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12:21 AM
 
 
4 hours later…
4:14 AM
 
5:12 AM
 
 
1 hour later…
@TylerH I'm good with deleting answers on the second page that don't answer the question. :-)
Oh... did you already request that they be deleted in here? Good.
@VLAZ Dharman was hardly the first moderator to run on that platform. It's a long and proud tradition.
 
7:05 AM
@gre_gor What's the typo? Why does that need to be closed?
 
7:21 AM
@CodyGray They used document.querySelector("button") which doesn't select the button they need (because there is another one, the mobile menu one). If there is something else wrong, it also needs more debugging details.
 
That's not a typo... that's a bug in the code.
That the code is wrong and produces the wrong result is not a reason to close a question as a typo.
 
KGG
7:36 AM
Hmm.. Its really sad when 7 questions just got asked within the hour and all need to be reported :(
 
7:50 AM
@CodyGray Then it can be considered "not reproachable" as their shown code works and we shouldn't need to visit their site to see the problem.
 
@CodyGray to be fair the flagger self-retracted in <20 seconds
 
@gre_gor Err... okay, that's an entirely different thing. Your previous response (and the comments) made it sound like the code did not work as shown. Now you're saying that it does?
 
@CodyGray The code in the question itself works. When blindly embedded into a full site (that's only available behind a link) it doesn't.
 
KGG
I was wondering, Did I flag this correctly?
 
@KGG Doesn't look off-topic - it's about programming - just woefully lacking in details. Better to flag as NDD
 
KGG
8:02 AM
@CertainPerformance Awesome, thank you :)
 
@SmokeDetector edited by Suraj to remove the annoji
 
KGG
Can I also bring to the attention The comment in this question is not appropriate chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/55909467#55909467
 
@KGG flagging it was the correct approach (gone now)
 
@KGG probably better to link to the actual comment, you get a link when you click on the timestamp
 
KGG
@tripleee I never realized I could click on the timestamp to get the URL :O :O thank you!
@RyanM Appreciate that thank you.
 
8:46 AM
I love that they didn't even vote to close after leaving that comment. They obviously think it's either unclear or too broad, but thought that the comment was the best way to express that...
 
@MrUpsidown the formatting doesn't work when you post a multi-line message; you'll want to break these up into separate messages
 
@tripleee yup, sorry about that
 
9:07 AM
@Adriaan that's just pointing to the Android source code for reference, not their code
 
@RyanM ah ok. I'd still like to see the flow itself in that case, but if it's clear to SMEs it should be fine
 
I'm not an SME so I can't vouch for that
never used that device management stuff (source.android.com/docs/devices/admin/provision)
 
Can a RO thrash this request cc @RyanM?
 
10:39 AM
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null (per request)
 
11:00 AM
@CodyGray should I withdraw my cv on this after your edit? It still seems somewhat broad, but closing as a resource request might not be helpful to the OP?
 
Yeah, I don't think closing that as a resource request is useful at all, certainly not within the spirit of what that close reason was meant for.
It may be too broad; I lack the subject-matter expertise to make that determination.
 
yeah, I'd go with that, needs more focus
 
cv withdrawn
 
11:16 AM
@snakecharmerb I've gone ahead with "needs more focus", because I think that's reasonable.
 
Works for me, thanks.
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels There is code provided in that question. What is it missing to make it a MCVE?
 
11:29 AM
@CodyGray: debugging information such as what is in the problemsId array and how the array might change when the daoProblems.getCustomerProblems(...) is called.
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels Seems like it would be useful to tell them that along with closing their question, eh? A silent closure of a question that lacks an MCVE is reasonable when the question contains no code at all. When it contains what the asker probably thinks is an MCVE, the closure will just frustrate them because they will not understand why what they provided is not sufficient, and thus it will be very unlikely to have the desired effect (namely, the question getting edited with the required information and reopened).
 
@CodyGray Isn't that why the closed sign contains a link to explain how to write a mre?
 
No, of course not.
The closure banner doesn't contain links in order to encourage close-voters to be lazy.
 
@CodyGray the request for more information was already well-requested in comments, don't you think?
 
I definitely do not, as it was not at all clear to me.
 
11:33 AM
"What's in your problemsid array when you run this?" -- no reply from the OP
 
Were I that person, I would have had absolutely no idea why my question was closed, or why y'all were asking for example code when I clearly provided such.
 
