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11:07 AM
@CodyGray Oh, when I say "requirement dump", I mean the OP asked how to do something without showing any effort, which is a question, and an on-topic one. I'll stop using that terminology if it's confusing. Is the usage of "dump" the problem?
@CodyGray Yeah, it's unclear to me what they want. I engaged in comments for a while because I suspected there was an interesting question they weren't finding the words for. Anyway, they've left a comment saying they'll clarify, and have deleted their question an hour ago. Hopefully the new question will be clear. Thanks for reviewing.
 
@cigien "Requirement dump" makes it sound like there's no question. It's not just the "dump" part; it's also the "requirement" part.
 
Oh, what should I use for "how do I do X?" questions?
 
"How to" questions are suitable for Stack Overflow, regardless of effort and whether they're homework. The closure criteria for these questions is limited to whether they are clear and sufficiently narrowly-scoped (i.e., whether the answer can be typed into and explained within our character limits).
What's wrong with "how do I do X?" questions?
 
Nothing I guess, I realized that as I was typing it out :p I'll use "How to" from now on. Thanks.
 
"Requirement dump" is a common pejorative phrase describing precisely the kinds of questions we don't want. Even Scratte and I don't want those. :-)
Literally copy-pasting in your homework assignment is still off-topic. It wasn't that part of the Help Center that was making that off-topic.
What's really unproductive, though, if when commenters start telling professional programmers, "You need to show your work. We're not going to do your homework for you."
 
11:15 AM
Yeah, that makes sense. Since I've been pushing back against no-effort questions being closed, and "requirement dump" is often used to describe that, I thought I'd use the same terminology. But you're right, no point carrying over the negative connotation.
Yes, I understand the homework, and otherwise off-topic distinction.
 
@CodyGray is is unproductive in general, or only when it is addressed to professional programmers?
 
One down, 10 million to go
@desertnaut It's quite unproductive in general, because it just leads to arguments. If the question isn't suitable for Stack Overflow, then it's going to get closed, and they'll figure out that we aren't going to do their homework for them. If the question is OK and meets our guidelines, then, well, they just might get lucky and have some of their homework done for them.
Harkening back to that Meta discussion, it still blows my mind that there are people on a Q&A site who are afraid of accidentally answering a question.
 
I just came across this accepted answer (from Google search) - It is based on a link that now return 404 error. The answer is from 2013 and no longer valid, so should I flag it as NAA or ignore it and move on?
 
@desertnaut Also, about the identifying "professional programmers": several times I've seen people who know programming be misunderstood because they don't know how to ask a good question, or don't know English well. I feel it's best not to try and distinguish users based on that.
 
@AlonEitan Nah, just delete the whole question.
 
11:20 AM
@cigien I asked exactly because any such distinction sounds awkward here in the discussion context
 
@AlonEitan You should not flag it as NAA. Either ignore it, or replace the link with a working one.
Or, yeah, you can remove the question.
 
@desertnaut Ah, I see. Agreed, it's not a useful distinction since it's hard to get right.
 
are we talking about a Meta thread?
 
Yeah, that whole trying to figure out if an asker is a student is... exactly the kind of focus on users that we don't do here.
Just that Meta Q&A a few days back where cigien and I were telling everyone they were wrong.
 
If a line programmer posts their assignment here, that's also disallowed.
.. or an interviewee
 
11:23 AM
I don't have problems helping students out, what I have problem with is that said student expect us to do it all.
 
@AlonEitan Oops, early morning :( I voted to delete that. But GC questions should just be closed, why did it need deletion? cc @CodyGray
 
yeah, you may be right and literally everyne else wrong, but it can get lonely...
 
@cigien But Cody said that I can delete it :O
 
@cigien is there such a distinction for GC stuff?
 
Should we undelete it then?
 
11:25 AM
I don't know, I cc'ed Cody as well.
 
@cigien Why it doesn't?
 
What's wrong with deleting it?
 
@desertnaut No, not because it's GC per se. Just that a question needing closing doesn't mean it needs deleting.
 
The normal argument against deletion would be that the answers provide useful information. But...the whole reason it got brought up is because the link on the highest voted answer had rotted.
 
I don't know, I guess the 14k views makes me think it might still be useful. I'm mostly trying to account for my previous cavalier attitude to deleting stuff.
 
