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1:00 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Matthew Brown aka Lord Matt
TBH I have grave doubts about the long term viability of WPSE and the fact that all WP questions are best asked here at SO if you want timely answers. I am aware I am leaning on meta a bit hard but if I were to go ahead and propose WP2SE I would want to find broad support for doing so first. — Matthew Brown aka Lord Matt 24 secs ago
 
 
3 hours later…
3:48 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by peterh
@HereticMonkey It is an obvious bullshit to cover the hostility of the community. — peterh 34 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Robert Longson
[ Boson ] New comment posted by MicroservicesOnDDD
I just read the "duplicate". If the community just did not "Like" my question, then how can I fix it. And I can't delete the question they don't like because the community has "invested" too much into it. Unfortunately, I didn't do too well in mind-reading class, and I don't know what technologies the community doesn't like. That definitely isn't in the "duplicate" post. — MicroservicesOnDDD 11 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Robert Longson
If you want to focus on a specific question let us know. If not, the link is the general advice that's always given here. — Robert Longson 48 secs ago
 
4:28 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Houseman
You're making an unproven assumption that "the community doesn't LIKE the topic". You'd probably get better results if you didn't make such assumptions — Houseman 55 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by parsley72
I agree that not many people look at edits, but I just posted a question and someone immediately edited it to replace a tag with a more obvious tag that I'd missed. I wanted to upvote their change to say thanks but there's no way of doing that. — parsley72 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Patrice
So, we see nothing specific to help you. You also seem to mix answer and question ban. Are you banned for one? For both? Your question seems to say answer-ban, but then you say you need to ask questions.as for how to help you..... The duplicate has ALL the guidance that exists. No one will 'manually' unban you. The system will let you post when the positive contributions outweigh the bad. You have one question every 6 months that can help. Or you can ask for disassociation of some posts — Patrice 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Robert Longson
I suspect you're actually under an answer ban because one of your answers was flagged as spamRobert Longson 20 secs ago
 
5:02 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by MicroservicesOnDDD
Won't pointing people back to that question just tank my score even further. I'm trapped. The last post says, "Unfortunately, @MicroservicesOnDDD, what you think is a good question isn't what the community thinks is a good question." There's no way out of this trap, and you can't see it, because you have to "mind-read" what the community likes and doesn't like. — MicroservicesOnDDD 11 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by MicroservicesOnDDD
@RobertLongson - I looked at that, and I don't see anything spam, rude, or abusive. Have you looked at it? — MicroservicesOnDDD 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by luangtatipsy
Thank you for your replies, I'll take a look for it. — luangtatipsy 1 min ago
 
5:38 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Samuel Liew
Deleted answers, score <= 0: (1 2 3 4 5) — Samuel Liew ♦ 22 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Benjol
@AlexeiLevenkov, yes, all these downvotes make me feel persecuted. Where can I get a refund? — Benjol 1 min ago
 
6:00 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by BDL
Which type of questions would be allowed on WP2 but are off-topic on SO? Creating WP2 just for the sake of having a own community doesn't sound like a good idea. — BDL 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by StoryTeller
Stop being on the offensive. Robert didn't say your answer is spam/rude, he said it was flagged as such. That's a factual statement of the situation, there is a flag on it. — StoryTeller 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
Regarding your edit: that meta-question was about a question. Now you mention an answer ban, so the issues would be unrelated, I think. — yivi 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
WP.SE is already mostly redundant as it is... what would a new site provide, besides confusion? — yivi 35 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by StoryTeller
I see it as actively harmful. That will just give help vampires a means to hunt and pester people. — StoryTeller 50 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
I see no value in this, at all. Please explain how it would work that it would be different from "emails and links". — yivi 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
I'm asking the network to pay me! lol — Yvette Colomb ♦ 44 secs ago
 
7:04 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ivarni
@peterh voting works different on meta, and are often used to express disagreement. Those votes do not affect reputation in any way. — ivarni 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
"with jsfiddle/codepen link an no MCVE" Questions with no code and only a fiddle link already get blocked with a "We need the codez" kind of warning. "Only for JavaScript questions" And HTML/CSS — Cerbrus 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
That's all I wanted to hear :-) Thanks. — Cerbrus 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gman
They are not actually blocked (just saw one with no code) and they do not encourage an actually MCVE. Most new users just post some code which is neither Complete nor Verifiable. Hence my suggestion. If S.O. encourages them to copy the code from their jsfiddle/codepen into a snippet than the Complete and Verifiable requirements are likely covered. The Minimal one not so much but CVE is better then just a few lines of irrelevant code copied from their off site example. — gman 1 min ago
 
