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user6820627
12:00 AM
@AndrewLi updated from pyccknn to real english
 
afk, may not be back today
 
Rob
12:47 AM
God, documentation is such a mess. Half the topics are simply brain dumps or 'this thing exists in the language/community'
Pruned so many topics the tag has moved down a few ranks
 
1:38 AM
I wish I could do that myself. :/
Is there a Meta on that?
 
2:21 AM
They have a lot of time
Have a lot of time...
 
Yup...
 
 
2 hours later…
3:58 AM
Time to sleep.
Cya! o/
 
 
1 hour later…
user4639281
 
5:45 AM
@EdChum: Someone takes issue with one of your close votes: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/290034/…
 
 
1 hour later…
6:45 AM
^ Do we flag that as Rude/Abusive?
And morning o/
 
I was thinking I'd just edit it with the English translation, because it does actually seem to be an answer.
 
Ah, nice =)
 
@TinyGiant that applies to questions rather than answers...
 
user4639281
@JanDvorak That applies to all non-english content
 
6:50 AM
@TinyGiant Thanks. My reasoning is that if they could read the question and give an on-topic answer, they can maintain their answer.
 
It's ridiculous to say that answerers need to be able to respond to answers to their answers
 
user4639281
@JanDvorak "They need to be able to respond to feedback"
 
do they?
 
user4639281
Please read the linked FAQ post
 
I did. I still think it mostly to applies to questions
 
user4639281
6:53 AM
Nothing in that post says it only applies to questions. It seems to me to indicate otherwise.
 
user4639281
In fact it specifically mentions answers in the bullet points, and the statement I quoted is in the global scope, not the question bullet point.
 
I think it's destructive to roll-back the edit. If they can't maintain their answer, won't it just be downvoted and deleted anyway? If the answer actually is helpful, then now you're destroyed useful content.
 
user4639281
No, I'm following policy.
 
Worth posting a new question specifically for answers?
 
user4639281
If the OP wants to translate their post to english, they can do that.
 
user4639281
6:55 AM
@JanDvorak I don't see why, the same logic applies.
 
@TinyGiant so can they edit the broken formatting in their questions, should they desire so
moreover, we can instruct them on proper formatting, but not on proper grammar
do we want them to squeeze their content through a translator just to prove a point before we have to fix it anyways?
 
user4639281
You can edit to improve the formatting if you like, I don't see any reason to do so unless the OP translate's their post to english.
 
@TinyGiant What difference does it make if they use Google translate vs if I do?
 
As has been said - you're losing content
They don't really need the ability to respond to feedback. Most of them won't do even if they can.
 
user4639281
@4castle I'm just following the policy. I didn't make the policy, but until it changes I'm going to follow it.
 
user4639281
7:00 AM
The policy is quite clear in this case.
 
user4639281
If you would like to change the policy, by all means go to meta with a proposal.
 
@TinyGiant The policy is also quite clear on why the policy exists, and that reason doesn't apply here.
 
user4639281
I don't see why it does not. If it doesn't apply here, it doesn't apply in any case. In every single case the user could put their content or the feedback into google translate.
 
@TinyGiant they could properly format their code, too
 
user4639281
But editing to format code properly is accepted as per the current policy.
 
7:02 AM
Maybe we should just repost them along the lines of "as the deleted french answer by Frechie87LUL says, "
 
user4639281
If you're willing to maintain it.
 
Nah, I'll post it as CW and ignore feedback
because not-CW would accuse me of stealing rep anyways
 
user4639281
That's up to you.
 
You know who else just followed their current policy?
 
user4639281
Who?
 
7:07 AM
Everyone in military.
 
Naw, they follow orders.
 
Whistleblowers in the communist regime
 
What communist regime?
 
user4639281
Health care workers
 
user4639281
Teachers, bankers, lawyers, pretty well everyone who has a job follows some kind of policy.
 
7:09 AM
so, are we following the rule that loses content because somebody might be attributed an objective fact they cannot defend?
 
user4639281
@SmokeDetector Wat? 2010?
 
