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12:06 AM
@Girgias What makes it worse is some tests don't fail until the NEXT time I push. So I can't do all of the fixes at once, I have to do them bit by bit.
 
12:22 AM
@Crell :( That's annoying indeed, I mean for IMAP I have a test failing locally but it work fine on CI, I think it's just a WSL1 limitation lol
 
@Crell have you tweaked the travis (or whichever CI you're checking) to run the tests you care about first? e.g. with php run-tests.php ext/mysqli ?
 
That's a thing?
 
...which bit are you doubting the existence of?
 
12:48 AM
Ability to tell Travis in a PR to run a certain set of tests first.
Well, Travis and Azure passed this time, so yay. We'll see if AppVeyor is in a good mood today.
 
1:12 AM
Aaaaand AppVeyor is still running, over a half hour later.
I'm done for tonight.
 
1:42 AM
Covariant return types failing compilation ・ Compile Failure ・ #80126
 
 
1 hour later…
Wes
2:54 AM
that sounds like the title of a very bad youtube video
 
3:40 AM
BeverlyJenty ・ *General Issues ・ #80127
 
 
3 hours later…
6:23 AM
With new PHP version, 7.X, having strict type hinting in methods, is there any point to also check with instanceof in the method that has the type hinting? I.e. won't PHP baulk on an invalid data type before it gets to the instanceof check inside the method?
E.g. public function fooBar(UserObject $user) { if (!$user instanceof UserObject) {handle} }
 
6:48 AM
@James There is no point for the instanceof check.
 
ta
 
 
1 hour later…
7:57 AM
@Girgias It looks like we have a couple of memory leaks in imap: dev.azure.com/phpazuredevops/PHP/_build/…
 
8:35 AM
trigger_error produces 255 exit code ・ Reproducible crash ・ #80128
 
Dmitry is asking whether the setting should be opcache.jit=tracing (as it is now) or opcache.jit=trace. Anyone have an opinion on that?
 
@MarkR Solving multiple problems twice - shame on you. :D
Good morning.
\o
 
8:53 AM
@NikiC The alternative is what? opcache.jit=method?
 
@LeviMorrison opcache.jit=function
 
user1804599
@bwoebi Actually this could still work without generics.
 
@NikiC Right, doesn't surprise me, I really should build with ASAN...
 
user1804599
Suit::Hearts->toString('Db');
 
user1804599
Would use the string for attribute AsString('Db', …).
 
8:55 AM
@NikiC "tracing" fits what I usually see in literature. Typically there are JIT compilers that work on method/function boundaries or by tracing.
 
user1804599
I’ll write a concrete example tonight, I think this would work quite well.
 
9:10 AM
@Girgias I just discovered collator_is_numeric
It may need some adjustments to be consistent with the numeric string RFC?
 
@NikiC Right, let me see
Also any idea where I can find some source code of whatever the IMAP extension is calling? So that I can check the flags which are passed
or we can burn this extension with fire
 
cmb
@Girgias look for libc-client
 
Cheers :)
Also @cmb about the COM warning to promotion PR, does it still need something?
 
@cmb Such a great name
 
cmb
9:15 AM
yes :D
 
Makes it look like a shitty IMAP implementation is part of libc...
 
cmb
 ext/imap/php_imap.c | 3 ++-
 1 file changed, 2 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-)

diff --git a/ext/imap/php_imap.c b/ext/imap/php_imap.c
index 667587ab77..27ff2058c7 100644
--- a/ext/imap/php_imap.c
+++ b/ext/imap/php_imap.c
@@ -2570,7 +2570,8 @@ static void php_imap_mutf7(INTERNAL_FUNCTION_PARAMETERS, int mode) /* {{{ */
 	if (out == NIL) {
 		RETURN_FALSE;
 	} else {
-		RETURN_STRING((char *)out);
+		RETVAL_STRING((char *)out);
+		fs_give((void**) &out);
 	}
 }
 /* }}} */
 
@cmb Turns out very hard to google :| had found github.com/jonabbey/panda-imap before but will use the Win one as that's the one used by us...
 
user1804599
3v4l.org/Zhi8l Why does this print empty array?
 