7:22 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Shadow Wizard
@Alex the API is open, and even got a whole site dedicated to it and apps using it: stackapps.comShadow Wizard 24 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by peterh
@ivarni Simply admitting that we are a hostile scum, would be at least clear and honest. If you are already evil, at least admit it. — peterh 19 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@AlexeiLevenkov Question doesn't say that the whole company must use the review system. Just that employees should be paid for it. Doesn't have to be all of them. On the other hand, this answer doesn't say that you should hire random people. Hire the right people instead. — Trilarion 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Ivar
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
I added the feature request tag, but only because it is one and the question was downvoted already before. In this case, it's especially useful to look at the pluses and minuses separately. It seems that about 40% of the people like the idea and that's a lot. Maybe for feature requests one should not display U-D which is not very informative but rather U/(U+D) (U=#upvotes and D=#downvotes). — Trilarion 58 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
Game development is basically a meta-tag more like the name for a collection of tags or a cluster of related tags. This kind of thing doesn't exist yet on StackOverflow. Maybe you want to create a feature request for it. — Trilarion 25 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ivarni
@peterh Not sure about evil, but parts of it seem a bit on the edge — ivarni 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ChrisF
@JeanneDark - That's already mentioned - "voting on posts or comments [...] from other accounts with your main account and your alternate account(s)" — ChrisF ♦ 7 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Alexei Levenkov
Semi-serious suggestion - what if we instead encourage questions to be just link to JSFiddle and correspondingly link-only answer? This way both people involved will get what they need and SO will not be burdened by poor questions showing up in search... — Alexei Levenkov 35 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
Aren't all burninated tags automatically blacklisted? If not, why not? — Trilarion 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
You need to format it yourself, in an editor. on SO there are no fancy formatting features as many programming languages and formats have their own needs, not to speak about tabs vs spaces .... — rene 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Jeanne Dark
Also voting on other people's posts with your main and sockpuppet account(s), either up- or downvoting. — Jeanne Dark 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by peterh
@ivarni I would suggest to read this. An important feature of the evil, that it is irrational (the community simply does not profits anything to harm others - if they would harm others for their own benefit, it would be at least understable. And not so demonic.) — peterh 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by peterh
@Trilarion I believe, the tagging had only little effect to the score of the question, and the attitude of the community was the major determinant. — peterh 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ivarni
@peterh there's a lack of rationality in certain parts of the community, that's for sure — ivarni 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by peterh
@ivarni If the voting and other actions, what the MSO community is doing, would be done by a single person, this person would imho require urgent therapy. This community, as a collective entity, is imho abnormal. — peterh 45 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Jeanne Dark
1) Reviewing one's own posts (not sure if it counts as voting, maybe make it more explicit.) For example, come across sockpuppet's question in Close Vote Review Queue and vote "Leave Open". 2) Engaging in discussions (comment threads and chat) with main and sockpuppet account(s). While discussions in comments are discouraged, with sockpuppets supporting me, it's even worse (FWIW, Jeannie Dark and Jeanne Dork agree with me). — Jeanne Dark 53 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Vadim Kotov
No open questions left — Vadim Kotov 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
Stack Overflow tries to be inclusive and we already have a hard time achieving that. It can't be ruled out that such mechanism lead to the forming of a clique of users that pass each other posts to answer. While beneficial for you that is unhealthy in the long run for SO as site. The idea of the Share button has always been to attract attention from users that are not already participating on the platform. The Q/A model is about posts, not that much about users. It lacks many social network features on purpose. — rene 1 min ago
 
8:42 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
 
9:28 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
Since voting has no clear, distinct significance on meta, this kind of change would be rather meaningless. — yivi 41 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
Half-way solutions won't help here. A proper bug/feature tracker is needed at some point, and I believe everybody is aware of this. — yivi 24 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@yivi This is too negative. Voting is at least officially still the question quality except for feature requests. I say that the ratio is always better than the difference, independent of if there is a bug tracker or not. — Trilarion 58 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
For FRs voting can be agreement/disagreement or any of the usual reasons. So voting do not express a clear signal. I do not believe this solve any problem we currently have in meta. — yivi 10 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by CertainPerformance
Just my experience, but as a Javascript regular, I find link-only questions unusual. Most questions about code I see contain some code. — CertainPerformance 35 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by E_net4
Are we ignoring that Meta can have bad questions in this proposal? Or we would somehow tell people to only vote if they understand the feature proposed? — E_net4 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ivarni
The issue is that votes can signal different things, it could be straight disagreement but it could also be that a feature request is poorly researched or duplicated ad nauseam in previous posts. This doesn't really fix that, it just shifts the problem to pretending all votes are about agreement, — ivarni 1 min ago
 
