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Wes
Wes
05:29
@StatikStasis how doesn't that raise any alarm in the united states
like we want to make sars more infectious to humans and we want to free it in the environment
how can you be allowed to even say that
user10008009
Hi,
user10008009
This question is not specialized on a specific technique (PHP, ASP or similar). It's a generic question about the HTTP standard. So I don't know if this question is on topic for SO.

Is there a default response code for a illegal or rather unsupported request? For example on my current private page I only use two keys (id and lang) for the GET method. Which status code should I use, when the request contains an unsupported key? Is there a similar status code like 405 (method not allowed)?

I have read the specific RFC. But I'm not sure which status code I should use.
Wes
Wes
404
user10008009
05:47
@Wes Thanks. The reason: On my private I have many requests from maybe scripts which scanning for security holes. Currently I redirect to home, but I want to redirect to an error page.
Wes
Wes
why?
just send 404, or 401 (403?) if they try to access private pages
if the url doesn't exist, you should use 404. that is never wrong
user10008009
Okay, thanks.
posted on October 05, 2021

user10008009
06:13
I have another question related to PHP running on OpenBSD with OpenBSD's HTTPD. In the default configuration I don't see a time nor the specific request on which an PHP error occurred under /var/www/logs/error.log. Is there a configuration to print more details?
06:36
\o
o/
@Tiffany yeah I loved it. I liked Parasite a lot as well
07:12
@Derick do you think this is a bug? 3v4l.org/S4GZs
Wes
Wes
07:40
\o
08:20
@Sjon No, feature. PHP will now handle far-in-future (beyond 2038) DST changeovers correctly.
@Derick aha, thanks
@Derick ah, yes that makes sense
08:43
@Derick do you think this is a bug? 3v4l.org/Y7ONB
That looks suspicious...
@salathe Yeah, bug.
I don't know whether it picks transition 1/2 instead of the ones it should
@salathe 3v4l.org/CXu17 is a better shorter test case
<insert thumbs up emoji>
cmb
cmb
09:26
@cmb ah. Tough call. Hopefully the related issue gets fixed in time for 8.1 final, or is php too far in the release-cycle for that?
We can still fix it as a bug in PHP 8.1.1, no?
cmb
cmb
let's wait on the bug fix
What's the status of prototype.php.net?
@salathe Have a bug ID for me?
cmb
cmb
09:43
@Derick, @GabrielCaruso, please note that github.com/php/php-src/pull/7556 should be part of the RCs.
@cmb Is it in PHP-7.4 branch yet?
cmb
cmb
no, I'm going to merge
I'll make the RC after that then.
@cmb I'm having some odd Windows issues with Xdebutg 3.1.0 :-/ → bugs.xdebug.org/view.php?id=2024 && bugs.xdebug.org/view.php?id=2028
And I still have no idea about bugs.xdebug.org/view.php?id=2016 either :-/
@cmb Thanks for the heads up. I'm still trying to figure out what is wrong with my setup (see emails to systems@ and rms@) :(
@GabrielCaruso You're still using the wrong key
10:00
@Derick I've tested the two keys I have locally, that's not the problem, but thanks for suggesting it
@Derick #81504
@cmb I think that's @MarkR 's playground nowadays. I doubt it makes sense to be providing any support for it at this time.
cmb
cmb
@salathe yeah, but that site should not be generally available, should it?
Morning
cmb
cmb
@Derick "LoadModule php7_module "${INSTALL_DIR}/bin/php/php8.1.0/php7apache2_4.dll"" facepalm
10:22
@cmb Uh... :-)
cmb
cmb
I'm commenting on that
cheers
The other two issues are different :-/
@cmb I bet they just made that one up in the bug report. You can't ever trust what they write is the truth
@cmb I guess a "this is an unsupported, experimental site, don't expect anything to work, don't raise bugs" banner on every page wouldn't go amiss. :-p
cmb
cmb
@salathe that, or set up basic auth to prevent bugs.php.net/81503 /cc @MarkR
or remove the DNS entry and have folks go to Mark's site directly
cmb
cmb
10:28
@Derick yeah, but I can't reproduce (PHP-7.4.24 and Xdebug 3.1.0)
@salathe ah, right! maybe FB helps with that :p
@cmb I bet it is with PHP 8.1
cmb
cmb
both bugs claim it happens with different PHP 7 versions as well
I can imagine that it's a setup issue
oh, yes, you're right that it's on 7 too
But #2028 says it's a 3.0.4 vs a 3.1.0 issue
@cmb You've said before that you can't reproduce bugs.xdebug.org/view.php?id=2016 either, right?
cmb
cmb
@Derick ah, tracing triggers a segfault for me; let me check
ah ha
11:24
Yeah it was / is my prototype, I've not done any work on it in a long time as by the time I started pushing with it, the original designers of php.net indicated they'd keep on that instead.
I could push it forward at Christmas, but I was hoping to push for wiki.php.net/rfc/open_release_manifest
Wes
Wes
in august i've predicted on twitter that china would put military pressure on taiwan..... specifically because of tsmc