"Link at the end of answer" - stackoverflow.com
 
@Seth point taken
yeah, let's nuke ALL the answers
 
user4639281
@JanDvorak We are following the policy because it is policy. If you want to change the policy, there is an established method of doing so.
 
As far as I'm concerned the overall goal of SO is to build a repository of questions and answers so if we have good content in the wrong language what's so wrong with translating it rather than nuking it?
 
7:11 AM
I've already commented under the answer
 
Honestly, I'm a fan of the VLQ flag + repost it (in english) method.
 
Is there a policy to revert edits so that a policy can be re-applied?
 
@ivarni Because the author cannot properly respond to feedback.
 
user4639281
@ivarni That seems like a discussion for meta.
 
@Seth Why do they need to?
I ignore "feedback" on a fairly regular basis
Should I then delete my answers?
 
7:12 AM
@ivarni That's your way of going about it.
 
user4639281
There's a difference between being able to do something, and choosing not to do something.
 
Let's play devil's advocate here. If we clean up broken english, they get feedback, and they reply in barely intelligible english, were they really able to respond to feedback?
 
@JanDvorak I get the feeling you like playing devils advocate...
 
@TinyGiant they weren't told to post in English, were they? And if they were, do they know how to access their deleted answer so that they could squeeze it through a translator and prove a point to us that yes, they can read English?
@Seth the problem is, sometimes I convince myself anyways
 
And also, atleast they'll understand the feedback they've been given.
So, the feedback isn't completely worthless.
Also, I'd take a reply written in broken english above one written in mandarin any day.
 
user4639281
7:16 AM
^
 
So, when is the meta discussion going to appear? I'd rather not have to ask it myself....
 
user4639281
You are correct that it does not say anything about english only content in the tour. Maybe it should, maybe it shouldn't. I don't know.
 
@TinyGiant doesn't?
:p
 
does, or does not?
 
user4639281
What?
 
7:19 AM
That.
 
user4639281
I'm not interested in posting on meta about it. I don't disagree with the current reasoning and policy.
 
Do you ever?
 
user4639281
Often actually.
 
user4639281
@4castle I would like to see some attribution there for users who can't see the deleted content.
 
How should the attribution be formatted?
 
user4639281
7:22 AM
Even if it is "This is a translated version of a now deleted non english answer by [user](link to profile)"
 
"as FrenchieLover 98 said in his deleted answer, " might raise some questions. Which is a good thing, now that I think about it.
 
@TinyGiant It's a community post. You may add the attribution.
 
Another question: CW, or not?
 
user4639281
Whichever you prefer, I would pick CW if I were doing the reposting.
 
@dur I want to close (2 more votes) and then delete that question, it's part of my clean up effort.
 
user4639281
7:26 AM
Which is only something I would do if it were a technology I was familiar with and I knew it was a correct and useful answer.
 
I thought we wanted to preserve incorrect answers as examples of what not to do?
Speaking of reposts - if I repost someone's answer, I take the OP's ability to provide feedback to the feedback to his content.
 
... Which he probably wouldn't be able to either way.
And by probably I mean around 95% sure.
 
You don't know that
Don't the 5% matter?
 
They do, but I'd expect those to raise their voice. We did leave comments after all.
 
or did we? I didn't.
 
user4639281
7:38 AM
I did. They did not respond.
 
8:08 AM
Good morning \o
 
8:21 AM
Greetings
1 message moved to Trash
 
@Tunaki o/
@kayess o/
 
\o
 
morning
 
8:51 AM
Just learned that arrays in Fortran start at 1...
 
Autohotkey doesn't even have arrays, or even numbers
 
@Tunaki as do they in MATLAB
 
9:09 AM
@AlexanderO'Mara I don't remember this question very well, it looks like it appeared in the close vote review queue, the OP is moaning about lack of comments but the review queue generally just lets you vote, the close reason also may not have been my reason, rather it was the first or majority close vote. Also as one of the close voters is a pro openGL expert I think it would be reasonable to assume they had good enough domain expertise to judge this question.
 
hiya @JarrodRoberson @EdChum @PetterFriberg \o
 
@Tunaki The worst in java is that also the recordset starts at 1.
\o
 
Morning all ٩(θ‿θ)۶
@kayess morning
 
@PetterFriberg Also in FoxPro every index starts at 1
You can imagine how confusing it might be to switch back to legacy code from C# :p
 
well all at 1 is ok in java almost everyting start at 0 array, list etc, except that darn RecordSet it starts at 1
 
9:14 AM
wow bad
 
@PetterFriberg That is so disturbing yes.
 
