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1:55 AM
Think it acceptable to downvote and vote to delete the last 6 of 7 copy/paste duplicate answers? Or is that serial voting? I suspect the automatic flag will get them all eventually.
 
2:42 AM
@U12-Forward I'm not sure how anyone is going to be able to answer that over on CV. I would have closed with a custom reason.
 
@IanCampbell Ah yeah...
 
 
2 hours later…
5:11 AM
Any idea how 3 questions are untagged ? I dont see anything in their timeline. Are people just adding ?
 
@SurajRao I think the system does that if you don't add any tags
 
ohk. arent tags mandatory? I have only seen this before in the case of migration.
 
5:26 AM
@SurajRao It seems that that tag can get added for other reasons than migration; staff deleting the tag, or if the question originally had a single-use tag that died of natural causes. Users also can't actually add that tag directly.
 
@cigien ah ok thanks!
 
np
 
5:45 AM
@DavidBuck self-answer suggests no repro
 
@tripleee I agree, but I went with Debugging details as there's no way of confirming that from the question.
 
5:58 AM
I assume the first sentence in this answer is sufficient to make this not NAA, so I'll just edit the rest of it out unless anyone has a better idea?
 
@VLAZ so a follow-up on the offensive name flag in different language. Flag got processed and marked helpful. In case anybody else wonders how to handle those. The user was nuked. However, I doubt that was just an offensive name thing. From what I saw of the few posts and comments they made, they weren't offensive otherwise. But I'd rather not speculate. I just guess there was something else.
 
6:45 AM
Thanks for the update! Is it possible they decided to delete their own account?
 
@JeanneDark Perhaps but seems like a rather extreme reaction to being asked to change your name (AFAIK, that's the normal result of such a flag). The Q I flagged was also mod deleted but might be unrelated. I guess we'll never know. And to be honest, I don't care that much. Either there was something extra and mods stepped in harsher or not and user perhaps overreacted. Doesn't really matter much in the end, I think.
 
I agree.
 
 
4 hours later…
10:40 AM
Where is advanced flagging gone?
It's back... must have been some hiccup in the US
 
 
1 hour later…
11:44 AM
would this be a comment?
 
12:02 PM
Morning
@SurajRao I think it qualifies as an answer. I left a comment.
 
12:57 PM
Any Laravel experts around who understand the difference between {{ ... }} and {!! ... !!}? Is this answer copied from the other one?
 
I understand
 
Is it significant?
 
Significant yes, but I don't understand the answer yet. Let me read it
 
I added code-fences to make the code similarity more obvious (without them, the <small> tag didn't show).
 
I am more interested to know what is suggested in stackoverflow.com/a/25401545/1839439
Why did they use {{}}?
 
1:02 PM
Is this spam? IIRC there was someone linking a lot to that site a few days ago.
 
@Dharman No idea ... but I didn't get that answer in review ... just the second one. ;-)
{NM - Used the auto-comments ...}
 
[Why not upload images of code/errors when asking a question?](https://meta.stackoverflow.com/q/285551)
 
Thanks, anyway, Jeanne & VLAZ.
 
@AdrianMole I think this is what the question was asking stackoverflow.com/questions/34638287/…
 
1:06 PM
... and it was in an answer. ;-P
 
that +4 answer looks wrong... the new answer looks more correct, but still dubious
 
More correct, or less incorrect?
 
But the second answerer should have explained that {{ was wrong and why ... is not?
 
Let me spend some time and try to clean it up a little
@AdrianMole Ohh yeah, definitely
 
1:10 PM
It's your time, do with it what you will. :)
@Dharman SO my comment was OK, then.
 
1:21 PM
Hmm, they don't have PHP tags so I can't hammer them
 
1:38 PM
Not sure if flag this for non-english or translate and edit the comments...
 
