not solidified.
we got with.
 
user559633
I'm finding it hard to find reasons to get my company to move from 2.7.9 if all I'm going to buy with the change is sweeping maintenances on minor version changes.
 
3:48 PM
so now the backward incompatible change is that you cannot use names async and await
 
user559633
...which is the only reason why i moved to 3.5
 
so your fix would be s/\basync\b/async_/ and s/\bawait\b/await_/
@tristan planning to remove them?? w00t?
 
user559633
unless the change is something different. unless finland is hours ahead of my time zone and also years
 
user559633
Yeah, exactly. I don't understand why they were introduced as tokens if the idea in the future is to have them as something like co_def x() or adef x()
 
@tristan damnit they're not going to be like that
 
user559633
3:53 PM
Then what are they going to be like? Innocent question
 
laurel :D
what the text means in Python 3.5 async = True works
in Python 3.7 it will be SyntaxError
 
Oh, I got this right \o/
 
so you'd get:
 
user559633
Oh. Can you just like..follow me around and explain things to me?
 
>>> async = True
  File "<stdin>", line 1
    async = True
          ^
SyntaxError: invalid syntax
 
user559633
3:55 PM
Syntax Error: invalid.. yeah
 
user559633
It occurs to me that life would be much easier for me if I was smarter
 
this means: "parsing async and await as NAME tokens will be softly deprecated"
 
user559633
Yeah, I read proper 'keywords' as 'we do not really like the way this works now' and not 'they are not already keywords'
 
user559633
i think i need to spend more time reading about grammars and tokenization to really get the most out of PEPs
 
btw now in Python 3.5, ofc:
>>> async def foo():
...     async = 5
  File "<stdin>", line 2
    async = 5
          ^
SyntaxError: invalid syntax
 
user559633
4:03 PM
yeah, because async in async
 
so now you need to repent, read the prayer of BDFL Zen of Python 99 times.
 
4:42 PM
@tristan: are you getting confused by my type of return or del answer?
async and await are eased in as keywords.
So only if you used async or await as identifiers in a coroutine context would you have a problem. From 3.7 onwards they become full keywords and cannot use them as identifiers anywhere.
Just like you can't use if or with as identifiers now.
And that happened in the Python 2 cycle too, only without gradual introduction. with became a keyword in 2.5.
 
user559633
@MartijnPieters I'm not -- I think my confusion is a function of that I was reading the pep while getting interrupted after 5 minutes over the past few days. Now that I'm home, I think I was actually processing what I was reading, but I had misunderstood what I had previously run
 
user559633
I was also trying to shoehorn coroutine use into a context in which it didn't make sense.
 
cbg!
 
user559633
4:58 PM
hi there
 
@tristan :-)
 
user559633
How's the "new" job @MartijnPieters? Can you share what you're working on?
 
@tristan I'm currently working on being at home and buying an electric car.
And making sure my mortgage lender comes through on deal.
I'll start the actual new job on Monday in a week.
:-)
 
user559633
Are you living in England now?
 
I'll then be doing a 7 week bootcamp.
Yes, living in the UK, staying in the UK.
I'll work in London.
 
user559633
5:07 PM
I assume it's a 7 week PHP bootcamp? (kidding, kind of)
 
user559633
I mostly ask because you seemingly have a reasonable grasp of Python, 7 weeks is a long time, and I assume that they'd want you producing code sooner than that.
 
user559633
5:24 PM
API user experience question: i'm working on an API that parses a status page of a third party. if the third party responds with a content type we don't expect (json instead of text/html), would you expect the API to return with an HTTP error code? The API did its job correctly, so it could return a 2xx, but the body of the response will not be useful for the API consumer, so I was thinking that it would be useful to denote the failure in a means beyond the response body
 
5:35 PM
Just to make sure I understand. Are you looking to provide more context either via body or status code to responses based on invalid content types that are returned?
 
user559633
Say that you were consuming a JSON API that warned you of outages on dropbox, google, facebook, and aws. If AWS was having an outage, would you expect the HTTP response code from the API to be a 500 error?
 
No.
 
user559633
Or would you expect an HTTP 200 and a key/value inside the resp to have something like "status":"nok"
 
That would make me think "There's an issue with the API" not "The API is telling me there's an issue with a third party"
 
user559633
Thanks
 
5:39 PM
As how would you tell users that, actually, your api is having issues? Might be that AWS is fine but your API has fallen over, but I'd assume that it was AWS with an issue.
 
If the third party API is broken, wouldn't a 4xx be expected?
 
user559633
@idjaw No, because the route on the API was found and permitted to be accessed.
 
right.
 
user559633
Exactly @Ffisegydd -- it was a half baked idea to communicate "bad shit happened" without requiring someone to parse the JSON
 
user559633
maybe i'll pop it in the header
 
5:59 PM
@tristan It's a get to know the company and our culture bootcamp.
2 weeks London, 2 weeks Menlo Park, CA.
Then 2 or 3 weeks back in London.
Then pick a team.
If I don't touch the frontend I won't touch PHP.
And you get to change things in the first weeks already.
 
