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12:00 AM
@AdrianMole LOL ... I'm actually still quite content ;)
 
@RyanM I agree with you, a list of links would be tedious without userscript. But asking "what's my score" is fair enough (I took note, to avoid having to ask twice). If I make it to 10k I'll be able to find the Q's without having to bother anyone.
 
My linux breaks down every time I start it.. with some obscure message that's completely misleading.
 
@tink When I start using a new library it's common to go through old threads, or if you are curating something specific, or looking for duplicates...
 
@bad_coder yeah, agreed. My message was referring to Scratte's suggestion to request "a list of all your deleted posts"
 
@bad_coder fairy nuff =}
 
12:05 AM
@bad_coder The algorithm will look at all your posts for every recalculation. If you can fix some of those deleted ones, it would help a long way to get the badge :)
 
@AdrianMole @Vickel Answers which existed prior to the bounty being placed are not eligible for automatic awarding of 50% of the bounty. OTOH, existing answers are valid for manually awarded bounties. There's even a stock bounty reason for rewarding an existing answer.
 
@Makyen that's what I meant, I still remember all these bounties on Meta when users left bc of Monica
 
@RyanM The last I checked, that userscript only generates a limited list of deleted posts, and only for the author of a question on Meta, with considerable, reasonable restrictions. It's quite useful for that, but when it shows any information is quite limited. It could be modified to do so in other circumstances.
 
@Makyen Ah, rats. I probably shouldn't assume exactly what mod scripts I can't run can do...thanks for setting me straight :-)
 
np
 
12:28 AM
I think Samuel has obliged users that asked on a few occasions. Even if they didn't post a Question about a ban on meta.
 
 
1 hour later…
2:06 AM
Is this an Answer?
 
@Scratte I don't think so.
@KarlKnechtel Then maybe it's not a dupe. Regardless, you haven't actually suggested a target.
 
Yeah.. I'm also in that group of not thinking so. It seems that it takes more than 10 seconds to be sure, if it's at all possible to be sure.
 
Why does one have to decide in 10 seconds?
 
Not sure who came up with the 10 seconds rule. Maybe it's even only 5 seconds. It was a joke about if it takes longer to evaluate for the "Not an Answer" flag, the flag is more likely to get declined :D
 
Oh, I see. That does makes some sense :)
 
2:22 AM
I'm trying to search for it. I'm pretty sure it was mentioned in here.
 
@SotiriosDelimanolis Not sure as I do like Andreas's answer
 
Can a Java SME check this? The target looks wrong (even though the title is identical). The suggestion in the comment is more appropriate, and should be added to the list at least.
 
@RyanM Oops, my custom message has a typo. Is there a way to fix that or is it too late?
 
@cigien nope, but your message seems fine, especially alongside mine
 
2:31 AM
Ok, anyway the editor made a comment on the post, so I can respond there.
 
ah, true! good point.
 
@cigien You need a node.js expert, not a java not, I think :)
 
Oops, that's right. Second silly mistake in a row :(
 
@cigien Knowing nothing about Node.JS, the source seems better than the target: it at least actually has code...
 
@cigien No problem. But from what I can see. The target is wrong. That target is about using the java native interface, which is unlikely to be helpful for the closed Question.
@RyanM Are you confusing the two too? The closed post has no code. But it has a strange target.
 
2:36 AM
@RyanM Oh, you mean the answers? I was confused, because it's the other way around for the questions :p I don't really know, I just noticed the target seemed wrong.
 
@Scratte I'm referring to the answer: I don't really factor the question quality in as much when deciding which way to close older duplicates. The one with the best answers should stay open and have people directed there.
occasionally merges are needed
 
@RyanM That I agree with. The Answer on the closed post is quite good.
But.. the other post isn't asking how to call a java program, but just any. Or rather just a command.
 
I'm not sure the 3 of us should spend too much time on this, given how none of us are SMEs :)
 
Well.. enough to know that the target used is not helpful.
 
Well, for my part, I voted to reopen, as I concur that the target isn't very good.
 
2:45 AM
Is voting to reopen a good idea? If the target needs to be swung around, it'll take 6 votes, and maybe requests in here. I was rather hoping a hammer would just check and do what they felt like.
 
well, at least for the reopen votes, I've never once come anywhere close to using all of mine
 
@cigien I'm not convinced that they do. One is about running a command on windows. The other is about starting a java program. One could argue that it's the same, and that running a java program is just another command, but closing the java one seems not right. And closing the general one on the java one also seems not right.
 
