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00:10
> put on hold as off-topic by idjaw, Prune, TigerhawkT3, davidism, mgilson 11 mins ago
Typo or Cannot Reproduce Cannot run Django development server - Nowandthen98‎ - 2016-10-17 18:18:15Z
Unclear unit test work flow - Lisa‎ - 2016-10-18 00:13:51Z
@AnttiHaapala you'll love how this answer starts stackoverflow.com/a/40097547/1048539
omfg 6 answers already Duplicate How do I concat a string of chars together from a matrix in python? - user6840964‎ - 2016-10-18 00:03:13Z
I need to post more in python to get a gold tag badge
00:56
Well, I hammered the heck out of it :D
there's gotta be a reason this person wants to do this... right? stackoverflow.com/q/40097863/1048539
was just looking at that
I think they want to just print it out
is .replace() very efficient in python?
Reminds me of my solution for flattening nested lists
@WayneWerner 2sweet
01:10
I was slightly surprised that cheating ended out faster than doing it the right way. I mean, I wouldn't recommend it for production code (and maybe ast.literal_eval would work fine there), but it was interesting.
Great solution. Thank you. =) — user3271404 22 secs ago
odds of that resulting in a green check? probably zero...
01:24
Would it be appropriate to dupe hammer stackoverflow.com/q/40098038/344286 as a dupe of stackoverflow.com/questions/1132941/… ?
if there's something else handy, I'll hammer it as a dupe of that
the hammerer of hammerers took care of it already
:)
man it's annoying to see someone stealth edit and just copy your answer
really? where?
1
A: list.sort() not sorting values correctly by second tuple parameter

enderlandWhen you iterate over your tuples, you want to print the tuple itself: for tup in sorted_list: print(tup) otherwise, you are printing the values at the index based on the first value of the index. For example, the first value in the sorted list is: (11, 0) is actually looking for: sort...

I mean it's pretty basic anyways but the currently +4 just ninja edited exactly my solution as an adendum to his
:\
meh, it's just SO, FGITW and ninja editing is part of the territory
@enderland please don't turn this room into "cv room part 2". It's fine if you want to get some things closed but don't: tag them python, link the user (it doesn't matter), post the time (it doesn't matter except that it's > 10 minutes). Dumping a whole bunch of them during inactive times in the room just looks bad.
01:30
ok
user559633
I agree with what Davidism said and want to add my gratitude for understanding (not that it needed someone to cosign).
I guess realistically 75% of the python questions are off topic
user559633
Is that better or worse than the mode?
*blatantly off topic
user559633
sweaters that feel like bathrobes has been added to tristan's list of favorite things
01:34
I got my first ever bathrobe last year as a gift
Hmm, someone added "use theses userscripts to generate cvs" to the cv-pls wiki page. Shouldn't have made that a wiki page.
@idjaw living the high life now!
user559633
literally. he's canadian big lebowski
@davidism livin' the dream! Working my up to be The Dude
wow....hah
is there a python close room?
also fantasy football, RB has 19 points before halftime. need about 2x that. will it work out!?
user559633
@enderland no. we've found the cv-plz and some ad-hoc stuff to be fine
user559633
01:36
@idjaw ya, wow.
ok
I just won't bother using it I guess
wife and I just started watching Westworld
so far so good
@enderland SOBiotics would be the closest thing
user559633
lol new favorite thing: showed gf epic sax guy. no reaction to neon violin or epic sax guy
user559633
eastern europeans have been added to tristan's list of favorite things
01:41
I was sold at the spinny violin player
user559633
haha, she just said "oh yeah, moldova" and went back to fixing the (ostensibly subpar) cleaning job i did of the kitchen
@idjaw oh, that just reminded me that I haven't watched the latest episode. Really hoping this is where it picks up, not that the introduction wasn't good.
user559633
@davidism already laughing at "play"
There's a bunch of them, a lot of fans put other things in the box that he's reacting too.
"Rich Evans watches Rich Evans watches the Space Cop trailer"
user559633
i forgot that this movie was made.
user559633
01:48
i started watching best of the worst. good idea. i generally don't like "ha ha it's so bad" stuff, but their spin on it and them letting loose is great
user559633
pro tip: on apple tv's youtube app, you can use initialisms to search -- e.g. Half in the Bag: Robocop can be searched for by "hitb robocop"
Tonight I was introduced to Rich Evans
Tonight has been added to to my favourite nights in a little while
DSM
DSM
Evening cabbage.
cabbage
user559633
Yeah, he's great. He seems like an extremely nice man.
user559633
01:53
Cabbage DSM!
hey DSM
DSM
DSM
We're doing RLM tonight?
user559633
Well, I am. This one review slipped through somehow.
DSM
DSM
In real life I think I'm most like Jim from Canada of all the extended RLM family. Since I'm also from Canada, that seems appropriate.
user559633
02:00
lmao, forgot about ED 209
user559633
@DSM Yeah, they were in 1 of the 2 episodes I watched today. They're a great addition to the element
@idjaw man if they can't figure out commented code like that they are in a rough shape
DSM
DSM
I try to judge true beginners pretty gently. It's really hard to put yourself back in the situation of not knowing what anything means, and it sometimes takes a while to learn the tricks of how to learn things. (It's only recently that I've gotten my mentee at the office to try experimenting at the console.)
I think that there is a pretty immediate difference between a "going to do well" beginner asking "tell me what everything here does" and one who tries to figure something out and asks a beginner question
02:09
well Westworld hooked me in
I'm interested in watching the original 70's movie too, the trailer looked pretty good for it.
Was surprised to learn Michael Crichton wrote and directed it
DSM
DSM
I haven't caught any yet. Is it worth waiting until the first season is done, d'you think?
I'm impatient. I can't do that.
@DSM at least with the first two episodes, I wasn't bothered at all by the minor hooks they ended with.
DSM
DSM
02:14
Hmm. I'm well-supplied for subway reading and viewing for the next while, but maybe I'll put it on deck after that.
The Expanse is another good one that we have to go back to
DSM
DSM
I liked The Expanse. And I think I admired it even more than I liked it: that's the kind of story I want to see told.
 