@cmb Please don't tell me that "fs_give" is how you write "free" in imap?
 
cmb
9:16 AM
winlibs is only used for Windows builds; I think that libc-client is unpatched
@NikiC that's how it is ;)
 
of ffs
 
@rightfold Looks like it doesn't have beta4 yet
So still using old attribute syntax
 
user1804599
Ah, thanks.
 
cmb
Program:	Free storage management routines
 
@cmb That's not very intuitive :(
 
9:18 AM
What does NIL correspond to? just 0? a NULL pointer? Cause that's super confusing too
 
cmb
#define NIL 0			/* convenient name */
 
Devil's advocate, it was written before ISO C existed...
@cmb Great, now I need to figure out why it is passed as a char* at one point
@cmb Do you want to commit this?
 
cmb
@Girgias yes, can do
 
👍
 
9:24 AM
@cmb Ahhhhhh, thanks :)
 
hello
 
9:56 AM
morns
 
o/
 
@Girgias Did you run buildconf?
 
@NikiC Ahhhhh, maybe not
Let me redo that
 
10:57 AM
Morning :)
 
11:23 AM
How do I set default compiler flags for a shared PHP extension in it's config.m4? Because PHP_NEW_EXTENSION seems to ignore my extra cflags when using phpize ...
 
Morning
 
11:39 AM
@Girgias CFLAGS="-o2" ./configure works for us
 
Right, but Remi said I should but the --std=C99 in the config.m4 if my target is not C89
which I don't know how to go about
And also he posted this issue on my CSV extension 6 month ago but it seems GitLab didn't want to send me any notification so I just saw it >_<
 
link to m4
 
But my changes are just locally currently
 
dnl config.m4 for extension csv

dnl Comments in this file start with the string 'dnl'.
dnl Remove where necessary.

PHP_ARG_ENABLE([csv],
  [whether to enable csv support],
  [AS_HELP_STRING([--enable-csv],
    [Enable csv support])],
  [no])

if test "$PHP_CSV" != "no"; then
  dnl In case of no dependencies
  AC_DEFINE(HAVE_CSV, 1, [ Have csv support ])

  CFLAGS="$CFLAGS -Wall"

  PHP_SUBST(CFLAGS)

  PHP_NEW_EXTENSION(csv, csv.c, $ext_shared)
fi
something like that, or pick some other thing, PHP_SUBST is the interesting bit ... also take care of replacements ...
 
Cheers will try this :)
 
11:48 AM
cat your Makefile for other possible _CFLAGS, I forget if there are more available ... I think EXTRA_CFLAGS ought to work, or it might have another name ...
it's EXTRA_CFLAGS, see Makefile for use
 
@JoeWatkins It still doesn't seem to add them :(
 
try that approach
(that was remi, iirc)
 
Don't know why I get ./configure: line 4079: CFLAGS: command not found when running: ./configure --with-php-config=/mnt/c/Dev/custom-php/bin/php-config
 
me neither
the standard way is passing to PHP_NEW_EXTENSION, but you mentioned strangeness, iirc remi used this MAINTAINER_CFLAGS thing on parallel, possibly to work around the strangeness ...
I tested what I done to your config.m4 and it worked, but as you know this is mysterious stuff ... I'd copy what remi did ...
 
I'll do that... why is all of this magic :(
 
11:56 AM
ah we do:

PHP_TIDEWAYS_CFLAGS="$STD_CFLAGS $MAINTAINER_CFLAGS"
PHP_NEW_EXTENSION(tideways, $TIDEWAYS_SOURCES, $ext_shared,, $PHP_TIDEWAYS_CFLAGS)
 
Mind sharing what STD_CFLAGS has in it?
 
no clue :D
 
see, mysterious ...
 
ah wait, its being set
in our "developer compile mode", its set to STD_CFLAGS="-g -O0 -Wall", otherwise its not set
 
right Will play around a bit more
 
12:22 PM
./configure: line 4079: STD_CFLAGS: command not found
./configure: line 4080: MAINTAINER_CFLAGS: command not found
*why :(*
At this point might as well generate a new skeleton
 
@Trowski I have no idea how to run any of the fiber stuff. it says to use FiberScheduler::run but that is an interface......can you give an example of how to do anything please?
 
Oh god I found my error
I had a space in between the =
 
@Girgias Hm, it looks like the ext/imap/tests/imap_errors_basic.phpt test needs >60s to run
Some kind of too large timeout?
 
