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01:14
@Tiffany Yes, throws a fatale error in PHP 8.0
01:50
@Girgias do you know offhand if it's been reworded yet for 8? I'll check tomorrow if you're not sure.
I'm being lazy, and there's no need to support my laziness :P
@Tiffany 3v4l.org/KZAsn :p
Non-static method Foo::bar() cannot be called statically
02:17
I really hope this will be reverted: github.com/php/php-src/pull/6384
@Girgias I mean PR for doc-en
I'll look it up tomorrow
@Tiffany I'll let you handle that, still don't know if I should merge my other PR
👍
 
3 hours later…
05:27
Hi all! I'm wondering if the difference between the "tracing" and "function" JIT is documented somewhere?
05:41
If not in the JIT RFC don't think so
I know, these options were added later to finetune the RFC
@BrentRoose Looking at the RFC it seems like the function mode is on first execution
From what I gathered the new values for opcache.jit replaced the CRTO flags listed in the RFC; so I assume both function and tracing both represent a combination of those flags, though I'm not sure which
eg. `function` could mean both of these triggers:

0 - JIT all functions on first script load
1 - JIT function on first execution
What are all the values that it can take?
only tracing and function if I remember correctly
05:59
Well, something to add on the Todo list for the docs team :(
 
2 hours later…
07:40
morns
Morning.
08:13
o/
\o
@BrentRoose it can still take the numbers, tracing and function are just human readable shortcuts
@BrentRoose function and tracing jit are both terms from the literature, so you'll find on wikipedia how they are defined
08:41
Null constant in method signature did not allow nullable anymore ・ *General Issues ・ #80283
08:54
@beberlei aah TIL, thanks!
cmb
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09:31
@Girgias there's a draft for the new OPcache INIs: github.com/php/doc-en/pull/140
cmb
cmb
10:02
@Girgias, when committing to lower branches than master, it is important to merge those commits upwards (even when the commit would not affect the higher branches); see wiki.php.net/vcs/… :)
@Sara It looks like github.com/php/php-src/pull/6318 is waiting on your decision
10:25
Logical operators using Halloween twitter.com/38mo1/status/1320004943542009857
10:41
\o
@cmb What's the difference between the element and the text map in phd?
cmb
cmb
elements is about the opening and closing tags, text is the textContent
@cmb And why is the return type formatted using "text" and the parameter type using "element"?
hello?
cmb
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@NikiC is that so? I'll have a closer look soon.
cmb
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11:06
Well, the difference is due to the ordering; return types are processed first, but have to be written at the end of the signature. Parameter types can be written right away.
11:50
Is there some way to skip a phpunit test from cli?
Without modifying the test that is
I only see --exclude-group
Incident on 2020-10-26 11:54 UTC ・ Notifications has Partial Outage ・ Gists has Partial Outage
hm, --filter is the whitelist one, but there is no corresponding --exclude-filter it seems
sed -i 's/PHP_OS/"Darwin"/' tests/Filesystem/FilesystemTest.php it is I guess
12:20
@DaveRandom if I wouldn't feel old all the time anyway, I'd now do
12:33
All issues have been resolved!
@Gordon og r11
13:06
@Tiffany og?
13:34
@cmb Wait, when did I not do that?
cmb
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@Girgias when you applied Kalle's IMAP fix (zend_list_close)
But I did merge up
Or did I fuck that up badly
Because that's my merge commit from PHP-8.0 to master: github.com/php/php-src/commit/…
cmb
cmb
There appear to be two commits: d5e2431884b2c13d39f698bcdeeb27c107443555 and 12a09183b369779fcf123cdd4fbacee373cc7d98. The latter had been merged upwards, but the former apparently not.
Huh, that's weird, I don't even have a merge commit in the PHP-8.0 branch
uhhhhhh
Git worktrees shouldn't mess the merge commits, right?
Sometimes there are issues if someone else pushes at the same time
And you end up pushing your change but not your merges, or only some of the merges :)
13:47
Well I do use --atomic and push all branches at the same time so I would expect that not to mess up?
But maybe I'm just misunderstanding what --atomic is meant to do
@Girgias TIL --atomic ^^
@Crell ping
14:32
Good Morning!
@PeeHaa LOL! Sorry I missed it, man!
@mega6382 I endorse this message. =D
It's ok :) Hope you had a good weekend!
Had a disc golf tournament. Placed 28th... eh. Weekend was great though.
@PeeHaa How was the game?
Was funsies. Missed stabbing you though!
14:38
Awe- how sweet.
@pmmaga CONGRATS! Don't let them grow up to be a PHP developer. Help them to learn from your mistakes.
15:01
@PeeHaa and I make a great imposter team :P
We became imposters together twice
LOL, nice!
I think we won both times
Wait until @Ekin and @PeeHaa become an imposter team, they'll be unstoppable
@FrankdeJonge Oh hai! Also paging @IluTov.
@Crell :wave: hi!
I looked over the RFC, I like it a lot. I do have some questions/suggestions, mostly in the "scope" department.
The enum-comparison repo also has discussion and analysis. The specific syntax it recommends is a bit out of date, but the logic behind it is still mostly valid.
The big question mark is how to handle primitive equivalence when enums are objects. That's a difficult question to sort out.
15:17
To get a good understanding of this, I can try to explain how I interpreted the RFC in relation to the issue you're describing. You can then correct me where I missed the mark, does that sound ok?
@cre
