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12:26 AM
@Zoe What are you trying to do here?
 
12:37 AM
I also don't know why you dismiss Microsoft's compiler as horrible. It's not...not at all. There are a few quirks/differences from GCC/Clang, but it's exceptionally good in a lot of ways. Microsoft pioneered link-time code generation (which allows cross-module optimization), and had it working long before GCC. It still works better, and does a better job of creating custom register-based calling conventions, especially important for 32-bit x86 targets.
I've spent a lot of time investigating the way various compilers optimize code, especially to x86 targets. Microsoft and GCC are pretty much on par. ICC is best-of-the-breed for vectorization, but Clang is far and away the best with optimizing general-purpose code.
But obviously Microsoft's compiler is not terribly useful for Linux targets, which as far as I understand, is your setup, so I'm not really sure why you're trying to use it or its headers...?
 
12:51 AM
It would be great if you could help her out as I have no clue here at all. As I understand it, Zoe uses Windows but wants to build some code to run on her Raspberry Pi... No doubt she'll tell you all about it tmw :)
 
Yeah, I was going to say, I don't know why she's telling you about it. I don't think a C# programmer is going to be of much help. :-)
I thought I remember Zoe saying she wouldn't be caught dead using Windows.
 
She's not a big fan of Windows (or anything corporate/non-OSS from what I can tell) but like a lot of people struggles with drivers etc for Linux so has given in on that one for the time being. We looked at running Linux in Virtual Box but she's also a bit short on RAM.
I think it was Microsoft Edge she said she wouldn't be seen dead using. She'd rather go offline! gasp
 
Huh. I've never had an issue with drivers for Linux.
I mean, you might not be able to get your obscure 30-year-old widget-frobber working in Linux, but there are no issues with standard hardware anymore.
Dual-booting is a good choice if you've got something weird that requires Windows, but you otherwise want to run Linux. Easy on RAM. Only taxes HD space, which is plentiful.
Edge is...not great. I don't use it, either. But Chrome is so user-hostile it's hard to recommend it anymore. Firefox is nice. I used Waterfox for a long time, which was a custom distro of Firefox compiled with an excellent optimizer, targeting 64-bit, and losing the unwanted garbage (e.g., Pocket).
It'll be interesting to see how Edge turns out once Microsoft completes adopting Blink.
 
I built my very first PC and it was dual boot Linux (Slackware) and iirc Windows 3.11. Windows was absolute rubbish in those days.
Nowadays I use laptops and work pays the bills so I just get loads of RAM and use VMs.
 
1:06 AM
Heh. Slackware was rubbish in those days, too. The cool kids used OS/2. Clearly you were not a cool kid. :-)
 
Oh excuse me, I had OS/2 later on - and loved it! :)
a PC mag over here gave away a free copy of OS/2 on one of their CDROMs
 
Wow, that's a bargain
And back when people actually read magazines because they contained useful content, too
 
I actually bought Warp (boxed with a book). Loaned it to a friend and never saw it again!
 
I remember buying Windows 2000 and loving it. The Windows platform pretty much peaked with that version.
Never bought OS/2. Wasn't old enough to have actual money at that time...
 
I'll say goodnight Cody, it's pretty late here.
 
1:17 AM
Alrighty. Goodnight!
 
@Zoe ^ offer of help from someone with a clue, please take it :)
o/
 
\o
 
 
6 hours later…
Zoe
7:39 AM
@CodyGray right now I'm trying to get SCons working on Windows with Clang without MinGW, WSL, and similar (the terminals hate me :])
"right now", lol
Not right now right now, but the current goal. aside getting out of bed xD
@StephenKennedy I'm not a big fan of anything that discards UX for profits, which unfortunately 99% of the time means corporate
@CodyGray rubber duck debugging
Gets me thinking, figures some stuff out. Doesn't beat the bugs though :/
@CodyGray because I apparently have no idea what I'm doing :')
@StephenKennedy I want to build it cross-platform, or at least on my computer.
@StephenKennedy aside for downloading a decent browser ^^"
@CodyGray I'm an expert at having no-repro issues limited to my system
Like borked Vim in CMD :')
Works fine for other people, I get the default background where there isn't text and mixed char issues xd
MinGW is the fastest terminal for Vim, but in spite of installing Z3 from source, it still finds version 0.0.0
So no Clang 8
Also no general stdlib, it can't find stream :face_palm:
MSVC includes throws errors I don't understand why exist. Works fine on Raspbian, in Windows with MSVC includes, too many errors to print xd
When I dualbooted, Ubuntu also overwrote the bootloader entirely (UEFI). Talked to someone who's actually competent with Linux (and Ubuntu) who said that shouldn't happen
I've been on and off thinking about going for Linux Mint, but I'm not sure whether I'll actually do that or not
Especially because there's still a high chance the drivers won't be much better there either
 
Zoe
8:30 AM
@ashleedawg !!!!
Long time no see ^^"
 
