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1:07 AM
 
2:07 AM
RO -- is it possible to retract this cv-pls request? @Makyen? @Machavity? @NathanOliver? The OP has improved the question and has clarified it.
 
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null, by request
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels Well, just this once. But you know how we like closed things... ;)
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels You forgot to ping 2 of the ROs ;)
 
@cigien I was on a ping-a-thon and just got giddy and blinded by the awesome power of it all
 
While I guess it is an "outage", that error is being reported directly in programming tools (Xcode) and will certainly be googled the next time the same error occurs. Leave it undeleted and closed?
 
2:24 AM
@pkamb You're welcome to discuss this, but an actual del-pls request for a post which was deleted by a moderator is invalid in here, because regular users can't do anything about it. In other words, it's not possible for people to vote to undelete, and thus nothing that users in here can do to action the request.
 
@pkamb I'm willing to have it discussed, but my opinion is that Stack Overflow isn't here to be a place where people report outages for websites in order to have a record of the outage available into the future. That is a customer service issue for the website which is having the problem.
 
Specifically my thinking is that all of the other ITMS-XYZ errors for uploading in Xcode are quickly and usefully answered on SO. ITMS-90000 indicates the backend service is down, but is still a very valid answer for the immediate problem occurring in Xcode.
 
@pkamb: that would almost be making this site into a forum -- a place to chat about acute problems and issues that likely have little relevance in a relatively short period of time. This is a useful thing, but not what this site is for. There are other sites for this.
 
Definitely disagree with that. It's not a discussion/chat, it's a specific answer to the problem. The solution is that the ITMS backend is down and that you should wait and try again later (which the error message does not tell you).
(and there additionally may be other reasons for that same error, which now cannot be ever Answered)
 
2:37 AM
@pkamb OK, please explain how a backend website being down is not a customer service issue.
 
Getting the site back up might be a customer service issue. Is that what you mean? That's not what the question is asking.
But receiving IMMS-90000 is an error in a programming IDE with a specific answer of what you should do.
 
3:02 AM
@pkamb As I understand it, the error is being received when the user is trying to submit their program to an app distribution network and it is being rejected due to a service outage. The general case as to issues with such distribution networks being on topic is fairly well covered under Are developer-centric questions about application stores on topic?
The specific issue, in this case, was that it was a temporary service outage, which feels even further into the customer service realm than most that are just "how to". Your argument is basically that we should permit questions which ask about 3rd party websites being down, because programmers use those sites. I don't think SO is wanting to be a collection of completely ineffective "website down" reports, which do nothing other than inform others that, yes, the site is down.
In general, a question being posted about such things when they have happened is tolerated, because it's far easier to let one such question exist during a major outage than try to keep swatting the multiple questions which will be posted if one doesn't exist. Such questions about outages typically are closed as off-topic, with any duplicates closed as dups, then the questions deleted at some point after the outage is over (and past the point people would just create more off-topic questions).
 
3:20 AM
@pkamb To try to be clear, I'm not intending to create a policy by moderator fiat. If you feel strongly about this, perhaps it's something that should be discussed on Meta?
BTW: My understanding from what is stated in the question I deleted is that the error is not, in fact, part of the IDE, but is received in an email response to the submission (based on "There is not more info on this in the rejection email."). Is it really something that is directly in the Xcode IDE?
 
3:43 AM
@Makyen That Robert Harvey answer seems to be referring to App Store policy / moderation, which I agree is off topic for SO. ITMS / Xcode submissions seem to fit more in the "technical questions" examples in Machavity's answer, on topic for SO.
I don't see a difference between the deleted question and this one for a slightly different ITMS error (209 upvotes, 93k views) stackoverflow.com/questions/25680604/…
 
Oh yeah, some service goes down and instead of twitter, people asks on SO...
I find some irony there.
@pkamb BTW, that doesn't seems to be "apple is down, panic" question.
 
Again there was no indication that "Apple is down" when you hit this error... it appeared to be some error that could be fixed by a plist change or bundle structure change, as most Xcode errors are fixed and are on topic for SO. That it's caused by the service down is incidental and a valid Answer.
 
Yeah, still don't like either question, nor the one you linked nor the one you present. They are stuff that Apple should address in their documentation instead of being opaque about it.
 
@pkamb 1. The message is caused by an error on Apple's end (see customer service questions), not a coding issue 2. The message is purely temporary 3. People use these to guess and discuss, not answer
Lest you think this is also something random we've seen that problem before. In virtually all cases, once the outage is resolved, the error never recurs
 
4:02 AM
You have more faith in the iTunesConnect API than I do :)
 
I mean, I have deep respect for someone that knows that is crap yet manage to not take it to the company that made it crap so they fix it...
 
It's not really faith as much as they probably did not plan for [insert critical subsystem here] to go down so they don't have a proper error for it
 
I wonder if it's hamsters or monkeys the problem.
 
so if it had a proper error and error message would it be on-topic..?
 
No, but at least people would know that it's Apple's fault.
I know some will ask here anyways, since no matter how carefully crafted your message is, someone is going to literally not read it and asks others to read it for them.
 
4:11 AM
@pkamb It needs a reproducible error. An error you only see when infrastructure is down (and vomiting anything it happens to find) isn't something useful. In the case of the Google outage, we never saw that error asked about again
 
The Apple one does seemingly have a specific error code, which is the reason I didn't think it should be closed then or deleted now.
 