Zoe
@SurajRao It's a code-only answer in its current form
 
@SurajRao Hmm .. a bit tricky. The answer, as it is (although code-only) isn't really flaggable, but it would certainly benefit from some added explanation. That could be done by a third party from the comments (if they were in English) but translating on behalf of the poster is generally frowned-upon.
... second party?
... using non-English variable names, etc., in code is normally OK.
 
current form is code only. so not technically flaggable.
 
I think your comment is sufficient (for now). Maybe you can follow, to see if anything is done to improve it?
 
Heyy a serial vote reversal, nice
first time I've actually had the system detect that in a while
 
1:51 PM
Any native speakers? Does this sentence sound right? Should it be "will" or "would" "Before PHP 8.0.0, if the parameter is neither an object that implements the Countable interface, 1 would be returned, unless a value is null, in which case 0 will be returned."
 
Either is technically correct but it's context-sensitive. However, having would in the first clause and will in the second looks dodgy.
 
Yes, also I see I missed "neither an array nor object"
 
... Because the whole thing is a conditional construct ("if the parameter... unless..."), then I would go with would.
 
@Dharman "will" because you are using present tense
 
ahh, conflicting opinions
 
1:54 PM
"would" is appropriate for present perfect, which you are not using
 
(I'm probably lucky that Cody isn't watching.)
 
@AdrianMole He's probably currently in ELU chat room to discuss question closures on SO ;)
 
@Dharman If you were to say "if the parameter were neither an object [...]" then you would use "would" afterward
That aside, it's not likely anyone will criticize you for either, so long as you use the same word in both locations (e.g. consistency)
However, more importantly is the fact you use "neither" but only have one item you're talking about, not multiple
 
1:58 PM
So it should be "Before PHP 8.0.0, if the parameter is neither an array nor an object that implements the Countable interface, 1 will be returned, unless a value is null, in which case 0 will be returned."
 
neither an object nor a <something>
ah I see, the "an array" got missed in the first quote
@Dharman That's spot on
Actually, is PHP 8 out yet?
 
As of last year
 
Can anyone offer an opinion on a disputed dupe-hammer closure I made? Happy to reverse it, if convicned...
 
oh, ok
that changes everything then; you're actually in past perfect tense
 
My past was tense but far from perfect.
 
2:00 PM
I am in what?
 
so "would" is more appropriate than "will" in that situation (e.g. if you're referencing what would have happened on a previous version)
@Dharman You know tenses, like present, past, future
there are others beyond those three
present perfect, past perfect, future perfect
etc.
 
ok, so what is past perfect?
 
It's not just about tense but also about mood and voice.
 
Just go with "would", it is complicated to explain
 
without were?
 
2:02 PM
"Before PHP 8.0.0, if the parameter was neither an array nor an object that implements the Countable interface, 1 would be returned, unless the value was null, in which case 0 would be returned."
That's how I'd probably do it
 
It's like, "What do you call a man with four trees on his head?" ... A: I don't know, but Edward Woodward would!
 
@AdrianMole Well now you're just confusing the man
 
I am doing this for the PR if you would like more context github.com/php/doc-en/pull/948
 
@AdrianMole I think you're fine leaving it closed. OP can raise a bounty on the canonical asking for a more authoritative/better solution within X parameters if they're unsatisfied. They don't get to ask a separate question asking for something vaguely "better"
Maybe add the Q that the other commenter linked to in the dupes list
 
@TylerH Good idea!
 
2:22 PM
borderline rude
 
i liked the original title better
 
That reminds me.. the "language please" autocomment in socvr only shows up for answers. Do we need it for questions as well?
 
@AdrianMole Sorry, that may be my fault; I mentioned something earlier but I was probably mixing it up with mods' ability to veto the reinstatement of a mod candidate who get de-modded/suspended/whatever. Currently there's no direct path for a moderator to attempt to veto the initial election/candidacy of a person as moderator
 
@TylerH Well, they could probably do so indirectly - a simple, short suspension would make that candidate ineligible. (Not that they'd likely be left untouched for doing such a dastardly deed.)
 
@AdrianMole yeah, that'd probably be invalidated as abuse and the offending mod suspended in turn by the CM team :-P
 
2:37 PM
Couldn't they un-suspend themself?
 