11:27 AM
The other argument for it is that there's a better or equivalent resource elsewhere superuser.com/q/343158/235569
 
@CodyGray that's a general reason, not particular to GC (... or particular to the specific Q, not general to GC...)
:/
 
Oh, ok I see. That question is outdated, it's not useful anymore. Deleting it is fine cc @AlonEitan
 
Thanks :)
 
@Braiam No, my understanding is that the order of evaluation should be, is it useful on SO? Whether it's also useful elsewhere is secondary.
 
@cigien Nope. It's it should be here and is not anywhere else? It's a double conditional.
 
11:29 AM
@Braiam I also found this answer and was disappointed that it's no longer working
But nevermind
 
@Braiam Huh, why does SO care if the content is only appropriate here?
 
@cigien Because we don't want examples of off topic questions ;)
It's "we shouldn't put it here, but we don't know where to put it" the argument against deletion.
 
@Braiam If it's off-topic, it's off-topic. Regardless of whether it's on-topic somewhere else or not.
 
@cigien That's not the argument here: it's off topic on SO.
That's why it was closed.
@Braiam If it's closed it is fair game. The only exception is this ^
 
@Braiam Ok, that's true. I was confused by your argument that it's on-topicness on other sites is relevant, that's all.
 
11:33 AM
There's nothing specific to general computing and deletion. I don't know what y'all are talking about?
 
@cigien No, I was just pointing out that I have no qualms deleting stuff if it can be found elsewhere.
 
Ah, I see. That's reasonable.
 
I've used that several times before
 
In general... closed questions are eventually deleted. But in most cases we delay that deletion (i.e., to give the question a chance to be edited) and there are also some edge cases where we reprieve that deletion (e.g., because the Q&A accumulated high-quality content before it got closed).
 
@CodyGray And even then, the exception is only as long as the content doesn't live elsewhere
 
11:36 AM
Meh, possibly. I can see the argument there, but deleting it breaks links, which is unfriendly.
But yeah, the reprieve can definitely be rescinded in the case that the content has rotted over time or whatever.
 
@CodyGray I see that you love MS :D
 
Or if someone can prove that having it publicly visible is actively causing harm
 
@Braiam That's a well asked question. You've focused on one post, and stated clearly your reasons for deletion. I should have tried that approach rather than just asking users to delete things en masse :p
 
Multiple Sclerosis? It certainly breaks a lot of links, and I do not much care for it.
 
@πάνταῥεῖ Not sure, but that seems focused enough to be answerable. Is there a canonical for "how does using aliases work?". A dupe closure would be better.
 
11:40 AM
@cigien Agree
@cigien Yeah, when you want to make a case for deletion of an old "popular" question, you can do that on Meta, but we'd prefer that you stick to one question at a time, not a big list. We don't like big lists.
(remember that we don't do big list questions on the main site, either)
 
@CodyGray Maybe this? Not ideal though.
 
I already found one
and closed it
like a half hour ago :-p
 
Are we sure that what OP doesn't understand is using?
 
@CodyGray What do you mean? The banner says closed a minute ago. And yeah, the target is perfect, thanks.
@CodyGray Yeah, took me two meta posts to realize that, instead of one, but lesson learned for sure :)
 
Well, the line they quoted is a using declaration, so... yes, pretty sure.
@cigien The "half hour ago" was an exaggeration.
 
11:46 AM
:p
 
It was actually just 2 minutes ago at the time of typing that message. But it seemed like an eternity :-p
 
do you consider this to be about programming? stackoverflow.com/questions/65162756/…
 
@CodyGray Like I said, you're always in a hurry ;)
 
Things take as long as they need to take. No longer, no shorter.
 
@desertnaut Sure, but it's a resource request, and arguably needs more focus.
 
11:50 AM
I know!!! Sorry, what's wrong with me
 
"Moderators Please Close This Isuue,Because it is no longer needs an Answer.I fixed it."
 
Ooh, somehow we missed that request. You know, since we read every single incoming comment that is posted on this site.
Sounds like a closure flag for "typo/localized"
 
@CodyGray Better: It's in the question
 
@JeanneDark you can leave a comment, telling them either to share their answer here for the benefit of the community or delete the question altogether.
 
Facepalm.
Later, that same person is going to be complaining about how their question got closed.
 
11:58 AM
I'm allergic to comments.
 
@JeanneDark share the link then - we can do it
 
@JeanneDark Gesundheit x136
 
They added the answer to their question.
@CodyGray Does that number have a specific meaning?
 