9:52 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Zoe
@Cerbrus blocked? Yes. Easy to bypass? Also yes. All it checks for is a code block, not whether that code block is a block with code — Zoe 11 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
@Zoe yea, I didn’t claim it was perfect. — Cerbrus 1 min ago
 
10:28 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by forpas
After almost 4 days the votes are not yet reversed! — forpas 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by walen
@Magisch Hand-waving GDPR compliance as a non-issue because companies use ad-blockers seems kind of wrong? Like saying burglary is a non-issue because companies use door locks anyway... — walen 25 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by adiga
Paste the JSON in a stack snippet and click on "Tidy": How do I create a Stack Snippet?adiga 43 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Alex
cool, it's hard to find. — Alex 1 min ago
 
10:54 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Magisch
@walen I wasn't handwaving it, but any company that is big enough to benefit from this likely has their own DPO (or an external one to consult), which will recommend policies and can give guidance to make something otherwise incompatible with GDPR useable in the company. If there's a will to use SO teams, GDPR will not be the thing that stops a company from using it. — Magisch 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Bob
I downvoted something and then realised too late that it didn't deserve the down vote but now I can't remove it ( not a tactical down vote - a genuine error. Just lock accounts for people who are tactical-down-voting as detected by the system and verified by a moderator and let everyone else change their minds. — Bob 9 secs ago
 
11:08 AM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by duplode
@E_net4 This proposal wouldn't affect our ability to downvote poorly formulated FRs. The only difference is that the default display of scores would be geared towards conveying the reception of well formulated FRs, rather than of the poorly formulated ones. — duplode 29 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Peter Mortensen
Why do you have grave doubts about the long term viability of WPSE? Quality of answers? Answer response time? Question quality? Moderation or lack thereof? Non-critical mass? — Peter Mortensen 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Peter Mortensen
What do you mean by "...with not code"? — Peter Mortensen 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
I feel adventurous. — rene 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
Should've seen that coming. — Cerbrus 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@E_net4 Voting is different on meta says voting on feature request is agreement not quality. You have to understand something to agree with it. It's difficult to express two things in a single value anyway. If people don't understand a feature request, they should post a comment or close vote as "unclear what is asked", I would say. — Trilarion 11 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
It doesn't say "it's agreement not quality". It says "it's agreement [...] rather than just quality or usefulness". (Emphasis mine). They are supposed to mean a both a quality score and an agreement indicator. And everybody uses them as they wish anyway. — yivi 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Adriaan
"if those accounts interact in any way, then that's against the rules," Given that "any way" is in bold, this would not allow you to interact with a chatbot you own. (It wouldn't be against this rule to create it, but it would to respond to it/give it commands in a chatroom). — Adriaan 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ChrisF
@Adriaan I was thinking about interactions on the main site when I wrote that. It would also apply to chat if the second account wasn't a chatbot. — ChrisF ♦ 20 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@yivi I thought the "rather than" is a synonym of "instead", but I'm not a native speaker. — Trilarion 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
I interpret that as they can be used both because of reasons of quality or agreement. And I think I'm not alone in that interpretation. — yivi 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
And in meta votes are routinely used to express agreement and disagreement on things not tagged as FR anyway. — yivi 1 min ago
 
12:04 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
I think that would be a very accurate description. — yivi 14 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@yivi I didn't. I reserved agreement/disagreement for answers on non feature requests. But it looks like voting on meta can be rightfully described as kind of a mess. — Trilarion 45 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by JL2210
What are the rules governing multiple accounts and downvotes? — JL2210 2 mins ago
 
12:38 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
...another (human-spoken) language? When I read that I said, "but it is another language! bash and JSONPath rather than PHP!" but then I (think I) got it. — Heretic Monkey 44 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
 