Not if the CM removes their Di'mond.
 
not unless they get elected, which they can't because they are suspended
 
@Dharman It's about the mod suspending the candidate
 
There was a (somewhat different) issue last time: They couldn't delete an account (even though it was requested) for an already-nominated candidate, so they had to suspend, instead. After the election the account was deleted.
 
oh @Dharman I'm super stoked to start learning/using PHP and MySQL! Just pulled this book off the shelf i.stack.imgur.com/bgamV.jpg
;-)
 
2:40 PM
lol
Is this a real book?
 
Yep
 
It's a PHP book - of course it's not real.
 
I suppose it was not a bestseller
 
"visual quickpro" guide
is it a picture book?
 
Does it come with a set of crayons?
 
2:41 PM
It was published while PHP6 was still in development and not yet dropped IIRC
 
For non-PHP folks: PHP 6 was never released and the development scrapped
 
how long was it in development
 
the book I have (I think there were several revisions) was published in 2008
 
I can't find it, but it was a good few years
 
So it was 5 - 7 (rather than 6 - 8)? (Off-by-one error?)
 
2:44 PM
3 editions were published and a 4th edition planned for 2011
 
hey, it uses mysqli at least
 
did it have any super cool features
 
the book or php6?
 
the book
 
Here's a screenshot of how it handled preventing XSS attacks i.stack.imgur.com/ZvqKM.jpg
Um I think it showed you how to implement a full, yet simplistic forum (think phpBB) from scratch
considering it was 2008, it makes sense, since such forums were all the rage then
 
2:47 PM
PHP 6 was meant to make PHP Unicode native. However, that wasn't easy. Unicode is very difficult. Many features that were developed as part of PHP 6 were backported to PHP 5 and then the development continued with PHP 7
 
Was Windows 9 written in/for PHP 6?
 
Would be a great April Fools joke if they announced they were finally releasing the standalone version 6 of PHP next year :-P
"ever wondered what PHP 6 would've looked like? Now you can find out!"
 
windows 9 never existed in any form
 
Nein.
 
> I'm building an integration with a banking system and keep seeing this csrf thing, what is it and how do I generate it?
 
2:53 PM
Found it Good part starts on slide 36
 
@Dharman Lessons learned: practice more with your poo-throwing hand.
 
3:12 PM
@KevinB Well, seven ate 9 :P
 
Wasn't Windows 8.1 an "off-by-nearly-one error"?
 
in PHP, Nov 11 '16 at 13:56, by PeeHaa
WHat about P�wered-By: PHP6
 
3:28 PM
Good old PeeHaa
 
Or, if you prefer, dank PHP memes
 
@SurajRao surely not for at least 10 years
 
3:46 PM
@SurajRao Same point, but without the reference to some refund system :P
 
4:02 PM
@JeanneDark Yes, it's spam, and you're right, it's been spammed before.
 
@cigien thanks
 
4:31 PM
@AdrianMole I see you reported this to SD. It looks like a natural language. Is the translation rude? Machine translation is not helping. It says it's Igbo, but doesn't actually translate it. (We can discuss this in CHQ, but pinging you there isn't working, hence the ping here).
 
@SurajRao now that I see it, its a self duplicate as well
 
5:32 PM
@TylerH Yeah. I know a lot of people are using SEDE - it'd be nice to have a "Calculate my scores" button.
 
5:44 PM
^ link in punctuation. spam?
 
@JeanneDark Usually in. And that was
 
@Machavity thanks. unfortunately someone edited it.
 
7:03 PM
So, now the site is for "asynchronous collaboration and sharing knowledge"?
 
aka it's a help desk
has been for years
 
Have any of the basic rules changed though?
 
They will
Remember, this is the internal voice of the company leaking out.
 
not quite sure what you want that comment to tell us
tink isn't staff?
 
7:10 PM
This isn't really an "internal policy" matter
 
Internal voice ⊂ internal documentation.
 