@JeanneDark It's the number of comments left by a user with severe allergies.
 
@CodyGray Why did you rollback immediately? I learned recently that we should leave a comment for the OP asking them to do it, and then do it ourselves if the OP doesn't respond. I think that's a good idea.
 
12:03 PM
@CodyGray Now you see what the review queues made me do
 
@cigien Where did you learn that from? Certainly not from me. I do not believe in leaving stupid comments telling other people to do what I can easily do. That just results in stuff that needs to be done not getting done.
It needed to be rolled back, and rolling back doesn't lose any information (because revision history), so there's no reason not to just roll back immediately and then simply leave a comment explaining what happened and why.
This ensures that it doesn't fall through the cracks. Again, we're not these people's parents or teachers.
 
@CodyGray I'm making the argument on merit. But since you ask, it was Makyen. I'll look in the transcript for the exact quote if you want.
 
@CodyGray You are their drill instructor ;)
 
@CodyGray Ah, this is our disagreement about the merits of hand holding. Fair enough :)
 
More like busy colleague.
I'm beginning to think most of the disagreements in approach between Makyen and myself can be attributed to the fact that Makyen has boundless patience, whereas mine...has some bounds.
 
12:08 PM
I understand. Yes, I'm quite patient myself, so I guess that's why Makyen's approaches in general are more appealing to me.
 
In particular, I don't want to enter a situation where posts become chains tying me down. I don't want to have to maintain a zillion tabs where I've obligated myself to go back and check on something in order to ensure that the right thing will ultimately happen.
 
@cigien this (i.e. what Cody did, rolling back & comment) is exactly what I would do, too, and I have done it several times indeed
 
I like Cody's approach
 
and I am not even a mod...
 
Oh dear, so many impatient people ;)
 
12:09 PM
I don't actually see myself as impatient, for what it's worth.
 
@cigien efficient not impatient ;)
 
Efficiency is certainly a good way of thinking about it.
 
@cigien problems transform depending on the perspective
 
It's more that I see my obligation to the site and the long term, rather than an individual user.
 
That makes a lot of sense. To clarify, that's my goal as well. I just feel that helping individual users contributes to that. If they learn the right thing today, they know what to do tomorrow, and can then guide others, and so on. I certainly know that I've personally benefited from other users guiding me on main.
 
12:13 PM
But can't they learn the right thing to do by example?
It's not that I provided no guidance. It's just that I didn't sit there like a track coach waiting for them to jump over the hurdle.
 
They can but different people learn differently. And there's certainly a ton of bad examples they might learn from, so I'm not sure how new users would distinguish necessarily.
No, it's a spectrum for sure.
 
Look for the shiny diamonds?
 
How do you tell what a shiny diamond is though?
 
It's...diamond-shaped
 
And shiny, right? ;)
 
12:16 PM
Glistening culets!
 
I didn't know that word, I had to look it up. Thank you.
 
@CodyGray I knew Cody was Shog smurf account
 
What is more beneficial long term, spend the time guiding a user through the basics despite help center and countless examples could do that as well, or ask/answer etc. useful questions? They'd have to learn to find out themselves anyway, they can't rely on SO users to always guide them.
 
I think it's common knowledge by now
Two WinAPI programmers? What are the odds?
 
Ooh, I've achieved some accidental round numbers! 90,000 posts edited | 6,600 helpful flags
 
12:19 PM
@JeanneDark I think a combination of both is better than just one or the other. Fortunately, there are users for both approaches, i.e. lead by example, and lead by instruction. And yes, guidance should be limited, I'm not advocating we become a help-desk.
 
C'mon, guys! I left a comment!! What more could you ask for??!
That's holding at least one hand.
If I have to reply to additional pings, it starts turning into holding both hands, or even wearing the same jacket.
 
No one is criticizing you, Cody
 
Indeed :) Poor Cody, are you feeling beset upon?
 
Nah. This is fun for me.
 
Excellent.
 
12:22 PM
@JeanneDark I recently spotted a pair of users, one who always asks apparently trivial questions, despite identifying themselves as a senior developer, and another who gamely provides a high-quality answer in that tag to the same question author. I just don't know how the answerer has the patience - maybe the rep they acquire offsets the frustration of persistently serving someone who will never learn.
 
I'm getting too comfortable. My oblique, snarky humor was even missed once by Jeanne.
 