@NikiC Very likely, as it's trying to hit a mailbox which doesn't exist
 
Is it possible to configure it?
 
12:36 PM
I think it is possible in the connection handler
Maybe also setting retries to 0 would speed this up
 
@Crell this sounds really controversial function gimmie_red_card(Suit::Hearts|Suit::Diamonds $card) { ... }
 
?
 
12:54 PM
Morning
 
1:08 PM
@FlorianMargaine huh?
 
@Crell I would expect Suit to be a type, not Suit::Hearts
the snippet is saying that Suit::Hearts is a type, not a value
 
Oh, I thought there was some cultural issue I hadn't noticed. :-P
 
no, sorry, I'm just a nerd
 
We're still unsure what to do with that. unioning cases like that may or may not survive.
Can confirm.
 
not even unioning, I mean that this value is acceptable as a type hint. It means each "value" is a type.
 
1:11 PM
In the current planned implementation, they are. Each case is a class, under the hood.
How much that gets exposed to user land is still very up in the air.
 
I could see function foo(Suit $card=Suit::Heart), however
 
Yeah, that's a no-brainer. It's not real enums if not.
 
hm
so you're saying that Suit::Heart is both a type and a value
 
@FlorianMargaine yes
 
The current thinking is that Heart becomes a class, and Suit::Heart is a singleton instance of that class.
Again, to what degree that is user-exposed is still undecided.
 
1:13 PM
That's most likely worth splitting into 2 RFCs. The whole class/methods/type stuff in a separate one, that is.
 
huh?
@NikiC I'm not clear; did you merge this, or close it and expect me to file a new PR with the changes you mentioned? github.com/php/php-src/pull/6171
 
i.e. the first RFC could be offering where each value is only a value, and not a class where you can specify methods
which also removes the fact that it's a type
 
@FlorianMargaine ummm no… the implementations would be vastly different and as such it's not worth it
 
That would be a completely different implementation and just add more work. ADTs are what we (@IluTov and I) are really after.
 
but idk if it's then possible to make a second RFC that makes each value a class
 
1:14 PM
Unless we were going to really have two independent structures, enums and ADTs, that were independent of each other. F# does that, but I do not approve.
 
I see. Then I think you should add more justification on the "beyond simple enums" choices in the RFC
because, you know, I ended up with those questions after reading it :P
 
As for why including full ADTs rather than just glorified constants?
 
" For this implementation we opted to implement full Algebraic Data Types, as that offers the most robust set of functionality while also degrading gracefully to simpler use cases. (Or it progressively enhances to more complex use cases, depending on your point of view.)" - Not sufficient?
 
maybe it's just me, though
it probably is
 
1:22 PM
Well, heading off that question is a good thing, so good to know it's not necessarily obvious why we went with the full version. :-)
 
> php-pulls closed this in 94854e0 3 hours ago
This is how merged PRs look like in php-src
 
From analyzing how people perceive the reddit post, I want to clarify that it has nothing to do with how internals is run, or how the project is run, but more focused on communication and the ability to make contributing to PHP easier.

Less internals, more about our website and docs, and modernization of those things, and better understanding the community and what they'd like from the project (discovery phase), and based on that outcome see what fits the php.net space, and what doesn't.

When Levi and I modernized the php.net website years ago, maintenance died off and nobody really picke
 
Right, but you had a comment outstanding when you did so. :-) So you want another PR for that?
 
1:37 PM
.. /cc @Girgias @Danack @beberlei
 
The problem with it IMO is that /r/php is a terrible metric for anything
 
Wes
is the markdown editor laggy also for you in phpstorm? it's been like that for a while
 
@Crell Ah no, I adjusted that when merging
@cmb You mentioned that github.com/php/php-src/pull/5576 was a big perf improvement for tests on windows. Do you plan to merge it? Presumably has to happen before rc1 due to abi
 
cmb
1:59 PM
@NikiC oh, indeed no change to get that into 7.4, and time hurries for 8. I'm going to merge that today.
 