a bunch of people ridiculed me... now i noticed they deleted their tweets

i'm not so crazy now eh
I predict global war with china at some point in history
That would be a very short war
Wes
Wes
invading a country to get the number one chip maker in the world seems for a good reason
amd intel nvidia playstation xbox arm apple... basically all the stuff that matters is made by tsmc
If it genuinely looked like war the US / Europe would immediately pour tens if not hundreds of of billions into creating new fabs, and justify it as national security.
11:31
China is a monster fed by countries like the US, very same people who oppose to them, but hey, gotta get that cheap labor some how
Wes
Wes
they are doing it already, even tsmc is investing outside of taiwan
but apparently getting something like that started can take several years
let alone getting to 6nm chips
@MarkR Not so sure about that, they always go conservative first then pull out the big guns
Well any war against china would necessitate immediately destroying their entire navy so there would be tremendous loss of life in the opening salvo, hard to see how that wouldn't escalate to a nuclear exchange
Anyway, I hope I'm no alive for when that happens
11:43
Well Australia will be firing torpedos at chinese warships, so, yeah.
@Sara @cmb Who do I talk to about 2FA? Keys are working, configuration looks good, but looks like I can't jump because I don't have 2FA :)
cmb
cmb
@Derick debugging the dump with differrent gives totally different results; while WinDbg and VS point at _get_nanotime, DebugDiag points at xdebug_init_oparray (like #2016); guess the latter is just broken. I cannot repro with debug builds, but see gist.github.com/cmb69/692b64cf185bd05b1a6994eca73dc964.
@GabrielCaruso I guess you need to get someone from systems; maybe Rasmus can help?
@cmb Maybe, I'm gonna email him, systems@ wasn't a success. Thanks mate!
cmb
cmb
systems is a black hole :(
11:59
Yeap, it's on my plans for 2022/2023 touch that part of PHP. We need to open source a little bit more the background of php.net, it's heavily concentrated in a few people around
@cmb Tried with "export USE_ZEND_ALLOC=0" or the windows equivalent?
@cmb And that time thing was a /0, right?
cmb
cmb
yeah, right; it's initialized to zero, but never changed on Windows 10
There is about an hour of sun... so I'll go for a walk and then I'll dive into the date issue that @salathe reported and if you have time we can dive into this windows issue? I always feel annoyed about windows issues, cause I can't really run / reproduce much locally. I do have a VM (Win 8.1), but I'm just lost as a user.
Wes
Wes
12:23
@Danack css added rgb(255 0 0 / 50%) as synonym to rgba(255, 0, 0, .5) but we still can't do stuff like color(darkblue / 50%)
@Wes yeah...........adding a new syntax that only has the same capabilities of the existing syntax seems pretty bonkers to me.
Wes
Wes
i gave up trying to understand the priorities of the css working groups
That's both hilarious and depressing (about the nature of the CSS working groups)
I actually did some digging......basically it seems that it was proposed and accepted in an off-line working group meeting, because no-one was fast enough to say no. But the process for how they make decisions seems way more opaque than PHP....
Wes
Wes
i wonder how many voted
12:36
@Wes Like he comically stated "Are you literally the Joker?"
Wes
Wes
12:57
@StatikStasis i lost it lol
@Danack of the million problems css has, they fixed what we didn't need
kinda like css grid. 77 million features, doesn't have the stuff we actually need
13:18
@StatikStasis I passed out :( Do anything fancy?
@cmb Ah neat! I'll have a proper look in a moment. FInishing that date/time issue first
@cmb What makes you think xdebug_nanotime_context isn't a proper global?
cmb
cmb
well, at least it is not properly initialized for the threads
@Wes oh, that's what that syntax means … TIL?
I init it in minit
xdebug.c:531 -> src/base/base.c:1116 -> src/lib/timing.c:135
cmb
cmb
yeah, but that field looses it's value
14:29
ah
why would it lose its value?
cmb
cmb
idk :)
oh, FWIW, if xdebug's mode is "off", then it does not get initialised... but then you can't also use the tracer
cmb
cmb
in a debug build it's 0xcdcdcdcdcdcdcdcd (MS heap)
it's properly initialized in MINIT
In any case, nanotime_init does need to happen always, regardless of which mode is turned on
Hey there!
Is there anyone who knows nginx well here?
14:36
@cmb When you write "If tracing is done in a ZTS environment on Windows 8.0+," --- how did you do tracing, with xdebug_start_trace() ?
cmb
cmb
I had just xdebug.mode=trace xdebug.start_with_request=yes
@Derick Nice, a quick fix on that timezone transitions bug. Many thanks. :-)
Hi folks, just a quick simple question. I have an observer class which listens to two events: save and delete. What should I call it? Is the following name fine for it?

