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1:28 AM
Gosh no one on any platform can help me??
comoooon
 
 
1 hour later…
2:33 AM
!!meow
 
 
3 hours later…
5:17 AM
power outage is a symbol of backwarded district
I cant accept a power outage even once in a quarter
And here is a business district, how can this ridiculous thing can happen?
 
 
1 hour later…
6:29 AM
@nyconing the alternative is to regularly dig up wires older than a certain amount of years and verify that everything is still in order
and honestly, had they done so, it's not even said they'd have found something wrong with the wires beforehand
 
7:16 AM
Is anything related to ... 'wires'?
checking the cable health do not require to digging
 
I think you can verify that current is still passing through and take measures if it is dipping slightly, sure
I don't think all wire-related problems would suffer from a slight degrading of the wire though
 
they fix the power supply very quickly after somebody make a call to contractor
but damage already done
god I think I should be grateful the technician dont accidentally supplied 72kv to my office....
My house dont even have a outage in past few years... or Im not in home when it happen
 
@TaylorSpark ? I didn't see you ask
 
7:45 AM
Power outages happen
If your employer isn't prepared for that, it's on them.
 
well depends on what you mean by "prepared"
nobody's using a database all in memory these days
 
posted on July 16, 2019 by Scott Hanselman

There's some interesting stuff quietly happening in the "Console App" world within open source .NET Core right now. Within the https://github.com/dotnet/command-line-api repository are three packages: System.CommandLine.Experimental System.CommandLine.DragonFruit System.CommandLine.Rendering These are interesting experiments and directions that are exploring how to make Console apps easier to

 
8:04 AM
morn
@nyconing haha
 
8:24 AM
Some guy has implemented a 4-bit calculator in Cities: Skylines - Powered by Wind turbines and shit
 
if you can read/write bits, perform "and" and "or" bitwise operators in some capacity, you can write a basic computer in that game
i think you can also build "and" and "or" gates from nand gates, so also nand gates would be sufficient
still impressive though
 
8:46 AM
something something UPS @nyconing
 
@Neil I interpret that in two ways
> nobody's using a database, all in memory these days
> nobody's using a database all in memory, these days
 
Nah UPS only stand for few minutes and my compny dont want to buy that expensive stuff
 
but I do both :D
 
@Wietlol feel free to interpret however you prefer
 
UPS only stand for updates per second
 
8:49 AM
user permanently stubborn
 
@nyconing a few minutes? Maybe if you buy the crappy ones sure
 
Dont plug into the UPS all the machines, only plug the server/infra devices
 
It will give you plenty of time for a proper shutdown of the servers
 
8:51 AM
my company server still crappy than that UPS
 
imagine what a power outage can do to a crappy server
 
dbo.****** (suspect)
 
it will add to the crappy software/hardware faulty power suppliers, disk errors, etc
 
because the data damage never caused by power outage, we IT always fix that suspected database perfectly!
My boss dont think he server need a UPS
He need us instead
even my firewall-router login page is exposed to the internet, and only boss can login that stuff
 
mr5
can anyone tell me the "extra" characters in this code:
"‭5‬"
 
8:58 AM
I reported that vulnerability and my boss never care
maybe some chars hiding inside
convert to bytes and see there really only have 5?
 
@mr5 22 E2 80 AD 35 E2 80 22
the 22s are the quotation marks
35 is the "5" character
everything else are extras
a good hex editor. Don't leave home without it
 
mr5
one of my colleagues had a hard time debugging why he can't convert that string to an int.
he says, he copied the "5" from an app calculator
 
@nyconing this is where you send a list of things wrong to your boss via email
and get an email response of him saying you don't need it
then when it does hit the fan and your bosses boss is screaming at you
you can direct them to the email that outlines all the things that would have stopped said situation from happening and that your boss is responsible
 
@mr5 well there you go :P
we use skype for business at work, and you cannot pass a SQL query because it does something funny to space characters
why they do something strange to space characters, I'll never know, but you have to manually delete them and replace with spaces. it is a pain
 
take sql query
copy to .txt file
send .txt file
 
9:09 AM
or just send the query in an e-mail, sure
 
or that
 
9:28 AM
We don't have a UPS for our servers/infra yet
We had a powercut on Fridya
 