12:58 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
Intuitively, I wouldn't know what to do with numbers like 40% (42) if I saw them in the vote count area, even if I knew it was a "ratio". 40% in favor I guess? 42... is the spread? It might be helpful for those <1k users who can't see the vote counts, but I would say that argues for always showing the vote counts for FRs... — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
 
1:12 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
@JL2210 the same user shouldn't up or downvote the same post from multiple accounts — Yvette Colomb ♦ 12 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
It's MRE now, not MCVE. That's like, so three months ago. :) I like where you're going, but Snippets do need some love. For instance, we need to have a way of reproducing ajax requests/responses, or at least a reasonable facsimile thereof. We need the console code to be updated to a more recent version. Also, Snippets work great for browser-based code, but for things like Node.js, where you might deal with file systems and networking, it falls short. But let not "perfect" become the enemy of "good". — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
 
1:38 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Joey Quint
@fbueckert I don't think I can, it would still be wrong because I'm making a sum of the subquery. But anyway, it fits the way I asked the question so I'm going to accept the answer. — Joey Quint 46 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by jhpratt
Note that there is one explicit exception to sockpuppetry — testing a possible security vulnerability. I can't find the page on it, but I I recall seeing it when I went to report one. — jhpratt 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by user000001
Just add a red exclamation mark when there is a large percentage of opposing views, so that you don't forget to click the score. — user000001 32 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ChrisF
@jhpratt - but in that case you're not really doing something that you can't do with your main account. Some mods maintain a low rep account so they can remind themselves what the site looks like to newcomers. I tend to use browse it logged out for that purpose. — ChrisF ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@HereticMonkey You might get better with time. The percentage can only mean agreement or disagreement and the number of parentheses could maybe written as (N=42) to make it more clear that it's the total number. One would probably get used to it. Intuitively, would a score of -8 be strong disagreement (probably only if N is small)? — Trilarion 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@HereticMonkey "I would say that argues for always showing the vote counts for FRs" I guess what people would do internally then would probably be to calculate the ratio. Would they rather see +8/-2 and +16/-4 or 80%(10) and 80%(20)? — Trilarion 27 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cindy Meister
Happened to me, yesterday. Q about Word; A for Excel. The Q-OP commented to the A-OP, who's reply was "Oh, yeah, I missed that." But didn't delete it. I flagged as LQ, which was rejected... <sigh> — Cindy Meister 1 min ago
 
2:08 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
@CindyMeister: VLQ isn't for technical inaccuracies, no matter how blatant. — Cerbrus 43 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Erik A
How about second accounts to avoid quality control measures? I've had a previous discussion with a user that advocated using a second account to ask questions you know will get poor reception (debugging/poor effort ones) to avoid rep loss. My opinion is that shouldn't be allowed, but we don't have official guidance on it. — Erik A 9 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
Maybe it's just me, but I can tell, by looking at +17/-25, that it's a fairly negative reaction, albeit controversial. I don't need to do any math on it to come up with that - it shows +/- in green and red. Honestly, to really get your head around the numbers, you'd want something like a sparkline that shows the votes over time, perhaps relative to some "average FR". — Heretic Monkey 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by jhpratt
@ChrisF I imagine if there was some weird but with regard to voting, close votes, etc. that it would be acceptable as well. Without going into too much detail, the potential vulnerability I noticed required a suggested edit to be present, so I had to use a second account. It's more of an edge case that the overwhelming majority of people will never run into, though. — jhpratt 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by ChrisF
@ErikA - technically that's not against the rules as long as the first account doesn't interact with those questions. — ChrisF ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@HereticMonkey Why a sparkline? The time order of the up and downvotes should be relatively random. Maybe a trend analysis (up/down arrows). Your comment about a spread sounded interesting. By bootstraping (or assuming the score is a result of a binomial random exp.) one could probably display the ratio (p) and the spread=std. (sqrt(p(1-p)/N)) or so. Instead of +17/-25 it would be 40%(7.5%) - maybe not such a fairly negative reaction. — Trilarion 19 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
I think the sparkline would be show voting trends, e.g., if a good portion of positive votes came at the beginning, then the negative votes came in, it might be that it seemed like a good idea when posted, but as answers were posted, people read those and saw the problems with the proposed change. Or vice versa, of course. — Heretic Monkey 13 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cindy Meister
@Cerbrus Yes, so I was reminded :-) Still, it would be useful to have a way to get rid of things so obviously not pertinent to the Q. And it's a shame to have to waste DV on things like that. — Cindy Meister 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
Your comment about bootstraping/binomial random exp flew over my head, I'm afraid. Not sure what that means, and therefore am not sure how many others would either (but I'm a self-taught programmer who graduated with a degree in theater :)). — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
@CindyMeister: But is the downvote really wasted if you use it the way it was intended? :P — Cerbrus 41 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Trilarion
@HereticMonkey Basically, the idea was that the more voters we have, the less uncertainty would we have that the displayed score is not changing much anymore if even more voters would came. You wouldn't want to judge a question after the first vote only. You would trust a -30/+20 much more that it's fairly negative than a -3/+2, would you? The rest is just doing one calculation or the other. Maybe that's also not the best idea really. — Trilarion 22 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
@fbueckert there is a general duplicate answer policy on SO. In fact there's an automated flagging that lets mods know a duplicated answer has been posted. — Yvette Colomb ♦ 55 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
@fbueckert yeh I was posting an answer on there when it was migrated. So I copy and pasted it across :) — Yvette Colomb ♦ 7 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by fbueckert
@YvetteColomb Yeah, that's what I said. The comment was on the M.SE post, a hair before it was migrated here. — fbueckert 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Braiam
@jhpratt if you are talking about the hammer, it falls under "do something with one or more alternate accounts that you wouldn't be able to do with just your main account" — Braiam 45 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cindy Meister
Mmm. There's some question in my mind how much use it is in a low-traffic tag (ms-word)... One, at the most, 2 DV is pretty much it, no matter what the content. Low quality posts are coming thick-and-fast. It would be nice to reach 20k at some point. — Cindy Meister 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Cerbrus
You're getting there. — Cerbrus 1 min ago
 