@Crell or is there already a place where this problem is illustrated that I can use to verify my understanding?
It's probably good for me to first dive into the prior art as much as I can, otherwise we'd need to go over everything you probably already spent brain power on.
There's some issues filed on the enum-comparison repo as well. That's our open-questions list.
And there's probably stuff missing, but start there. :-)
@FrankdeJonge if you have the time/energy to write notes, then I think there's quite a few people on internals who would benefit from having it explained.
@Danack I'll make sure to do that. Better to have this energy spent once and used N times.
15:33
There's an RFC doc in the enum-comparison repo if you want to PR against it where things are unclear.
@Crell My guess is that having two separate docs would be better.....one to explain what enums are and how they behave in other languages, and an RFC to add them to PHP. Otherwise it's going to be one huge document, that would be hard to parse.
I'm also guessing that this conversation is going to be dominated by people who have very strong feelings about something they don't fully understand. aka a shitshow.
@Danack Flashbacks to @ attributes
They are separate docs.
@Girgias imo, the short closure one was worse. The authors spent a large chunk of effort on explaining the downside to various possible syntaxes. The majority of the discussion was people pulling symbols out of their fundament and saying "hey what about this?".
Ah right, not sure if I remember much of that discussion. But if it's the same as the Attribute discussion but worse than yeah ...
15:48
The main open question for enums is how they map to primitives. That's the trickiest, both technically and socially/discussion-wise.
The issue is that sometimes an integer representation would be better and sometimes a String representation would be better I imagine
Yes. And sometimes there is no primitive equivalent and that's OK.
But round-tripping to a DB is a not-small use case, so we need something clearly defined.
@Crell from what I understand, the complicated cases around comparison and equality originate from the associable cases. Because they effectively turn an exhaustive list into a non-exhaustive set of possibilities where in the case of unit cases equality certain semantics make sense (such as having the same reference), where as in the case of associable cases this doesn't fit the normal object model of equality. Is that a correct interpretation?
Obviously, again I haven't thought about it extensively as you did, but I had imaginary cases for both and I was like, how the hell do you support both use cases D:
"How the hell do you support both use cases" is basically where we are right now. :-)
15:53
haha good luck on that front then :D
Cause I'm gonna be very useless :D
@FrankdeJonge It's more about how to conceptually have unit and associable cases at the same time, where units sometimes have a primitive equivalent and sometimes not.
And we need to be able to map the primitive to the enum as well as vice versa.
Just always use a string and numeric strings runs away
@Crell gotcha. One of my questions was, could the associative cases be modelled in something distinctly different from Enums?
There have been people encouraging that. But Swift, Rust, and Kotlin all model them in the same structure, so it's definitely possible, at least in theory.
And most of the monad cases work better with explicit enum/ADTs rather than something cobbled together with sealed classes and such.
Where are the repos please? and shall I pin them here?
16:04
@Crell In TypeScript you have type declarations that allow you to represent (and re-use) a union. So a "type Distance = Miles | Kilometers;" would allow you to effectively hint against both while referring to it in as a singular concept. Would a construct like that be a viable alternative for associable values? I'm just brainstorming here to see if there are other language primitives that could be put in play to allow the same situations to be catered for while reducing the enum complexity.
@cmb does the "fix" I did for the Windows warning in the IMAP test work?
Because I might XFAIL the 2 other ones and merge the PR
cmb
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@Girgias I haven't explicitly checked the PR, but see chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/50752593#50752593
Well I set the INI setting that's why I was expecting that test to work now
But I can't double check :(
Oh wait there is another warning if you set it
Didn't realise that bit u.u
@FrankdeJonge No, Associable values are something else. Think enum Maybe { case None; case Some($a_value); }
Oh, which reminds me of the other tricky part, which is how enums interact with match(). Which is the standard way to deal with enums, but we need to then teach it to do something other than a === check. Which could be full pattern matching, or something less aggressive, TBD.
strspn $length argument may no longer exceed the string bounds ・ Unknown/Other Function ・ #80285
cmb
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16:22
@Girgias we could split the test, if all else fails
split: windows/non-windows
Yeah, but I would like to avoid that :( But the double new line thing is still puzzling me
Guys, do you know if there's a PHP extension that could throw a parse error for a PHP code that never runs? We have this dead code in our codebase that can't be reached in any way, but it's throwing a fatal for a couple customers, and I'm wondering how
it's not commented-out. The code that leads to it is commented-out, so it's dead code. But the dead code is valid PHP.