@PeeHaa I'm doing the whole walk through of Final Fantasy Tactics: The War of the Lions... with voices because my wife was dying laughing at it on my first video. =D youtube.com/watch?v=KBox2T5X3CI
 
Is it a smell to set a variable to false every time a method is called even if the variable might already be false? I'm wondering if a check for a true value before setting it false should be removed altogether
 
2:15 PM
I've recently found a (segfault) bug in OpCache in PHP7.2 (and presumably PHP7.4). Maybe it's still in PHP8.0? It's around opcache interned strings, and I can replicate it but I can't identify why it's happening. I provided the gdb trace here a while back, but it didn't give much info. I'm wondering if there's a procedure to get more advanced metrics out of gdb or whatnot, to help provide replicatable information.

So far I can only replicate it with my customer's project, in thir specific circumstances.
 
@Alesana hard to say without seeing code...but it's sounds a bit like a smell.....and also sounds like you're using 'falsy' logic, which could be the cause.
 
@Danack I didn't write the code just refactoring it to pass phpmd checks. But basically before a loop it sets "isFileEmpty" to true. Then if it's false, it will append an EOL to the file. Then if it's true it will set it to false. Then it will write a line to a file.
It doesn't make sense to me either way because you need an EOL after every line but I was specifically told not to change it
But I do have to remove the else statement to get it to pass phpmd. I can agree that you should avoid using else statements most of the time but I don't think it should be a hard rule, but oh well.
 
> But I do have to remove the else statement to get it to pass phpmd.
ugh.....I'd just whitelist it. things that produce 'code quality scores' are not a good way of figuring out whether some legacy code needs refactoring or not...
I mean, that does sound like it needs refactoring, but being forced to by a tool is kind of dumb.
 
@NikiC Oh, OK. So no further action items needed from me on mbstring. Check, thanks.
 
I completely agree
There's certain reasons for these rules, because there's certain ways of doing things that are better. But if they're following the rules without doing it the certain way that's better then the code is probably worse off
I'm seeing a lot of that in our code
 
2:22 PM
From your description it sounds clumsy, but not necessarily bad.
The better ways of doing it would be a complete rewrite of that block of code. Up to you if that's worth it.
 
@PaulDragoonis hypothetically, if the segfault is in the same memory location all the time, you could start the application wait until the data in that spot is created, and then set a breakpoint to watch when something writes to that memory, you might be able to find it. And I know that's possible but am not good at doing it.
 
@PaulDragoonis you've posted that reddit discussion to internals?
 
@PaulDragoonis First step is usually valgrind. USE_ZEND_ALLOC=0 valgrind php ...
 
@salathe no? I seen some chat in here regarding it, on Saturday, and a few others reachd out to me, so I've clarified a few things in here.
 
@PaulDragoonis Oh, what does "UPDATE #1: Paul here: I've posted this into PHP Internals, and I'm posting is here too." mean then?
 
2:26 PM
@Crell Yeah I was originally going to refactor the whole thing but there's a lot of other things I'm seeing that need priority for refactoring but still pass phpmd
 
@salathe "posted this" I meant "posted the following clarification". I'll update the that line on reddit to be more explicitly clear
 
@PaulDragoonis I'm still missing something, you haven't posted anything to internals…
 
I posted it here.
Internals is our generic word for a lot of stuff. I didn't send it to the mailing list, if that's what you mean by internals.
 
@salathe Paul just realizes that the real PHP internals is here :D
 
Well, this is the new efnet :D
 
2:29 PM
@PaulDragoonis so what?
 
So I can say I participate in Internals? NICE! Updating my resume!
 
@PaulDragoonis Maybe your generic word, but "internals" means the maliing list and you even captialized it.
Also, why haven't you sent it to the PHP Official Internals Mailing List (see what I did there?)?
 
@salathe there's enough people from internals, on here, I just wanted to reply to people's messages from Saturday. I'll update my message again, respectively.
 
@PaulDragoonis sorry i realized my post wasn't "complete" enough, i had late thoughts and such, coulda waited ab it more before posting. Website is a good example, i think if someone were sort of "responsible" for it as in the project lead for it, then they could have a list of things to work on, or gather feedback from the community what to work on, and delegate that out. maybe they exist?
but if this was more structured, then contributors could seek out the people responsible for individual projects and ask them for input what they can work on
 
@PaulDragoonis Okay, then just say you posted it to "room 11" (with link) or skip that part entirely. At least one person (me) thinks you've discussed something with The PHP Project™ via the internals list.
 
2:32 PM
@salathe sure, no problem
 
@salathe Shhh don't tell them about our hideout here... then everyone will come. =P
 
@StatikStasis I welcome the reddit army, with open arms. :)
 
That's it... you've jinxed us good now.
 