@CodyGray Yeah, requirement dump for sure. I see what you mean, I'll stop using that term for narrowly scoped "How to" questions.
 
@halfer Are you sufficiently convinced that these are separate accounts?
 
@halfer The one answers the questions of the other?
 
@CodyGray If Jeanne missed it, it was probably too oblique :p
 
12:23 PM
@CodyGray No, I'm just immune to your snark :)
 
@CodyGray Yeah, I am pretty sure they are separate.
 
@cigien Exactly my thoughts.
 
@JeanneDark Yep, a big stack of them.
 
Either that or she was just playing dumb. I mean, who has their exact number of flags memorized, but doesn't recognize their total number of comments? Odd, indeed.
 
@CodyGray How should I know that? Most posts I comment on are eventually deleted.
(not claiming a causal connection)
 
12:25 PM
^^ I don't think even the network profile shows that info.
 
My profile shows 52 comments
 
That's obviously not counting deleted ones right?
 
Ah, yeah, good point. I should have cribbed from the normally visible information, not the mod-only stats.
In my defense, the mod-only stats were easier to access. (Efficiency? Hurried? Laziness? You decide!)
 
unless you know a body that could
 
@desertnaut The last 2 sentences suggest the question would be off-topic ML even with an MRE. Canned comment appropriate?
 
12:32 PM
@CodyGray I pick efficiency ;)
 
Efficiency is just laziness that has been elevated to an art form, right?
 
@cigien no, "evaluating" and "predicting" are Keras functions indeed; the question could be about programming (and most probably it is)
 
@desertnaut Oh, I see. Those terms should maybe be quoted then?
Actually, scratch that. OP should clarify in that case.
 
@cigien ... well, you know, it's the limit of when you decide to become rather academic. Truth is, anyone familiar with Keras would not get confused here
 
@desertnaut That's fair. Yeah, I'm not familiar with Keras at all, so I didn't read that properly.
 
12:38 PM
all good ;)
 
1:13 PM
I feel this should be closed. I'm not sure for what reason though. Assuming it was only tagged with one language. Currently the 2 tags make it too broad I think.
 
@cigien That is an unanswerable question, especially with both language tags. Note that it's a copy-paste from some homework assignment, they've just failed to get the numbered list indicating the choices copied over.
 
@CodyGray Yeah, that makes sense. So which reason would I use here? POB seems ok. Is the exam-question bit related? I thought we didn't enforce those things.
 
@cigien No, it's not related to the reason why it should be closed. It's related to the reason why it's unanswerable. Like most multiple-choice questions, there is no correct answer. Just a bunch of bad choices.
I don't think it's opinion-based...
It's just unclear.
We have no idea how your teacher defines/interprets those choices.
 
I see. So a well constructed MCQ, where the options are clear, and there's one objectively correct answer, are on-topic?
 
Wouldn't you say so?
I mean... I don't like broad, sweeping rules... so I'm not going to just agree to that.
 
1:29 PM
Indeed. I'll bring up an example if I run across one.
 
Of course, I could. Only once in my life have I ever seen well-constructed multiple-choice questions. So the odds that I would ever have to eat my words are vanishingly small. I could just blame it on one of the preconditions being violated.
 
Really? I've seen more than a few good ones. They are in a minority, I'll grant that.
 
Those multiple choice questions? In a genetics course, first semester of college. Who would have ever thought you could reasonably test genetics using multiple choice questions? Certainly not me. I was blown away. This professor was amazing. I studied everything she did, less to learn genetics and more to learn how to teach and write exams.
These weren't just clear, unambiguous multiple-choice questions. That would have been impressive a feat enough. No, these were tricky multiple-choice questions, ones that required you to actually think and analyze, rather than just regurgitate information.
 
In a genetics course, that's particularly impressive. It's hard enough to do in a CS course.
 
I don't know how to teach CS
 
1:32 PM
I'm supposed to know how to at least.
I have opinions on it of course :)
 
I'm pretty sure that "no multiple choice" is the correct way to teach it.
 
@CodyGray Their only purpose is not to better teach students but to have exams easier to correct (even by people who know nothing about the subject).
 
I agree in principle. In practice, there are several external constraints that make those questions somewhat necessary.
 
Nitpick, though: exams aren't supposed to teach. They're supposed to be a reasonably accurate metric of a student's grasp of the material.
Having 24 hours after the completion of the final examination to submit semester grades? I went to a university that did this for a while. Absolutely stupid, but not enough to convince me that grading convenience should win over quality.
 