1 hour later…
03:36
morning
yo
 
2 hours later…
05:48
cbg
 
2 hours later…
07:58
cbg
@DSM Cabbage - really like your approach. You may have noticed I try to be gentle with them.
Cabbage @MartijnPieters, and many congrats on the half mill!
Quite some achievement, and no mean contribution to the Python community
Cabbage
08:14
I read in codementor.io/ama/0926528143/… that Martijn has been coding in Python about as long as me
Which very few can say (I started in 95/96)
I was born in 94
Poke started in 99. (iirc)
I was always struck by the oddness of that - oh, you were born in year {{awesome_album}} came out in.
Morgan was also born in 1994. We both share the same birth month too!
user6568562
08:19
I remember very clearly the year 94, this is depressing : /
(when recruiting, mostly. People finishing high school five years after I graduated from my masters)
1994 was In Utero, Vitalogy, Dune 2 on the Amiga, and buying a really expensive guitar (which I still have)
That's JS -_-
;)
I'm looking for suggestions. I'm Sole Developer in NewCo - this is fine, and I'm still learning a lot - how can I make sure that when I'm working out how to do a thing I do it (or at least refactor it to) the most idiomatic way?
Being on my own, opportunities for code review are limited (although there's some opportunity with the external agency that are doing some migration work for us, but it'll be far from universal)
Sole Developer is an antipattern.
I'd try anttipatterns instead
08:28
I'm already rebuilding in Py3 ;)
sole developer is even worse antipattern than Py2 or PHP
one can do decent PHP that can be fixed... but ..
a sole developer without feedback... with brainfarts, and "it looks so natural to me"
Well, this is the problem that I'm trying to solve.
usually the reasoning starts like this:
"we need to do thing x, but we're short on money, thus we just hire one person to do it"
the end result is that x will be expensive.
Fast, cheap or good: choose any two
08:54
Yep, all of these, except that's not what I'm asking. I'm on my own. i'll muddle through and find ways to fix the various things that are asked of me. In the absence of another developer to give feedback, how can I maximise my learning during this to ensure I'm as idiomatic as possible?
09:05
Cabbage!
Cbg \o
10:00
Cabbage y'all
Cabbage \o
@Withnail My two cents? Get a trusted contractor in periodically to do some code reviews with you
Thanks for that - that's sort of reassuring, as I'm already in the middle of setting that up.
And from a personal perspective, keep doing some work with OP projects, or helping other people.
Just so you're regularly exposed to other people's code
(Haven't figured out a way to get employers to do that on their dollarpound, despite them directly benefiting from it)
10:21
@Withnail in any case you want to have someone else...
one way or another,
10:46
@Withnail I think you're doing pretty well as you are going: you are mixing with (ostensibly :P) more knowledgeable people and talking about code quality issues. Sprints and conferences can help amazingly, too. I'll be quite happy as a CTO to attest to your employers that they would derive immense benefit from sending you to the occasional condference
You're only round the corner, too. ;)
11:15
PyCharm sucks part 323, cpu usage >300 %
throw out a few cores, it will go down
brief cabbage
and rhubarb
Wot, you in central London?
It feels like I should be looking for a new job again
11:30
@Antti Try applying for SO - Remote
You'll get a diamond free also
11:54
@holdenweb yeah, round by Cardinal Place at Victorai.
We should have lunch or a beer after work some time
It's a trap!
Sorry, I'll stop channelling my inner Ackbar
"Nice little programmer want candy? Just get in the van, I have plenty there"
Would probably work quite well
"here, in the van I've got an interesting problem preloaded on a computer, you think you can solve it?"
user559633
12:30
what just happened here
Cabbage
@idjaw Humour in questionable taste...
ah...there was one I saw recently..
what did the 0 say to the 8
@idjaw Nice belt
12:36
@idjaw do you use hipchat? or is that meme from somewhere else?
