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00:00
If it's OpenSource, you're going to get hacked 20 to 30 times every minute.
I mean, how good can it be if it's written by people for free?
After all, the hackers have the source code (what could be worse?)
if the code is just available for free - how will we publish it?
yo hello guys
@JacobyYarrow cbg
00:27
@Martijn look what I've found:
> When a suggested edit is approved, the user who suggested it gets +2 reputation. The regular daily reputation cap applies, and the total cap for reputation gained via suggested edits is 1,000. Like any other reputation, the +2 is reversed if the edited post is ever deleted.
emphasis mine
so did I misunderstand you, or does the faq need an update?:)
00:46
Random but, anyone else wish that various control structures could `try`/`except` without adding a level of nesting?

`try with open('file', 'r') as f:
pass
except OSError as e:
pass`

`try for i in range(10):
pass
except RandomError as e:
pass`
curious, where would you use that?
so i love context managers, but if the context manager could possibly throw an exception, i need to catch it. but two levels of nesting any time i use such a pattern drives me crazy. i could reduce nesting by not using the context manager, but then i risk unclosed/uncleanedup resources
even just with ... except would be cool
maybe this need is limited to with
for example i have a codebase that uses a with ChangeDirectoryContext(dir): which could fail if the path doesnt exist. but not existing isn't a nominal case, and i feel that readability suffers from the double nesting of try: ... with:
even in this answer for example, with a try: ... for ...: ... except:, it would be sexier with try for ;)
01:07
ah, I most often deal with files through Pandas so I want it to fail loudly for any errors so never ran into that
yeah, makes sense. i wouldnt use it everywhere, but id definitely use it :)
02:00
because im too lazy to try and i bet someone here knows ... if you have a classmethod ... it should have the same id(memory location) everywhere it is available right?
The new documentation feature seems like a more formal version of "Answer your own question." I've only glanced at C-language's documentation page and it appears well organized and insightful.
02:23
@JoranBeasley yeah, because the class itself is an object also
@Byte, yeah, im very happy with it so far
03:19
@Will I've always ensured that the context manager cleans up, e.g.
@contextmanager
def foo():
    try:
        yield something
    finally:
        cleanup(something)
03:37
holy sh**. Okay so every single topic in the Scikit-learn Topic is taken directly from the docs with zero attributes
03:50
@WayneWerner right, it cleans up, but they can still throw exceptions
@Will Well, yeah... but your program should know about exceptions that it cares about
@JGreenwell Zesty!
is anyone can help me solve sqlserver PDO connection issue ?
it does though. see my example above. more specific use case is, with open(...) raises an OSError, but I want to catch it, and then rethrow a friendly error message at the right layer of abstraction
if you have a problem, just give your problem
If it's a Python problem we can sure try to help
i know @WayneWerner sorry buddy emergency
03:55
@Will So... do what you want to do?
@WayneWerner not mython
0
Q: sqlsrv connection lost when iframe load

AshanI have a project in php (fuelphp framework). It's load iframe inside and inside for load window without page refresh. I'm using, IIS server sqlsrv driver use PDO connection mssql server when i load iframe in my application randomly connection lost with sqlserver. which mean PDOException retur...

@Ashan Then why are you asking in the Python room?
@WayneWerner no one in php or sql room. sorry i'm leave now
I flagged 3 of them with a note on the last one that it was same user for every one without citation (yes, BSD license requires a citation) and that it seemed to be the entire topic....not sure what this will do as mods aren't allowed(?) on SOD
@WayneWerner I was discussing a new language feature I'd like to see in Python 4 or something. There's no problem I need help solving. Was just discussing it with people :)
03:58
Ahhh. So you're just dreaming of some new syntax help because something like this is ugly?
exactly :) it crossed my mind a few times and wanted to brainstorm on it a bit
considering I am in academia I don't like plagiarism - and I actually do worry that SOD could start associating SO members with this (not a good thing when your just starting ones academic career)
try:
    with open(...) as f:
        do_something(f)
except:
    print('It broke!')
I wonder... could you write a context manager class that would make things prettier?
Like... maybe...
with DoThingButHandle(something, args=('foo', 'bar'), exceptions=(IOError, OSError, KeyboardInterrupt)) as blearg:
    okay_this_is_pretty_ugly()
heh...one of the excepts in my code prints "It's just a flesh wound."
Very nice
04:25
@AndrasDeak i like cabbage
> I want to rename files so I tried regular expressions
0
Q: Call a child variable in a mother class python