3:22 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Script47
@CindyMeister it sucks for those who are both curating and trying to reach a rep goal. — Script47 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Kevin B
Most javascript questions that can be helped by having an SO Snippet are duplicates. — Kevin B 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
@rene your humour is so dry... for a flower this is not healthy ;) — Yvette Colomb ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
@KevinB Yeah, but it helps determine which duplicate ;). — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yvette Colomb
@gnat helpful links, but this post is expressing dislike at the unwelcoming nature of the deletion and comment. There's some discourse about this under a deleted answer here that <10k cannot see. — Yvette Colomb ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Braiam
"because people tend to use Close Vote in many cases where a Downvote would be more consistent" [citation needed]. — Braiam 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
I wouldn't say that making it easier for users to answer your question is "hand-wringy". If I get a question with a Stack Snippet, I don't have to copy and paste from five different code blocks and try and munge them together into a moderately coherent answer: I can click on Copy Snippet to Answer, fix their code, add an explanation of what I changed, and be done. That gets them their answer faster, there's less chance for long comment chains trying the clarify things, etc. — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
@YvetteColomb if you believe expressing dislike is important, take a look at Why are duplicate answers deleted? As far as I can tell it covers same matter of deleted identical answers and adds a solid dose of dislike over that — gnat 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
Well, if all they've done is post a link to their code off-site then that's safe to close, no comments required. If they've posted their code on the site and have a link to an off-site code snippet, then that's at least serviceable. I find it hand-wringy since comments to the effect of, "Bring your code to this snippet instead of that snippet" when there's enough code to answer their question don't add value. — Makoto 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by WBT
@Braiam What kind of evidence are you looking for? I see it happening on a regular basis. — WBT 40 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
I'm talking about when they have enough code, but it's not in a snippet, and it really needs the OP to put it together. Maybe it's because you're not answering a lot of HTML/CSS/JS questions, but a lot of questions in those tags come piecemeal. "I've got this HTML {code block} and I'm trying to use this JavaScript on it {partial JS block which references HTML not in previous code block}. I tried to fix it with {another partial JS block with seemingly no relation to previous JS block}." (and it turns out it was actually some CSS animation causing the problem). — Heretic Monkey 17 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
...but they have enough code. It's just not pretty. Hence, hand-wringy. — Makoto 6 secs ago
 