Nah, paste all quoted text into MS Word and after word screws all the quotes paste that into visual studio
 
We are probably getting UPSs now
 
From experience, bosses only care about bad things they were warned when things go totally dead, users stop working for 4+ hours, and it takes 2 employees doing extra hours to fix them
Transaction log file of a 2 GB database is 30GB instead of 4 MB? They dont care, until main production database goes to hell and there is no space in the server to recover data files nor transacion log
from 15:00pm to 00:15am to fix that mess, 1 infra guy, me, infra's boss, my boss
next week they did configure properly the ***** server
 
@bradbury9 dumb
it's happened to me that someone restores a database with full transaction logs enabled
that basically just creates a full copy of your database inside the logs
 
I said "bosses only care about bad things they were warned when things go totally dead", I didnt said "they do take smart actions"
Full log requires a log backup in the maintenance plan, that avoids huge transaction logs
 
9:35 AM
Luckily my old place had loads of ups's about
just they were all old as fuck
and only half of them had working batteries lmao
 
You tell a manager that full transaction logs are enabled and that you'll have all changes to the database right up to the moment of failure, they're all like "Well do it!"
and then you tell them it'll occupy lots of space and require regular maintenance and then they go, "Pff.. who cares about maintenance?"
then of course when it breaks because the hd is full, it's your fault
 
Well infra guys did say SQL Server maintenance plans were "dev's task, not theirs"
 
it's not the dev's job
 
And my boss did not give a fuck and said "backups are infra's task"
 
you hire a systems administrator exactly for such things
 
9:38 AM
"SQL Server maintenance plans were "dev's task"
 
The same system administrator that charges us a week of work for a production "servers monitoring" I asked for
 
In what forkin' scenario is that EVER true
 
weeks later users warned us when servers were shutdown
 
now, where is Harry ?
 
Holiday
 
9:40 AM
at my old job, we'd install our software on their computers, and told them they needed to be maintained regularly and for whatever reason, the clients never seemed to want to bother with that
 
But as I wanted to tell him
 
oh
 
I asked "how the hell are you monitoring this? Didnt you notice machine was not on?"
 
going to hogwarts for school is not a holiday
 
hol..i..d..ay
is this how you write it ?
never heard of it
 
9:40 AM
so we'd regularly get calls for full hard drives and whatnot, and since they paid for the helpdesk, we were always guilty until proven innocent
 
LAZY ROACH
 
@bradbury9 YOU HAD ONE JOB
 
2 years later, we still do not notice when servers go offline
I had to configure myself SQL Server email notifications to being able to notice when SSIS task failed
but if services are not started, I will not get feedback and are the users complains that warn us
@Neil You charged my project 40 hours and did nothing, and lie about it every time I ask when users cannot work
 
@bradbury9 you can't be at fault for that
heck, you're taking active efforts despite him
 
I know, and my boss does know also. But I can't stand with that guys attitude
Lets ignore I am not the project manager but just a coder that gives support to it
 
9:51 AM
Aww did I miss harry
 
there's this project that I worked on with another guy who works for another development department
 
holyday
 
His part is having some sort of network problems calling an external service, and for the love of god, it has been like two weeks now of at least one e-mail per day, where they're asking for some sort of support and he's not responding
I'd help, but he has all the details regarding the call, and I can't do anything really other than reply to the e-mail strongly implying that he is the one who should deal with it
but I'm not his boss, so I can't really make him do anything
I had a chat with my boss, and he decided to write an e-mail to everyone clarifying that this doesn't concern our department and that they should refer to the other
 
Heck, how do I run asyn method in foreach loop inside async Task<bool> method?
 
I just don't understand how some people can be so carefree about such things
 
9:59 AM
@Neil because some people just don't give a shit
 
@CaptainSquirrel I'm the first to defend people if they don't know how to do something, but I have absolutely no reservations to firing someone for not doing their job
 
@Neil Once the manager asked me about a project where two departments (infra and dev) were involved and I answered "it is going to hell, infra treats us like we were clients, lying us". He did call head of both departments to a reunion and that project went sweet afterwards.
 