@PetterFriberg yeah java sucks
 
expects kick in 3...2...1
 
c# > java
 
@ColdFire : ), says the android developer.... since android is built on java... what does that make android?
@px06 naaa c# is a copy of java...
 
9:16 AM
@PetterFriberg android too sucks you know
 
Don't worry. Java sucks less that ObjC
 
that is true^
 
lets all use scratch
 
Let's stick to Javascript, just for the lulz
 
9:18 AM
@PetterFriberg scratch is a language?
 
Yeah my Kids do it in school... it's great you drag and drop stuff : )
 
@PetterFriberg I think they're very similar but C# in my opinion is more structured, more organised in terms of OOP semantics and also VS beats all IDEs.
I just wish .NET wasn't constrained to windows
 
ooh no I hate VS... maybe because I used eclipse for years and know all shorts cuts in it...
 
@px06 except for performance, the bugs and that it's Windows-only, you mean?
 
IntellIj is better
 
9:22 AM
C# is a high powered laser cannon attached to a donkey. If you disconnect the donkey, it doesn't work.
They're slowly but surely getting there though
 
I love new VS 2016 and all the debugging tools; I can't find any other IDE offers that for any other language
 
I'm still stuck at VS 2013
 
@MadaraUchiha i think since 2-3 years ago it's been improved substantially
@PetterFriberg would really recommend you try out the new one, there is no difference between pro and community so you won't be missing out
 
@px06 eh, I can do away with print statements - and they have their beauty
@px06 so... they literally sell you nothing but a good feeling of having supported M$?
 
Eclipse is Dah Best
 
9:25 AM
Dah Beast, pejoratively :p
 
Netbeans...
=)
 
awww
Netbeans
 
@Seth slow, but decent
 
@JanDvorak A sturdy beast.
And a very nice UI.
 
@Seth POB, and I disagree
 
9:26 AM
Wait, someone should have mentioned Zend $tudio, the GUI of Pretty Hard to Program
 
@Seth what?
 
@JanDvorak Compared to Eclipse the Netbeans UI rocks. ô.o
Fight me, pleb!
 
netbeans is one of the worst IDE ever IMO
 
@JanDvorak They only license it for professional use, not really features. visualstudio.com/vs/compare which I think is a great idea for people who don't want to spend money on a product which they will probably develop a few applications on
 
@JanDvorak english question: in my last sentence, should I write "should have mentioned" or just "should have mention" ? For past tense
 
9:27 AM
Currently I'm using Atom
@kayess the former
 
@kayess should have mentioned.
 
@ColdFire Never.
 
Thank you to both
 
and it's present perfect, not past tense (but you got the usage right)
 
ò_ó
 
9:28 AM
@SmokeDetector I'd vote for unclear if it were a question...
 
Hm doesn't the 'ed' affix makes it past?
 
@SmokeDetector @tripleee are you sure?
 
> Constantly freezing, overclocking cpu and memory because it's written in shittiest language ever invented JAVA! BAH! Worst IDE!
Meh :/
 
> -ed | a suffix forming the past participle of weak verbs
 
9:31 AM
@kayess "I killed him yesterday" is simple past tense, "I have killed him and now he's dead" is present perfect, "He had already died by the time he was dead" is past perfect. The latter is a rare sight.
 
@Seth see told you Netbeans is the worst
 
@YvetteColomb I went general hardware on that one
 
@JanDvorak You're playing devil's advocate whenever I see you, and now you're talking about killing people...
 
@JanDvorak makes sense, thanks
 
>:-)
 
9:32 AM
@ColdFire Na. That guy just has 0 clue.
 
