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12:00
Can you host sites with sensible thematics there? Like a site to create a new political system (just an example) or critics against any public figure?
Like I had a file permissions error and I just opened a ticket and they took care of it
Didn't even have to figure out what I messed up
@Meredith RamNode is an unmanaged service, so I doubt you'd get that here
@SufiDeveloper I haven't seen anything about it when reviewing the terms of service, so I guess you can, yes.
@SecondRikudo Well thanks. I asked because the users on the site will most likely discuss and organize sensible things and I don't want to restrict anything on them unless they're trolls or disruptive users in general.
@SufiDeveloper You might be interested in visiting their IRC server
And also, Moderators once it's in public beta
@SecondRikudo That second one looks interesting. I'll definitely look both later :)
12:08
reading my super past transcript of this room, I feel like a complete pervert zigi.
@AwalGarg Does zigi means something in your language?
m59
m59
@AwalGarg because it was way late and I made some mistakes :)
@m59 kk. also, I get an error on that page when I press the ctrl key and release it. it just logs in the console. it doesn't have any other bad effect. should I care?
m59
m59
I know. Send me the link.
I'm much less tired right now :)
Think through the logic. It's pretty obvious.
I suddenly rmembered that yesterday. I was like "oh dang, I gave him bad code." lol
12:21
@m59 I thought about it, I press ctrl, it tries to find the function corresponding to the key, and since it doesn't exist, it logs, "undefined can't be called", right?
m59
m59
Right. Send me the link, please?
@m59 yep, I am making a fiddle right now. please stay here for 5 minutes.
m59
m59
nah, no worries, I'll write it again.
@m59 jsfiddle.net/3d6YD here. I tried to wrap in ifs so it only calls if the function exists, but then, the commands did not execute.
You know those chat bugs that you know that are there, and managed to live with them for years?
0
Q: If a message I starred gets edited, the star state is forgotten

Second Rikudo'nuff said. Steps to reproduce Star any recent message Have the OP to edit it Star count remains, but now it appears as though you haven't starred it (star is black) Star it again for it to receive star state again, but the star count goes down (your original star was removed).

12:25
edited hmm wtf
star remains o-O ?
edit it again @AbhishekHingnikar
not mine
@AbhishekHingnikar Not like this
Here, star this. Edited.
Now I'll edit, and you won't see the star being yellow anymore
oh yeah i have noticed that
thought it was a feature not a bug :o
And if you try to star it again, your star is removed.
12:27
@SecondRikudo SO WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL IN THIS???
lol
Perfectionism
user image
2
Hello everybody :)
you are mr methane ? just pun intended
Well think about it in this way
if someone writes 'I like ice-cream'
and you star it
and then changes it to 'I like eating raw fish'
and the star remains, people might get the wrong idea
and invite you to a sushi bar
@zigi But the star does remain
12:29
Oh, well then it should be changed
do not remain
It's only your browser that forgot that it starred that message
so you see it on the right star feed
but not on the message's side directly
@SecondRikudo lets do that again, post a message, I will star it, edit it. I'll refresh the page to see what happens.
Paul Oldfield, born in Macclesfield, Cheshire, North West England, is better known by his stage name Mr. Methane. He is a British farter or "professional farter" who started performing in 1991; he briefly retired in 2006 but restarted in mid-2007; he claims to be the only performing professional farter in the world. He has worked on railroads before focusing on his flatulence performances. == Background == According to When Will I Be Famous? (2003), a BBC book on British variety acts, Oldfield discovered his ability at the age of fifteen when practising yoga. The next day he performed twenty rapid...
google oneboxes him but not huge people from the oss ?
@AwalGarg Post edited again
12:31
starred
With a refresh you'll see the star back as yellow
^confirmed
haha, funny this is. @Sec
:18081945 > Line 21: Expected an assignment or function call and instead saw an expression.