@bradbury9 gee, I wonder why :P
 
I got later a meeting with my department boss, he was really angry, but hey! client was happy!
 
I hate it when a problem turns political
when you ask someone to do something, assuming they have the time, energy, and know-how, there is literally no excuse
 
10:01 AM
Actually that boss did demote me, only officially, I still do same tasks as before
 
@bradbury9 well that's messed up
 
And did ask me why I was not happy
 
you were demoted for making the client happy?
 
@bradbury9 you got demoted for getting a project back on track?
wut
 
some people in my office, you simply cannot speak to directly
 
10:03 AM
He said "do not think this as a punishment, do look at it as an attempt to encourage you to communicate more"
 
It's apparently something very typical of Italian culture. If you're high enough up, you don't speak to the lowly workers.. it's like a status thing
 
I answered "it was your boss the one that came to me and asked me about your project"
If i was not a labor worker (we get special protection while in charge) I am sure that dude would fire me
 
In America, assuming you approached your CEO correctly, yeah, you could talk to them about anything
you wouldn't of course unless it were important, but still
In Italy, talk to the wrong guy when he's having a bad day and you will be fired
 
He did talk to me, I was correct to the CEO, but my boss took it personally
 
regardless of the message or importance
every problem should be directed to your boss, except the problems about your boss
I hate to go over people like that but it is literally an issue about your boss
 
10:08 AM
hey-ho
 
I am sure I did right, my boss was warned several times and did nothing, without that talk the project would not be on time, and the client was happy as fuck
o/ Avner
 
@bradbury9 well, my opinion doesn't matter in the scheme of your career, but you did the right thing
 
o/
 
not a lot of people would go against their boss in the best interests of their company
 
10:11 AM
yeah we know how that Approach worked out for the italian economy...
they Need to Change Things up
 
@Hans1984 I agree
 
same goes for greece
 
they also have an attitude where age, not ability is what is important
 
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I said "happy as fuck" only because of your "strong language" starred message :-P
 
Yeah, that's the best way to get me in a good mood, to purposefully ignore what I'm saying and consider it a joke.
 
10:13 AM
As soon as I get a decent job offer in another company I will send my current job to hell
 
To be fair to Avner, he has mentioned the swearing thing twice now
(I am making an attempt to tone down the amount of swears i use)
 
I didn't say anything because I don't think the occasional profanity is that terrible, it's just that the tone of the room got really ugly recently.
 
serious question, can you use "af"?
 
But expressly saying he used it because I asked not to? That's a douche move.
 
AF isn't necessarily a swear
 
10:16 AM
well I mean it is an abbreviation of a swear
 
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan he probably mis-understood your message
@Neil yeah, but theres a difference between AF and As Fork
 
meh. it's a swear to those who know what it means
 
Personally, I don't consider it a swear
 
I'm not the language police and I'm not going to start whitelisting and blacklisting words. Do what you want. What I did say, in my capacity as a room regular and one of several ROs, is that the room was getting ugly. You don't have to run your language by me and you don't owe me anything.
 
You did fine starring that message, public chats need to be welcoming or they get low activity
 
10:24 AM
In a different topic, it took me only a couple of weeks to start hating on Docker. Woo!
 
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan what's making you hate on it?
 
@CaptainSquirrel I'm using Volumes to create a shared volume between several containers running on the same machine. But I'm also trying to run my containers with a limited user instead of (local) root. But it turns out that this user doesn't have permissions to write to the volume, by default, because its permissions are managed by the host.
 
Based on my (very limited) knowledge of docker
That sounds like you've got a problem :D
 
So the solution is either to run as root (which gets write access), or find some hack, such as creating user groups with the same gid on all my container images, and making sure the host gives permissions to that gid.
I've seen some hacks around.
 
Can you manage permissions directly for docker or is it integrated into ad?
 
10:32 AM
It's all local accounts in the host and container's linux systems.
 