ShipmentTrackAfterSaveOrDeleteObserver.php
hmm... php-src don't have "hacktoberfest" topic anymore .... perhaps have to be re-add each year....
15:00
Hi
@BasheerKharoti Shouldn't you have an observer for each separately?
@cmb github.com/xdebug/xdebug/pull/794/files Maybe that works? Or, you think I should stick it in GINIT or perhaps even RINIT? I can't see how it would have lost its value though...
cmb
cmb
@Derick I don't think this will help; I think you need GINIT.
But I would like to know why :-)
(I mean, this change needs to happen anyway, but...)
15:17
@RemiCollet @cmb Apologies, but today's release will be super late, or only tomorrow. I'm still trying to fix my connection issues with downloads.php.net
cmb
cmb
np
@Derick me too :) (I'm still working on that)
github.com/SidorkinAlex/multithreading_php I hope these side-cra(p)fts are part of the past after a year with fibers
@beberlei Would you be interested in the ZE keeping track of call stack depth for (it's per call stack/fiber, obviously) somehow? Also, what about unique call ids (unique per request, module 64-bit roll-over) per frame? The latter I am less certain about, but it seems a bit odd that we don't have call depth. I can "add" it using hooks but they are expensive.
15:42
@PeeHaa Crashed a lot. Got my plane to finally take off //cc @Derick | Accomplished a few missions. Got my first downvote (last night's video) +7 subscribers in the last 5 days.
Pretty good week. =)
Hah, neat.
@StatikStasis \o/
@StatikStasis I just built one and it worked first try :-D
but no parachute so I need to land it, or kill Jeb
Either way Jeb landed
Plane didn't survive... but Jeb and the cockpit did :-)
I need to make an RC
@cmb You merged that pcre thing, right?
cmb
cmb
15:58
@Derick yes (hours ago :)
16:34
@SaifEddinGmati What's a good way to chat with you privately?
17:07
I come back from two days of tiresome days doing uni shit, and Mike replies with a comment which I'm like, whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
Like.... ?mixed is not allowed for a reason
I guess, is there an engine reason why it shouldn't be supported?
not including the obvious "why would you even do that" reason
I dunno, maybe needs an ELI5 explanation
It's prevented at compile time
Because it makes no logical sense
You can't make something nullable, if it already includes null
17:24
makes sense
perhaps ?scalar
he might be overthinking it in his response... "why is ?null not allowed?" "is there a use case for ?null?"
18:01
My $0.02 (unasked for) is that as long as ? is supported, it should be supported with any type behind it, not just ones that "don't include null", because of consistency. Otherwise it becomes a weird game of "why does this include null again?", especially if you enable type aliases or type declarations. ?somecustomtype gives an error because somewhere in somecustomtype's declaration tree is a null. That sounds like a pretty painful thing to me to try to work around.
@ircmaxell I think there is a distinction between allowing the literal ?null vs ?sometyperesolvingtonull
@bwoebi was more referring to chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/53168993#53168993 and the derivatives than specifically ?null
ah, yeah okay.
18:23
to me ?null feels like a syntax error
18:47
Not a syntax error, but a semantic error.
@Trowski twitter :)
@Trowski or slack ( azjezz on symfonys slack )
19:06
@LeviMorrison that's what I meant, sure
@Girgias fyi, the weighting scale you should give to people's opinions doesn't go from zero to one, it's minus one to one.
Still the question from anthony remains
What about string|int|null
@Danack Huuuum
@ln-s ??????
This is valid
ngl, this is kinda on the same level as Mike's question there