They don't have internal policy on something like that; they have a public site policy based on what the wording is
 
The public policy is a reflection of what they think internally.
 
there's certainly people with agendas within the company who can make decisions, if that's what you're trying to say
just like in any company/community/group
it's pretty clear they've been trying to boost new user engagement for the past 7-8 years, which changing the things that most push those users away is certainly a valid tactic
the rather poor advice being given to users who have their question closed is a known issue, but now days they don't just fix things on the spot, it goes through a 6-8 month process
 
@Catija Since I have you periodically noticing these replies, any chance we can get the ask question title filter to block titles with the phrase "best practice" in them, pretty please?
 
7:15 PM
@TylerH Is there a request on MSO? We generally aren't going to do anything without that.
 
@TylerH She's right. That is a best practice, you know :P
 
... Wow, I really missed that opportunity. Glad you were there to pick it up for me, @Machavity :P
 
@Catija I think there are 20 or so over the years but let me check...
Oh, nvm, Kevin B did the honors already
Though to be frank it seems odd to see "we aren't gonna make a change without a feature request" when there have been constant changes recently that are not based on feature requests landing on the site (I know that's not necessarily your team, but still...)
 
I mean, you want us to have community discussion with a supportive decision to point to or at least a way to see what the community thinks... and we do, too. Most of the big changes that have been made recently do go through that discussion. I can't block things because they don't. We do what we can and we're making an effort to do better.
 
7:25 PM
I know, I know, I just find it remarkable there's that (perceived, at least) big of a disparity between how different teams operate with regard to the community. FWIW I agree that there should be a discussion to point back to in terms of "people asked for this feature we are implemented"
 
I kinda feel like we get smacked for things like the profile changes and CoSO but no credit for the huge amount of discussion that PubPlat is doing with y'all about outdated answers and review.
 
For outdated answers is a big meh for me. I have to read all answers anyways because there are answers that were posted that never worked.
 
I just don't see either of those projects as... a big deal. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
The unpinning was a big grief for most, since we couldn't as community tell visitors "hey, this is the good one!"
 
and don't particularly take too kindly to an ad/brand awareness campaign being described as a community building opportunity. At best it creates a new leaderboard to attract users to participate specifically in those tags, thus boosting those companies' userbase over their competition rather than growing the whole category of those technologies.
 
7:33 PM
I really have to ask, other than actual documentation, does SE has competition?
Because those are the only things that I use
 
no idea, never used any other.
 
@Catija come on, many folks like the outdated answers project :) And it is, indeed, look very good in terms of at least communicating the intent to us
 
I think the unpinning was a great change
i also think it was way over-researched
 
@OlegValter I'm not saying it's not positively received. I'm saying that when people claim we make changes without talking to the community, it feels like they only look at the places we've failed to do so and not the places where we've come to the community multiple times throughout the project.
 
The changes to the profile were criticized because we lost access to very important information.
 
7:37 PM
@KevinB well, yeah, but this over-research could also be used as a template for projects that do require one badly - despite being an a bit of an ... overkill, the reception is, in general, very warm
 
The look and feel of the new profile page is alright
 
i'm fine with the new design, still hate the font, still missing last active
 
@Dharman I mean... sure. I need that calendar box or something like it. As far as I'm aware, I have no replacement for it that's easily usable. But that's the only thing really bugging me at this point.
 
the userscript for last active screws with the design in a way i don't like
 
calendar box?
 
7:38 PM
yeah i never used teh calendar box
 
Y'all could only see your own.
 
it was an icon you could click to get a calendar popup of your activity
useful for seeing why you lose your streak
 
I could see it for everyone - and so could the mods on the site.
 
I don't think I paid attention to that, because I don't remember it
 
@Catija eh, well, come on, don't you know this is how humanity works? :) you can safely land thousands of planes but the one day you had too little coffee / distracted / too tired and manage to crash one, you are going to get most of the rest overshadowed. And methinks that's to be expected - screwups (and I do think collectives and some... decisions made during the profile page update are screwups) are much more memorable than conduct as usual
 
7:41 PM
i mean
 
@Dharman I think it was pretty infrequently used
 
how else should people react to things they don't want?
 
however, the last active was very frequently used. Only problem is they didn't have any way to collect data on that
 
just let it slide because other areas are working fine?
 