But my process running in the container is running in the context of the limited user. I can call sudo to give myself permissions, but that feels... wrong?
I haven't been using docker long enough to hate it yet!
 
limao
 
Can you not create a single group on one container and sync it to others?
or does something like that not exist
 
user10864482
10:37 AM
good morning
 
\o
 
@CaptainSquirrel I'm checking to see if I can. The problem isn't with creating a group in the container, it's with creating it on the host and assigning that group permissions to a shared volume that doesn't exist yet at build time.
And since I'm running linux containers on a host Windows machine during debugging, this isn't even a supported scenario. *sigh*.
Fine. I'll run the container process as root for now.
 
10:55 AM
oh the joys of development
 
we work for glory
 
And money
mainly money
 
apparently not, because we don't get too much of that
 
Then find a job that will pay you what you want, while also giving you a nice working environment too :D
That's what i did
 
There's a fantastic Terry Pratchett bit about that. The ethos of the Assassin's Guild: "We don't kill for honor. We don't kill for ideology, or hatred, or passion. No. We kill for money. And, because we value human life so much, we do it for a great deal of money".
 
11:06 AM
And all this is why I like managing shit myself
 
Im reading Guards saga atm, Vimes rocks more than Assasin's Guild.
 
Vimes is a fantastic character.
 
Probably the witches saga will be next
 
I have to say I'm not as fond of those books. I don't dislike them, but I would take the Night Watch or Rincewind and certainly Death over them.
 
11:32 AM
We started a deployment at 11am (1hr 33m ago)
We've only done one of the content servers so far and that's only nearly done ._.
 
11:45 AM
Wow
What are you deploying? the entire Windows codebase?
 
Our ServiceFabric cluster would often take 45-60 minutes to deploy. :-\
5 nodes in the cluster, and for each one it pulls the updates images, deploys, then spends 5-10 minutes doing automated health checks before moving on to the next node.
 
mr5
12:42 PM
good evening people!
 
@CaptainObvious its a deployment to azure
and then there's publish's & Indexing that needs to be carried out once the deployment is done
 
Now I'm wondering if I get Directory.EnumerateFiles(...).GetEnumerator(), and every time I finish processing one file I call enumerator.MoveNext(), whether I will be guaranteed to iterate over all files, assuming I don't care about file order.
 
It doesn't help that we have issues with some of the assets not loading due to the url being wrong
 
I'm gonna guess at no because thje filesystem can easily change while your application is running
 
That's fine, that's the point - I have one process constantly writing files, and another that needs to be constantly processing.
But EnumerateFiles() doesn't evaluate the whole list immediately.
 
12:53 PM
It does it you call ToList or something and them work from that
 
I don't want it.
I want a loop that continuously gets the next file and processes it.
 
But GetEnumerator would stop when it ran out of files wouldn't it?
 
mr5
foreach it
 
But will it ever run out of files? That's exactly what I don't know.
@mr5 foreach simply calls GetEnumerator/MoveNext.
 
mr5
foreach(var file in files)
{
    ProcessAsync(file); // not awaited
}
how about that?
 
12:56 PM
I'm not sure if the enumerator for files will continue infinitely if new files keep getting added.
 
I think it's how he's getting files in the firstplace which is the question
 
I'm guessing it won't, at least not reliably.
 
I have something that does this
 
mr5
oh
 
I've written various FileSystemWatcher-based solutions over the years. I hate FSW.
 
mr5
12:57 PM
I think you need to have a concurrent collection safe and file system listener in order to achieve that
 
Basically what I do is use a FileSystemWatcher which watches for new files and queues them up for processing. But it can sometimes miss files, so I also every <time period> queue up everything for processing
 
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan It will not get files added while you were in your loop, but it should get all the files
 
What I can do is simply do folder.EnumerateFiles().First(), process it, then call it again.
Always getting the first file (for an arbitrary value of first)
 
That would work fi the files are being removed or otherwise changed so the same one doesn't keep appearing at the start
 
mr5
why not yield return the enumerable?
 
12:58 PM
Yeah, processing should remove/rename it.
 