1:41 PM
^ +1
 
I flagged it but it actually is an answer, right?
 
Yes, and yes.
 
I must say, it's a little annoying that you can time travel edit your chat messages. My "^ +1" was responding to quite a different thing.
 
@Dharman Needs to actually link to Ronak's answer, but yeah, looks like an attempt to answer
@cigien You were +1-ing the "not supposed to teach". I didn't edit that.
Nothing I added to that second message changed the meaning. I just added some clarification of my meaning.
 
1:50 PM
Actually, I was +1-ing the specific thing you said in the second message. No big deal anyway. I can always explain myself if needed.
 
Original revision was "Having 24 hours after the completion of the final examination to submit semester grades? Not enough to convince me."
 
Damn, you can see revision histories of chat message edits? Cool.
 
Uh, yeah
Mods can see revision histories of comment edits.
 
Oh my. Please don't look at any of mine ;)
 
We can even see your thoughts. They show up as the initial "0" revision.
7
 
1:54 PM
What am I not seeing here? stackoverflow.com/a/65168777/1839439
 
@CodyGray In addition, they are also supposed to be a metric for how well the teacher taught the material.
 
@Dharman Capital "T" in "DevTools"
 
I'm with you in principle, convenience shouldn't win over quality, but the line must be drawn somewhere. I'm not thrilled about where it's usually drawn, of course.
 
Ohh
 
I just submitted an edit. Is that a property? Or is my nomenclature off?
 
1:57 PM
I would say it's a "name"
Or a function
 
Sometimes people are quick: Closed as dupe 29 seconds after it was posted (by gold badger)
 
I am going as fast as I can
 
got a question here asking for "possible explanations" of a function's design choice; is it POB or not? stackoverflow.com/questions/65167933/…
I mean, I can answer, but this will be my opinion only
@CodyGray is this just a matter of wording??
 
That's what I'm thinking
They aren't seeking "possible explanations"; they're seeking the explanation.
Unlike everyone else, I don't totally hate design questions
 
@CodyGray I don't hate anything. just applying the rules
 
2:09 PM
I don't have the subject matter expertise to judge whether that is inherently opinion-based
But it seems like why a function was designed to return out-of-range values instead of an error code could be objectively answered in such a way that was useful to future viewers trying to understand the API and integrate it into their app.
And that's the stuff I like to see, more than someone debugging someone else's code
@JeanneDark Oof. That one had been flagged for migration to Stats.SE.
 
@CodyGray :( The only time I use is that migration flag are for questions about SO to be migrated to MSO (after your guidance). Else I think migration is only an option if 1) the question adheres to the other site's standards and 2) if it has already answers (worth preserving).
 
Yeah, non-Meta migrations should probably be removed, or at least be mod-only
 
@CodyGray can anyone objectively answer this, beyond the one(s) who designed the function?
again, I can offer an answer, but it will be my opinion
 
I mean, I think so
But people disagree about this
And it's been discussed at length before
 
yeah, if they didn't we would not discuss it now... :)
ok, point taken
 
2:15 PM
Opinions aren't all bad, anyway. What's bad is a low-quality answer.
 
agree
 
The question you have to ask is, does your experience give you a perspective that others would not have and would be useful to them? Does it give you an "opinion" that is somehow valuable?
 
and "when in doubt, leave open"...
 
If we're just speculating about why the color is blue rather than green... that's probably pointless. But API design isn't quite rolling the dice.
 
@CodyGray it does (I think...)
 
2:18 PM
@CodyGray This turned out well :)
 
"It is completely out of my mind that i can aswer my posts by myself."
If only that were, like, documented somewhere
On a related note, it seems to be a very common misunderstanding, especially from a certain part of the world, to think that "close" means "mark as answered".
 
@CodyGray There should be more barriers to posting the first few questions.
 
It comes from support desk terminology
 
^^
 
2:42 PM
I want to give an answer 10 upvotes, but it feels so weird
 
How about a bounty?
 
Obviously I am talking about the bounty. I am not going to create 10 accounts
Still, it feels weird upvoting something, let alone giving it 100 rep
 
3:02 PM
Why does it feel weird upvoting or otherwise rewarding good content? That shouldn't feel weird.
 
@CodyGray probably because good content is rare and thus upvoting feels atypical?
 