"What makes you think both if/else are running? This is in a for-loop so chances are, in one iteration the if block runs, in the other iteration the else block runs. You can easily confirm that by adding a log line to print in each if/else and include the i variable." -- no reply from the OP
 
I'd probably make a YouTube video ranting about unhelpful moderators on Stack Overflow.
So... those are debugging questions/suggestions left as comments. None of those are reasons to close the question.
 
The reason it was closed was because it lacked debugging information
 
A lack of a reply is never a reason to close a question, because the presence of a reply is never a reason not to close a question.
Yes, and it was unclear what debugging information it lacked.
 
11:35 AM
If you want to re-open it, then please do so
 
No, I don't want to reopen it. I want people to actually provide useful information to the person whose question has been closed so that they can understand what is missing and what they need to do to get it reopened!
 
12:02 PM
Noted, and I try to do just this most times
 
12:56 PM
 
Morning
 
1:54 PM
@Adriaan is that an ads link? The link actually points to rads.stackoverflow.com/...
 
@Cristik yes, amazon.com link
 
but it's from the SO domain
this is what made me curious
 
@Cristik weird; it's a raw amazon link, check the raw source
 
@Cristik Amazon links are rewritten to SO affiliate links for Amazon
 
Paid-for spam? Sponsored spam?
 
1:57 PM
@AdrianMole Technically, it's spam where SO gets a cut if anybody orders the item off Amazon.
 
@VLAZ interesting, does that mean SO is monetizing the Amazon links people put in their posts?
 
@Cristik Yes. Mentioned somewhere on the metas.
 
I can't imagine the rewards are significant, but a side effect is that it neutralizes any affiliate link the OP tried to put there
 
@tripleee Well, except if OP directly benefits from the sale. Which might be the case in the Smokey report. The author and the user share a family name. Not sure if they are the same person, though.
 
@VLAZ avatar is the same as the image on the book
 
2:01 PM
I see. So, it's clearly the book posting! /s
 
2:25 PM
Lol RE: that book spam. Out of curiosity I checked the reviews on amazon. All reviews were from people from India - the first one even from a person with the exact same name as the author. And almost all were 5 stars. Only one review gives it one star. Not sure if it's thrown in for "authenticity" or does it happen to be genuine.
 
3:03 PM
@CertainPerformance The acronym NDD really makes me want that close reason to change back to "Needs a Minimal Reproducible Example"
because I always think people mean "Needs Details/Clarity" when they say NDD
 
@TylerH Reminds me a lot of ADD whenever I see it. So I have to actively guide away from potential health conditions to on-site acronyms.
 
what is the policy again for questions that are duplicates but have a bounty active?
is it worth mod flagging those?
 
Depends how long the bounty has been running. If it's within a day or so, I'll refund the bounty. But beyond that, all you're doing is giving them free publicity
 
It was just posted I think; expires in 7 days. I'll flag it
 
Can someone put a bounty on their question if it already has one/two close vote(s)?
 
3:13 PM
@AdrianMole Yes
I am pretty sure it has been done before to prevent closure
 
Seems like a dodge to force those CVs to expire, is not?
 
Yes
 
3:30 PM
@AdrianMole It doesn't expire them, but it does put the process on hold. Keep in mind, you have two days to close it before you can bounty it
In other news, Stack Exchange is handing out free cookies. Click here for details
 
@Machavity Is the expiration of CVs put on hold during a bounty, then? If I cast a CV, then the question get bountied, does my CV expire in X+7 days (where X is the original expiration time)?
 
I have already been re-prompted for Cookie Consent twice, today.
 
(well,more like X+Y where Y is the time it takes for the bounty to end)
@AdrianMole Get on my level: four times.
Seems it stopped prompting me, though.
 
@VLAZ No. But CVs are good for 2 weeks. A bounty would need to wait a full week to use it as a way to force them to expire
 
@AdrianMole I has to confirm twice as well, haven't been repromted since.
 
3:36 PM
I was prompted twice as well and left a comment to that regard under the announcement
@Machavity It does help age it out of the review queue, though
 
That it might
 
@TylerH Yeah, good question. It takes four days for it to expire from the queue, IIRC.
 
Why would a question that has a bounty put on it even stay in the CV queue?
 
because the review system is garbage
 
Has anyone ever seen a bountied question while reviewing CV?
 