^meaning?
m59
m59
meaning it's a stupid warning and I don't care.
@m59 ok. I am reading the code. now, wait.
@AbhishekHingnikar Interesting
m59
m59
@AwalGarg the only thing that is probably wrong now is that holding down a key makes the event fire over and over
I don't think that this would be the end for them, everyone pirate Windows anyway :P
i wonder if they do it how on earth will they generate revenues ?
12:34
They'll still make money off of Office and whatnot
@SecondRikudo just office
@m59 hehe. I intend doing that :D
@AbhishekHingnikar Nah, MS has other products.
but then apple is expanding iCloud (still in dark ages) but google on the other hand has aims for free office suite on cloud :P
SharePoint?
12:34
@SecondRikudo yeah probably cloud services ?
And that too
Meh, I'm not worrying about MS too much, and I wouldn't grieve them if they die either.
@SecondRikudo when it comes to user end cloud i believe nothing can beat google
they are just boss on web stuff :P
Apple on the other hand is user "paranoid" their cloud services still appear in dark ages of www. (though the look is so pleasing!)
Microsoft :-/ corporate revenues ?
@AbhishekHingnikar You don't get Apple for their "Cloud Services"
@m59 I can't understand second last line...
@SecondRikudo i kinda hate the slowness except for iTunes
12:37
You get an Apple machine/device for the security
google suite vs apple icloud / Goog wins
m59
m59
@AwalGarg What about it?
Is there any way to know that jQ reference the same dom object other than $(something1)[0]===$(the same something1)[0] ?
m59
m59
@AwalGarg console.log each bit
@m59 how did you use && there? and what does it do?
@m59 ok. I am trying that out.
m59
m59
12:38
Evaluates each part as a boolean.
What does an if statement do if the first part is false?
if (false && someFunction()) {
that function won't fire.
because it doesn't matter
@m59 false && sth is always false
m59
m59
Exactly.
someone ?
yes. ok, I got it. wait, just trying to get a more solid understanding.
@RoyiNamir .is
12:39
@AwalGarg The same goes for true || something(), something won't run
@AwalGarg your approach is good enough
m59
m59
@AwalGarg so, to me, rather than write

if (fn) {
  fn();
}

I prefer

fn && fn();
!!tell Awal mdn short circuit evaluation
call_if_exists( fn );
its a tiny tweak for me
m59
m59
12:41
lame, lol
tnx . didn't know about .is
@RoyiNamir yw
  var keys = Object.keys(keysPressed);
^what is Object here? @m59
funciton call_if_exists( fn, thisIs ){
   if( typeof fn !== 'function'){
         throw new Error("Function expected");
   }
   [].shift.call(arguments);
   thisIs = this || thisIs || window;
   return fn && fn.apply( thisIs, arguments );
}
12:43
basically that can't find actual code
I don't really see the point in checking if a function exists right before you call it
An error will be thrown anyway if it's undefined
@Meredith err... no
@JanDvorak Am I missing something?
12:45
@Meredith yes
poly morphism
I said Something you will never hear.... !!
@SecondRikudo -_- :D
Good point
m59
m59
@AwalGarg really, I'd probably add in more advanced logic... object keys aren't guaranteed an order. It just so happens that they are sorted low to high, but don't have to be.
@BenjaminGruenbaum XDDDDDDDD I laughed way more than I should've :D
m59
m59
12:46
@AwalGarg bro...that was a silly question :)
How could the function with the exact name NOT be the function I used?
@m59 i am a beginner so I was just confirming. I still don't understand how that statement worked there, but I understand what it did. But I guess, I should learn the former on my own...
m59
m59
heh, I'm just pointing out that you need to think intuitively about code :)
Most of it is intuitive (if you think properly).
yeh you are right... sorry
Linking to 9gag should be banworthy.
@SecondRikudo can't see the thing, it goes too fast
12:49
@NickDugger should I cast a flag?