It feels weird because most of the time there is bad content. When you find something worth upvoting it's really unusual.
 
@Dharman GMTA :D
 
Eh, I think that's a huge exaggeration. I see most of the worst content that SO has to offer, and I downvote a lot, but I also see enough good content worthy of an upvote that it doesn't feel weird at all.
 
And I have also cast over 3.3k upvotes, but finding something that I think is worth 10 upvotes is like a pearl in a haystack
 
3:09 PM
(OP confirmed that the answer from the other question does solve their problem)
 
This seems to be both, an answer and a new question. Salvageable by editing out the last sentence?
 
@JeanneDark It is not our job to salvage the answer. I would comment that they should refrain from asking new questions in an answer.
 
I already added a comment.
 
3:33 PM
It seems to be more of an attempt to ask a question. And editing out the last sentence would not make it into a useful answer. The asker already knows that they have focusable set to false. It's even mentioned in the title.
@Turing85 I have to disagree with that. When reviewing, whenever possible, you should try to improve the posts you come across. If they cannot reasonably be improved, then you should vote/flag them accordingly, so that they can be closed/removed.
Leaving a comment should be your last resort, and done only when you have something to add that one of the standard flags or close reasons doesn't already say.
Importantly, your goal when reviewing is to fix the problem. Leaving a comment doesn't fix anything.
 
If you can directly edit
 
Right. If you steadfastly refuse to earn privileges on this site, then you will find it very difficult to make meaningful contributions to the quality of the site overall.
It's weird, it's almost as if the site is set up to reward people with increased privilege levels, based on their contributions of quality content, recognizing the fact that users who contribute high-quality content can probably recognize when others do, too.
 
I wasn't reviewing the post
 
3:52 PM
@CodyGray This is not what a review is. Every review-system is based on feedback, and for good reason. If we correct the "mistakes" without explaining, worst case scenario OP will not even notice their mistake. By commenting, we provide feedback and reason in the hopes that this changes the general approach OP takes when asking/answering question and thus improving the quality in the long run. "Treat the disease, not the symptom".
 
@Turing85 No, reviewing has nothing to do with any of that. The purpose of reviewing is to improve the overall quality of content on the site. 90% of the "feedback" you leave on reviewed posts falls on deaf ears. If you aren't actually solving the problem, you're wasting time.
 
@CodyGray What you describe is curation, not review.
 
Curation is what you do in the review queues.
 
^ spam
 
@cigien 📎 It looks like you are trying to provide feedback to SD. Would you like to obtain privileges to provide feedback directly?
 
4:07 PM
No, I'm just notifying other users so it gets flagged faster. Is that pointless? Yes, I do want SD privileges eventually, but I feel like I want to hang around in Charcoal for a bit to get a feel for how it works.
 
Eh, those guys aren't as much fun as we are
 
Haha, I'll tell them you said that. Anyway, I've read some of the content you've linked but I don't feel comfortable yet. I'll get around to it soon, and then ask for privileges.
 
By "we", of course, I mean "me". Off-by-one errors are almost unavoidable.
It was partially a tongue-in-cheek reply, but only partially. Given how often we agree, I would not have any objection to your being granted privileges.
 
I appreciate that. I'll ask soon I think.
 
Get while the gettin' is good?
 
4:10 PM
BTW, is that signal to other users pointless? It seems to get things flagged faster.
 
Hmm, I'd say it's pretty pointless. But also fairly harmless.
 
Oh, I see. I won't bother then. I could have sworn it seems to help, but maybe I'm imagining it.
 
I mean, we're both just going off of impressions. If you're looking for science, you'll need to try down the hall.
Most of the SD reports that get echoed in here get handled extremely quickly anyway.
 
Oh, maybe I'll keep doing it. Makes me feel like I'm contributing ;)
 
Often, they get handled by 6 community members before a mod has a chance to smite the offending account.
 
4:14 PM
@CodyGray Isn't permission needed from one of the SD maintainers? You don't seem to be on that list.
 
@cigien In my experience, people don't like it
 
Oh, I didn't know that. I'll definitely cut it out then. Thanks for telling me.
 
@cigien I am not! You need to impress your qualifications and good nature on one of the room owners, like rene, Makyen, Machavity, TylerH, or perhaps some other chaps whose names I did not forget but only omitted in order to ensure that this comment remains as brief as possible, not long-winded and prolix as some of my other messages tend, on occasion, to be when they are posted in here.
 