3:40 PM
@AdrianMole I suspect it would remove it immediately
which is still helpful for aging it out of the queue, in a manner of speaking
 
Who wants to donate 25 Unicorn Pointz to science: Pick a question in the CV queue and offer a bounty on it; then we can see if it's still in the review queue after a few minutes. :)
 
that would involve opening the review queue tho
 
@AdrianMole Kind of asking the wrong question there. We're all reading tea leaves and throwing chicken bones to figure out how most systems on SE work. I mean, there is documentation but the tea leaves and chicken bones are more reliable than scouring Meta, maybe finding something that's outdated, or even if it isn't, it might be incomplete.
 
i mean, i doubt most staff know how it actually works
it's not a teams or collectives tool
 
@KevinB won't get fooled again, eh
 
3:45 PM
@KevinB I can find a review queue item and post a 'permalink' to it. But I don't have enough rep to start throwing it away on vaguely scientific experiments. :)
 
I mean you do have quite a lot of reputation
 
My reputation is all bad, though.
 
in b4 a joan jett song reference
 
i'm 8 skips in and i've skipped 3 audits
the audits are the only ones old enough to even be bountied
 
Heh - Maybe posting a bounty is a new way to disable dodgy audits? xD
 
3:49 PM
seems kinda abusive tho to apply a bounty to a legit post for the purpose of testing
 
I asked a new question, I can post a bounty on it in two days, but I doubt it will land in close queue
 
If only the devs had a test site they could do this in and publish the criteria on a site about SO somehow...
 
@TylerH Test site? Yes, they have that.
 
use the contact us form
i did find a suitable question tho
one that absolutely should be closed
 
I think a more suitable question is one that shouldn't be closed.
 
3:59 PM
Just heard a coworker at a nearby desk read out a URL to someone over the phone
and she said "backslash backslash"
arghhh
 
Bonus points if the person on the other end understood?
 
lol. Can't tell you how many times I tell someone to use backslash and they use forward instead. I try to educate them by pointing out a backslash leans back, while a forward slash leans forward
 
I always had to say "The slash underneath the question mark"
 
i always just don't state that part of the url
let the browser figure it out
 
4:22 PM
@NathanOliver Depends on perspective: / has the lower part back. And the "forward" and "back" directions only really make sense if you consider left-to-right text direction as "forward".
 
@VLAZ If you are standing and lean forward your top is in front of your bottom. And of course is consider left-to-right, I'm American, no other system exists (looks at you made up grams and meters) ;)
 
@NathanOliver *gasp* Santa was already taken away from me, now I find grandma is also made up!
 
🎅
 
@KevinB 😢
 
4:39 PM
@Machavity Close-votes (and close-flags) are aged away between 3.5 to 4.5 days after being cast if the question has > 100 views, depending on when the vote was cast relative to when the job which performs the aging away task is run during the day. That timeframe is 13.5 to 14.5 days if the question is <= 100 views. Both timeframes may be extended by additional days, depending on if other people had cast close-votes on the question and when they cast them.
 
Also note that close reviews age faster than the ~14-day time if they don't receive votes/reviews, though I don't remember the exact mechanism/timing
 
@Makyen Ah, I forgot there were additional aging rules. So, yeah, it interferes more than I thought
 
Although I wouldn't be surprised if bounties instantly invalidated a close review (arguably, they should)
 
An auto-flag being raised when a bounty is placed on a question with a close vote seems like it would be helpful.
 
Agreed. Or allowing bountied questions to be closed with, like, 6 CVs or something.
 
4:48 PM
Or just don't let a bounty be placed while there are active close votes on the Q
 
just get rid of the bounty system
 
^ +1
 
that also works
 
ehhhhhhh, there are enough bad CVs that I dunno about that. Making someone wait potentially 2 weeks for a bounty because some 3k user tossed an errant CV on it seems a bit much
without the bounty system, how else would people do extremely obvious sockpuppetry?
 
but do those bad CV's show up on good Qs?
 
4:51 PM
Really though I think most of the problem with the bounty system would be solved by not having bounties entirely prevent question closure
 
So what? Automatically refund the bounty if the question is closed?
 
probably. I think that would be fair
 
I think so. There's some potential for mischief there but unless there's a lot of such mischief, that's probably a reasonable compromise. And it could always be revisited.
 