One of these customers is in GoDaddy with PHP 5.6 - the others I don't know - but I'm suspecting it's something at GoDaddy
Redefining constants/classes?
You could check Psalm with it's dead code removal analysis
As maybe it isn't truly dead code
logically speaking, besides being dead, that code should only run in AJAX requests - but it's throwing a 500 on the main request - so it doesn't make sense
there's something parsing that
@LucasBustamante What is the code and the error?
16:34
The code that is causing the error is a lexical typo that we just fixed
Grabbing it, just a sec...
So it's a parse error?
Error:
`Parse error: syntax error, unexpected '(' in /home/content/52/10758452/html/wp-content/plugins/foo/Framework/Filesystem/Filesystem.php on line 133`

Lexical typo on dead code:
`if ($this->shouldStop && $this->getShouldStop()()) {`
Yeah so it doesn't matter whether the code is dead
Hmm
Just by requiring the file should fatal...
It should
php needs to parse your file
16:38
The whole file is parsed at once, so parse errors happen file-at-a-time.
Errors that only happen when code is run (eg, type mismatches) are line-by-line, so unused code wouldn't be an issue.
Let me try to reproduce this...
the cats are finally earning their keep, and the geckos are learning what it means to be prey
for me, on PHP 7.3 web and 7.4 CLI the error only happens when the code is executed - not when the file is parsed... I'll try to spin up a 5.6 container and see what happens
@LucasBustamante btw the (actual) error is probably on the line above that
@Stephen cats - 1, geckos - 0. Have the geckos started avoiding your home yet?
16:52
@Tiffany no because they're stupid creatures
@Tiffany Can't warn the others if you're dead...
so far the cats haven't caught up with air conditioner fan blades for the number of gecko fatalities
not even joking.
@Derick I missed your stream :( forgot I have meetings on Monday and this week's took longer than usual. I'll have to watch your YouTube recordings.
Interesting. On PHP 5.6 that error happens on file-include time - that means it happens on dead code
$this->getShouldStop()() is a syntax error on 5.6, isn't it?
16:55
Seems we have to tweak our CI
yes: Parse error: syntax error, unexpected '(' in /var/www/html/foo.php on line 7
If you need 5.6 compatibility, you'll need to back that out to a 5.6-compatible syntax.
@LucasBustamante 5.6 o.O
@Tiffany Aw, it happens. I do need to edit a little before I upload it.
Well there's your problem :D
"To hell with 5.6" is the better solution, though. :-)
16:57
an attempt an humour, because more fun than helping. i.sstatic.net/ZZ7GT.jpg
@Crell WordPress walks up Hey kid... wanna support PHP 5.2 5.5?
WP runs on 7.4 and by now probably 8.0 just fine. :-) (Lazy-ass plugin authors are a different matter.)
Ah guys, I already suffer enough with this, don't mock me hehe
I know.
Trust me.
I know.
Anyone know any good bluetooth transmitters so I can connect headphones to a tv without bluetooth
Thanks, I'll do my lunch break now. Have a good one everyone, thanks for the help!
17:05
Wrong room. This is PHP, not "random bluetooth headphone questions" room
@LucasBustamante You work with PHP. Mocking comes with the territory
We get the confusion a lot
cmb
cmb
@Girgias I'll try to check that. :)
Cheers :D
@PeeHaa maybe you should update the Chat Guidelines my friend. Nowhere in here does it mention I can't ask a unrelated question 0.o room-11.github.io/#dont_6
17:13
May 24 at 9:28, by Danack
no. off topic is allowed. But disruption isn't.
