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12:05 AM
my ip is 127.0.0.1
 
@Danack h4x0r
 
Try and do DOS attack on me I dare you.
 
lol
 
<Mark R has lost connection to the chat>
 
12:20 AM
/me sends 20 gbit of data to 127.0.0.1 - that'll teach you
 
@Danack meh, skiddies know that this is localhost … perhaps propose them 127.67.250.5 instead
 
that's where my website runs at!
 
I don't get why IPv6 has only a single /128 address assigned to mean local host and IPv4 a whole /8
 
12:52 AM
@Sara Thanks for going through it with me :)
 
1:22 AM
@bwoebi okay, I'll bite, what is it?
 
1:37 AM
@NikiC @Sara Okay, I have convinced myself that the parent:: scope behavior I was mentioning earlier is a bug in PHP. Here's the code that makes me think that: 3v4l.org/gtRNW.
 
1:50 AM
Same issue with different outcome: 3v4l.org/E98TK. Some times multiple examples help me think about the result.
 
2:19 AM
@Tiffany the loopback device listens on 127.0.0.0/8 - any address starting with 127. is local host
just most people don't know that :-)
 
2:35 AM
I recently installed a unify network controller / firewall / switch for some VLAN network segregation. I use a /16 now and I constantly forget where I put my servers.
 
2:48 AM
I need to write notes on what the numbers after / mean. I've been told at least twice and I keep forgetting.
 
The number after / is how many bits are used belong to the wider network, an ipv4 address is 32 bits wide so /24 means that 24 bits represent the wider network, and 8 bits (32 - 24) represent the local subnet.
/24 means you get 256 ip addresses, /16 is roughly 65000 etc
 
I need to make a gist with this
Because I will forget again
 
think of it like slicing part off
 
How annoying, I can't paste into a gist from mobile
@MarkR I'll forget what it's slicing from... even with an IP in front.
My memory is weird and fickle. I can remember random obscure things like 3.1415926535897932, but forget what someone told me two minutes ago.
I used to know more numbers of π
 
 
3 hours later…
6:16 AM
"fcgi_request" makes building failed on freeBSD ・ Compile Failure ・ #79967
 
6:49 AM
morning
 
7:01 AM
mornings
 
7:45 AM
@LeviMorrison See the RFC I linked previously :)
 
Bore da
 
8:04 AM
@bwoebi only on linux
 
8:15 AM
morning
 
8:26 AM
morning
yet another day of bikeshedding on attributes syntax :/
was there any other case of RFC with so hot discussion around in the past? the namespace delimiter or introduction?
I wasn't there at ML at that time
 
8:41 AM
P++, <? removal, scalar type hints
 
oh right
got a short memory :P
 
scalar type hints was a lot of fun.
 
Which try? There were at least 4
 
8:57 AM
I think the only good-faith thing to do right now is drop attributes from 8.0, and allow a chunk of time (i.e. at some point before 8.1) for a consensus to be arrived at. I have no confidence that a decision from the currently running RFC is actually what the project really wants.
4
 
cmb
^ +1
 
9:15 AM
Does it make sense to propose conditional if-expression (not ternary but the one like in Python):
$bar = true;
$foo = 'bar' if $bar; // otherwise null
$foo = 'bar' if $bar else 'baz';
 
morns
 
 
1 hour later…
10:45 AM
hey can anybody tell me how to implement the multi authentication system in lumen laravel ?
 
@brzuchal No. This was proposed a few months back and faced a lot of criticism. We can already express this using the ternary operator, introducing an alternative way to write it just increases cognitive load.
 
11:07 AM
DOMText::before() crashes ・ DOM XML related ・ #79968
 
@beberlei I ran into bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=79968 doing some testing. I assume that should be throwing, but I don't know what it should be throwing ^^
 
@NikiC hm that looks weird, it should work because DOMText is a DOMCharacteRData which has before()
 
@beberlei It does "work", just crashes :)
Same also happens with DomComment
So DomCharacterData subclasses
 
not sure crashes fits my definition of "work" :p
i will look into it
 
@beberlei TIL lots of my code works :P
 
11:16 AM
@beberlei @IluTov Well, if it crashes, then no incorrect result will ever be observed. Ergo, it works.
 
cmb
@NikiC TypeError if any arguments isn't DOMNode or string?
 