@RyanM No, I didn't mean waste of reopen votes, just an efficiency thing. But I voted to reopen as well, and left a comment explaining what I think should be done. We'll see what happens.
 
As far as flipping the dupe the other way, I'm not too picky about whether that occurs (I don't think either is a great dupe of the other), but I think "both open" is better than "closed in this manner"
 
Fair enough.
 
2:50 AM
@dippas what off-site resource is that asking for?
Seems to be a "how to do X" question, not a "recommend me a library" question
 
@Scratte Are you referring to the suggestion in the comment? i.e. this one? I'm not suggesting we use that as a target anymore.
 
@cigien Yes. Even if we close that one to the other one. It doesn't seem to me to be a good match.
 
Agreed. But I'm not suggesting that.
 
Ahh.. now I see. I'm so slow :(
 
@dippas I think you went off the comment which does suggest an external resource. But the OP is not asking for that. See the new posted answers. Can you review? And trash the request if you agree?
 
3:18 AM
Never seen that description from Smokey before.
 
@Scratte Zero-score, too...
 
It looks like an answer to me, and a useful one at that. I can see why it triggered SD though.
Is there any policy about how soon cv-pls requests can be posted? Especially for posts with high traffic tags?
 
@cigien I do not think so. Other than there's no reason to post them here if they are likely to get closed in the queue or from passers by.
 
Ok, that's what I thought. Thanks.
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels should we assume from your answering the question that the OP has added an MCVE and the request should be binned?
 
3:33 AM
@RyanM Yes, he has updated the question so that now it is answerable. RO (???) please delete my CV request here: chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/51051179#51051179
Don't see a RO around
 
Most recently active seems to be...wow, far down the list. @Makyen appears to be the winner.
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels Just ping the last active one.
 
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null, by request
 
3:53 AM
@rene Even sane people can make mistakes.
@khelwood Or another mod. The answer was deleted in response to a NAA flag. It does look suspiciously like a link-only answer, but I agree with @Scratte that it probably isn't in this particular case.
@AdrianMole Are you kidding?! He absolutely does sarcasm! And also dry humour.
 
I think you're have it the wrong way around. I agree with you ;) How do "we" get it undeleted? Or should "we" not?
 
@cigien I won't speak for what Adrian meant, but... In general, none of the mods really love being called out on Meta. It's just not the kind of thing that anyone likes, having their decisions questioned, much less having their nose rubbed in an actual mistake. But...it's part of the job, so we deal with it. No different for Martijn than any other mod.
@Scratte I'm still trying to read the transcript... Talk less if you want more mod stuff to get done. :-p
@Scratte Perhaps, but it's also of extremely low quality and questionable applicability, so I just deleted it.
@Dharman While everyone is right about popularity being sufficient for the system to automatically nominate questions for re-opening, that isn't what is happening in this case. It's being flagged for re-opening. By the same person each time. I won't say who it is, since that's giving out too much information.
@cigien I think that's reasonable. Rule of thumb: the amount of effort the asker puts into the question should be proportional to the amount of effort you spend dealing with it. That one is pretty low-effort, so closing as a duplicate of the canonical (assuming that the canonical does, in fact, contain enough information to arrive at the answer) strikes me as reasonable.
If there were more effort shown, like some indication they'd already looked at the canonical, then it would not be appropriate to close it as a dupe.
(Oh, you agree with me; that's convenient.)
@tink Truthfully, it only makes sense to close these old questions if they are causing harm (for example, attracting low-quality answers). Otherwise, it's a major waste of time to go digging for old questions to close. If you come across them naturally when searching the site, and they are clearly off-topic, maybe it makes sense to throw a close vote on there. At least you could argue that if you found it, others probably will/are, too.
But don't just do a keyword search to find and close these.
@JeanneDark That post was indeed rude. A rude/abusive flag would be appropriate, as would a NAA flag. Whatever speaks to you. It was rude enough in my view, especially combined with another answer by the same user, that I thought a moderator should remind them of our Code of Conduct. (cc @cigien @AdrianMole @10Rep)
@Scratte That post got an upvote from me. Honestly, what else could you want out of life? Is there any higher achievement for a Meta question?
Snarkiness aside, you can't judge the quality of feature requests by how often they get implemented by the team. Look at what happened with the improvements to the review queue. How many years did that take? Whose failure was that? The people who proposed them? Or...somebody else's?
@cigien I'm confused about what part you're confused about. Writing a novella is not programming. Even if it's a novella about programming.
For questions to be on-topic here, they either need to be about programming tools or about using tools for the express purpose of programming. Spell-checking a novella is not programming. Vim is not inherently a programming tool (it's a text editor). Thus, not on-topic.
 