4:08 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Michael
Is your answer mostly a duplicate of this one from the 12th? — Michael 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gman
Did you skim my question or do you have a different experience? My experience is the question more often then not does not have enough context to debug but the jsfiddle/codepen does. That seems off topic by definition in that I have to go offsite to understand the issue. Requesting a snippet, or rather getting the user to have put their jsfiddle/codenpen in a snippet in the first place would solve that and save everyone time. How is that not constructive use of energy? — gman 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
And it's that kind of "blowing off things people find important by calling it names" that people find toxic... The code may be present in the question, technically, but without knowing how it fits together, you can be led to incorrect assumptions. Consider a question where the issue is an order-of-operations bug, but the code is presented out of order, in separate code blocks. If the user would put them together in a single block, as it is in their application, the answer would be obvious (to a trained eye). That's why we want to know how to reproduce a bug. I don't think that's "hand-wringy". — Heretic Monkey 1 min ago
 
4:24 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gman
4 me user asks question about stateful API like Canvas2D. They post 2 lines of code but the bug could be any any of 10 other lines they didn't post that setup state (fill style, stroke style, transform, line width, font, etc...) If S.O. had encouraged them to put their complete code in a snippet and if they did then everyone saves time. Time saved = more time for other answers. Just voting to close and moving on doesn't help them understand what to do. Even the close reason doesn't mention a snippet so I'm left to either be a dick and just vote to close or have to spend time adding a comment. — gman 15 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Tim Post
A problem I think we need to address independently is, don't encourage edits at all for something that is just blatantly off-topic. With the post notice re-design work, I think we can communicate that gently and effectively. Any edit that gets something that can't ever be salvaged more visibility is actively harmful because it's more likely to be heavily downvoted and the OP is more likely to encounter rolling rate limits and an eventual q-block faster. That's been sticking in my head ever since we introduced "on hold". I'm wondering what impact that alone might have. — Tim Post ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gman
@KevinB does that matter? Are you suggesting that encouraging snippets would lead to more duplicate questions? That seems unintuitive to me. I think we'd get the same number of duplicates and for the non-duplicates we get a more on topic questions. — gman 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Kevin B
No, it's more just that it's a moot effort. The questions that would most benefit from having a MRE aren't capable of being reproduced in the snippet tool we have. — Kevin B 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
If it is about ASP.NET server-controls could be meant in which case we have: stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/custom-server-controlsrene 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gman
@KevinB Every codepen and every jsfiddle runs just fine in a snippet or at least all the questions I've ever run across I've never seen one that doesn't work just fine as a snippet. — gman 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Kevin B
anything ajax related is out, anything react/angular/vue/typescript related is out, everything else is duplicated a thousand times over and not worth the enforcement. — Kevin B 41 secs ago
 
5:16 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Braiam
Well, show us an example, since it's readily available as you see it happening on regular basis. — Braiam just now
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Petter Friberg
@rene 7 questions... yes moderate away no one will miss that tag — Petter Friberg 1 min ago
 
5:32 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Jeanne Dark
I tried to but didn't find a question covering this topic yet. — Jeanne Dark 14 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by James K Polk
sock puppetry variant: have your friends upvote your posts and downvote the posts you tell them to. — James K Polk 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Rob
@ChrisF, it might not be against "the letter of the law" as it stands currently but it certainly feels like its well and truly poking a hole in the "spirit of the law" to do that =) — Rob 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Joshua Moore
Or is it coincidence? — Joshua Moore 52 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
What "responses" are you talking about? Nothing much happens when I click on an answer (unless my mouse happens to be on a button or a link...) — Heretic Monkey 25 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by yivi
You may want to clarify your question. It's hard to guess what exactly you are talking about. A screenshot may be useful. — yivi 34 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
I mean, you could go through the trouble of editing and all that, but since your edits would go into the review queue, I wouldn't suggest it as I think it would be hard to explain in the edit summary what you are attempting. I'd suggest just leaving it as is. No one should be using Web Forms these days anyway ;-). — Heretic Monkey 24 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
It is not coincidence but you might want to tighten your computer security a bit ... — rene 14 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Jeanne Dark
@HereticMonkey Yes, that's exactly why I do not consider suggested edits a useful tool for such a complicated case. I fear they would all get rejected. — Jeanne Dark 48 secs ago
 
6:26 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Heretic Monkey
Definitely a good question (got my vote). I'm afraid the answer's going to be "leave 'em alone" though... — Heretic Monkey 43 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Yaakov Ellis
Marking this as completed for the time being, as we think that we have addressed the issue. If anyone still sees it, ping here please. — Yaakov Ellis ♦ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by CodeCaster
"If you do something with one or more alternate accounts that you wouldn't be able to do with just your main account, then that's against the rules" - if your alt account earns more reputation that your main account, it gains more privileges. That's not against the rules. — CodeCaster 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by CodeCaster
Do you mean that the system proposes relevant questions when you start typing a question? — CodeCaster 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by CodeCaster
A quick scan reveals that all questions are about "generating serverside controls at runtime". These don't have to be custom controls, it could be buttons. Just nuke the tag. — CodeCaster 13 secs ago
 
