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8:00 PM
@AwalGarg Let me guess. He's Indian, isn't he?
 
@KendallFrey Awal has a picture of himself on his monitor for rubber duck debugging
 
@KendallFrey hey Mr. Racist how do you do? :D
 
@KendallFrey doesn't look like so.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum LOL after your previous statement too...
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'm doing just fine, you smelly old Jew. Sorry, I couldn't resist
poetry ftw
 
8:01 PM
Crazy stuff chrome wants to display a warning for all http websites, like when they have a self-signed certificate chromium.org/Home/chromium-security/marking-http-as-non-secure
 
Okay, confession time: who else has to look up switch statement syntax every time they use one?
 
@rlemon haha
 
@rlemon well, a picture can't say "thanks", neither can it point out an error :P
 
@Retsam every single time.
 
@AwalGarg sure it can
 
8:02 PM
@Retsam not me, sorry
 
@ssube woah man
ok Ill agree a lot of greenlight games now are kind of meh
 
!!tell AwalGarg google rubber duck debugging
 
but in the beginning there were some kickass ones
Steam with lack of curation kind of sucks though imo
 
@Loktar there were. The first round was pretty carefully curated though, no?
 
8:02 PM
I enjoy TB's rants about terrible games that get greenlit
 
yea
@KendallFrey you should listen to his recent one about censoring
 
His Guise Of The Wolf is a great video
 
@KendallFrey yea I just started watching him
 
they should just raise the bar for early access a ton
 
he's quite entertaining
 
8:03 PM
ahahahaha
 
@Loktar Hmm, link?
 
steam shouldn't be kickstarter, they should partner and sort that out
 
@ssube THEY SHOULD PUT A FUCKING TIME LIMIT ON IT! JESUS! I OWN GAMES THAT HAVE BEEN IN EARLY ACCESS FOR OVER TWO YEARS! /yell-rant
 
@KendallFrey hmm hey may not have done a video yet
If Netflix can have the Human Centipede 2 on their service I'm sure you can handle a game about killing imaginary people.
 
@rlemon dude u so funny...
 
8:04 PM
@rlemon I agree
 
@rlemon hence kickstarter. You have so much time to reach a set goal, and you have to have a solid plan ahead of time, or you get nothing.
NOTHING.
 
I bought another Early Access game yesterday
 
Early access is destroying Steam
 
Almost bought two
 
there are just so few that are actually good, and will actually be completed
 
8:04 PM
however, space engineers made me ok with it for a while.
 
@Loktar I think that's a bit hyperbolic. Early access might be destroying itself, but Steam is going to be fine
 
Have a smoke and play that for a while...
 
@Retsam consumer confidence in steam has dropped
 
@Loktar the demo derby one is great
I REALLY hope they finish it
 
The complaints raised from Early Access have improved Steam
 
8:05 PM
^^^ confirm
 
people are actively looking at other digital distributers now which is great
can't wait until gog universe comes out
 
Assuming you mean Wreckfest
 
@Retsam those AAA titles on the front page are never going to be hidden behind early access stuff
 
@SomeKittens how so?
 
8:05 PM
@Loktar But the thing is when you say "consumer confidence in Steam" you mean "consumer confidence in Steam's ability to choose what games I want to play for me", which is, I thought, what you were just saying you didn't want
 
@Retsam no in Steam as a platform
 
It's frustrating from a sim racing perspective, but once I got over that and started smashing cars, it was just plain entertainment
@rlemon That's the one
 
games 25% completed shouldn't be in the store imo
 
So much fun!
I don't care that it's incomplete .. well I do. but it is still fun!
 
@Loktar Ah, but again, you're talking about curation, which is what I just said.
 
8:06 PM
I don't go to Walmart and expect to get a half empty box of cereal and pay full price :/
 
I got to play it for one evening
 
curation to an extent
 
now KSP 0.90 is out, so...
 
At least games that are finished lol
 
@KendallFrey racing-wise, it feels a lot like dirt 3
 
8:07 PM
Racing-wise, I get pissed off every time someone spins me because I lose 20 places
 
@Loktar I mean, sure, deceptive labeling needs to be dealt with harshly; but early-access isn't "a half-empty cereal box at full price".
 
@Loktar curators, etc
 
dude is my new favorite reviewer
 
It's quite clearly labeled "early access".
 
8:08 PM
I wish there was a less aggressive AI
 
@Retsam how isn't it?
 