@Seth whether or not he has clue Netbeans is the worst
 
@ColdFire Naw. Is gud.
 
even autocomplete is pathetic in Netbeans
 
netbeans looks so bad, the intellisense is retarded and it doesn't do anything spectacular...
 
^
the netbeans intellisense is anciet
to say the least
 
9:34 AM
I also think eclipse has stupid intellisense, whenever I press backspace i closes and doesn't come back up again... maybe I'm doing something weong
 
Y'all are doing something very wrong.
NetBeans also closes & crashes when someone inserts bad code c:
 
user3956566
@Adriaan possibly
 
@Seth That's actually a feature
 
@JanDvorak Indeed.
Sadly it works afterwards again, so with enough time someone could create the ugliest program ever in netbeans =/
 
The only reason to start Netbeans is to lose time
4
 
9:37 AM
^
 
and sanity
 
Is it worth learning x86 asm ?
 
For whom?
 
@Tunaki You are using eclipse =(
 
I mean is it beneficial to have on my skillset?
 
9:38 AM
I would give up my sanity & time just for the promise of getting to keep my eyes =/
 
you know eclipse has themes?
and you can customize it
 
It's still bloody ugly.
 
@px06 ... yes?
 
lol and you think netbeans isnt ugly?
facepalm
 
Why try & spend a lot of time on crafting something terribad into something slightly-less-terribad, when you can just have something good to begin with?
ô.ô
 
9:42 AM
@Seth because everyone has their own definition of good and bad when it comes to workspace and IDEs and all of that
One company can't cater for everyone individually
 
Clearly, we need to create our own IDE that will please everyone.
 
SOCVR Studio '18
 
Built exclusively with browser userscripts
 
@JanDvorak :D
 
9:44 AM
@Tunaki see my last delv-pls; should that be delv-pls or reflag-pls? I'm unsure, now that I thought about it longer than the grace period allowed for
 
@ivarni and the recompile function should just run MagicEditor(TM) on a given post
 
@Adriaan bah I wouldn't really flag that, so del-pls is fine
 
speaking of which, where is @Mogsdad
 
@Tunaki aight, thanks. I already used both flag types, so I was wondering whether I did something wrong there, but I still think it should be deleted.
 
10:03 AM
@PetterFriberg sorry for late reply, turns out I was probably wrong, apologies
 
10:47 AM
 
11:28 AM
> well, on the brighter side of things, we have freed up a roster slot. ~~ Baer, playing Darkest Dungeon
 
!!/blame
 
@ColdFire It's Cold Fire's fault.
 
harakiri
 
lol
 
11:44 AM
@ColdFire You need to commit sudoku now =/ T'was nice knowing you.
 
is that a bug in the blame function
 
!!/blame
 
@ColdFire It's Seth's fault.
 
yay
@Seth ^^
 
>,<
 
12:30 PM
Morning
 
Hey NO o/
 
1:01 PM
I actually plugged SO.Jobs in a close vote reason \o/
 
Hiya
 
1:39 PM
Does anyone happen to have a link to a meta question regarding the topicality of licencing + app store acceptance questions? I can't find it right now.
 
Plop everyone
 
Hiya Kyll
 
Plap
 
Slap
 
Anyone else eating popcorn and watching meta?
 
1:49 PM
oh wow
well I am now :D
 
/me fetches popcorn
 
PLZ SEND TEH POP CORZ!!!
I don't have :(
 
sends using FTL travelz
 
Bummer. I tried but it said you you to open up a POP3 port ;)
 
1:52 PM
Goddamnit Nathan
 
couldn't help myself there
 
cool, GH buttons works even without javascript...
 
Oh hey, there's a page for moderator private messages? I never knew that.
 
Is there a way to search chat for everything said by a particular user?
 
... Which on second thought is probably a good thing.
 
1:54 PM
@NathanOliver Nope.
 
Yes it is
 
@NathanOliver nope
 
dang and blast
 
@NathanOliver Nop- damnit
 
@Kyll Your ninja skills seem to be lacking.
 
1:55 PM
I did ninja you on the comments though.
 
I blame caching :p
 
That's my second name.
 