6:46 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makyen
@TimPost It's not clear how much impact that will have (assuming were talking only blatantly off-topic questions). How many of those are from people that come back and contribute? I'd expect most edits to be in a relatively short period after the question was asked/closed. If the score is <=-3 then it's not on the homepage. For questions in tag lists, if edits are grouped near posting or closure, then the Q isn't going to be bumped in the tag lists all that far, probably not even for quite active tags. While Qs will get some additional views from an edit, I'm not sure if it's all that much. — Makyen 44 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by TylerH
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Rui Barradas
@YaakovEllis Like I said in my comment, it's gone and never returned. Thanks for looking into it. — Rui Barradas 35 secs ago
 
7:12 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
Closing the question doesn't make you a dick. If you want to be additionally helpful, closing the question and providing information about what's missing would be beneficial for everyone. — Makoto 53 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
I will also admit that I have had a different experience and have a different perspective. Irrespective of who's asking or what technology stack they're using, the fundamental issue is, if they're asking about their code, then they need to give us enough code to work with to see their plight. We can't really deploy or troubleshoot super complex set-ups, which is fine - we were never meant to. However it's a true shame to just close a question as "off-topic" if they've satisfied every requirement you've asked of them, with the caveat that their code snippet just so happens to be elsewhere. — Makoto 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
I think they can send an answer and all its comments to another answer but it needs trickery that Shog9 explained in a chatroom and the mods present all went silent so I assume they need to ask him again if they need it. — rene 12 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Shog9
Not so much trickery as "tedious pain in the rear" — Shog9 ♦ 1 min ago
 