Yeah. If someone puts a bounty on an unanswered question because they really need the answer, and then some kind soul comes along and points that that it has already been answered (in a duplicate question), then that second user should be able to VTC or hammer it closed. In the latter case, the bounty would obviously be awarded to the hammer-swinger. :)
 
5:07 PM
@AdrianMole How about refund an amount proportional to the time the bounty was active vs the full time for the bounty? Bounties are paying for advertising not for answers. They got a portion of the advertising they were paying for. Shouldn't they actually pay for it?
 
I could get behind that
 
Sounds reasonable. But folks may not be happy that their advertising expenses attracted the wrong sort of attention.
 
This does already happen sometimes, in the form of downvotes.
at any rate yes this will definitely annoy people and maybe mods should have a revert button, but most of the people who would be annoyed by it are those asking and answering off-topic questions
 
@AdrianMole Of course they won't. All most of them want is their problem solved without doing much, if any, work. It's rare for someone in that situation to have put any thought into what's good for the site, other than to oppose the good of the site in favor of obtaining what they desire.
 
5:25 PM
... should this be no repro? stackoverflow.com/questions/75290144/…
 
6:06 PM
@JeanneDark impressive psychic debugging, though...
 
6:33 PM
@Jonas you participate on Server Fault a bit; think this one's suitable for that?
@Cristik I don't think this is opinion-based. It's answerable objectively, and the top answer does so (it's not, for example, about which type of quotes are better in a given situation, which would be opinion-based)
 
7:07 PM
@RyanM yes, I think it is a good question for ServerFault.
 
M--
7:20 PM
this will be deleted in 3 days, so no need to close it. Please discard. Thank you. chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/55912185#55912185
 
ah, sniped
 
@M-- discarded
 
M--
Thank you :)
 
No, thank you, I got a snipe in ;)
 
7:24 PM
@RyanM agreed, binning this request as it's not a matter of opinion; cc @Cristik
 
M--
@KGG OP edited and added code. Is this still No MCVE?
 
@Jonas thanks! sent it over (along with another one that had received an answer)
 
8:07 PM
@Vickel I think I found the start of a new heap to curate if you are interested. stackoverflow.com/q/75302062/2943403
 
a new heap! same as the old heap...
oh joy, just came across some old gems
"is hard coding acceptable"
queue the dogmatic responses in 3, 2, 1...
 
yes but easy coding is preferred
 
Could a 2k-er edit this question to fix the broken code-block formatting? The suggested edit queue is full :(
 
there's... no question there
 
honestly, not easily... they've somehow got a bunch of extra newlines in there.
also it would still lack a question
 
8:22 PM
Maybe "debug my code for me"? That question is... in need of significant improvement to meet standards. I didn't realize the formatting was that broken (side note: is it possible to see the markdown source when the edit queue is full for under 2k-users?)
 
ugh, that really didn't need to be immediately deleted though.
I've seen blatant spam regularly stay on the site longer than that
7
 
i mean, blatant spam is built-in to the site at this point
> Error uploading ad report.
oh look, a new pulse survey, yet again only served to users not blocking ads
 
8:38 PM
@RyanM Look, it takes time to get close votes for that. Oh, wait...
 
What is the custom close reason field but a text box into which to type the names of flags and other invalid close reasons?
 
i mean
that's just your opinion of what is and isn't an invalid close reason
 
 
1 hour later…
9:51 PM
is adding an "s" to the end of a function name a typo
 
Seems like it would be.
 
I could imagine scenarios in which it would not be (e.g, some framework that generates method names based off pluralizing things), but I'm gonna say "usually"
 
Just be careful, Jeff Atwood might bludgeon you with the S ;)
 
@KevinB if you took a nap, then got some coffee, and reviewed the problem or re-wrote that line from scratch, would you make the same error?
 
i mean, given my typing accuracy lately, that's entirely likely
addMeal vs addMeals, when the correct method addMeal only adds a single meal and has no mothod for adding multiple
 
9:58 PM
I would call that a typo all day long
Because careful attention to what you are doing would fix it, even without learning something new
 
but what if i was just hungry and wanted 2 meals
 
run it twice
 
10:17 PM
@KevinB So, that would be addMeal('happy')? :;
 
 
1 hour later…
11:18 PM
@mickmackusa hehe, thanks for the invite!
 
11:52 PM
@RyanM Well, of course! Removing spam takes six flags, whereas deleting a question only requires 3. It would stand to reason that it would, therefore, take about half as much time to get questions deleted as it would to get spam removed. I wonder how our priorities got so mixed up.
@KevinB You know what's great about being a moderator? Our opinions matter. :-D
 

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