I don't use hipchat. That's bad joke eel.
that image is on an emoticon there. so it must be the meme that I missed until now somehow
Here's some fresh blues-rock for you by Manx guitarist Davy Knowles and his band: Outside Woman Blues. It's an old blues song from the 1920s, but Cream did a version on Disraeli Gears
good. The kids are going to listen to this too while I get them ready for daycare
@idjaw "When an eel's in your pants, And you've just got to dance, That's a moray."
12
12:38
^^ well done
Thanks. It's an oldie, but a goodie. :)
user559633
eels are kind of like cpythons
7
Heh.
A 9k user just recommended the csv module for that comma removal gimme teh codez question. :facepalm:
12:51
@PM2Ring I'm not crazy, their latest updates is showing the two same lists right?
it looks like the input/results are the same? — enderland 34 secs ago
@idjaw You're not crazy. I'm not so sure about the OP, though. :)
I think they want something like
l = [i.replace(",", "") for i in input_list]
but that doesn't match their examples (shrug)
This is branching in to XY territory. I am curious to see their source text
But I don't want to ask
oh
he removed the , in the " " of the second string
12:55
It amuses me that he read "you know this list only has one item, right?" and changed the example to a list that contains two lists that each contain one item. But also it makes me sad.
It's nice to see that some OPs appreciate how SO works. I just got another thankyou comment from an OP whose question I hammered.
Thanks! It was very helpful. — Mitchell Duffy 5 mins ago
@idjaw I edited his question to clarify, I guess it's not so bad now
still missing the "what have you tried" but it is at least clear
I'm still annoyed that they still are ignoring the "show your code"
@PM2Ring Happy to see that a few good souls do exist on SO :)
12:58
@PM2Ring A nice change from the "this is not a dupe, you guys all suck"
@enderland It's now a slightly interesting question, but yeah, they ought to show a code attempt.
> This is not a dupe because the target adds 4 numbers and not 5. My question is different.
6
and in the spirit of what should qualify an on-topic complete question, their other question here got four upvotes (1 downvote) showing the same question structure. Just input and expected output...
@idjaw but clearly showing it...
Perfect. Even with my bad output example! Thanks. — Sledro 14 hours ago
ok maybe not. sigh
Oh, yeah you should have seen the original. It was two separate dictionaries. I saw that question yesterday
13:03
I wish that SO would implement my A/B study on prepopulating question boxes
user559633
cv and move on?
@tristan I'm a work in progress on being more zen.....I think I'll take that advice and use it as step 1 in my recovery
rubs ears woossaaa
user559633
I think it's funny when the room swarms for half an hour, because that's hundreds of dollars worth of attention/help on a "gimme the codes"
no we must debate the minutia of whether this particular poster will recover from "gimme teh codez"itis in hopes of eventually finding a cure
13:05
"Please put down your weapon post your code attempt, you have 15 seconds to comply"
What enderland said. Finally, someone understands my question haha, its crazy how hard your rep gets hit before you can even edit the question. — Sledro 22 secs ago
Found a dead link on the front page of the C# documentation... That's comforting.
user559633
/me wonders if he can put up a "code test" website and get free work from the room
"Move. Away. From. The. Terminal"
@holdenweb sounds good - anytime after half term is good.
(My word, that takes us into november)
13:05
@tristan you need to make it offensive enough in order to attract people who need to fix something that is wrong on the internet
That'll be the week after next then, right?
user559633
"Step. Away. From. The. Geese."
@tristan or kill the geese
The only work we do for free is fun work. Every project has non-fun work, so you can't trick us into making a complete project.
Nope, Ignore.
13:06
except Antti, I suspect you could trick him :P
user559633
ah. okay.