Alfredo AlvaradoI'm trying to access the "Table_Name variable" of the Child class to make the "Load_Data" method do different stuff depending on the child who cast the parent Class. Also, is there method to know the child who summoned the parent class? class DataBaseClass(obj): .. def Load_Data(): ...

> the child who cast the parent Class.
> the child who summoned the parent class
I wanna cast magic missile!
rbrb all!
 
2 hours later…
06:58
@AndrasDeak Ah, no, the FAQ is correct, I was mis-remembering.
Suggested edit reputation counts towards the cap.
I'll update my meta question.
07:54
cbg all
Yeah, the beginner could see that
cbg
Does this thing #soreadytohelp for shirt still apply ?
@MarkoMackic no, that's looong past. Sorry.
:( not cool , it'd be nice to get that shirt :D
morning
well done @PM2Ring
Thanks, Andy.
Nice one @pm2.
08:18
Ta, JRS.
Congrats
Thanks, Marko. Here's a band from Slovenia (The Dreams) doing some American music. Don't Want You No More & It's Not My Cross To Bear
Well we're really close to Slovenia, our language is much like theirs, when they talk slowly :D
To us non-Slavs, you guys all sound the same. :)
Yeah, that's logical, but most of people in Europe know English as it's their native language, because we start learning it so young. So you're not strangers to us
Are you speaking multiple languages or just one
I don't got those ops (usually noobs) that accept answer without upvoting it
08:42
kudos @PM2Ring - a real little Python helper. Well done!
I only speak English, although I did 5 years of French in high school, and I also studied linguistics for a year. I've studied bits and pieces of a couple of other languages, including Russian and Sanskrit, but certainly not enough to do anything useful with them, just enough to get a vague idea of the grammar.
@holdenweb Thanks. It's taken me long enough. But I finally got there. :)
I know may languages; Swedish, English, Python, Java, JavaScript, Swift, Ruby and a little Japanese
@PM2Ring Congratulations!
(let's not mention that I also know how to get around with PHP)
These things tend to go in spurts. Took me like three months to get from 7,800 rep to 8,000, but I've added almost another 200 in the last three days. Just keep chiselling away!
08:47
@Gemtastic Dutch, English, German, French, Norwegian, a little Japanese, Python, Perl, C, JavaScript, Java, and little Ruby.
@PM2Ring Congrats!
Heh, ironic that it's both Japanese and Ruby that I know a little of..
versatility really is the best, isn't it? @MartijnPieters
Ponders installing japanese on my work computer
English, French , Cantonese and learning Python
Thanks, Martijn and Gemtastic.
08:49
:)
Oh , lets not dig into my languages, I know BASIC, Visual Basic 2013, Visual Basic Express Edition 2008, a bit of python .. :P
Wow, almost a year since I last blogged!
You sound like you've got the basics down ;P @MarkoMackic ;P
@MarkoMackic if there were a "how many languages" pissing contest I could win it as long as programming languages were included. Alas natural languages are English (for some value of English) with a smattering of French
I don't get the point of blogging , I just get nervous, I write text 3000 times, and then I realize that it's bullshit, and then give up. I tried many times :D
08:53