Can I get SD privileges?
 
Good, a clean concise response. Just what I expect :)
 
4:17 PM
I thought that I had it before, but not now ....
OK, to find a RO and request
 
You'll need a "Proof of Sanity" certificate, of course.
 
@AdrianMole Uh-oh. You'll have to venture far outside the confines of this room to find someone who would be qualified to award such a certificate.
@VarunKumar Hi! Do you have a question? How can we help you?
 
@CodyGray Self-certification? Visual Studio allows that, so why not Smoke Detector?
 
4:39 PM
The OP in this question is asking how to do X without using libraries, but has accepted an answer that uses a library. OP has been inactive pretty much since they asked this 5 years ago, so contacting them is pointless. Can I just edit out the "without library" part?
 
Why does it bother you so? It's OK for an answer to suggest a different approach than that proposed in the question.
Also... uh... while the "standard library" is technically a library, I don't think it's what most people mean to avoid when they say "without libraries". That just means they want to use something built-in, without having to add extra stuff. The standard library isn't extra; it's standard.
 
You interested in a "RTFM" dupe suggestion?
 
No objections if you want to edit and reword that, but I feel like you might be obsessing.
 
@CodyGray I just used it as a target. And on the banner it looks slightly wrong since the new question doesn't mention any restriction on libraries. No big deal.
 
This is the duplicate, no RTFM required: stackoverflow.com/questions/16533936/…
@cigien Oops. Update your duplicates. :-)
 
4:43 PM
No - I was thinking of a post with the "What is a debugger..." suggested. But it's now been closed with a better dupe target, anyway.
 
x == std::floor(x) seems like a particularly bad solution to me, to be honest.
 
You said a while back that you'd be interested in 'educating' folks who suggest that as a dupe.
 
I'm gonna give you some edjumacation if you don't knock it off
 
@CodyGray Why did you pick that direction? Because the question title is better?
 
@cigien Question was older, question was better posed, I liked the top-rated answer better
 
4:46 PM
{suitably knocked-off}
 
@CodyGray Older, yes. better question, yes. Not so sure, answers seem similar, but you don't like floor so ok :p Also, does views matter? The other one has twice as many.
 
At a certain point, you just have to make a call...
 
Understood. Overall, I agree with the direction. Thanks for reviewing. And finding the actual target.
 
I wouldn't say views doesn't matter. It does, that's a good point. But nobody gave me the formula with the proper weights, you can't get a perfect outcome every time, and the view counter is a lot smaller for me to read and consider.
Efficiency again, I guess. :-)
 
I don't think views should matter too much, but I also don't know how people are generally searching for things, and how views affect that.
@AdrianMole Hmm, 3rd time now I've brought up a dupe target question, and someone's pointed out that RTFM targets are bad. I thought we had all agreed on this.
 
4:51 PM
!!/amiprivileged
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels ✓ You are a privileged user.
 
!!/amiprivileged
 
@cigien ╳ You are not a privileged user. Please see the privileges wiki page for information on what privileges are and what is expected of privileged users.
 
Thanks Smokey :)
 
!!/amiprivileged
 
4:53 PM
@CodyGray ✓ You are a privileged user.
 
@cigien I just came across a post entirely unrelated to anything you and Cody were discussing. It was the classic scanf(%c) and left-over newline problem (for which there is an excellent canonical). But someone had VTC as a dupe of the "RTFM" post.
 
Oh, I thought you were talking about suggesting that as the duplicate for cifigien's question.
Hence my confusion.
 
Oh, sorry. Did you share the link? I don't see it. Yeah, that confused me too.
 
OP has now deleted their question, after it was closed with the 'correct' target.
 
!!/amiprivileged
 
4:54 PM
@khelwood ╳ You are not a privileged user. Please see the privileges wiki page for information on what privileges are and what is expected of privileged users.
 
But, if anyone's interested: this one.
 
Oh, you already told them.
 
I did, didn't I. Do I get a gold star?
 
I would have upvoted the comment, were it not deleted.
 
If a correct dupe hadn't been found, the post would have likely been closed with the debugger target anyway. Shame. Maybe a meta post is in order. It is Sunday after all ;)
 
4:58 PM
@CodyGray just tempted to do this, although not sure if it ticks your objectivity requirement box: stackoverflow.com/questions/65167933/…
 
You don't need to be objective when you're an expert :-)
 

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