I have the following code
- x ;fdsà1!!!

I need it to implement click and drag for React elements. Thanks in advance
@BhargavRao no, he's trying to do find/replace on substrings of a csv rather than just read it
Granted, each person's idea of fun is different, so everyone doing what they consider the fun part will get you closer to being finished than just one person doing the fun part. But there's a lot of overlap.
Yeah, week commencing Nov 1st
@enderland Yep, Realized that. Just read the question which was quite vague and thought that it must be a dupe.
13:08
I find it fun to help people, even people who have no idea what they are doing, because I like teaching others and explaining things (and learning through the process)
user559633
I regret that I get that reference.
Real Winning - Or, How I turned in an entire StackOverflow community in to my employees without them knowing it. For free. - By Tristan.
user559633
1337codetest.io
That week actaully commences 31 Oct, I think. Ive pencilled you in for 12:30 Tuesday 1 Nov if that suits?
13:11
Oh yes, that's right. My week starts Tuesday as there's an Inset day on the monday at school. rolls eyes
D'you have a preferred location?
user559633
Is holdenweb interviewing withnail?
Nah, Luhndun coffee innit.
user559633
I don't know what that is
Inside the Programmer's Studio with your host, Holdenweb.
@enderland Yammed if I know. :)
normally questions are at least sort of understandable in the sense of what the general question is, that one doesn't make any sense at all
I interpret that question as "I have a function that loops through a collection and prints some data. But I decided I don't want the function to print the data, I want the function to return the data as a string. subprocess.check_output can turn output into a string, so I assume I have to use that on my function. How do I do that?"
OP should refactor his function to use return or yield instead of print. Or, if that's impossible for some reason, he should temporarily redirect stdout.
For example, if he has no control over the implementation of PrintInfo and there's no other way to extract the data stored in c
user559633
current pet peeve: recursive licenses.
user559633
> You may use the Licensed Material in any commercial project according to the (Product) Terms of Use;
user559633
13:21
but that's what i'm....reading :(
@Kevin Maybe. If the OP hasn't responded in 5 minutes I'm VTCing as unclear.
Book chat. Trigger Warning contains a complete original Doctor Who story and has thus catapulted to the best book I've checked out this year.
Does it still count as fanfiction if the author previously wrote scripts for the show that made it to air? Discuss.
If Tolkien writes "Bilbo has eleven toes" on a tree in the forest and no one's around to read it, is it canon?
`for c in children:`` guy just self-deleted.
I choose to believe he was illuminated by my amazing comment.
@Kevin I wouldn't class that as fanfiction, but I guess its actual status is a little murky.
user559633
13:29
@Kevin Yes. If he wasn't being paid to work on the source material. It's like how hobby code you write off the clock doesn't count as professional Kevinning
In the Foreword he mentions that he was commissioned to write the story for an official(tm) Doctor Who story collection. I don't recall if it actually made it in or if he made multiple submissions and they accepted the other one, or what. Murkier and murkier.
The non-doctor-who stories are also very good. The Man Who Forgot Ray Bradbury was particularly poignant.
user6568562
Cabbage, everyone [ :
cabbage : ]
user559633
cbg
user6568562
I just finished brushing my brain with the functions section from Data Structure and Algorithms in Python. Man, not encountering a single analogy feels damn good
user6568562
13:44
There's also a nice book I recommend for productive people : Deep Work : Rules for Focused Success in a Distracted World. But I felt offended with every paragraph. What am I ? Made of actual strength ?
@randomhopeful I've actually been considering how distracted I am at work and trying to think through the longer term implications on my career
user6568562
@enderland True, me too. Not really my career but my skill set. My sarcasm aside, it is a good book to have by yourself. And quite simply, either you grow your set of skills or you'll wake up one day finding your job outsourced or replaced by an algorithm.
I've wondered whether the internet actually is a net benefit, or hinderance, towards me becoming a good developer
benefit
Having coded back in the days of books and 56k modems. Definitely infinitely more productive now
user6568562
Benefit as a terrific conduit for reliable information. Hindrance because it's f*cking distracting
13:48
@IntrepidBrit but, are you more productive now because you had a solid foundation of "how to learn" that the internet has limited development in?
Oh gosh no. I just learned to do it the same way, just more slowly and painfully