@MarkoMackic yes I have a few draft blog posts and no real ones
If you ever hear about a guy getting fired for moaning about how rubbish HR are on his blog, please come on here and comfort me
:)
@Gemtastic you're proficient at java, I liked java for a while, when I was 13 I think :) I learned with help of thenewboston channel on youtube, but now didn't left much of sintax in my head, but as more as I program, more I spot similarities between the languages.. :)
Happy Friday everyone
@MarkoMackic that's kinda how I feel about C++; I tried it in senior high and doing java I feel a bit refreshed
09:09
o/ @IntrepidBrit
@IntrepidBrit bah humbug :)
What's up pup?
morning everyone!
anyone knows how to list all class names in a package in python?
@IntrepidBrit Nothing... just felt like saying that :)
09:33
Fair enough!
I also feel like saying "haggis" - just 'cos I can
but it's probably best I just stop throwing out random words - that's how salad started :)
Salad is not a dirty word... crevice is
09:52
@MarkoMackic - Java is Object-Oriented COBOL artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=42242
That one certainly brought them out of the woodwork
10:03
@JonClements thought you'd seen a Christmas advert or something!
@holdenweb probably not long until we do - I mean - it's almost August... surely we must be getting ready to advertise for Easter in September...
It's a little bit early for Christmas adverts, isn't it? OTOH, there are many people in Australia who like to have "Christmas in July" parties.
10:16
Local carvery is taking Christmas bookings already. Tis disgusting.
10:29
@Ffisegydd for Christmas 2017, right?
@MartijnPieters Of course - gotta spend the time making sure you get a decent three ghosts :)
Martijn, Jon, are mods sill powerless on docs?
@AndrasDeak I think some stuff just happens, but I've been ignoring it - @Martijn is more au fait than I am :)
my main question is: can you do anything about plagiarized content?
10:39
possibly? Not sure... does seem to be an overlap between people that plag. on Docs that also plag. on Q&A... suspending them on main locks 'em out of docs... but don't think there's anything directly specific to docs
because I'm planning to get some new enemies on meta:P
I hear collecting enemies isn't supposedly as good as trying to collect all the pokemon? :p
maybe I can hatch them as I walk around the city...
@AndrasDeak I for one support the decision to let staff do the moderation. I quickly learned to let things go, it'll all sort itself out in the end.
how can I contact staff about plagiarists?:P
10:44
Staff doing moderation means they see the pain points for themselves, rather than adding more work on top of our already strained flag queue.
@AndrasDeak Do what Undo recommended: flag a Question or Answer post by the plagiarist, linking to the plagiarism.
and we can take a look too.
I know, not ideal.
I'm sure it'll be solved eventually.
But I reaaaally want to post my "Documentation plagiarists wall of shame" meta post:D
3
The thing is, nothing is set in stone. Not even reputation earned from anything you have done so far.
@MartijnPieters do you happen to have a link to that recommendation? I haven't heard of it yet
@MartijnPieters I hope that's so...
22
A: What is currently being done to keep plagiarists at bay?