@Loktar hahaha wow just read the article
 
Some games are great, the majority aren't
 
steam carries all the postal games, but this is "too far"
 
@rwollr haha ikr!
@Retsam look at Dayz for example :/
 
8:08 PM
@Loktar It's labeled early access. There's an inherent risk in buying an early access game; if you don't want to take that risk, don't buy it.
 
@Loktar I'd totally buy a half-full box of cereal at full price if they were going to fill the rest of it with marshmallows, or gummi bears, or bacon
 
@Retsam they shouldn't be featured prominently for consumers to purchase then
many early access titles are on the front page during sales
 
There's two distinctly different types of early access: this is pretty much done but needs polish and we're not sure how to finish it (which is the good kind) and "hey, look at what we might do!" (which is bad)
 
@Loktar Why not? Customers shouldn't be allowed to think for themselves to decide whether they want to take a risk on an early access?
 
@ssube KSP falls mostly into the latter category, and man, is it good
 
8:10 PM
It's like saying "a gas station shouldn't be able to put lotto tickets out for sale, because not all tickets are winners!"'
 
@Retsam no its nothing like that
Its like saying here is a game that may never be done, give us money
 
@KendallFrey KSP sounds like the former. They had a working version before they started charging.
It just happened to expand a ton once they got some money.
 
if you trust steam and see it on the main page you fall into the trap of "cool this game must be good!"
 
@Loktar So? You, as the consumer, can choose to give them money or not. They're not stealing your money just by asking.
 
@ssube They had almost none of the features they have today
 
8:10 PM
@Retsam I never said that
I said the quality of Steam is going down and consumer confidence is being destroyed
 
Say more random things so I can star them please!
 
@KendallFrey No, but last I played (shortly before they started selling it), it was small and simple and worked just fine.
 
@Loktar Again, you shouldn't "trust steam [to think for you]"; it's not it's job.
 
@Jonathan sandbox
 
games like KSP are a great example of being done right
 
8:11 PM
vs other games that are entirely missing features, but have a half-assed UI and the description details the feature (as it doesn't exist)
 
@Retsam not to think for me, but to provide a service I can be confident in
 
Never!
 
@Loktar It does; but "only show me games that are safe purchases" shouldn't be part of that service, necessarily.
 
Only show games that are finished should be.
 
Though you can remove all early access from showing up on the front page, if you want.
 
8:12 PM
The best early access games are the ones where you think "Hey, this is really fun, the developer deserves money just for this!"
 
They are way too prominent on Steam
and so many are just languishing.
Hell some are just scams
 
It's a problem when they use early access to market their game enterprise-style: "Look at all the things we (could) have (if you gave us money)! Aren't they great? Don't you like them?"
 
@Loktar There's an option for it; but if you make that a rule, you through out the KSP baby with the bathwater.
 
When Valve is alerted they are rarely removed.
 
Because "this game is a scam" is not really a provable accusation.
 
8:13 PM
Generally its not worded like that.
 
Steam does warn you: Don't buy this game if you're not excited to play it in its current state
 
user1596138
Anyone get Spintires? :P
 
I'd assume most games people call "scams" really aren't; just failed projects.
 
@Retsam then they should be removed
they aren't early access at that point
 
@someDoge Not yet, but it's on the waiting list
 
8:14 PM
they are just unfinished projects.
 
user1596138
@KendallFrey I want
 
Spintires looks interesting
 
At this point, I want to see more stuff in it
 
"Failed" isn't cut and dry either. You can't generally prove that either.
 
So I shall wait to buy it, unless deep discount
 
8:15 PM
I just hate the mindset of "I chose to buy this game, and I'm not satisfied with my experience... so I'm going to blame the developer and/or Steam, rather than admit I might have made an unwise purchasing decision"
 
@Retsam eh as a consumer you can though
 
@Loktar "mudding simulator" is a pretty novel idea, and sounds like lots of fun
 
user1596138
There seems to be a lot of stuff already
 
look at Assasins Creed Unity for example
it was "finished" but was a mess
 
so many bugs.. undocumented features
 
8:15 PM
how can you decide if you should buy it as a consumer or not?
I guess you have to wait it out
 
@Loktar demos
 
@Loktar Right. Which is what I did.
 
@rlemon hah
!!xkcd Workflow
 
@ssube if only game devs provied demos as often as they did in the early 2ks :(
 
8:16 PM
no such thing as a bug
 
People who buy launch titles are gambling almost as much as people who buy early access titles. Even if the game isn't buggy, there's no guarantee it's any fun.
 
But it shouldn't be a gamble lol
 
I have cast 588 votes, out of which 50%~ are on questions. If I cast 12 more votes on questions, I should get this gold badge, right?
 