4:19 AM
@CodyGray I think we may be bordering a voting ring on meta. I seem to recall you mentioned upvoting one or two of my other meta posts ;)
 
Yeah, I may have accidentally upvoted both of the questions you ever posted. Imagine if you posted more.
Fun fact: there is one user whom I have voted up 439 times on Meta. That user is not Scratte (obviously, since he hasn't posted nearly that many times).
 
@CodyGray That would be a problem. I really can't have my Questions becoming questions ;)
Answers are easier, since answers can be deleted..
 
When someone helpfully fixes your Germanglish?
 
@CodyGray Their username starts with j?
 
@CodyGray MSO or MSE?
 
4:22 AM
Capitalizing regular nouns, commas after the word "that", occasional misspelling of "is" as "ist", ...
 
@CodyGray No.. it's just like I don't call you cody, but Cody. Since you're so special.
 
Is it just me or is "I have to go for the night" a poor reason to accept an answer.
 
@RyanM MSO. It's far easier to check this information when you have mod tools, so definitely MSO.
@Scratte Since names are a proper noun, this is correct. "Answer" is not a proper noun. Now, I guess you could give names to each of your answers, then you could speak of, "Someone has downvoted Suzy!" and "What idiot voted to close Madison?!"
@Scratte Username? No.
 
I think Zalgo is a proper noun for an answer by now.
 
@CodyGray Heh.. almost about to say real name now.
 
4:25 AM
@Joshua I would say that's quite a poor reason, yes. But not really as far as the site is concerned: users can accept answers (or not) for whatever reasons they chose.
 
@Joshua So are Questions and Answers on Stack Overflow ;)
 
@Scratte Seems obvious
 
But if a user has 1414 posts on meta, then voting 439 times isn't too much..
 
Right. Plus, I have 20 downvotes on posts by the same user, so clearly I'm a lousy sockpuppet.
 
That's just cunning to throw the moderators off.
 
4:29 AM
Well, there are 16 options. I didn't realize Shog is the most frequent poster on MSO in addition to his many MSE posts, so it could be Shog.
 
In my top 15 voted-for users, whose posts I've voted up over 100 times, there are only 3 whose posts I've downvoted less than 5 times.
 
@Scratte this is a terrible guess, because there are no users with that many posts whose usernames start with "j" ;-)
 
@CodyGray Right, "calling out" is not what I meant. e.g. asking about just a single post is silly. But if I were to ask about something broader like a systemic problem with certain mod actions, and I were to frame that constructively, with suggestions for how to fix that, I assume mods would appreciate that.
 
@RyanM You just finished checking all the users on MSO to see how many have real names starting with "j"?
 
@CodyGray Understood, thanks.
 
4:32 AM
@RyanM Indeed. I assume he was thinking of a certain moderator runner-up from a previous election, whom I'm on record as heavily endorsing, but he hasn't posted that many times on MSO, so isn't at the top of my vote recipient list.
 
@RyanM ;) Not saying anymore now :)
 
@CodyGray Hmm, I misread Shog9's comment then. I seem to remember posts about IDE usage getting closed, but those might have been incorrect closures then.
 
@cigien Hrm... I want to say that being called out for a specific mistake is better/preferable to being called out for systematic issues... :-)
@cigien Definitely incorrect closures. There are a lot of incorrect closures when it comes to questions about software tools, especially IDEs.
Some people think that if the answer is, "Reinstall the IDE", that somehow makes it a Super User question. (Hint: those people are wrong.)
 
Are "we" reopening the keybaord shortcut? :)
 
@CodyGray Better? I see a mod getting more annoyed in the moment, but on reflection, they'd see the merit of it, right? I mean, should I not bring up a topic like that just because a mod would be upset? Or is there some deeper reason not to do that?
 
4:35 AM
@cigien On reflection, we'd see the merit in all of it. That was kinda the point of my original message. Nobody enjoys it, necessarily, but no one would have an issue with it.
 
Aah, ok, that makes complete sense. Thanks :)
 
@CodyGray ...well, now I just did. There are 16 users with that many MSO posts. Of them, only one has a disclosed real name starting with "J," with two who are purely pseudonymous. I didn't try anything fancy to find names for users whose real names aren't already obvious. The one person whose real name starts with "J" would've been my guess for the recipient of that many upvotes anyway :-)
 
@CodyGray Ok, I'll watch out for these, and see if I can learn how to spot when such questions are off-topic or not.
 