Blame? I get that. You are blamed a lot hey oh ;)
 
Aug 11 '16 at 18:23, by gunr2171
"protocol violation"? That's Kyll's middle name!
 
1:57 PM
o_o
 
Kyll has a second name and a middle name
 
I don't even
How do you remember that
 
That means he has at least 5 names
 
I don't want to think about what goes on in Tuna's memory
@NathanOliver Rofl, as a matter of fact I have 4 first names and 5 last names if you want to count them all
 
1:59 PM
@Kyll It must be fun filing out applications.
 
@NathanOliver I only use two legally, because lazy.
 
figures
 
@Braiam Old one, still nice =D
@NathanOliver I've heard about Indian with only a single name who have trouble filling out applications in the west, particularly for studies.
 
That doesn't surprise me. People don't seam to realize all the different kinds of names that are out there. It's like trying to add proper address support to a form. Address can be crazy like 5 miles south of the last gas station on highway 404
 
o_o
@NathanOliver VARCHAR all the things?
 
2:05 PM
Pretty much. Take in all input as strings
 
@Kyll I wish I knew as well :(
 
@Enzokie Where's your close vote on this qu... oh. S-sorry, I didn't know. Gosh it must feel so bad, I'm sorry.
 
Was that the XKCD game thingy?
lol Pekka
 
2:22 PM
@Kyll :3
 
:3
 
Hi cold fire
 
hey
 
@SamuelLiew I wonder why after 90k views, no-one voted to delete it though.
 
@Tunaki Well, we can continue to leave it up, but it sure won't be helpful
 
2:28 PM
why are those guys upvoting stackoverflow.com/posts/14751137/…? :/
 
morning!
 
Hiya gunr
 
@Tunaki Don't attract negative attention to stuff
Plop gunr!
 
well, today is it. They day we are all screwed.
 
Haha
 
2:31 PM
lol
 
We'll be with you in a few months
 
sounds like we should do TF2 tonight to make up for it
 
I won't be at my flat, thus won't have proper network abilities for TF2 =(
 
noooooo!!!
that question is not programming related, right?
 
Seems like GC
 
2:46 PM
@SamuelLiew can 20k users vote to delete an accepted answer?
 
yes
 
That's... a little scary
SO opinion on accepted answer has always been that they are a sacred thing, more or less. As in, only an OP or a moderator can do something about changing an accepted answer in that way
Of course I personally have considered posting a discussion/feature request to let community change the accepted answer in some cases
 
There may be useful Meta discussions or comments about this
 
but that gets into changing what an accepted answer is
 
It's the first time I see a Meta post at -50 or less without a single upvote
 
2:53 PM
@Kyll there should be a badge for that
there's probably 6 hats for it
 
user6820627
3:08 PM
Someone is stealing my name! "I want be transparent". OK, serious thing. Do you think we really need to delete it?
 
@LearnHowToBeTransparent Delete the post? We don't moderate Meta.
 
user6820627
@Kyll i know. i am not asking for del votes. what do you think?
 
Meh on that.
 
user6820627
@Kyll imo, just keep.
 
@LearnHowToBeTransparent I have a comment about that every thing there
Still debating on whether or not to use my delete vote. It's not often I use them on meta
 
3:19 PM
oh wow, that meta post got heated
Meta: it's too hot for you
 
Yeah. Meagar wound up locking the answer even
 
yeah too heated
 
3:52 PM
> Web developers are not being taught OOP. They are being taught a simple way of programming - steering them towards simple websites (which is what governments want).
lol, quoted from here
 
Jon Skeet took away my meta drama :(
 
@kayess it's a conspiracy! wake up people!
Dangit Kyll
 
Hi all. o/
 
I was literally moving my pinky finger over to the enter button when you beat me
 
Gotta hide the conspiracy!
@TylerH Proof that paws > hands
 
3:55 PM
@Kyll indeed
 
Hiya Baum
 
that thing better get closed quick, it's attracting upvotes like candy
 
@kayess "Modular programming caused many problems, so they invented encapsulation" is also nonsense. OOP just extends modular programming to bundling data and operation.
 

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