If all of reddit joins here, maybe that will incentivize the insiders to move again to a better chat tool. :-)
 
cmb
irc? ;)
 
2:38 PM
So, re-evaluating, again, Maybe I won't post Room 11, and just say something like: "I've reached out to many of the internals team" .. or something? And not say Room 11
We don't want to flood this place, this is where we're productive.
 
@Crell Like Discord or something else?
 
Maybe, crazy idea, but maybe actually post it to internals?
 
@PaulDragoonis Are we?
 
^
We don't want to flood this place, this is where we don't have to be productive. FTFY
 
@pmmaga there's nothing to reply to, but there's msgs in here to reply to.
Discord is a good shout btw :P I'm finding it to be the lightweight balance between IRC and Slack .. slack being the big fat beast that OSS doesn't like
I've been thinking about this a lot recently, for PHP. Wider discussions needed ... FYI I'm part of the LinuxFoundation in some areas .. and in there we have SIG's (Special Interest Groups) - the Jenkins and CNCF projects do this really well, so I've been thinking about Website SIG and Docs SIG, for PHP..

I'm going to bring this up, on the mailing list, soon, I'll ping you once I've done it.
 
2:50 PM
I really hope this isn't going to be a flash in the pan idea, and that it doesn't actually harm contributing to the PHP Project's various parts… but, that's usually how this sort of thing turns out.
 
@StatikStasis Discord would work. Certainly better than this mess. I know Rust has a very robust Discord group.
Discord has all the same security/FREEDOM!!! concerns as Slack, though. (All data on someone else's server and who knows what they're doing with it.)
@PaulDragoonis The biggest problem is there's no consensus among Internals denizens about how much Internals should GAF about people who use PHP but aren't sending PRs.
Anything more structured or formal to get more people involved is going to fail as long as that isn't settled.
 
there is a divide between internals and the community, like there's a divide between german speaking people and english speaking people, of course ... but if there's anything sure to drive a wedge into that gap it's people going around implying that the internals community are fundamentally different to the community that uses PHP, as well as claiming that there needs to be some special effort to make us pay attention to what is happening in the community ...
if this discussion is going to do any damage, it's already done ... and I doubt any good (anything at all) will come from it, except you will have annoyed a few people ...
 
3:08 PM
imo you're making internals seem elitist, exclusive, like we need to be approached with force in order to listen to the views of people that don't write in C ... none of these things are true, they just aren't ... it's almost as easy to contribute to PHP as it could be and slowly we're making it even easier (you can do doc pr's on gh now) ... changing the arena for discussion, or tooling, or anything else isn't going to increase our contributor count, educating people
in the right ways to engage the project might ...
 
Most php-src contributors are there because they hit bugs/deficiencies in the language in their work and want to make it better. I have no idea why @Sara still contributes, though. Just can't give up her PHP crush, I guess? :)
But jokes aside, php-src contributors aren't really special: we just determined to learn the beast, at least enough to do what we want.
 
Blame pavlov
 
Obligatory footnote: Nikita is special though.
We're so lucky JetBrains decided to try this community experiment with him.
 
I have no knowledge of C or PHP internals and yet somehow my PRs got accepted
 
It's sad that Microsoft stopped funding Pierre here, and MySQL stopped with johannes, and so on.
I think it's only JetBrains that are sponsoring these days, unsure.
 
3:17 PM
Is anyone sponsoring Dmitry at the moment?
 
I think he's still at RogueWave
 
RogueWave was acquired by Perforce, right?
 
 
1 hour later…
4:23 PM
I thought one of the PHP mailing lists was getting spammed, but it was just @salathe doing on a notes killing streak :D
 
I'm a dirty spammer. :)
Figured spending half an hour doing that was the least I could do, given the user notes was the single biggest complaint from that twitter/reddit thread.
 
user1804599
@bwoebi What do you think of this? 3v4l.org/mvGZu
 
user1804599
You can define multiple scalar values for each case, and select one of them by giving the appropriate identifier when doing a conversion.
 
user1804599
And it is a pure library implementation using a trait. No special language features needed. Just uses reflection and attributes.
 
user1804599
Alternatively you could imagine an implementation that uses freestanding functions instead of a trait, but having a way to cache the attribute lookups would be nice (which can be done with private static member when using trait).
 