@Loktar now "demos" are 6 minute video showcasing the cinematics
 
user1596138
I don't have a decent PC so no steam for me
 
8:16 PM
I should havent to wait a year to buy the new Dodge 1500
 
@KendallFrey goat simulator proved that's a viable attitude
 
in case it just randomly explodes for some users
 
@Loktar don't worry, it's not a Ford
 
anyway haha my point is consumer confidence definitely isn't as high as it was which sucks
 
@Loktar dude, I wouldn't buy it because it's a Dodge, never mind the reviews :P
 
8:17 PM
early access and even AAA releases lately aren't helping
 
@someDoge I was worried about Wreckfest for a bit, it wouldn't find my Nvidia GPU, and the Intel one was dog-slow
But it was pretty fast according to youtube, so I hacked around it, and now it's fine
 
@rlemon :P
 
user1596138
Who buys a <3 year old vehicle anyway lol it's gonna drop like $8K/year haha
 
user1596138
^ Ooh I made a heart
 
@someDoge A what, sorry?
 
8:18 PM
psh I just lease now
 
@Loktar to play devils advocate, I had to 'rent' my snes games without 'demo's - however one could argue that was my demo. $9 was a lot of greenbacks in the 90's
 
renting is another great feature though
that lets you try before you buy
 
Don't tell anyone, but I still find myself demos of some games before I buy them
 
I miss renting
 
but when you are poor you rent the game and plan on grinding and beating it because that is all you can afford
 
8:19 PM
If early access provided that omg.. like a timed 60 minute trial
 
user1596138
I rented like 4 games from blockbuster right before they died...
 
and then you decide if you want to buy it, that would be amazing imo
 
@Loktar ew. They don't let you changes bits out and take them off when you're doing that, do they?
 
user1596138
I still have them haha
 
I hate time trials, I fucking hate them
 
8:19 PM
all early access games should have a free weekend at least once every 3 months
 
@ssube no you totally can
 
I would rather have no access than access for 1 month
 
some things add value as well, like putting in a liner
anything crazy I just have to remove before returning it
 
huh. I thought leases had terms against modification.
 
@KendallFrey timed trials for a game are a bit different if you ask me. so long as they don't block functionality because of the trial. give me a full experience for 48 hours? Im happy
 
8:21 PM
not mine. I'm going to put a liner, I keep forgetting
 
user1596138
YEah I think renting is great. If you see it as a trial.
 
Give me unlimited time with basic functionality, hell yeah
 
@KendallFrey two solutions to the same problem.
 
@KendallFrey I think a timed trial would be easier for something like Steam to implement though
 
I just prefer the one you don't
 
8:21 PM
If I don't like the basic gameplay, I wouldn't like the game anyway
 
the devs wouldn't have to do anything extra
 
@Loktar Who cares, we don't know anything about implementing programs
BTW rlemon, have you heard of runasdate?
 
> Early access 0.1 working on the basic features for Steam trial, just buy our game instead to try NAOW! :P
 
user1596138
Steam needs an all access pass
 
user1596138
Then you guys will finally be happy
 
8:22 PM
@someDoge heh that would be cool actually
I mean Steam is already sort of like that just on a per game basis
 
It would be like netflix letting you have 2 dvds at a time.
 
user1596138
Well I mean, so is McDonalds just on a per item basis :P
 
You can have 10 games installed per month.
 
@someDoge haha idk man McD's provides me more than just a license to eat a big mac
the big mac at least is mine at the point I pay for it
 
user1596138
I don't use steam I've lost you
 
8:24 PM
@Loktar I dunno, they're getting the ingredients back at some point.
 
LOL I don't give them back!
 
For me personally, the idea of something taken away from me is more repulsive than the idea of getting something free is attractive
 
@someDoge with steam and many digital platforms you just get a license to play the game
 
hence my hate of time trials, and why I got so rich playing minecraft
 
you don't really own the game ever
heck even some physical copies are worded like that
gog though, you own the game drm free, its yours. Thats why I friggin love gog
 
8:25 PM
@KendallFrey How does one get rich playing MineCraft?
 
most EULAs that come with CDs are
 
user1596138
Eh I mean it makes sense.
 
@Jonathan virtual economy
 
user1596138
If you're a troll
 
and grinding
 
8:25 PM
it's been a big thing since autodesk made it a problem
 
@KendallFrey So you got virtually rich, not actually?
 
yeah
 
..Ok
 
user1596138
@Jonathan nice hat
 
any of you guys do the gem stuff on steam?
 