@RyanM Haha, right. One nitpick, though: what if some of those votes were on deleted posts? Then you wouldn't see them in your total number of posts lists.
@cigien If they're about IDEs, then they're pretty much on-topic. Kinda simpler than folks try to make it.
 
@CodyGray Huh. Now I'm itching to come up with an off-topic IDE question just to prove you wrong ;)
 
4:38 AM
@CodyGray it had not occurred to me that you were including votes on deleted posts, since mere mortals don't have any record of that :-) but unless they had a lot of deleted posts, it would be unlikely that you'd upvoted enough of them for it to be that person, since I'm assuming you're not consistently voting on nearly every post (otherwise your number would likely be higher for someone)
 
@cigien Well, don't overtax yourself. They can still be unclear, too broad, resource requests, or whatever else. That would still make them inappropriate. But if it's truly about an IDE, which is a software tool almost exclusively used by programmers, then it'll be hard to argue that it's off-topic.
 
@cigien That's easy: I'd like to get all my buttons in green shades. Please help me find a plugin for that.
 
@RyanM I actually don't know for sure whether these tallies include deleted posts or not. I was just trying to find fault with your logic.
@RyanM For several years, I was consistently voting on nearly every post.
Then I stopped, and let others pass me up.
 
@cigien I'm trying to write my novel in Android Studio and I can't get it to do drop caps for the first paragraph of a chapter. How can I make it do that?
 
Mostly because I kept running out of daily votes, and so would have to leave tabs open to come back and vote on later, and that just got annoying.
@RyanM Prima facie on-topic. The answer is, of course, "don't do that". A fairly common answer to programming questions.
 
4:42 AM
@RyanM Good point. I think the "write a novel" part makes it not programming. But if it said "I want to capitalize the first names of all functions" I think that's on-topic.
 
Basically, yes. Although I'm a bit uncomfortable saying that the user's motivation/use-case has anything to do with making a question on-topic.
 
How is use-case not relevant to whether a post is on-topic?
 
@CodyGray Clearly your mistake was trying to find fault in my logic ;-) (...I say, as you successfully poke at least a small hole in something else I said).
 
@cigien Why does it matter what the user is trying to do? Why should that affect scope? What if they don't tell us what they're trying to do? Do we have to read their mind in order to assess the topicality of their question?
 
@CodyGray Yeah, imo it's rude. The reason I didn't flag it as RA is because some mods may decline such a flag.
But I agree they should get a message.
 
4:44 AM
@10Rep Why would mods make a horribly wrong decision?!
 
..why do I want to post another one of my meta posts now? :D
 
It might be more of a close call if you switched "Android Studio" to "Visual Studio Code": VS code is an IDE. It can be a full-featured IDE with the right plugins, and many people use it that way. But it's also a text editor, and can be used in other situations as a non-programming tool (most, but not all, of my usage falls into "misc text editing).
 
@CodyGray If I understand correctly, you're saying it doesn't matter why the OP wants to do something. But it does matter what they want to do. If that's not clear, then how is it answerable?
 
@Scratte You already did that one. It was the first one I admitted to upvoting.
 
@CodyGray It seems borderline...one could make a case that it's not exactly RA.
 
4:45 AM
@cigien Yes, that's correct.
 
For the writing-a-novel-in-an-IDE example, I also deliberately picked a task (formatting with drop caps) that is clearly not programming.
 
@CodyGray You read my mind too. This is awesome :)
 
Changing formatting in the IDE is on-topic. It doesn't matter why someone wants to make that change.
 
That makes sense. In fact, I think if the OP said "... write a novella ..." I could edit that to "... write some code ..." and it would be definitely on-topic, without changing the OP's intent.
 
If you can find even one programmer who wants their code formatted with drop caps at the start of each section, I'll be very surprised.
 
4:48 AM
Right, that's the point. Intent doesn't matter when determining scope, because we don't even always know intent.
@RyanM Customer requirement :-)
 
@cigien I guess any good book about code reads like a novella :)
 
That is true :)
 
Actually... wouldn't be half-bad to have the first letter of each function's name formatted with a drop-cap.
 
@CodyGray ...yeah, okay, I'm prepared to buy that this might help skimmability.
 
So.. who's going to ask the Question on Stack? (Note: It will be closed.. but then you get to ask another one on Meta.)
 
4:50 AM
Personally, I prefer to have all function definitions collapsed in my editor, except for the one(s) I am currently editing.
 