@NickDugger No, linking to w3schools should be banworthy
sadly linking to w3school is not but linking to 9 gag is
@SecondRikudo no, that could be caused by lack of knowledge
I'd rather visit w3schools than 9gag
12:51
@Meredith i will flag that
Nooooo
@Meredith flag in 3...
I flagged it
now you have 2 flags
ok
ezgif to the rescue
@FlorianMargaine XD
12:52
oneboxing images from 9gag should be banworthy
I love w3schools' jquery tutorial
@Meredith 8 flags now
It's pretty funny
hip, I got some spamflags
so needed to join here as obviously w3fools is being bashed atm
i didn't flag for real though <3
12:53
This message was flagged as spam/offensive by 2 users:
http://www.w3schools.com/ :d
3 mins ago, by Second Rikudo
@NickDugger No, linking to w3schools should be banworthy
@AnttiHaapala don't quote it!
validate those flags
You-Know-Which, That-Which-Must-Not-Be-Named, the Dark Site
@m59 I am not sure what I understood from mdn is correct, but did the function Object.keys work there on a completely new variable which still wasn't an object because everything in javascript is either an object or a primitive? (rlemon told me so :P)
12:55
Wait did you guys actually flag me? lol
m59
m59
@AwalGarg I have no idea what you said.
@Meredith No........
m59
m59
It just returns an object's keys as an array
logging everything there will make that pretty clear
@m59 but you called it as Object.keys.blaBla and Object wasn't defined atm, was it?
m59
m59
lol
That isn't what the code said, and if Object isn't defined, you have big problems.
12:57
Do NOT validate flags on w3schools.com . Seriously, what is wrong with people...
@SecondRikudo I know that, but he used the function directly on the literal word "Object"
@BenjaminGruenbaum w3schools is bad
oh shit, I am idiot.
m59
m59
12:57
@AwalGarg console.log(window);
@BenjaminGruenbaum w3school must burn.
@JanDvorak so is Hitler.
Hitler.
Do you see that message being mass flagged?
It's just a website people don't like.
@BenjaminGruenbaum inb4 flag
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'm seriously considering to XD
Do not flag sites you don't like, flags are for abusive content.
12:58
w3schools abuse their name
If you don't like a message, say "Don't recommend that site", if other people agree with you - they'll star it.
if w3s is not abusive then nothing is
@m59 yea got it now, I didn't knew we can call functions like that :P always good to learn something new
I think Benjamin is now banworthy.
m59
m59
@AwalGarg I dunno why I wrote it like that
@BenjaminGruenbaum that's not what stars are for, is it?
m59
m59
12:59
I'm going back to bed haha.
@m59 thats alright. Its good you did it like that.
@BenjaminGruenbaum I think it got flagged as a joke, and then others joined in XD
Wtf how many people flagged it
m59
m59
@AwalGarg nah, it doesn't matter either way.
I only slept 3 hours last night, gotta get moar zzzzz
13:00
@Meredith 4
@BenjaminGruenbaum 5*
What a bunch of punks
m59
m59
I invalidated it (I hope)
@Meredith the thug life is not an easy life.
m59
m59
but I don't trust myself
night all
13:01
@m59 sweet dreams, and thanks again :)
@Meredith are you the same Meredith from youtube.com/watch?v=syIFaeeDiQI ?
Yeah
Can I do this ?
$(.Class.SubClass).... ?
13:05
@CustomizedName missing quotes
thank you
13:18
Has anyone seen Google Keep
and how it arranges tiles in a good way
Do you see how the layout puts the longest one on the second row but under the smallest available tile
is it better than masonry?
I don't know
I was wondering what they are using
my pop up is not toggling anymore
what should I do
:'(
@CustomizedName fix it
Have you tried turning it off and on again?