That's why we limit customer service questions. If your API call worked yesterday but randomly stopped today it's not something we can help debug, especially once it's confirmed it's on the API end
It's also worth noting that that particular error can apparently happen in other contexts as well. A service outage isn't going to help you if you encounter that error
 
 
2 hours later…
6:16 AM
@BhargavRao he wants to pinch you stackoverflow.com/a/66396090/15070659
 
 
1 hour later…
7:41 AM
I don't know js but this looks like a duplicate: stackoverflow.com/q/66380095/11573842
They just need to escape the \n -- surely that has been asked before
 
8:34 AM
@Yatin just move on. Flag for a mod (as I already did). No need to keep commenting, that only feeds the fire.
 
Ok
Sorry, I lost my cool. I will take a break.
 
Don't feel bad about it. It happens to all of us and they were clearly picking a fight.
 
Hm... thanks for reminding me to cool down.
I'll go for a walk or something
 
Yeah, take it easy. This is meant to be fun, not a place to have your blood pressure raise by a few points ...
 
10:05 AM
If I ask a question, then figured out half the issue, what should I do?
Editing the question will make it significantly different from the original.
But if I don't, then it wastes time of the answerers.
 
@user202729 Please edit your question and add any information that will help SO users to answer it. Maybe the answerers will respond to your edit by editing their answers.
 
What if it becomes a new question in a way that might make posted answers nonsense?
(there's no posted answer)
On the other hand, that doesn't make much sense if I figured out the whole solution, right? (post a self-answer)
 
A self-answer would help users who have the same problem to solve theirs, especially if you accept your own answer.
 
 
2 hours later…
11:53 AM
 
12:08 PM
@klutt Is that an 'official' room-request tag? :-)
 
@AdrianMole Yep, they rolled it out last week ;)
 
OK. Must have missed the announcement.
I'm working on the assumption that the clean-up/analysis script won't be able to parse the original request.
 
12:25 PM
@AdrianMole thanks
 
@Yatin Are you sure?
 
@Dharman you got any close votes left?
 
Almost all of them
 
 
2 hours later…
2:25 PM
regarding ^ question, is this NAA?
 
@klutt That seems to have got all confused. Maybe the reopen hammerer will close it (again). Don't think they've cast a close vote (yet).
... beyond this room's remit, now, though, I guess. :(
 
2:50 PM
this is a link only answer?
 
3:01 PM
@Droid Hmmm. Close call. I would not flag it as such but, were I a mod handling an NAA flag on it, I would probably endorse it.
... and that's about as "on the fence" as it gets. :-)
 
3:14 PM
How did this happen? Is it a result of mod-flagging? How can I find only integers with a regular expression?
Does it happen often on the tag?
 
@AnnZen check the timeline. Repeated delete /undelete and Mod locked it
 
3:33 PM
@klutt Please use the prescribed request tags. Doing so helps avoid confusion.
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null: @klutt feel free to re-post with normal request tag(s)
 
@Makyen That's already been closed following a cv-pls in here, so we can't do it again, right? But there seems to have been some confusion between the various commentators.
 
@user202729 Edits which invalidate existing answers are not appropriate. The general policy is that such edits should be rolled back by any user with edit privileges. OTOH, there is considerably more leeway for questions without existing answers.
@AdrianMole I had not seen that there's already a cv-pls request for that question posted. My statement was based on the assumption that the request I moved to /dev/null was the only one which had been posted. No, an additional request is not appropriate.
 
3:49 PM
See - you were right about one thing: confusion. :-)
 
Yep. :)
 
{chocolate biscuits}
 
is (still) burning: Close Queue - Open Qs - Meta - Tracking.
10
 
4:22 PM
@Dharman They edited afterwards. It didn't have a question so details and clarity was needed ;)
@Yatin @rene please trash this
 
Thank you :)
 
 
 
1 hour later…
6:39 PM
@klutt The change to FAQ rule #15 may be applicable here: "You are "involved" in any post for which you have voted in a successful action to change the state of the post to the same state for which you are considering posting a request. In other words, if you've close-voted a question and that vote was the vote, or one of the votes, which caused the question to be closed, you may not post a cv-pls if the question is later reopened."
 
@JeanneDark Ah, sorry
 
@klutt Sorry that it contradicts what I'd previously posted. I did not check to see if you'd participated with a prior closure and was basing my earlier statement only on the request which I'd moved.
 
@Makyen I did participate in the first closing, but that was before the dup close
 
6:56 PM
@klutt Yep. The rule is not intended as "participated in the most recent change to that state", but is intended as "participated in any change to that state", where "state" is open/closed/deleted/undeleted, without regard to the reason for the change to that state (i.e. without regard to the fact that you're asking for closure due to a different close reason).
 
@Makyen Yep, I just forgot about that rule :)
 
7:12 PM
np
 
@JeanneDark Hey, we have cast exactly the same number of votes. (give or take a few due to caching) :)
 
7:31 PM
@tony19 FYI we encourage people to vote themselves on the request they post here.
 
 
1 hour later…
 
1 hour later…
10:07 PM
 
10:20 PM
Would this count as NAA? It's basically saying that the best sort of apple is an apple, is not?
 
I think it is an answer. The question is how best to change the height of a carousel while keeping it full width, and they are saying the best way is to change the height of the source images. Now from my limited knowledge of bootstrap that will probably not work on its own, but it is the start of a solution
 
@AdrianMole it is an answer.
Not an awesome answer (NAAA)
 
@rene Hmmm. I chose to skip it in review.
Probably needs a bit of editing and some contextual text.
 
"Needs author edit"
 
Wrong queue! :-)
 
11:19 PM
out of close votes :(
 
11:49 PM
 

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