^I try to follow that
17:42
18:06
Didn't see any disruption
18:51
I hate autoconf.
19:12
@bigchungus this is an oxymoron in my experience, unfortunately :-/
(as in there aren't any good ones that I have ever found)
@DaveRandom found one haha
however, I will say this: the best ones I have found were marketed specifically at the Nintendo Switch
@bigchungus ^ that is the only useful thing I have to say on the subject :-P
@DaveRandom thats how I found the one I came across haha
I'm not a massive fan of bluetooth for wireless audio, obviously it works pretty well and interop is astonishingly good (in general) but it's quite inefficient if you have a specific narrow use case like that
I wouldn't mind betting there are some based on alternative tech (maybe DECT-esque things) which are more reliable, better range and lower power consumption
they are probably not cheap, though
Not even for my use... found one with really low latency and power consumption for a pretty good price on Amazon
13k reviews. Avg 4+ stars not bad
19:17
if it's for a static setup like that, try and avoid something that relies on a battery... other than that it's just suck it and see I guess
the other problem with anything like that (and esp. "junk band" tech like bluetooth) is that you are so reliant on the surrounding radio environment
Noticed batteries cause interference
like you might get something that works great 99% of the time but doesn't work for you because of some weird interference source in your vicinity
bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-54239180 <-- this is a recent example of how badly radio interference can fuck with yo shit :-P
4
there is a nearly identical story from another town in the UK about 5 years ago
stuff like that is nearly impossible to find, as well
My dad used to have a huge 100+ foot radio mast in the back garden for Amateur radio. Could shut down the entire neighbourhood with that thing.
 
2 hours later…
21:29
@MarkR <3 the capitalisation
:-P
I assume deliberate, and I appreciate
Mast should have been capitalized too imo
oh hey @MarkR I was in you general part of the world today, in a town called Garforth
not super close but closer than manc :-P
it rained. lots.
Just passing through level 3 for shits and giggles?
living that level 3 shiz yo
currently going round the country visiting every site that Cartwrights Fleet Services operate
one of which is on the north coast of scotland, and depsite my protests I think I am actually going to have to physically go there even though it's one bloke with a laptop in a shed
but whatever, it's their dime
and at least it's not actually winter yet
@PeeHaa yes I agree, you are an absolute Mast
@MarkR ftr I spent like 6hrs today wearing a mask, I'm not big on this whole thing :-P
mostly because of other people, I am like a walking transmission vector atm
but diligently wearing a mask every time I walk through a door + usual sanitisation etc, I feel morally OK in terms of best-effort :-P
I prefer a head-to-toe air-tight PVC bodysuit and a military gas mask. Covid protection and can get into some really fun clubs!... if they hadn't all shut down
21:39
I thought that was hilarious \o/ now if only he carries through and gives them all a good thrashing
21:52
@DaveRandom @PeeHaa I just found an unopened pack that was there the whole time.
22:10
@DaveRandom good jorb
tbf all I did is buy some fags the other day and then sit on my bed
it wasn't all that difficult
:-P

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