13:24
how can i turn it off and on again, it's just a click handler on a div, which displays it and then hides it on a button click
so @JanDvorak I was wondering what do you think in terms of the algorithm in the Tiling? because of course I can use a plugin like Masonry but then again I was just wondering about the intricates
@zigi the simplest algorithm just places the tiles in definition order, top to bottom, left to right
if you want to equalise the heights more, you could place largest tiles first
I know, but then if you do some thinking about it, you can make an NP problem to check what's the best way of optimizing the used space
sounds like knapsack
!!undo 18083275
exactly!
combination optimization problems
13:27
In the bin packing problem, objects of different volumes must be packed into a finite number of bins or containers each of volume V in a way that minimizes the number of bins used. In computational complexity theory, it is a combinatorial NP-hard problem. There are many variations of this problem, such as 2D packing, linear packing, packing by weight, packing by cost, and so on. They have many applications, such as filling up containers, loading trucks with weight capacity constraints, creating file backups in media and technology mapping in Field-programmable gate array semiconductor chip design...
I remember I used to solve some like that, for example if you are a robber you are breaking in so your backpacks can hold up to 50kg of goods and you have goods with different weights and values
you have to find the best fit for your backpacks
@zigi that's Knapsack
yes
that's why I said NP complete problem
earlier
Can you prove it?
you want the bin packing problem. n containers of volume v each, can you pack your items?
13:29
3 mins ago, by zigi
I know, but then if you do some thinking about it, you can make an NP problem to check what's the best way of optimizing the used space
Bounded tiling is also NP complete.
Tiling is undecidable.
Benjamin, what do you refer to as bounded tiling?
with rules?
@zigi sounds like a superproblem of bin packing
yep
i hate MSIE 8
13:31
@zigi You have a finite amount of square tiles, each with divided into 4 and has 4 edges, each side has a different color. You must say whether there is a tiling of a bounded plane in a way that fills it completely.
ah I remember that problem, yes
@BenjaminGruenbaum Is periodic tiling decideable?
@JanDvorak periodic tiling?
yes, that is quite cool
well you can always convert bounded tiling problem and apply it to real life
13:32
@BenjaminGruenbaum does there exist a periodic infinite tiling with a given set of square tiles?
@zigi the reduction works the same way as in the Post Correspondence Problem. You map a run of a turing machine into a series of tiles. It's Atm < Tiling. You show that there is an accepting run on the TM if and only if there is a tiling.
for example make some predictions in terms of which tiles are more valuable than others
It is definitely half-decideable
how did you conclude that?
As for bounded tiling, you can either show a reduction via 3Sat or you can show it directly.
@JanDvorak it's what now?
13:34
Benjamin is 3sat the boolean satisfiability one?
I don't remember anymore cause I haven't done it for a few years
@zigi yeah, but you can also show it's NPC directly.
@zigi for each pair w*h, does there exist a periodic tiling with that period? You can test that by enumeration
@JanDvorak Ok, I've thought about for a minute now, it's undedicable.
@JanDvorak what do you call a period?
@JanDvorak The "period" in periodic is unbounded though, right? You can't just test that by enumeration, you'd never halt.
13:35
HAMMERZEIT!
haha :D
@BenjaminGruenbaum Isn't it just "Sort by cost/weight for each of the items in the house, then grab as many items from the top of that list"?
@BenjaminGruenbaum that's what half-decideability means. Either you find an example or you run forever.
@SecondRikudo not really since you might have a better fit with the right combination of items
13:36
@JanDvorak Your enumeration method shows that it's in RE, that is - you have shown a recognizer and not a decider - a machine that accepts if it should but doesn't always reject. Is that the term you were looking for?
@zigi Example?
Example:
you have bag that can hold 50kg of goods
you have 3 goods
@SecondRikudo the weights and values are integer.
If they're not, it's the fractional knapsack and your greedy suggestion works.
@BenjaminGruenbaum Even if they are fractions, so what?
hey Dor, did you get any follow up on that meta question for the star bug?