@ircmaxell I think there is a distinction between allowing the literal ?null vs ?sometyperesolvingtonull
The question is if ?mixed should be allowed
19:08
just pointing that out
Any other type can have ?T
Well if ?sometyperesolvingtonull ....
Same as the usual redundancy rules
If we know at compile time, error
otherwise not
int|string|int will compile error
@Girgias 3v4l.org/KCVrf I think explains my thoughts
@ircmaxell Again, that's how the redundancy rules work, it's compile time alias of the same time, the type is not "minimal"
Also that's not really the same
19:21
@Girgias point I'm making tho is that I don't think "minimal" should be put on the author to figure out. Only not trivially redundant (so int|int is trivial, shouldn't be allowed, but int|numeric where numeric is defined as int|float isn't trivial since it requires a resolution step. That resolution step may be simple, but it also may not be obvious or even semantically what the author is trying to convey, hence why my suggestion to only prohibit the most trivial cases
(and as an extension, ?mixed feels non-trivial even if mixed isn't user defined)
@ircmaxell That's something to decide for type aliasing
A feature we don't have
But I maintain my point that ?null makes utterly no sense
sure it does: iterable and mixed... Just cause they are hard-coded doesn't make them not aliases
I am not seeing the point you are trying to make
@Girgias I';m not really arguing that ?null should be supported, but more that anything else but null should, even if that other thing has a null in it somewhere
@ircmaxell But they are not aliases... they have special logic dealing with them, I literally have a PR to make iterable a array|Traversable alias
19:28
@Girgias functionally, to the end user, is there any meaningful difference?
For iterable maybe not, for mixed yeah, because you cannot type mixed as a union as we don't have a resource type (for good reasons but none less), but by that logic ?mixed should be allowed, but that points to a clear bug
I mean, I'm getting around that ?T was just a bandaid, an I'm starting to hate it more and more, but that's just me
 
1 hour later…
20:45
morns
21:29
TIL: Packagist is hosted on windows then....
oh, or those Composer CVEs are separate....
Ok, that is confusing. Anyone else just gotten security alerts on a composer thing that are from April 29 ?
21:48
o_O
Hosted on windows ?
oh my
@Danack you know this from a trusted source ?
@ln-s No....I was confused by a github notification....and misread something.
yeah....though as I said I misread it. GHSA-frqg-7g38-6gcf was found today.... but in github:
And the one you linked from April is also in the email.
And I missed that they were separate issues, and one is six months old.
22:04
hmmm a new one eh, someone should probably post that on reddit
@MarkR Most users don't install untrusted packages anyway.
(especially on Windows)
I really don't understand why composer allows running third party code by default in the first place tbh.
Same, but on the other hand, if you install a dependency and its autoloaded automatically anyway, there's not much difference.
Composer usually runs in the context of the IDE, nowadays the code itself usually runs in the context of whatever container its in, or under www-data etc
22:20
That's true, but untrusted code on production is likely worse than on the development environment.
Perhaps, but production systems are often more locked down and with more extensive logging
I apologize for this interruption in programming conversation, but this... this has to be shared
thats quite the tangent tiffs :p
It's after 5pm :P

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