Undo"In need of moderator intervention" flags on Documentation don't seem to be real flags yet; they show up as improvement requests and don't enter the moderator queue. I would treat this as any other plagiarism case: valid grounds for warning and suspension. If they're abusing Documentation, they'...

@MartijnPieters ah, thank you
OK, I'll postpone my wall of shame post...
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGHHHHHH
I wrote a lengthy and informative flag, had to use a url shortener since one of the sources is on google books. It let me spend ten minutes on the flag, then on submit told me "Mwhaha, loser". Flag gone without a trace.
fuck it
I'll just write my meta later when I get home
we don't need flags, we need vigilantes vigilant community members
11:06
@AndrasDeak :-(
Wow.. was Mad Eye Moody present for a moment? :p
11:34
Unlucky, @Andras. I flagged one the other day and it went in an "improvement request". I also explained the meaning of plagiarism to the "author" in the docs chat and they took it down themselves. It is a real issue in some of the docs stuff, though.
I've adopted Martijn's position basically, though:
> I quickly learned to let things go, it'll all sort itself out in the end.
If you were asked to pass a protocol into a function would you expect to pass (for instance) http or http://?
@Ffisegydd the former
Good answer.
11:37
:// is just cruft.
@Ffisegydd Technically speaking that's a "scheme" rather than a protocol. And the colon and the slashes aren't part of it
Bah you're right.
I have httP (protocol) in my head.
You have something against other people being right?
Always.
11:40
That'll lead to tears ...
What'll lead to tears? I've changed it to scheme as you're of course right.
I'm intrigued now, why is http not a protocol, despite its name?
import urllib.parse
urllib.parse.urlsplit('http://chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/6/python')
# SplitResult(scheme='http', netloc='chat.stackoverflow.com', path='/rooms/6/python', query='', fragment='')
@JRichardSnape I assume that http is a protocol, but it's also a scheme.
Does the same also hold for FTP?
P.S. Not being snarky, I truly don't know the answer here. Is it just because it's part of a URL string?
11:44
ahh.. is it URL or URI? :p
You beat me - I was just about to ask that question too.
Now reading RFCs - thanks for distraction tools...
No worries.
@holdenweb The "Bah" is directed at himself, not at you.
It's a Welsh thing. :)
Mmm, and Northern. I frequently "Bah" at my own lack of education/knowledge. "Baa" is more Welsh specific ;)
11:49
I'm going to go blog about your racist antics and lack of sensitivity on tumblr.
I shall counter-post an amusing gif on the subject on tumblr.
We should start chipmunking instead of rick-rolling...
Cabbage, @khajvah. How are things today in Armenia?
@PM2Ring Nothing new yet. They stopped mass arrests for now.
Well I guess that's an improvement.
11:55
I wouldn't say so. They can start the same thing at any point. Nothing prevents that.
Well, my search for URI schemes turned up a lot more than I expected. Some pretty esoteric ones in there. TIL - thanks @holdenweb for piquing my interest.
@JRichardSnape Happy to pique!
After all, it's not like an exam, where piquing would be strictly forbidden
Steve Steve Steve :)
I'm really enjoying Scala.
12:08
Ah, you've found my level of punning. Lovely.
12:20
Think it's dead... either that or playing possum... weird looking things... quite fascinating what nature produces...
A moth. It may just be 'sleeping' if it is nocturnal.
Well, if it's just sleeping, it'd better stop doing it before the dog notices it...
I'd have thought the dog was more likely to notice motion than stillness
12:39
Depends... he won't be noticing much for a while anyway - he's sound asleep himself :)
Cool video of our office and what we do here: facebook.com/FacebookCareersEMEA/videos/1007452922686594
12:55
@Martijn other than enjoy good food, a stocked bar and get to play with cool gadgets - you actually do something? :p
morning everyone
Morning cabbage.
In the IntrepidOffice - PIZZA
(no login required, my mistake, loaded the wrong URL before)
@JonClements don't forget the fantastic guest speakers and other celebs ;-)
Dame Stephanie Shirley last week, visit by Grumpy Cat, we had Deborah Frances-White recently, etc.
I assume Martijn's workplace is a lot like the beam breaking complex in The Dark Tower. He sits in an easy chair by the fire while his dark masters mystically leech the coding energy from him.
(Don't worry, it grows back)
13:08
cabbage
Office of corvid: I found a small nook that you have to take a ladder to get to and it's super comfortable up here
Very cozy once you clear out the skeleton of the previous inhabitant.
that's who reviews my pull requests
cbg all
@corvid now I've started imagining you on the roof
13:15
Skeletons make pretty good coworkers if you can stand the unending stream of bone puns.
heh...my "office" is the back corner of one of IT's rooms
in Cambridge there are a few places where there are gardens on the roof, so one time I did work on the roof of a building
@Kevin makes one wonder who'd be the ka-tet of this group? I say thankee sai!