7 weeks though... damn
I thought my 5 days in Guildford was rough.
 
@tristan Sure. Means the part of the API is running at Amazon and can't be reached :-)
 
> Engineers have real work assigned to them the first time they open their laptops and many push code to the live site within their first week.
 
So don't open your laptop. Easy fix.
 
Pretty interesting that you get to choose what team you want to work on after your training. A lot of times you get hired on to a team. Very awesome approach.
 
Martijn, are you in that video?
 
0
Q: Not sure if SO is the right place for a question about Python 'culture'

RFlackI have a question I'd like to air: Will the Python culture of 'find a library for it' kill the art of coding? I dont want to put it up on SO and then get all kinds down votes for being off topic. I suspect it may not be right for SO but not sure where else.

 
6:25 PM
CBG peeps. I come in peace, to ask for ye opinions on what syntax highlighting theme/stuff you use. My current theme (dunno what it is) looks like this: i.stack.imgur.com/aySRY.png and I think the tokenization is pretty scarce. Method invocation is not highlighted, for instance.
 
@AaronHall no, I am not.
@AaronHall: I have yet to start at FB.
@JonClements I avoided pointing to the chat room (or any alternative place for that question).
Mostly because I haven't seen such a culture at all.
 
Although that culture exists for sure in the JS land.
 
Anonymous
Guys. I'm on bookdepository.com checking out some Python books. Any recommendations?
 
Anonymous
I need a book for almost complete newbie.
 
Don't bother with books, just use online tutorials.
 
Anonymous
6:38 PM
A little better than x for dummies but, nothing complicated.
 
+1 for online tutorials
 
Anonymous
@Ffisegydd Yeah, I know. I just move a lot (1 hour train ride) everyday without any laptop. So, I need to make use of these hours.
 
Do you have a phone/reader?
 
Download pdfs then.
Assuming you have some electronic device.
 
Anonymous
No laptops.
 
Anonymous
6:40 PM
My laptop battery lasts 45 seconds :/
 
Anonymous
I thought I could print a PDF, but the money used to print a pdf would be better spent on a book.
 
rbrb all
 
cheers @vaultah
 
7:47 PM
@MartijnPieters Even if there were a good place to ask the question, the only correct answer would be "WTF are you smoking??!?" If anything, the Python culture is the complete opposite of this -- arguably way too many of whatever kind of library you want.
 
7:58 PM
Not looking good for England.
 
user559633
8:17 PM
i hate html
 
user559633
let's all communicate using a heavy structure that doesn't require even balancing your close and open tags
 
and is many times computer generated through a framework that completely ignores human readability
 
It's great for unbalanced people like me.
 
8:36 PM
@PatrickMaupin Yup. And to top that off, this was in reference to my answer where I credited the Python 3 itertools documentation.
Why invent a new accumulate() implementation when there is one available already?
@Ffisegydd England is a broken country, all things considered. Anything not looking good in particular?
 
@Martijn rugby, in particular :P
 
@Ffisegydd ah, I'm not following the World Cup, too many other things taking my attention at the moment.
 
I've not been following it in that much detail, but unless something drastic changes in the next 10 minutes, England will become the first host nation to not make it out of the group stages in the history of the tournament.
 
@Ffisegydd at least it's a record of some sorts :)
 
:P It'll also be the first time they've never gotten out of the groups in general.
 
8:44 PM
wow - two records then
yay England!
 
I feel weird rooting for Australia though :P (if England lose to Aus then Wales are guaranteed to go through sorta)
And by sorta I mean definitely.
 
9:37 PM
reminds me of a skit from Fry and Laurie
 
10:06 PM
What online tutorials are we recommending now?
If only wine could keep until the next day.
 
10:25 PM
cbg all
 
@PatrickMaupin you mean everyone's "rolling their own"? ;-D
 
I'm close to tearing my hair out, I have this python3.4 app and I need to package it for use on windows for an almost-computer-illiterate audience. PyInstaller doesn't appear to want to work with Python3.4 so I'm at a bit of a loss for what to do, anyone have any suggestions?
Am I going to need to use distutils?
 
what is the error message you are getting
 
stackoverflow.com/questions/27138649/… exact same issue as that question
 
10:42 PM
Unfortunately I don't have a Windows machine to try this right now but did you read this? stackoverflow.com/questions/26215685/… Does this still hold for today?
 
As far as I can tell I'm still running into that problem. Apparently they have an experimental python3 branch, but I'm not sure where that is exactly.
 
If there is an experimental branch that means it is a branch in github. You will probably have to clone that particular branch from github and use that test on your project
 
I have a bit of an aversion to using experimental branches for deploying to end users but I will look into that if I can't find another solution, thanks for the suggestion :)
 
I took a look at gh and there doesn't seem to be much activity but apparently it's supposed to work and the build is currently tagged is failinghttps://github.com/pyinstaller/pyinstaller/blob/develop/README.rst
 
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