7:44 PM
[ Boson ] New comment posted by WBT
@Braiam Just looking at the latest closed question, it's clear what OP want to do: "I want to add something that says "The Number you have entered is too high/ low". The correct answer is four lines of very simple code. It's not a great question and maybe deserves downvotes, but not "Closed as too broad." It apparently got more close votes than downvotes. — WBT 51 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Davis Broda
[ Boson ] New comment posted by formerlyknownas_463035818
not that I am planning to do anything in that direction, but your "It boils down to: "something [...] you wouldn't be able to do with just your main account" does not include accepting answers, because that is something one can do with the main account only (I guess the awarded rep is different, if it isnt then actually I dont see what would be bad about doing it with two accounts) — formerlyknownas_463035818 37 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by JL2210
So... within the span of four days comments were added? In the "If I dynamically ..." non-answer, there's a comment by the person who answered the question. — JL2210 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by rene
The comment should have been flagged. It is not needed. — rene 25 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by WBT
Here's another one in a similar vein. OP provides multiple input/output examples and a clear description of the desired behavior, along with showing code to illustrate. It's not a great question, but "Closed as too broad" seems like an inappropriate response for the way downvoting and close voting are supposed to be distinguished. — WBT 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Gaurav Mall
@rene I didn't know who was right at that point. It had actually two helpful votes received too. Was that deliberate? — Gaurav Mall 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Gaurav Mall
I agree with your opinion that somebody who tries to help the community has to have a few downvotes. For example, I now have 125 downvotes. Which for me is pretty good as I been contributing at SO for the previous 4 months. — Gaurav Mall 7 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Gaurav Mall
Of course it can't be flagged now, as the question has been deleted. — Gaurav Mall 18 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Alexei Levenkov
Fix your question and improve quality as much as possible. What other general guidance you are looking for? If you want help with particular question -edit to link it in the post and tag with "specific-question". In current state this question is way too broad/unclear. — Alexei Levenkov 58 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Ethan Field
Which question would be a good place to start. — Ethan Field 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
If you can find it and link to it, anyone with 10k+ rep can see it and flag it @GauravMall. — Makoto 13 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Ethan Field
For a start, I don't actually know what you're asking for. You state a behaviour but not why that behaviour is undesirable. — Ethan Field 20 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
Question looks okay to me; anything I'm missing here C++ people? — Makoto 23 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Gaurav Mall
Also, thanks for you interest! — Gaurav Mall 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by MirzaPayam
Link to question added, would be thankful if you help — MirzaPayam 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Gaurav Mall
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Jeanne Dark
@JL2210 I was baffled, too. I don't know when exactly comments were introduced but based on this question, I believe it may have been early September 2008. The comment there may be one of the first ever. The first post I found is from late September 2008. — Jeanne Dark 39 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
You've not been around long enough to know about accept rates and all of the connotations attached to those, so I can kinda see why you think the comment is acceptable. To me...having lived through that era of Stack Overflow, I can see literally no difference. Rattling off numbers/stats to a user to question whether or not they're doing A Thing™ on the site which is either Good or Bad is pretty...bad. — Makoto 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by fbueckert
Uh. It got a single downvote. That doesn't automatically make it bad. — fbueckert 10 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
@Makoto: You took my input out of context please; I didn't disclose that information. The OP clearly stated that. More over, I cannot see the post in other to even see that first hand as the post has been deleted by the author and I require a 10k + reps to view a deleted post (which I currently do not have). I feel wrongly sanctioned by your comment and action. — nyedidikeke 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
I don't up/downvote these days - kind of on a self-imposed quality strike - but you really don't need to see the post. How would you feel if someone went to you and mentioned your up/downvote ratio and then said that you weren't "doing your part to keep the site clean"? Would that not qualify as an attack on your person which ain't relevant to anything anyone could post that's on-topic on the site? — Makoto 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by πάντα ῥεῖ
@Makoto "anything I'm missing here C++ people?" Well, it was my down and close vote. I've been missing debugging efforts and a [mcve] in 1st place. — πάντα ῥεῖ 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
@Makoto: Are you suggesting I shouldn't make reference to content shared by the OP in sharing my opinion on the matter? Will be glad to know how you suggest I could make it better. — nyedidikeke 36 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by JL2210
What triggers this? I'd like to take the survey, too. — JL2210 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
@πάνταῥεῖ: Admittedly when you closed the question there was no code. How about now? — Makoto 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
Mm, fair enough @πάνταῥεῖ. — Makoto 8 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Makoto
I've been...pretty clear about my feedback. Where I take umbrage is with you not seeing anything wrong with the comment. That's it. Then, I compared it to another era of Stack Overflow where people did just that - take numbers in or out of context and use that to attack or bully people into doing something that they wanted, which at the time, was accepting more questions. In this case, it's to get someone to downvote more, even if they so happen to come across questions which may not merit such. — Makoto 41 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Will
For more information about what debugging is and how important it is to do it before asking a question, check here. — Will 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by πάντα ῥεῖ
@Makoto Still doesn't show observations with debugging effort. Grumble. I am harsh, I know well :-P ... — πάντα ῥεῖ 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
I get your point now. Not to dispute the fact (I do equally agree not disclosing that) but think you went too strong; I got misunderstood. — nyedidikeke 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
Well said. Great input. 😎 — nyedidikeke 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by JL2210
I've taken an opportunity to flag this and describe a bit more: "Plagiarism: This copies directly from the first revision of the other answer.". — JL2210 23 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by glibdud
@Machavity I flagged "in need of moderator intervention". — glibdud 45 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
You are right indeed; the cup may be half-full or half-empty. The comment (should) may be flagged as suggested by @Makoto, but one may need to assess further than the words shared and get the message communicated. — nyedidikeke 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Machavity
What kind of flag did you raise? If it was NAA, you should have mod flagged — Machavity 1 min ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by JL2210
What if, say, a user writes a super long helpful answer, posts it, forgets their password over a few years, creates a new account, finds their old answer helpful, and upvotes it without realizing that it's theirs? — JL2210 2 mins ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by gnat
[ Boson ] New comment posted by TheWanderer
@Machavity I don't think you can add a message to NAA flags. — TheWanderer 49 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by George Stocker
Using an earlier version of the answer to plagiarize is something I’ve not seen. In the future be sure you call that out explicitly. — George Stocker ♦ 8 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by Machavity
@TheWanderer mods can decline any flag with a custom message. The Q mentions nothing about the flag type — Machavity 15 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by nyedidikeke
... given the consistent sense of deliberate abuse of the site by the author.nyedidikeke 29 secs ago
[ Boson ] New comment posted by TheWanderer
@Machavity sorry, I thought you were responding to JL — TheWanderer 1 min ago
 
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