@cmb Ah, the null there is just a placeholder, that's not where the problem is
 
11:34 AM
it should throw an error because its not attached to a dom
browser dom implementation happily accepts before on an unattached node, but seems to immediately drop it
i.e .previousSibling is NULL
 
11:55 AM
@IluTov Ok
 
12:35 PM
Wrong error message in strict mode ・ Reflection related ・ #79969
Null coalescing operator needs to have a higher precedence value ・ *Programming Data Structures ・ #79970
 
1:16 PM
Implement JsonSerializable interface in stdClass ・ Class/Object related ・ #79972
 
@Jeeves TBH, the ?? precedence also annoys the fuck out of me
I rarely have compound expressions on the RHS of ??
($array["key"] ?? "") == ""
 
1:43 PM
I wish there was an API to get the data from this section of PHP info:
    php_info_print_table_row(2, "Configuration File (php.ini) Path", PHP_CONFIG_FILE_PATH);
    php_info_print_table_row(2, "Loaded Configuration File", php_ini_opened_path ? php_ini_opened_path : "(none)");
    php_info_print_table_row(2, "Scan this dir for additional .ini files", php_ini_scanned_path ? php_ini_scanned_path : "(none)");
    php_info_print_table_row(2, "Additional .ini files parsed", php_ini_scanned_files ? php_ini_scanned_files : "(none)");
hmm, looks like I can just extern them
 
I was thinking recently on API to get all from the phpinfo actually
I was thinking of it when investigating environment variables to be read for INI directive modifications
 
morning o/
 
Segfault in php-fpm ・ FPM related ・ #79973
 
cmb
2:00 PM
@Jeeves frame #7 looks interesting
 
@cmb does it?
 
cmb
just guessing, but seems to be a float storing a monetary value
 
@NikiC That RFC is not particularly detailed or well written...
Even still, I think it's wrong. parent:: and A:: should have no differences. This late static bind crap is just that, a bunch of crap.
People don't use parent:: because of static binding; they use it to simply forward along to previous scopes, which should use the scope they forwarded to. I understand it's unlikely to change, though.
I still think after all these years that late static binding is a mis-feature...
Any time I see a code base that uses it I just want to NOPE out of there.
 
2:25 PM
/rant
On the bright side, Sammy has made excellent progress on the observer API for PHP 8.
 
3:05 PM
E_NOT_ENOUGH_SLEEP
 
same
 
@NikiC Yeah, I saw that! How embarrassing :S :)
Oh, the arginfo_zpp_mismatch test segfaults again :/
 
3:23 PM
Can anyone help me with google contact API for adding custom fields in contacts
 
@MateKocsis yeah ... just fixed another set of segfault (in DatePeriod), but there's still more
 
3:50 PM
Inspired by a conversation with @bwoebi a few days ago, any thoughts on deprecating arbitrary expressions in "${}" and use them for arbitrary string interpolation at some point? I'm concerned the syntax would be confusing, ${} currently behaves the same inside and outside of strings (variable lookup by name). On the other hand, I can't think of any new syntax that wouldn't cause major breaking changes (e.g. \{}, \(), $(), etc) as they are often used in regular expressions or jQuery.
 
@salathe hear hear
 
@salathe That would be a shame. All syntax options are fine, people are exaggerating about how bad the other options are to make their points stronger. Syntax will always be a controversial topic, I don't think time can solve this conflict.
 
4:07 PM
There was already a vote between <<>>, #[], and @@. Some people didn't like the outcome, and so the same options were hastily put to vote again with less info about the BC breaks and other factors considered in the last RFC. This is abusing the process, and sets a bad precedent for future contentious RFCs.
 
So what did you guys decide are we sticking to @@ or not?
 
Considering the way the vote is looking right now, it's really rather obvious that @@ has lost at least 80% of its support.
Well, maybe a bit less, but from 33 putting it as their first preference, to 10, and 68% of people putting it as their last choice
 
This is likely because the new RFC doesn't present all the pros and cons that were considered in the Shorter Attribute Syntax RFC.
It's basically just an incomplete table and a few visual examples. No details about the backward incompatible changes, no discussion section, no comparison with other languages, etc.
 
hello
 
The whole thing has been a shit-show. From the overlapping votes, to the missing details about @@ namespacing, to what feels like 6 different RFCs
The only thing that's going to come out of this with some sense of dignity will be @beberlei for the original RFC
 
4:23 PM
Yeah. I wish I had known about the namespace issue earlier so it could have been mentioned in the Shorter Attribute Syntax RFC. But it's a moot point now.
 
Any one have idea how to read raw xml data from postman to php
 
Theodore is getting desperate just to keep the @@ syntax
:p
 
That is clearly apparent
Although I suspect whatever arguments are made over rfc policy etc, that battle has already been lost
 
Nah, I'm just really unhappy with how the process is being abused with a low-effort, biased RFC after all the work I put into the last one.
 
I mean, I see no point in resetting the vote since @@ is still going to lose based on current votes
So it's just delaying the voting for no reason
 
4:27 PM
I think @@ would do better if all the pros and cons were fairly presented.
 
Personal opinion here but I really don't think that anyone cares about pros such as 1 less character or "20 lines of additional code in php-src"
 
@moliata Some people care about a smaller BC break.
 