4:34 PM
Using attributes for such things feels a bit blurgh. I get the easy benefits but if we're not careful they'll become a meta-programming language in core
 
user1804599
I think attributes are right for this. They associate data with syntactically defined items.
 
user1804599
Though I agree runtime reflection is not nice as it makes static analysis more difficult.
 
I both really like and really dislike that at the same time.
 
4:50 PM
@salathe with the comment ban hammer! :exploding head:
Incidentally, when I delete a comment I still get a message that I can't send email to php-notes, despite being subscribed to it. I don't know who to bug about that.
 
5:01 PM
@Crell I have this issue too :(
 
@Crell the black hole that is the "systems" email group :P
 
So forward to systems@lists.php.net?
 
@Crell systems@php.net
 
Roger.
The message says to send to php-notes-owner@lists.php.net, so someone may want to update that. :-)
 
@rightfold we definitely then need enum SuitScalar { case db; case json; } :-)
 
5:16 PM
@Crell the -owner email is just ezmlm's weirdness
it might go somewhere, for all I know. :)
 
Ancient technology...
 
Has anyone ever looked at what it might take to make pass-by-value, copy-on-write structs/classes/object-likes from a VM perspective?
It's okay if it's php-src/extension only.
 
I know about responsible design and how to make the page responsive depending on different screens sizes, but should you also make it so it adjusts when people zoom in and out?
 
Basically the number of prereqs on my dream of generic vec and dict with copy-on-write behavior with array literal construction like vec[1, 3, 5, 7, 9] is too high; seeing if I can work some other proposals in there first...
 
cmb
@LeviMorrison ZendEngine 2? :P
 
5:23 PM
Sadly, this is one thing we got wrong, I'm afraid. The real problem was references, not the object model...
(Well, there may have been other problems with the object model; I'm just saying the pass-by-value, copy-on-write was probably a better choice that wasn't obvious because we had problems with references and such)
 
@Tiffany I would not be bothered. :)
 
Various grapheme functions throw new and bogus exceptions ・ intl ・ #80129
 
@LeviMorrison An equivalent to with-er methods would be the main syntactic challenge.
 
There isn't anything to do: you just modify it.
The engine makes the copy for you if needed; caller remains unchanged.
 
$myvar->foo = 'bar'; // The copy does what?
 
if $myvar's refcount is 1 it just assigns as normal. If it's > 1, then it copies it (refcount is now 1), and then assigns as normal.
Just imagine the properties are an array hashtable.
 
Copies to...?
 
user1804599
5:50 PM
@bwoebi Not sure what you mean.
 
@rightfold I mean, #[Scalar(SuitScala::db, 'h'), Scalar(SuitScalar::json, 'hearts')]
i.e. having the enum as key
 
user1804599
Seems obnoxious.
 
@Crell The local $myvar?
 
Then it's not a RO variable.
 
It's not read-only, it's copy-on-write, pass-by-value.
 
5:56 PM
ah.
 
6:11 PM
Enums are coming to PHP? :D
 
user1804599
6:28 PM
Nobody knows.
 
Enum EnumsInPHP {
Yes = 1;
No = -1;
Maybe = 0;
}
 
user1804599
enum Int { case Zero; case One; case Two; case Three; … }
 
user1804599
If you wanna be concise you can use Roman numerals instead.
 
@rightfold Well… can we just go straight ahead to haskell typeclasses then?
 
user1804599
Type classes aren’t practical with dynamic typing.
 
6:32 PM
:-)
 
user1804599
You can explicitly pass dictionaries around though.
 
user1804599
/** @template T */
interface Semigroup
{
    /**
     * @param T $a
     * @param T $b
     * @return T
     */
    function append($a, $b);
}
 
@2dsharp There are people working on it. That is as much as anyone can guarantee right now. :-)
 
user1804599
Nevermind it’s fine.
 
:-)
 
user1804599
6:45 PM
This is what D and Go and Rust do too.
 
user1804599
Same operator for field access through pointer and not through pointer.
 
Wrong result of pathinfo function with PATHINFO_FILENAME parameter ・ *Directory/Filesystem functions ・ #80130
 
When I got involved I was using PHP day in and day out. There are still webapps in use at UC Berkeley FIFTEEN YEARS AFTER I LEFT running along happily on PHP.... I want to say 5.0? Maybe 4.4? Surely not 4.3...