 
3 hours later…
Zoe
:D
 
Zoe
11:25 AM
Here's what Git Bash using the system Clang spews out: paste.ofcode.org/59eifvEEGsrEpRnLFXC8Uy
And with the full MinGW:
LunarWatcher@Bitshift MSYS /d/programming/stackcpp
$ scons
scons: Reading SConscript files ...
posix
scons: done reading SConscript files.
scons: Building targets ...
clang++ -o build/test/test.o -c -std=c++11 -pedantic -Wall -Wextra -O3 -Iinclude -Ilib/rapidjson/include test/test.cpp
In file included from test/test.cpp:28:
test/catch.hpp:377:10: fatal error: 'sstream' file not found
#include <sstream>
         ^
1 error generated.
scons: *** [build/test/test.o] Error 1
scons: building terminated because of errors.
Cygwin has a Python mismatch:
LunarWatcher@Bitshift /cygdrive/d/programming/stackcpp
$ scons
whichC:\Users\LunarWatcher\AppData\Local\Programs\Python\Python37\python.exe: can't open file '/usr/bin/scons': [Errno 2] No such file or directory
CMD and Powershell spews out the same errors as Git Bash
 
 
5 hours later…
Zoe
4:54 PM
lmao
Stephen Kennedy the NASCAR Driver :D
 
does that look like a NASCAR?!
it's 115bhp
 
Zoe
Is that good?
 
These things are all relative - weight and torque are both important. That little car could beat much powerful things from a standing start to say 40kph because it doesn't weigh much, but by modern standards for a sports car 115 is low.
Google says a NASCAR has over 800bhp
 
Zoe
5:17 PM
@StephenKennedy Meh, 115, 800, it all means the same to me ;)
 
you can't have more fun on narrow country lanes while keeping within the speed limits (or thereabouts) than in a 205 GTi. The power level is just right to keep your licence safe, and the handling is terrific. They are absolutely horrible on motorways though.
@Zoe 800 > 115. Yw.
Is there a size limit on image uploads?
 
Zoe
5:41 PM
@StephenKennedy I know ^^"
@StephenKennedy dunno
 
Zoe
Kinda sorta, but not really
 
if you have a couple of minutes you can make me happy and watch this :) - we enter the programme as Clarkson is wrapping up saying how great the Volkswagen Golf GTi is... youtu.be/rYGqOdolzv4?t=101 swoon at that colour, Miami Blue (h)
and if you don't nm because I just watched it twice :)
 
Zoe
@StephenKennedy I don't get it xd
 
summary: he liked it
 
Zoe
5:54 PM
Oh ^^"
 
more than it's great rival of the day, the VW
When I first got that car other owners of the same model would wave. Now they're so rare I never see one to wave at :/
Don't worry though, I'm the weirdo not you :P To you and most people, a car is just an appliance.
 
Zoe
It's not really weird though
 
Objection!
 
Zoe
@JennaSloan Overruled
It's just a different field of interest. And as an example everyone here can understand, it's like coding to non-coders
Looks horribly complicated, but some people are still interested in it and find it easy (and/or fun)
 
Yeah, and like a lot of coders I get a bit obsessive about things that interest me :)
well you know that already, you heard about my CD/record collection
there's a little bit more to it than that though, as that very car gave me my independence back after I quit driving for a few years after those crashes we talked about. I bought it for £600 and treated it like a piece of scrap metal to begin with. Then I fell in love with it. Will never, ever ever sell it. In fact I might ask to be buried in it :)
oops I was going to try to not talk too much today so that the transcript was clean for Cody to help Zoe
@Makyen test ping
 
Zoe
6:21 PM
@StephenKennedy damn o.o
@StephenKennedy meh, no rush though
 
Actually I think we did OK. The C++ stuff is grouped together and Cody was pinged at the start.
Not saying there's any rush, just didn't want to make the transcript hard to follow.
 
Zoe
Oh yeah, good point
 
 
1 hour later…
Zoe
7:48 PM
I've had enough coding for today. Well, meta debugging xd Imma go draw something
 
8:00 PM
most sensible thing you've said all week :P
have fun o/
 
Zoe
Actually, nvm that. Imma go play a game
And I need the RAM, so later o/
 
 
1 hour later…
9:16 PM
@Zoe around?
nm not even present, silly me
 
 
1 hour later…
Zoe
10:31 PM
@StephenKennedy you rang?
 
@Zoe Indeed I did. I was going to ask you to review my RO nomination but as you weren't around I submitted it anyway.
I took on board what you said and since I'm often in the room anyway...
 
Zoe
You posted it? OwO
Link?
 
See pinned msg from Mach in SOCVR
 
Zoe
Found it through a GH commit (I'm mobile atm)
Looks good ^^
You'd have my vote if I had one ^^"
 
Thanks
 
Zoe
10:48 PM
Anyways, this girl needs to sleep uwu Gn o/
 
11:00 PM
and this boy needs to eat \o
 

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