@10Rep Just to confirm, we're talking about this right? I don't see how an R/A flag would be declined on that. If it got declined, I'd say that's a mistake.
 
You're aware that 10Rep can't see that post, right? :)
 
Because they only have 10 rep?
2
 
Oh, crap, I keep forgetting. Sorry about that.
Is it ok of I add the text of a R/A post in chat?
 
Not entirely sure why you'd want to do that.
 
4:53 AM
I think it's not uncommon to do a screen shot. But if everyone thinks it's rude, then.. it's kind of.. just that, no? :)
 
They know what the post said; they brought it up originally.
 
@cigien Yeah, I'm talking about that one :). On the case of flags, I guess you could say I'm paranoid. I don't really want more declines, and in either case it's a positive contribution to the site.
 
Obsession with flag declines is the new pandemic.
 
hides.. since I certainly had no part in that.. ;)
 
Patient Zero has already been identified.
 
4:55 AM
well, 1 accepted flag is better than 10 declines, no? it's like skipping in a review queue, 1000 skips is better than one wrong review.
 
How do you figure?
 
@10Rep Ok, that's fine. I'm confident that those flags would be accepted. But I don't want to be the cause of your stats getting affected, so don't take my word for it ;)
 
10 declined flags means that you 10 times saw something that made you uncomfortable and brought it to moderator attention.
Since that's kinda the point of flags... I can't see how that's something to be embarrassed about.
 
But I definitely agree that is RA now.
 
@CodyGray No.. it means you wrongly wasted a moderator's time. 10 times.
 
4:56 AM
Yeah - like I said, I would have been extremely surprised if an R/A flag on that post were declined, yet I didn't myself feel that it warranted one. Grey area: Were it a comment, I would give "unfriendly" (light red) rather than "bigotry/abuse" (full metal jacket).
 
Gray area: we handle those identically :-)
 
hmmm
 
A declined flag is not necessarily equivalent to an admonition that you wasted someone's time.
 
And yes, I am aware of his dry sense of humour. In my early days on Meta, it was something of a revelation.
 
@AdrianMole I see. So you were being sarcastic while accusing others of not utilizing sarcasm?
 
4:59 AM
I learnt that skill from a different Dutchman. ;)
 
R/A flags are one of the hardest things for me to do without letting my feelings get in the way. But the system definition for this seems clearer than other definitions, e.g. NAA. So I'm going with it.
 
You know, actually I don't know why I fuss over declined flags.
I just... do :D
 
The only thing the system definition lacks is some clarification that the post needs to be unsalvageable in order to quality for a R/A flag.
 
I wonder if there's another user called "-2 Rep". Though.. that's probably impossible.
 
Imagine an otherwise good answer that says, "This is an f***ing intractable problem, but fortunately, there is a **mn good solution" (but without the asterisks). Well, that could easily be considered inappropriate for respectful discourse, but could also be trivially reworded by an editor.
@Scratte No, you can name yourself with a leading hyphen.
 
5:00 AM
@CodyGray Meaning if the answer is good, but ends with "if you don't like this solution, you can go f yourself" should be edited instead of flagged?
 
@cigien Yes, that, too.
"You're such a fool that you shouldn't be allowed to program. All you have to do to solve this problem is..."
^^ All you have to do to solve this problem is edit out the first sentence.
 
@cigien unless the user persists in reverting or posting it in all their answers, in which case a custom flag for a moderator to have a chat with them about maybe not doing that is in order.
 
@CodyGray I saw one of those today :( Not that bad, but still impolite. I edited it a bit, and the author didn't say anything, which is good.
 
Some are cunning. They wait 56 hours before doing a rollback.
 
Yeah, it's the C++ tag. You'll see moderate forms of that fairly often. By users who are otherwise very helpful and post quality answers.
 
5:03 AM
@RyanM Good point. Is one revert enough to warrant a flag?
 
I guess when you're routinely abused by your compiler, you start to think it's normal.
 
Compilers aren't abusive, just unhelpful ;)
 
One IDE I downloaded literally said: Error on line 55. That's all.
 
@Scratte yeah I often follow posts where I suspect they might
 
@cigien Not to everyone.. compilers apologizes to Jon Skeet
 
5:05 AM
@10Rep Wow, you got line numbers?!
2
 
I'm used to an error type along with line numbers. Like "Index error on line 55!", or something similar.
 
Kids these days are so spoiled :-)
 
@10Rep Heh.. everytime I try to do something on MySQL, I get depressed.. it always tells me something like: error around "someword". Please check the manual.
 
