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8:01 PM
@RyanM Does all that fit into just one comment?
 
@RyanM Personally, I'd rather suggest that they break the problem up into the various component parts/stages and ask separately about each small, focused functional piece as they need it. IMO, it's better to have tightly focused "how to" questions, which tend to be applicable to multiple situations/future visitors, than for SO to accumulate debugging questions, which tend to have very limited usefulness for future visitors.
Frankly, what I often see is that people asking questions really don't understand how to, or that they should, break a problem up into smaller pieces and focus on the smaller pieces, rather than be looking at solving the whole of an overall problem.
 
@Scratte just barely
@Makyen That's a good idea...I might take a crack at rephrasing it.
I am partly hampered by the comment length limit, but I think I could fit some of that in if I removed some of the less useful bits.
 
@RyanM Sure. I think I have one or more versions I've used previously, but other takes on it are always beneficial.
@RyanM Yeah, I was taking advantage of chat allowing multiple successive comments in order to provide more explanation. It's not as easy to do that with post comments.
 
@Makyen Then there are other problems where one's able to solve all the small parts, but unable to make a design or put the pieces together. It can be nice to get the X to the Y problem, where X is the end goal of a larger thing.
 
Strictly speaking, post comments also allow that...but it feels a little spammy to leave multiple canned comments in a row. I've occasionally left a canned comment, followed by a personalized one.
 
8:08 PM
@Scratte It's reasonable to have a question which is "Here are all the pieces, how do I put them together?" It's not very helpful to future visitors to have a single questions which is just "I want to do M and N, then get O, P, Q, and then do R, and S, and send T, U, and V over to W."
@RyanM True. Although, I've been known to leave more than one canned comment when multiple ones fit and there's more information to communicate than fits in a single comment.
 
^ So it had time for two downvotes, but not for a single R/A flag?
 
By what means was it deleted? (still working on getting that 10k)
 
@E_net4theRustacean Looks that way.
@RyanM It was deleted by the author.
 
@Makyen I was more thinking about: I'm trying to make a program do Omega. I broke it up into alpha, beta and gamma. I trying to make this tiny thing in beta work, but I'm getting blib instead of blob.
 
well at least they thought better of it I guess.
@Scratte Yeah, that's a good example of what my comment tried to convey...but I think Makyen's point is probably more applicable to the "I don't know where to start" questions.
 
8:17 PM
What do you think is the best option for this answer that is neither an answer nor in English? Flag as not an answer?
 
@Scratte That sounds like it could be a reasonably focused debugging question. :)
 
@RyanM I always want to say: You should not start here. Find tutorials, go on youtube until you know how everyone else started, then try it out! But I don't, I just write "I think your Question is a little broad" :D
 
@IanCampbell Well, you've basically covered it by saying that it's Not An Answer, which is also an acceptable flag for answers which are not in English.
 
@Makyen With the hope that if someone really cool answers, they can also point but: But you should probably break it up in delta, epsilon and forget about beta :)
 
@Scratte there's a joke here somewhere about epsilon being the next little bit you can do
 
8:24 PM
@RyanM Only if you're continuous.. :) But since I'm distinct, it doesn't apply ;)
 
@dbc Is it time to close some Spanish questions, now? Don't mind if I do.
 
dbc
@Dharman Seems as though a lot of them have been coming in today, not sure why. That one was quite bad as it lacked an MCVE and instead just linked to a code screenshot. For questions that look legit, I'll point the questioner to Stack Overflow en espaƱol.
 
@Dharman okay but that's Portuguese ;-)
 
@dbc Don't take me too seriously. I am really bored now. I am thinking of switching to Wikipedia now. I think I can answer some question there too.
 
as is that one ^
 
Wow, there are a lot of questions in English with German content in them...every one of these is actually in English
 
I need 3000 rep points to be able to close-vote questions, right? Almost there
 
@DontKnowMuchButGettingBetter Correct
 
@RyanM One of them has to be Spanish, right?
 
8:42 PM
My initial reaction was wait, you already do have it! but then I realized that apparently the chat display rounds
@Dharman the last three are in fact in Spanish :D
 
@RyanM LOL, close, close
 
@DontKnowMuchButGettingBetter You are close to a close privilege.
 
@Dharman: LOL
@Dharman: overloaded language function
 
I stopped now, because it seems I overloaded this room.
 
9:00 PM
@Dharman: wise decision. No sense causing a stack overflow on stackoverflow
 
@DontKnowMuchButGettingBetter I see what you did there....
 
Foolishly, I just answered the second part of ^^ this question that remained unanswered, only to discover that the OP had posted it as a separate question that has already been answered.
 
Is this on-topic?
 
Where did all my close votes go?
 
@Dharman No tengo la menor idea
 
@Scratte I don't think so. It lacks focus for one
 
9:50 PM
@HovercraftFullOfEels Thanks. I've been staring at it for an hour. I couldn't put a real reason to it.
 
@Scratte doesn't feel like a practical programming issue.
Also, what's with the tags?
 
@Scratte Primarily opinion-based, I think...an on-topic version might be "What is the difference between pass-by-value and pass-by-reference? Could you give an example that would be understandable to someone with no programming experience?"
 
@RyanM ELINTP - explain it like I'm a non-technical person.
 