Otherwise you probably just keep processing the same file
 
Get a Queue and add items with a file system watcher
 
In that case just enumerate to list, process all of them and then rinse and repear
 
@bradbury9 That was my default choice, but I'm wondering if there's a better way.
@CaptainObvious Hmm, that's not a bad idea. Get a batch of whatever's on.
 
This is one of the 2 things one of my applications does
 
1:00 PM
EnumerateFiles will only be executed once
 
Something like
 
I'll try to see if I can wrap it in something that abstracts it away. So I can simply do while { var file = await GetNextFile(), and it either goes over the current list of files or, if it's empty, delays and/or polls a FSW until a file shows up.
 
while (true)
            {
                foreach (var VARIABLE in DirectoryInfo.EnumerateFiles().ToList())
                {
                    //Process file
                }
            }
 
@CaptainObvious How to avoid processing same file twice if you repeat the enumeration?
 
Of course, seeing as my current assumption is that the file creating would be faster than file processing, that might be overkill.
@CaptainObvious Might as well call DirectoryInfo.GetFiles(), which does the same.
 
1:01 PM
yeah that's what I meant
But specifically forcing it t fully enumerate before starting the iteration
If it lazily enumerates files could move around and you might miss something
 
GetFiles doesn't lazily enumerate.
 
Oh yeah fair enough
I thought it was IEnumerable
 
EnumerateFiles() is the lazy one. GetFiles returns string[].
 
This is one of my things. It uses an FSW to get most of the file updates almost instantly to process them asap, but will every 20 minutes queue up everything to be reprocessed in the event it missed something
 
@CaptainObvious There's a Microsoft project over on github that promises a more reliable FSW at the cost of potentially more overhead: github.com/dotnet/corefxlab/tree/master/src/…
> System.IO.FileSystem.Watcher.Polling. .NET's FileSystemWatcher has low overhead, but it can miss some changes. This is acceptable in many scenarios, but in some, it might be not. This component, PollingWatcher, allows to monitory directory changes by polling, and so will never miss a change. It is optimized to minimize allocations, when no changes are detected. In fact, it does not allocate anything on the GC heap when there are no changes detected.
 
1:09 PM
Polling suggests it periodically enumerates to check if it missed something
If the polling rate is configurable then that sounds ideal
 
Yup. But it does it for you.
Yeah, it lets you set PollingInterval, I see.
 
Seems cool. I just implemented my own version of the same thing a couple of years prior (and not in .net core)
 
1:41 PM
I knew that FileSystemWatcher couldn't be relied on to be timely. Are you saying that sometimes it doesn't emit results at all?
 
It either emits results immediatelyish or not at all yes
By default it's got a fairly small buffer so if stuff goes in faster than it's processed out it can be quite bad for missing changes
 
2:03 PM
I get so annoyed at the misconception that FileSystemWatcher is unreliable. It's the implementation of the user that's just terrible.
FSW is perfectly fine if you know what you're doing lol
 
....
People have seen that it's unreliable. They're not making it up
 
user10864482
2:17 PM
I experienced how unreliable FileSystemWatcher is
 
mr5
FSW should be calibrated to your needs. As Roel suggests, the implementation of the developer probably is the culprit.
 
FSW is fairly reliable. But it does occasionally miss things. There's no getting around that.
 
mr5
2:33 PM
34
A: FileSystemWatcher vs polling to watch for file changes

Brent RockwoodThe FileSystemWatcher may also miss changes during busy times, if the number of queued changes overflows the buffer provided. This is not a limitation of the .NET class per se, but of the underlying Win32 infrastructure. In our experience, the best way to minimize this problem is to dequeue the...

 
user10864482
2:50 PM
if something is working most of the time but not all the time, its per see unreliable
 
It's great if there isn't a huge amount of activity
But if there's a lot going on in a short space of time (ie 50 file updates in a 0.5s) it can struggle to keep up. Especially if there's persistently a lot going on
 
I had a dream. I wanted a function have an input parameter and an output parameter with extensibility. I mean the function is overrided using the input parameters extra stuff too. Like this one> gist.github.com/mrtank/f7d1236c20e36f5f9cf429f48b54fbeb
what is the common solution for this without Actions?
and without double cast...
or even without cast.
Covariance comes to my mind
 
3:18 PM
hello friends, I am working on a .NET Core Web API application. Is it normal for the time it takes for a GET request to vary wildly? like 3s to 22s...
 