Aye, it's all about the futureproofing.
I'm sure some people just don't like the visual looks, but that's a side argument at best
 
@TheodoreBrown the size of BC breaks with i. e. #[ is so negligible that I also don't think that anyone cares
 
I wonder why temporarily making things a tiny bit easier for a handful of library authors is suddenly so important?
 
4:32 PM
90% of BC breaks are from old metasploiy
Metasploit* PHP exploits
Which aren't even designed for newer PHP versions
So if we don't count those, the number of BC breaks is very small
 
that, and it's the first in the 8.0 major so BC breaks are to be expected, even serious ones (which these aren't)
 
@moliata #[] breaks useful syntax that is sometimes used to comment out an array or write checkboxes. Also, it will be hard to blog about since existing syntax highlighters display it as a comment.
 
@TheodoreBrown @@ is shown as double suppression by existing syntax highlighters as well.
In both cases, they will need to be updated
 
Saying it's used to comment out an array is a non-starter IMO, at least in my experience # is the least used of all comment types, and is like-for-like replaceable with //
 
OK, there's a helpful error message now: Fatal error: mhash(): could not obtain parameters for parsing in Unknown on line 0
I've already tried to make this ZPP sane a while ago... But I couldn't :(
 
4:37 PM
@moliata But the highlighting of attribute names/arguments still works there, while it does not for #[]
 
IDE's will be quickly updated, just as they're updated for other syntax.
 
Yes but who cares about the old syntax highlighters anyways? They won't highlight match as keyword as well
That's the whole point of updating
 
It will make it harder for people to write blog posts about attributes that aren't really confusing. Obviously it's a non-issue for IDEs.
 
if no-one needs to update their IDEs, Jetbrains will have no money then there will be no-one to pay Nikita then we're all screwed :P
Cmon Theodore, a person's blog is in no way a consideration when designing a language. What next, banning the use of < because it has to be escaped in HTML?
 
@TheodoreBrown it's going to be hard to write about ?-> and match as well, I suppose?
Also what Mark said ^
 
4:41 PM
@moliata Existing highlighters should display those syntaxes just fine, even if the match keyword isn't highlighted.
 
But again... who cares if people use outdated syntax rendering on their blogs? In what world does that have any relevance to the technical merits of a language design
 
And it would also display #[] just fine. Just because you don't get beautiful colors on #[...] syntax on blogs with outdated syntax highlighters, doesn't mean we should stop adoption
Of another syntax style
 
Also the downsides of grouping aren't being considered. It makes attribute grepping harder and leads to unnecessary diff noise when switching between 1 attribute and multiple attributes.
 
Let's remove grouped class constants and properties as well?
 
Fortunately practically every IDE out there (as well as parsers) comes with full token scanning, making grep mostly irrelevant.
 
4:44 PM
I'm sorry Theodore but at this point it's just arguing for nothing. It's like asking for a 0.01$ discount
 
@TheodoreBrown attributes cannot be grepped either way, because with namespace imports there are multiple ways to write the same attribute
 
@moliata Too late to remove, though I believe some coding style guides do ban them.
 
@@Assert\Email or @@Symfony\Component\Validator\Constraints\Email
 
@TheodoreBrown I am still astounded as to how your "mulligan" RFC passed. It made claims about the capabilities of Attributes that had since been changed by a subsequent RFC, it made highly subjective claims about confusion with generics or bit shifting, and in the "comparison", but the most egregious failing IMO is that you're essentially claiming in argument #1, typing that two characters is a burden.
 
Fun fact, grouped class constants were added as part of the
Attributes v2 RFC (I think)
 
4:45 PM
@moliata grouped was added in Attribute Amendments
 
I need a clarification on that though
 
This entire attributes RFC process has been a shit show from the moment you ignored the amendments made to the passed RFC, and just said "fuck this I want my fucking at symbol".
 
Well yeah, so just PHP 8 is going to support grouped class constants
so no, It's not too late to remove
It's just that it's pointless and stupid to remove such a simple and actually fairly useful feature.
 
@moliata What do you mean by grouped class constants?
 
when you can declare multiple constants by using a single const keyword
 
4:47 PM
@NikiC I'd be inclined to add this function to the deprecations. It seems very crazy how it behaves.
 
The same way you can declare multiple attributes
with #[Attr1, Attr2]
 
@moliata This works fine in PHP 7.x. 3v4l.org/ZJV8l
 
Not with class constants
 
@moliata Huh? Can you show an example of what you mean?
The attributes RFC didn't change anything about class constants, as I recall.
 
It didn't mention because it doesn't need to
Just wrap your code between
class Name {}
You will get an error in PHP 7.x but not PHP 8
 
4:51 PM
@moliata There's no error: 3v4l.org/ZJV8l
 
Hmm, I'll take a look at that myself since I'm damn sure there was no support for grouped class constants.
 