@CodyGray There's some real gems there, thanks for that :)
 
5:09 AM
@Scratte I'm probably wrong, but did you try switching IDE's?
 
@RyanM Took me far too long to find this, but this is a good example of definitely flaggable conduct. (cc @cigien)
 
@RyanM Only with a custom flag.
 
@RyanM How can you see that?
 
@CodyGray yes, definitely. I didn't intend to imply otherwise.
 
@10Rep It's when I use a SQLfiddle online.. I don't know if IDE's can help me with that :) Don't even know if phpMyAdmin is any better. Posts on Stack Overflow doesn't look promising about it being any better.
 
5:11 AM
It has PHP in the name, so... probably not great.
 
@CodyGray Wait, why custom? Even without the later edits, the very first version seems to justify an R/A flag.
 
@RyanM Speaking of... a R/A flag was raised on that and marked helpful by a mod. A custom "offensive content used as MRE" flag was also raised and marked helpful.
 
@10Rep I can't, that's part of why it took me so long to find... Real answer, though, is that I knew there was a metasmoke record for the post, and I knew I'd commented on it, so I wrote a SQL query to find all my metasmoke comments and searched for "edit"
 
@cigien It doesn't. It justifies someone making an edit. Not an R/A flag.
 
@Scratte Yes, I see what you mean :)
@RyanM Or click on the fire next to the smokey report. Even deleted posts show up there.
 
5:14 AM
Heh. I have a "fire" icon next to posts, thanks to a userscript. It means something very different. Guess we'd better not swap computers.
 
@CodyGray Ok, because the string can be changed trivially. I see. And after the edit war, a custom flag would be better too. Got it.
 
@cigien Right. Mods don't typically look at revision histories when processing flags.
 
@10Rep the metasmoke record is here (contains offensive language). Note that what's in MS doesn't justify flagging: the OP also used edits and rollbacks to re-add offensive content, which is custom-flaggable behavior.
@10Rep that would have required me to find that, but I couldn't remember enough about the post to find it that way.
 
@CodyGray Huh, didn't know that. In fact, I think learned just today that mods don't typically look at questions when processing NAAs :p
 
@10Rep lol! "Create script error."
 
5:17 AM
@cigien I do evaluate NAAs in the context of the question, but even I don't look at revision histories without a custom flag suggesting there is some reason for me to do so.
 
Is that just you though? Or do all mods do that? I remember reading something different on meta.
 
@Scratte Some look closable to me as "Not Reproducible", but I don't know.
 
Not all; not none.
You didn't, perchance, read this Meta answer, did you? First couple of paragraphs addresses this precise issue.
 
@10Rep They reoccur often. So.. it's probably a good idea to leave them up.
 
I'm trying to remember why I didn't flag that post...perhaps a moderator had locked it by the time I saw the extra edits.
@CodyGray Lots of compilers give line numbers for errors; especially good compilers even give the correct line number.
 
5:19 AM
@RyanM Wasn't ever locked. Just that someone (in this case, trentcl) had already rolled it back at the time you commented on the MS report.
 
Maybe I just forgot to send the flag, then. Dunno.
 
I originally figured that's how you found it, by going through your flag history. But I checked, and no flags from you.
That's why I was looking at the flag history and commented about it above.
 
That was what I tried first, as I assumed I'd flagged it.
 
@10Rep Example fiddle Oracle. Note: It's not missing a right parenthesis. It's missing a comma. Run the same with MySQL and you'll get the note to go and check the manual :D
 
@Scratte On line 5?
 
5:24 AM
@CodyGray I've read that, but I was thinking of this one, where the issue seems to be precisely that mods don't consider questions necessarily when handling NAAs. That post has one of my favorite answers by the way :)
 
@10Rep Yes.
 
The Oracle error message is wrong. The MariaDB and MySQL error messages are useless (error in syntax; check the manual). The SQLite error message is spartan but actually more helpful than any of the previous. Postgres is an improvement over SQLite. SQL Server times out when I try to run it...
 
@cigien Oh my, that answer is amazing. I laughed out loud.
 
SQL Server is always out. But.. this fiddle is fine, when it's working. Unfortunately very often the entire thing just says "blah.. unavailable.."
 
"this answer appears to address the asker's problem. Use downvotes to indicate inaccurate or entirely wrong answers. For subtle forms of abuse, choose "other" and explain the problem in detail." Hmm, that's fantastic. Missed that wording suggestion. I should update some userscripts...
 
5:29 AM
@CodyGray The MySQL/MariaDB messages at least cryptically point to the right line of the query.
...if you ignore the line number.
 