Sounds like there's an issue with what your requests are doing
 
mr5
@ntohl a command(input) with dynamic properties?
from my interpretation, it roughly translates to this:
class command1: command
class command2: command1
class command3: command2
func print(input: command) -> Json.Serialize(command);
 
3:37 PM
@mr5 is it javascript?
 
user10864482
when I think of extensibility I think reflection. God I love reflection
 
I would like to avoid double casts too. Not to mention reflection
I'm thinking something like covariance solution (obviously with generic methods) or some GOF pattern for that
 
mr5
3:54 PM
@ntohl it's pseudo code
Does my pseudo code interpretation fits what you have in mind?
 
4:07 PM
Sara Chipps on July 18, 2019

“Caustic community for new users. There is no excuse for not being kind!”  – 6 years coding

“It feels too scary and unaccessible for new developers” – 3 years coding

“People could be less brutal” – 6 years coding

“The attitude is not beginner friendly. Askers are expected to have done a lot of research before asking a question (re: both question format and content), even if they are completely new to the community or topic. Not everyone can understand or even know to look for documentation when they’re completely new to programming.” – 12 years coding experience  …

 
4:24 PM
@mr5 I think not. I have only 1 level of derivation
 
mr5
Well I thought you would like to have an extensible input and output
So I derived it 2x
to "extend" properties
 
I would but that would be done with 1 derivation. The count doesn't matter
 
mr5
Oh well let's just say I derived it once.
 
the main problem is using command 2 or 3's property after ->
 
mr5
hmm
how about:
func morph<T>(input: command) -> Json.Serialize<T>(command);
 
4:28 PM
I have a point in my codebase, where I would like to have the print function implemented where all the props are used. Yes. Something like that
see my code. It's using T a lot
just I can't say T.NewProp
after the ->
 
mr5
Shouldn't it happen outside the function?
 
(NewProp is from command 2 or 3). I mean I need cast for that. 2 casts to be precise
 
mr5
well, if you're going to cast the generic inside, you should not make it a generic in the first place.
 
that's my problem
what are the alternatives
 
mr5
either you make it a plain object, query all of its properties using reflection, or do it the right way: access the properties outside, same way how DTO to Domain model mapping works.
var domain = mapper.Map<Domain, DomainDTO>(response);
 
4:33 PM
lot of reflection code can be avoided by Visitor pattern for example
I try to find the best pattern.
just like when you derive from a class where there are virtual methods, you can put a lot of extensible code in it. I would like to do the same, just generic return, input params
 
hi
anyone can suggest me a better rest api framework....
 
Odata?
 
Hi everyone
 
Golang vs Aps .net core
which can manage memory and concurrent better
 
php lol
3
 
4:39 PM
lol
 
I thought 7.3 and 7.x in general will improve the memory / performance situation a lot in PHP
 
I have never used php rest apis
I don't know how I can benchmark those which is appropriate on my case..
that's i am discussing.
 
Benchmark as in simple use cases? like /api/hello-world ?
 
haha]
no performance on different case
 
how do you benchmark an application without writing it in multiple platforms?
 
user10864482
4:50 PM
@bluetoothfx php + laravel is a charm
 
mr5
by using someone else's?
 
I thought PHP world has moved on to Symfony pretty much
 
user10864482
personally I like plain php
 
user10864482
there is also a possibility to build api using WordPress
 
4:54 PM
those two statements are a world apart
If you don't have legacy constraints, I'd strongly recommend Drupal REST over Wordpress REST
cb() is never called
 
mr5
yeah me too. I like plain PHP
I can pull of a web service in just 10 minutes including: table creation, writing backend and frontend code, launching that local XAMPP (MySQL + PhpMyAdmin)
and finally uploading it somewhere free
good 'ol college days
 
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