As to why I keep coming back: It's all about the groupies.
 
/me hides the sharpies.
 
 
1 hour later…
8:07 PM
@Crell /me watches where you hide them, waits til you've gone and draw a penis on everything in site
 
I've just counted that ~44 RFCs passed for PHP 8.0, which is a record number since PHP 7.0 (~47). And there were at least 15 failing RFCs too :D I think it explains the crazy rush we had during Spring
 
Hmph.
 
the run up to 7.0 was the same
 
damn major versions
 
I'm doing a writeup of all of the ones worth mentioning right now. It's a 10 part blog series spanning probably 50 pages by the time I'm done.
And I'm not even covering every RFC, and many are getting folded into mulit-RFC articles. It's bonkers.
 
8:21 PM
@MateKocsis Half of those failing ones were probably mine :P
 
9:09 PM
wiki.php.net/rfc/engine_warnings - So did the undefined array index severity pass here? It looks like everything else did, but that was exactly 66%.
 
user1804599
The undefined array index severity was raised according to the PHP 8 release notes.
 
Cool.
 
cmb
@Crell nope, that was 2:1, which is sufficient as super majority
 
... Nope? Don't you mean yep, given the rest of your sentence?
 
user1804599
9:12 PM
Can’t wait to upgrade our legacy shit from PHP 7 to PHP 8 and inevitably raise error reporting from warning to error because of this.
 
user1804599
SNAFU, so this is the only option.
 
cmb
@Crell I was referring to "exactly 66%" :)
 
user1804599
Or maybe implement log filtering. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
 
10:11 PM
@Crell I feel like the notice level is becoming meaningless when about everything is a warning
 
Is that a bad thing?
 
user1804599
The error levels are already arbitrary.
 
user1804599
Ah yes, let’s log everything starting at warning. Why that particular set of bugs? Why not that set of bugs, except this one other bug, but also these two other bugs?
 
Yes, but they were doing a distinction between "probably unwanted" and "most likely unwanted"
 
user1804599
IMO all these things should just throw exceptions, which is why I set up set_error_handler(function(…) { throw ErrorException(…); }); with no consideration for severity. If people want something else then they can vote for the RFCs. :)
 
10:15 PM
I'm the same, set_error_handler has saved me so many times
I just wish it could be per-file scoped (without having to do stack matching in the function)
 
user1804599
That would be nice if you use a lot of libraries.
 
What really bugged me is we were a handful of votes away from fixing what is probably one of the biggest source of screwups in PHP - undefined vars
 
@rightfold In 8.0 you can just do set_error_handler(fn(...) => throw new ErrorException(...)); :-)
 
user1804599
Sick!
 
user1804599
Saves me four lines in the file I’ll never touch again.
 
10:25 PM
unfortunately a proper implementation takes more than 1 line to deal with libraries so function callback it is :D
 
user1804599
I’m gonna sleep. Brb.
 
10:42 PM
hm fsockopen connect timeout is designated as float, but defined as "seconds", can you even give 0.1 or soethimg?
 
            struct timeval {
                         time_t          tv_sec;
                         suseconds_t     tv_usec;
                 };

           The tv_sec member represents the elapsed time, in whole seconds.  The tv_usec member
           captures rest of the elapsed time, represented as the number of microseconds.
 
@Danack yeah after failing to find examples i started digging in the code just now
 
sup
 
Evening Derick
 
10:58 PM
@Danack thanks, works :)
 
meduza.io/en/feature/2020/09/22/… - Russia's planning to prevent using TLS to hide which domain name is being accessed.....which might cut off access to AWS, Google and Digital Ocean.
 
So 50% less hackzors in the logs \o/
 
I wish I could say we're better but the UK ISP industry is throwing a hissy fit about DNS over HTTPS/TLS because they wont be able to filter as effectively
Not to mention the constant search for a physically impossible backdoor that only they ever have access to
 
Random Segmentation Fault running php cli ・ Unknown/Other Function ・ #80131
 
11:25 PM
is this still maintained? phpsec.org
 
@Tiffany You're back! How was it?
 
@MarkR fun filled :D
(my work computer is like a meter from my primary desktop)
huh, and I'm tired, and it's not even 7PM/19:00 yet
 

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