@RyanM Are we looking at the same messages? That one says "line 2".
Haha, yeah.
 
High crypticness points.
 
I still say that the SQLite error message is better.
Hah! Firebird is the worst.
 
agreed. SQLite is an amazing piece of software.
 
Meaningless error code, wrong line number, repeated nonsense, poor grammar...
 
5:31 AM
Wow that Firebird error is impressively bad, you aren't kidding.
I'm surprised there's no "unexpected token HIREDATE" or something in any of them.
 
I guess it's something to do with tokenization that is screwing up the accuracy of the line number reporting. Do the interpreters just ignore all the whitespace and treat that all as a single line?
But even then, that doesn't explain how Firebird gets the wrong column number.
 
SQL Server 2017 works and its error message is not bad either.
 
Not bad, but not great.
 
@RyanM There is.. DB2 :) Though it's "DATE"
 
These interpreters really should know their own requirements regarding commas.
Expected tokens may include: "<references_spec>". Ah, yes. Clear as mud.
Is that literally telling you to go reference the spec?
 
5:41 AM
Oracle had a html package that was used extensively on a project to render.. html :) Very nicely if there were any errors on a page, Oracle would just put those on the top. Except, sometimes the page rendered was just blank. Nothing on it. It took me while to find out that it happened when there was a problem with the number of parameters or the wrong type.
 
@CodyGray Yes. It's like a Turing machine and you're inside it: SQLSTATE=42601 SQLCODE=-104
 
That has been closed for...some unknown reason.
Perhaps because the edit button was broken?
 
lol! That Question is awesomely phrased :) Ohh.. it was closed this month :(
 
with the usual "why did you close an older question as a duplicate of a newer one?"
 
5:49 AM
I don't see any of that. :-)
 
sneaky
 
To be fair, I'd already remedied those problems before your messages showed up.
 
6:23 AM
 
6:46 AM
I was inclined to just NAA the latest SD report until I saw the ?utm_source=stackoverflow_11220&utm_medium=rightdatawarehouse on the end of the URL. To me that makes it spam...
 
7:58 AM
@CodyGray Thanks for the explanation! I didn't see an earlier answer from them. I have become a bit more tentative and will rather go for the softer flag instead. But in borderline cases, I also bring it to attention here (sometimes with unforeseen consequences like in this case).
 
8:47 AM
@JeanneDark You wouldn't have seen the other answer, as it was already deleted.
 
Yes, I know. I noticed that they had already been a member for three months, though.
 
9:12 AM
@CodyGray - I wasn't tracking them down; they were percolating up from the cesspool by edits. Things coming up in the top 20 of questions with new activity will attract my attention, and if the question, old as it may be, is clearly off-topic I'll happily close-vote it ;) I have better things to do with my day than hunting them down ...
 
 
1 hour later…
10:31 AM
 
11:09 AM
Is this question OK? It basically presents a problem, has code for the first part and then asks "Please help write me the second half" without attempt on that half
 
@Adriaan not thrilled by it but meh.
 
12:02 PM
 
12:28 PM
What is this strange edit? Is that OK?
 
Yes. That one. Well.. no. Revision 8.
 
the comments seem to explain well enough what's going on
 
Fair enough :)
 
The suspense... In LA I noticed a new answer that seemed to only copy-paste another answer's code (quite a lot, adding nothing new). I checked it and they were identical. So I custom flagged it. But the flag is still pending...
 
12:42 PM
@JeanneDark Heh.. In Spring such custom flag could take two weeks to get handled.
 
So I don't need to worry yet?
 
I think the general rules is that you can worry about an outcome until it's there. From that point on you either celebrate or regret.
 
But a custom flag was the correct action, wasn't it?
 
@Dharman Wins the worst formatted question of the week
 
@JeanneDark Yes. If it's plagiarism, there's no other way.
 
12:54 PM
Yes. But the other flags back then were handled.
 
Huh? <-- Which I learned during the night is also used as a compiler message :D
 
NAA flags
But I better stop whining. Cody reads the transcript :)
 
@JeanneDark Not sure I understand. You've flagged those before as NAAs? And they were helpful? Was that recently? Or when half the NAA were handled in the Low Quality Posts queue?
 
@Scratte No, I mean the other flags I raised around the same time were handled and NAA flags. This was the only custom flag. I wouldn't flag plagiarism as NAA.
 
lol! Don't be scared of Cody :) Think of it this way: Lots of people reads the transcript. Few are nice and give you feedback :)
@JeanneDark Ahh.. different moderator queue, I believe. It's not a FIFO :)
 
1:00 PM
Yes, I remember. NAA and VLQ go in the same queue.
 