oh, that's a nice one. I remember rooftop gardens in Chicago but most weren't that nice
13:17
cbg
@Jon Whoever goes to save Martijn from his extremely pleasant imprisonment for the good of the universe, of course
It's right next to Akamai, Microsoft, and the MIT computer science building
@Kevin that sounds like hard work... so it's not me :)
I'm not going to volunteer to play Oy...
user image
5
Picture this: someone contacted you about a job at your startup/company under an alias. They're a great fit for the job, and you decide that you'll hire them. When you respond to them, they disclose that their real name (and possibly the country of residence) is different, but the rest of the information is accurate. Would you still hire them?
Let's say that you do actually have a startup/company
13:23
no
trust is important, I have to trust that the rest of the information is correct, and that not only makes me distrust the other information provided it makes me wonder why they needed an alias
Country of residence versus company location can probably be a big deal, and name effects background checks, etc.
Depends on how good their justification was. The bar for me hiring them is set at "really really good".
The rooftop garden on city hall was pretty nice (and open to the public a good bit of the time)
Like, if it involves escaping from the watchful eye of a discriminatory fascist government, that's a start.
13:27
Thanks for the input, I appreciate it
I would still judge them. For all they know, I'm a mole of that discriminatory fascist government and they've revealed that they are Bruce Wayne too soon
But no, seriously. All about trust. I'm a one man band, and I would currently rather employ an absolute hack that I could trust, rather than a "coder/rockstar" that I couldn't
You don't need to trust your developers if your testing suite is thorough enough :-P
How can I trust my workers to produce accurate code? Oh yeah, by looking at this friendly green light that says "100% passed"
For the first time, one of those "we're a recruiter that analyzed your github profile" emails actually found a good match: remote work, cool sounding company / team, would be working directly with Flask. Unfortunately, the pay is below what I make now and I wouldn't get any of the other benefits I currently get. :-(
Riley Banks is becoming more and more burdensome for me :/ I can't even write a "real" CV for him
you have to trust that they are actually as good as they thought they were. Hired an intern once who passed all the Java problems he was given, 90s, but ended up he had cheated - more just studied for specific questions and parroted information - and cost our company time and resources we didn't need to lose
13:30
The tricky part is writing a unit test that fails if your programmer sends a copy of your proprietary algorithm to his secret communist spymaster.
I personally think I'm going to go down the absolute yammer road, and hire on a string of unpaid interns. The first one that seems like a good fit will actually get hired
I'll note we also hired an intern who came in stating he only had a basic understanding of Java, demonstrated a solid knowledge of algorithms and data structures, and we were able to train him and moved him to actual position
actually, that kid turned into a really good employee (really loyal to the company for giving him chance & training)
@vaultah Riley has always had an air of mystery... maybe the lack of CV just adds to that :)
yeah, totally
no work experience, no education, at least he has a Stack Overflow profile
and Twitter :[ Maybe it's time to merge him and <my real name>
okay, I think I cleaned out scikit-learn....for now
13:38
@JGreenwell the no walls part is slightly scary
@vaultah I don't know what your circumstances are, but it might not be as bad as you think. I was pretty worried about associating real information with online information for a while.
@corvid its a really big roof - and there were rails IIRC - but yeah part of the fun is that Chicago wind whipping around you
@MartijnPieters It resurfaced! Everyone was really nice to me that day.
> Programming is a skill that all psychology students should learn.
that statement makes me happy :)
@idjaw did you shave that day or is your photo here really old? :-D
13:42
> Programming is a skill that all psychology students most people should learn
At least at a rudimentary level
one step at a time corvid, we'll get 'em all
@MartijnPieters The photo was taken right before they got in touch with me. I thought I'd clean up a bit before my big break.
@corvid by the way his personal blog (linked in that article) expands that quote to Everyone should learn computer programming. It should be taught to our kids, in our school.
@idjaw It's amazing you haven't been invited for a lead role in the lego movies... :(
Here's some fresh fish for your listening pleasure. The Samantha Fish band with special guest Sara Morgan performing a rather swampy number, No Angels. Get it while it's hot. :)
13:57
I saw what you did there
@JonClements that was a very dark time. I let the immediate fame get to my head. We decided to part ways. It was for the best.

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