8:26 PM
If you want to talk to the rich guy here, ask @Loktar
 
Yes, I got it without playing MineCraft
 
I got like $45 dollars in games for $10
 
I'm really good at hats
 
@Loktar meh, no
 
And hats are good on me too
 
8:27 PM
@Jonathan I bet it was TF2
 
user1596138
lol yea I had an answer to delete today too. I had to coerce the OP into accepting a different one
 
or something
 
@KendallFrey 1k gems is like $1.21 (or was last night) I bought 9000 or so
and won like 6 auctions
 
user1596138
He said he knew mine was wrong but didn't want to unaccept it in case it hurt my feelings lmao
 
just have to bid on not so popular games
 
8:28 PM
I'd probably not have to worry about that
I have a switch in my brain that ignores big titles
 
haha
well KSP is kind of big :P
 
@Basj inb4 your meta post will backfire. Don't forget who told you first.
 
user1596138
hipswitch
 
@Loktar it is now
 
@KendallFrey I did not read "titles" there, the first time through.
3
 
8:28 PM
But it's still pretty much an indie game
@ssube dayum son
 
LOL
 
user1596138
Edit fixed it
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum i.imgur.com/t0tCWdb.webm
Ah, does webm not inline?
 
8:34 PM
Morning
I just got shat on by a pigeon!
 
@Retsam because it is a video
 
I don't care if it's good luck, that bird's gotta learn some fuckin' manners
 
someone raised a meta issue about it. might get done. probably not
 
@monners they are the chavs of the sky, not a chance
 
!!urban chav
 
8:36 PM
@monners chav Picture this a young lad about 12 years of age and 4 ½ feet high baseball cap at ninety degrees in a imitation addidas tracksuit, with trouser legs tucked into his socks (of course, is definitely the height of fashion). This lad is strutting around, fag in one hand jewellery al over the over, outside McDonalds acting as if he is 8 foot tall and built like a rugby player, when some poor unsuspecting adult (ab(snip)
 
@TomW I want to see some pigeons in tracksuits and shitty renaults
 
lol
 
user1596138
...
 
Oh cool you got the picture again @someDoge
 
using muppets with jewelry as a very shaky segue...
 
user1596138
8:39 PM
I am tired of being a dogey lol
 
You hear that @Mosho!
He's "tired" of being a doge
:P
 
user1596138
... laughs hysterically.. ?
 
user1596138
lol weird humor
 
houdy
 
8:43 PM
-1 for displaying a situation in a biased context — Sterling Archer 7 mins ago
@Basj see, told you it'd backfire.
@user3470815 houdy ho.
 
@loktar $1.21 for 1000? dude
do what I do
you can buy emoticons for 4-6 cents and those convert to 60-100 gems
 
yeah just takes so long lol
but yeah that is a better approach
 
i know it is labor intensive yea
which is why i haven't bothered making a profit off it
probably could with a bot or somethin
 
lol "picks the answer that agrees with him as 'best answer'"
 
no hooks for doing these actions in the api obv so it'd have to be a good old fashioned autohotkey bot or something
 
user1596138
8:46 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum mostly I just wanted to use this hat hahaha
 
why is he so insistent on using big bold type?
 
the internet is a BIG DEAL
 
Because we're many miles away, we won't be able to hear what he writes unless he speaks loudly
 
I've heard there are also secret hats
 
8:50 PM
@Basj I don't want to say I told you so when it was still at +9 with 0 downvotes - but I told you so.
 
user1596138
Yeah I got one earlier on every site in the network lol
 
I like android room rule to have a minimum number of questions/answers to be able to speak
 
That question went for +bunch to -bunch really quickly. Seems like a lot of people upvoted until the other side of the story was posted, then reversed votes awful quick.
 
Well, to demonstrate some knowledge about the platform, at least
 
i don't even care but i agree with the guy with the gravatar
rock it
better conditions for gravatars now
 
8:52 PM
@FlorianMargaine hahaha love the avatar man
 
@FlorianMargaine I don't, I think we'd miss out on some people.
 
DAMNIT @rlemon!
 
WHAT?!
 
I expected to be able to pop those christmas lights!
 
:D
I'll work on it
good idea
 
8:54 PM
:)
 
@PeeHaa Made it ABN sort of compatible now github.com/Jonathan-Ironman/Rent-manager
 
Victory! \o/
 
I wonder if they have energy drinks in North Korea
 
I deserve a hat for it I'd say :D
 
@monners they will in 5-10 years once everyone moves past them
 
8:59 PM
@rwollr Those poor developers :(
 

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