@JeanneDark I had custom flags for plagiarism sit in the queue for a while until Martijn handled them. Wait for his commute / lunch break.
 
o/
 
Morning to you
 
@rene So you know what Martijn is currently doing by keeping track of when the flags are handled? ;)
 
1:03 PM
Exactly. Not stalking mods at all ....
 
@JeanneDark I think you're thinking of the Low Quality Posts queue. But that's a queue for mortals. I don't know how the moderator queues are split exactly, but I've heard rumours that moderator can even pull for the posts in the LQP queue.
 
@Scratte That's possible. I just remember reading that, while they go in the same queue, mods can still see whether they were flagged NAA or VLQ. But could have been about LQP.
 
When I first joined this chat someone said something about rene moderating moderators. Obviously I was more scared of rene.
 
Are you still afraid?
 
Hello! I have a question: When a post gets undeleted, does the reputation change show up in the reputation tab?
 
1:13 PM
@JeanneDark Oh yes! Maybe even more :)
 
Maybe I should be afraid, too. Like I'm afraid of declined flags and...
 
@AnnZen I'd expect so. Though there may be some delay. I think it doesn't if it's all in the same day though. As in: you post, get an upvote, delete your post.
@JeanneDark :D I call it "Respectful admiration" :)
 
Can someone please explain why earlier my rep was at 12484, and now it's t 12515, without indicating any undeleted posts, reversed serial votes, etc?
 
@AnnZen Is there a 2 missing there?
 
oops
 
1:20 PM
@AnnZen You have 12515, so you've gained rep
 
Yeah?
Yesterday, I've been serially downvoted. I'm concerned that it's the voting reversal that only gave back the rep, and not reversing the actual votes.
 
Have you checked the "show removed posts" at the bottom of your page?
 
@AnnZen You could have a look through here: stackoverflow.com/reputation
 
@AnnZen go to stackoverflow.com/reputation and compare the most recent rep there to your profile. If those down votes are not on the rep link then it just means that your profile has not gotten the reversal added/updated to profile as yet
 
If you get reputation back from posts you've downvoted, I think it will only show that to you..
 
1:27 PM
@NathanOliver Yeah, I've analyzed it; they neglected to put a deleted post that cost 25 rep at 2020-11-29
 
Zoe
@AnnZen Caching
 
I still want to know why my rep went up without indication in the reputation tab.
 
@AnnZen reputation reversals do show up as removal of the -2 (or +10 in case of upvotes). So instead of 20 times "-2" there'll be nothing in the list.
 
@Adriaan I thought there's be a line saying "Voting corrected" or "Vote reversal"
 
@AnnZen we can't audit your reputation. You have all the tools available and numerous meta posts that discuss different contexts. We can't tell why something did or didn't happen. Use the Contact form to have an SE employee look into it.
 
1:33 PM
Wait a while though. Caching is a thing. I remember when Adrian didn't get the 25 reputation points for an upvoted accepted post for something like an hour or so..
 
@Scratte Yes, there should in the reputation tab on the profile; you don't get any indication in the top bar on the normal page. I understood the point as receiving no indication in the latter, which is normal
 
@Adriaan I don't understand... can you elaborate?
@rene Oh. I was hoping this happens to many users...
 
@AnnZen I was referring to the drop-down menu in the top-bar on the normal page, not the reputation tab in your profile. That will give you a list of "-2, -2, -,2 -,2 ..." etc with the relevant post name when you've been serially downvoted. When the votes are reversed, these indications simply disappear. If you've clicked this icon in the mean time, i.e. saw all the "-2", you'll get a new icon saying "+12" in green (in case of 6 reverted downvotes), but nothing whatsoever in the list
However, nothing whatsoever will show in the list, since there the six individual "-2"s have simply been removed.
 
@Adriaan I think the issue is there's no indication in the reputation tab. There's a change to reputation from 12484 to 12515 (31), but only one entry in the tab, that's not 31.
 
@AnnZen Even if it is, this room isn't the SO Reputation Audit Voters so discussing it until you have a satisfactory answer isn't really on topic here.
 
1:40 PM
The topic was leaning on undeleted posts though.
 
LOL
 
sorry.
 
@AnnZen There's only me there, but you can go to Userscript newbies and friends if you want to discuss further or The Ministry of Silly Hats (more users than me :-)
 
thanks, bye!
 
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