13:37
1. W = 40kg Value=10
2. W = 30kg Value=6
3. W = 20kg Value=5
in this case if you sort by size value
@SecondRikudo nono, if they are fractions then it's an easy problem, if they're not then it won't work.
then you will take the value 10
Zigi is showing you an example. Here. ^
and get left with 10kg free
and value 10
if you take 20+30 you will have better utilization of the space and gain 1 more value unit
I can compare it to a problem with fitting big and small marbles in a bin
if they are made of gold or diamonds
Knapsack is typically shown via SubsetSum which in turn can be shown from Vector Sum (or directly from SAT) which is shown from SAT which is NP complete from the Cooke Levine theorem, which is a nice and not too hard proof where you simulate a TM's run with first order logic.
13:39
it's always about optimizing space for best usability rather than being greedy and taking the most expensive one first
Basically, it's not that there is no polynomial solution because we haven't found one, there is no polynomial solution because there isn't one unless P = NP.
@BenjaminGruenbaum Benjamin, you seem like a really well-read person, how long have you been dealing with such problems
@BenjaminGruenbaum yes exactly
@zigi Everything we've discussed here is taught in an introductory computability course.
@BenjaminGruenbaum yes indeed, thanks
@BenjaminGruenbaum subset sum and knapsack are different
13:40
@zigi I have taught him everything he knows :P
@JanDvorak yw
@KendallFrey If you take the weights and the values to be the same thing in Knapsack you get exactly subset sum.
@BenjaminGruenbaum which institution and what programme?
@BenjaminGruenbaum subset sum is a subset of knapsack ;)
@zigi HUJI, but it's not that specific, you can read all about this in Sipser's "a theory of computation" and there are video lectures.
I really shouldn't be talking computer science today, I only slept an hour
13:42
@BenjaminGruenbaum I am asking since I have studied a lot of those things buy my knowledge is a bit scattered, so I was wondering if I could find it somewhere more constructively presentedc
@KendallFrey Yeah, but the other direction holds too, you can for example show how Subset Sum reduces to Vector Cover and then how Knapsack reduces to that. That shouldn't be too hard.
@zigi go read Sipser, it's a great introductory book on the theory of computation, not practical at all but very interesting.
Ok thank you greatly for that information
You're welcome, I still owe you some paper by the way, right?
ah yes, from 3 weeks ago
On learning A/B testing, IIRC?
13:44
I have sent you a letter
What's your email again? I'm at the office right now
just a sec
I asked you on the topic of website analysis about a paper you have wrote as a thesis if I am correct
Ok then, it's an old version but I think you'll handle it. It's not a thesis it's just some paper I wrote with a friend for something else :)
and you said you had some paper based on data mining
ah I see
is it public?
No, we have not published it, it was for a course and for fun.
13:46
cool, should I send you a mail again?
posted on August 04, 2014

var gaJsHost = (("https:" == document.location.protocol) ? "https://ssl." : "http://www."); document.write(unescape("%3Cscript src='" + gaJsHost + "google-analytics.com/ga.js' type='text/javascript'%3E%3C/script%3E")); try { var pageTracker = _gat._getTracker("UA-3727700-1"); pageTracker._trackPageview(); } catch(err) {} POW!

it is the benji at tipranks right?
Yeah, I already replied :)
ah
yeah, jus go it 3 sec after you told me here
:D
man this internet thing is a fast shit
:D
and I guess the document is written in LaTeX
oh no, it is in word actually
looks a bit like Latex though
the formatting itself
What is the difference between writing in two columns and in one big column? I like the two columns more but I have seen some people have different requirements.
btw I remember I have studied for statistics A/B testing as being quite popular with new products
13:54
We had to move it to that format, the original version was in LaTeX :D
Anyway, I'm afk, talk to you later.
!!afk going to get the car
good luck
I weep at the poetic beauty.
user1596138
morning
Dor has gone mad.

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