the main problem I have is the abundance of 'easy answers' to questions means it's very easy for me to not actually LEARN what I'm doing - and this is someone who clearly cares, given that I'm on SE at all, and asking questions which approach the why
user6568562
@tristan That same one ! Extremely well organized. You start with data types, then operators, then functions (including what could you call a function, and what could you call a method). I hopped along the chapters for days, then, started back from the bottom
user559633
@randomhopeful Nice! I have the C++ version and have been meaning to go through it
user6568562
13:52
@tristan I'm sure you'll appreciate it. Not a single Think of X as a kind of Y. A blessing : D
user559633
Yeah. I keep starting it, then I don't write C++ for 6 months, so them I end up spending more time re-acclimating to my C++ env and syntax than actually learning :|
user6568562
I can imagine that + C++ looks like it ain't playin'
@tristan do it in rust instead!
I've finished reading the C# documentation. I learned 12 new things, 3 of which are actually useful, 1 of which I will likely still remember a week from now.
Sorry, null coalesce operator, I like you but I definitely will forget about you during the next blue moon where you could be used.
14:02
I prefer not having null at all :)
option type is always nice
Hopefully they will be able to fix the null problem.
Was scheduled for C#7 but got dropped.
Null problem?
That null is the default for reference types.
Makes illegal state the default a large % of the times.
user559633
@FlorianMargaine a good suggestion, but i'm using c++ for some other stuff in my stack (via libraries) that i'm not smart enough to port to rust
Explicit nullability like for value types will be nice.
14:05
Oh. I'm in the habit of accompanying all my variable declarations with an accompanying assignment, so that doesn't come up for me often.
This means that I can't put all my declarations up at the top of the function, but I don't like doing that anyway, so I have lost nothing.
Can happen in every public method no? That someone passes in null.
Sure but I classify that as a different kind of error than "whoops you forgot to assign anything at all to this before using it". If your naughty user assigns null to your property, it's still an assignment.
Yeah but still nice if the type system allows you to express that null is not a valid value.
I wouldn't object to a feature like that.
:)
Same with range types, they are probably trickier.
14:14
Here's a fresh prog-rock style track from that Yorkshire lass, Chantel McGregor Sweetness in the Barnyard.
hello everyone! Help pls. I got a string with bytes value in it "b'\\xff...'". How can I convert it to bytes and then decode?
ast.literal_eval, maybe?
Why do you have the text representation of some bytes? Just decode the original bytes.
^ Also that
@MaxLunar You could use ast.literal_eval. But it looks like you're doing something odd. Why do you have a byte string embedded in a normal (Unicode) string?
DSM
DSM
14:25
Morning cabbage.
before I start my online interpreter, and I found a way to encode my login and pass. That string - one of stages to decode the original value
morning @DSM
Whatever you're doing, it's not right. See XY Problem.
user559633
garlic
@DSM cabbage
14:26
garlic
cabbage
guys my inability to math is causing me problems
@corvid 1 + 1 = 3?
Solution: learn to math.
Then realize enderland lies. 1 + 1 = 10
Someone's off base here. I can't tell who
4
14:29
clever pun
671
A: Write a program that makes 2 + 2 = 5

user12166Java Reflection is indeed the right way to go with abusing Java... but you need to go deeper than just tweaking some values. import java.lang.reflect.Field; public class Main { public static void main(String[] args) throws Exception { Class cache = Integer.class.getDeclaredClasses...

wow that java solution is evil
lol, the C solution is the best.
Here's Susan Tedeschi singing & playing her little heart out on the old B. B. King number, How Blue Can You Get?.
14:44
Current status: Looking at a SQL function that implements a (hopefully full) JSON parser…
I think I just cv my first java question because it had an unnecessary python tag
nice
maybe
maybe not
There was a question yesterday, "Which is the best programming language?" with 5 language tags. Some one edited that to leave only the [java] tag.
^^ yeah I posted that in here. It was funny
I wanted to re-edit it the tag out to put Python :P
Nope, It got deleted as soon as it was left with [java] tag
;)
14:55
stackoverflow.com/questions/40111322/… OP copies random code from internet, throws it up as a question and waits for solution.
Today's music will be A Perfect Circle.
Oh, nice.
That's an excellent shout, actually. I'm currently working through Hendrix, currently on Axis: Bold As Love
@idjaw They're looking for a graph, not a multidict. Answering either is relatively straightforward, as soon as they give an mcve.

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