@Catija I think there's been a huge outpouring of thanks and support for the outdated answers project. Unpinning the accepted answer has been one of the single biggest improvement to the network in years
I don't know what all avenues y'all get feedback thru, though, so I can't say if you've received negative reactions outside of Meta posts
Like I said above, I recognize there are different teams. I personally have very little grief with the CM team or their project (at least these days); it's almost all positive stuff
 
7:45 PM
And I appreciate that. I guess... the reason I'm struggling is that you made a point to mention it here and so it felt like you were upset about it.
 
most issues I have w/ changes are the ones that aren't asked for, like design overhauls that... also remove or reorder meaningful data points
@Catija Sorry, it was just surprising to see a staff member (different teams aside) say something like that. It's a pleasant change, to be clear, just... surprising.
 
@TylerH Ah. I guess it is different from my end - it feels like a constant refrain of mine "Is there a meta post about it? If so, throw a status-review tag to get it on our plate". :D
 
8:03 PM
@OlegValter The good old Chernobyl effect
 
@Catija That consistency is much appreciated!
 
@Braiam or Concord catastrophes, I guess - but yeah, one bad day can and does overshadow a lot of "acting as normal"
@Catija on that note... how does one get a tag in a proper manner without poking a mod to death? :) there is a response by a certain bluefeet from 2016 but not much else
 
@OlegValter typically mods just notice them
however you can always mod flag one and request the tag be added if you think it's appropriate, and it's currently missing
 
Flags are usually the best method, yeah.
 
8:12 PM
@TylerH Happy to oblige. :P
 
yeah, I mean, I know they can kind of "grow naturally" on posts but was curious what other venues there are :) [the former part of the response was composed before the replies] Thanks @TylerH, @Catija - it's always nice to have a clear reference
 
@Catija I don't know which team is responsible for the feature directly, but one thing I love about the Review queue redesign project is the review item you're on persisting when you leave and come back/close the tab on accident, etc. In the past it just loaded a new one every time the page loaded, so that session state functionality being added is a neat improvement. If you know the team, feel free to pass on my kudos as a heavy reviewer
 
I assume the review team is lead by Lisa?
 
Well the project was led by Lisa, I thought she was in a research role, though
I could be wrong though
 
Lisa is our primary designer. Anita is the PM and I think Brian and Kristina were doing most of the code.
 
8:17 PM
well, last time I checked they were a senior product (do correct me if I am wrong, @Catija) so I assume they are (were) the one leading the project
 
There's also a UX researcher who does interviews with people and reviews the feedback on meta.
 
Anita?
 
@Catija Ah, nice
 
@TylerH Eh, really? It always gave me a review id.
 
8:23 PM
@Braiam The URL does present an ID for a specific item, yes, but it would change each time you loaded the page, even if you navigated away from the queue and hit the back button in the browser
now it loads the same one that you were previously shown (that hadn't been completed)
You can also F5/refresh and it will still show you the same one, whereas before it would, again, show you a new one
 
I never experienced that. The thing about the id was something that I knew before.
 
@TylerH Hmmm... That's not what I recall happened for me, but I could be misremembering, or a userscript, most likely SOUP, fixed that for me. I specifically recall routinely having to navigate back to the main review page in order to get a new/different review (which I would do for testing to get different reviews without marking reviews as "skipped", so had to do it a significant number of times).
 
8:52 PM
It was a constant occurrence for me, so I suspect a user script was in play for you
 
9:07 PM
 
9:59 PM
@TylerH Actually, I suspect that it was a US at play for you :P
I only installed the cv-pls script recently and before that was bemoaning that we didn't have the keyboard shortcuts in review as well.
 
10:25 PM
 

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