@RyanM Then it would just need a little editing. But the difference between .. and .. is very well covered
 
I'm half-tempted to take a swing but I bet it's a dupe because...yeah, that
 
9:52 PM
I initially left a comment using drawers, but I've removed it.
 
my favorite is pass-references-by-value
(this is what Java does for objects)
 
Also, JavaScript.
 
@VLAZ The tags sort of makes sense. You need memory to have values, no? :)
 
@Scratte and you might use, uh, one of them to create a new column in a data frame using dplyr package in R programming language
 
@RyanM If you think this is crazy then you never worked with ABAP
 
9:54 PM
but immutability? Mutable? It's extremely loosely related to references. Memory has more relevance only by comparison. It's language mechanics at the core.
 
@Dharman I don't think it's crazy, but also I have never worked with ABAP, and from Google searching it, I suspect that I do not want to.
 
@VLAZ That one is not really explainable.. not mutate, unless they want to cover something like side-channel-attacks as well :)
 
@Scratte check the tag wiki on that one :-)
 
@dbc is it understandable by non-technical person?
 
9:57 PM
@dbc +1, it includes a non-technical explanation (ctrl+f "used to say")
 
@RyanM which one?
 
Here is a good example of how much different SO is from other Q&A sites. The lengths we go to keep the site clean. answers.sap.com/answers/3623367/view.html Also keep in mind SAP links are very short lived.
 
@Scratte mutate
 
@dbc Super. Now we just need a gold-hammer in mutate :D
@RyanM I don't expect this author read the description :)
 
@Scratte I don't think so either :-) I removed it.
 
10:02 PM
^^Smoke Detector report also appears to be spam
 
@RyanM Unfortunately one can't see the entire list of gold-hammers for memory
 
there's some way to do it...
 
dbc
@Scratte OK somehow I am compelled to check this... there are no gold or silver badges for , and two bronze badges, see stackoverflow.com/help/badges/8311/mutate. Congratulations to Ronak Shah and akrun for being stack overflow's top mutation experts.
 
@dbc I did not expect that :)
 
@Scratte there is exactly one gold-badge holder for
 
dbc
10:07 PM
Jon Skeet? ... no! Peter Lawrey.
 
there are two others who could have it if they answered enough additional questions.
 
@RyanM do we need to add more RAM to allow for more gold badge holders there? Or do we garbage collect Peter Lawrey?
 
@VLAZ They are still in use.
 
@RyanM If it requires 1000 points, then I'm not sure how there's only one. The list seems to indicate 3
 
@DavidBuck Yes, IMO, it is.
@Dharman Because it's closed as a duplicate and is answered.
 
10:13 PM
@Makyen I know, it was not a question :D. It should though.
@Scratte Don't you need to have 400 answers and 1000 points?
 
@Dharman sounds like some Highlander deal. "There can be only one" because you cannot get a gold badge in memory until you defeat the the current gold badge holder.
 
@Dharman 200, but yes
 
This Stack Overflow is too small for the two of us.
 
@Dharman That detail evaded me. Thanks :)
 
That's what I meant with "could have it if they answered enough additional questions."
Ha! The top [memory] question (community wiki) is "How to create a memory leak in Java?"
The top accepted answer is very creative, but somewhat misleading as to typical Java memory leaks
@Dharman assuming that's a legit question of why it won't, it's because the first answer was downvoted today
oh and because it's a dupe I suppose
that's actually the real reason.
don't mind me.
 
10:21 PM
@RyanM It won't roomba because it is a duplicate. I don't see how this has any value. Q:-8 A:-1. It should be gone
 
oh I'm not arguing it shouldn't be deleted. I thought it was something subtle but actually I just failed to notice the glaring "it's a dupe" reason. See "don't mind me" above >_<
 
These dupes are just a waste of my downvotes. Some of them disappear once I have seen them though.
 
@RyanM It looks creative, but I think there's been a lot of that with webservers that lets you update the application while hot.
 
@Scratte true, I wonder if Android hot reloading can cause that...
Now I'm tempted to see if I can crash Android Studio with buggy code in a previewed component...
 
@RyanM It depends on the classloading scheme. On tomcat it's because the classloader on the webserver doesn't abide by the ask-parent-first when referencing a class.
 
10:26 PM
We had an amazing memory leak at an old workplace. Somebody had made a homebrew performance monitoring system and sprinkled calls to homebrewStopwatch.start("some identifier") and homebrewStopwatch.stop("some identifier") all over the call. All the stopwatches were then kept forever. Also, they were not actually used because the performance monitoring wasn't great (if you can believe it).
Yet after the application ran for a while it just died because it kept adding performance statistics to a list and never clearing it.
The person who made the homebrew system had moved on to greener pastures by the time this became a problem.
 
@VLAZ That's usually how that works. And they can recreate it saying that never had any issues with it :D
 
that's quite a memory leak
 
@RyanM But they didn't.. they left before the problem started :)
 
It was fine if you ever showed the statistics as that emptied the recorded timings. But since the timings weren't very useful, we disabled showing them. Which in turn lead to the memory bloat. In the end we just used the delete refactor from the IDE which removed all the useless calls as well.
 
Lesson learned: you should never collect system statistics.
 
10:44 PM
Or use an actual performance monitoring tool.
 
@Dharman Can you back that lesson up with some system statistics?
 
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