@Stephen "It made claims about the capabilities of Attributes that had since been changed by a subsequent RFC" What claims do you mean?
 
cmb
@MateKocsis as for me, we can deprecate the whole mhash extension (if that's what you're talking about)
 
Yeah, even through git blame it shows that ZEND_AST_CLASS_CONST_GROUP was added as part of the attributes PR
Hmm, confusing
 
@cmb Yes. I've just commented on Nikita's PR where it came up. github.com/php/php-src/pull/5881#issuecomment-673593257
That said, I'll add a stub for this in the PHP 8.1 deprecations
 
cmb
5:02 PM
@MateKocsis ah, thanks! mhash is actually emulated by the hash functions as of PHP 5.3. It only has been removed as free standing extension with PHP 7.
 
@cmb yep :) I learned it a few minutes ago, after I saw #ifdef PHP_MHASH_BC in the code. :)
Ahh, no, I see what you mean. So emulation was introduced in 5.3 instead of 7.0. Thank you for the info :)
 
5:31 PM
@Girgias @Girgias @IluTov Confirmed that property access is slow. Additionally, it seems that ** is also a bit slow. gist.github.com/sj-i/d0cbc6c0baa414ffcd00be6840a9166f
What I've learned today: replying to someone on the chat automatically adds necessary mentioning, so there is no need to add one manually
 
@sj-i @sj-i :)
 
@salathe :-(
 
6:01 PM
@sj-i oh woah your profiler looks amazing, what a feat doing this in PHP, really cool
 
6:14 PM
@beberlei thanks! I don't know whether there is a real use-case for it, but at least it's fun for me to do some lower-level programming in PHP :)
 
@sj-i there is value in projects that are pure research!
 
6:36 PM
Maybe each project has its own needs for profiling. So if this tool grows to a framework to craft a profiler on each project, the fact that it is written in PHP may be a good thing, because the target is written in PHP and who optimize it would be a PHP programmer. In many cases, they will be satisfied by tideways though :)
 
@MateKocsis You mean mhash?
I thought we already deprecated those for PHP 8
 
@NikiC Yes, I was replying to an earlier message of mine which was a rely to you :)
 
For the first time in 1½ years, I've no podcast episode queued up, or planned. I do still want to talk about the match operator though.
 
@NikiC Unfortunately, mhash*() functions haven't been deprecated yet :/ But I've added them to the PHP 8.1 deprecations (with an incomplete description)
 
7:02 PM
@sj-i Huh, that's a neat thing you made :D That could explain why it's written using a bunch of arrays, wonder if that's something that can be optimized but that's out of of my grasp currently
 
7:52 PM
OH
MY
GOD
 
@Girgias I've updated the warning promotion task with a few "None present" and "No promotable warning" notes
 
Interview in an hour and I haven't eaten lunch. Oops.
 
8:27 PM
@Sara Shouldn't the vote at least wait until the RFC has been under discussion for 2 weeks, and the RFC updated to include examples of the breaking changes? Voting started with the RFC in a very incomplete state, and voters aren't being presented a full picture of the discussion arguments and syntax ramifications.
 
Hey, @NikiC! Good evening! Do you have an idea, why endTokenPos for node can be wrong starting from php-parser 4.7.0?
 
@Tiffany Best of luck :)
 
@salathe thanks
 
I want the best syntax outcome to be reached as much as anyone else, but it doesn't seem like a rushed, incomplete RFC is in a good position to achieve this. @beberlei @Derick
 
8:42 PM
Yes. It should. But it didn't. Are we going to cry about it? Or are we going to put on our big girl pants and move the fuck on?

**Checks lists....

Evidently we're going to cry about it.
Note that moving the fuck on CAN mean stopping the vote for a week. It can even mean not voting. But mailto:internals@lists.php.net?subject=whhhhhaaaaaaaaaa doesn't make any of those things happen.
So let's put out some suggestions for how to move the fuck on.
 
... has there not been enough attributes discussion?
 
Everything else is just noise, and if I wanted to hear crying, I'd go visit my four day old niece.
 
@LeviMorrison this
 
@LeviMorrison depends whom you ask, it would seem.
 
@Sara \o/ congrats on your new niece
 
8:46 PM
@Tiffany Her mom did most of the work.
 
Indeed x_x, reasons I do not want to have kids
My niece is 12 or 13, I forget exactly, and she's pretty awesome
 
when we talk about BC breakability of the three proposed syntaxes, we could have give an example of each one in the Table, but I am unconvinced this would change anything in the outcome. Every voter has either voted blindly without thought or has seen the table, seen each syntax breaks BC and come up with an example in their head how they do.
 
Yep.
Which is why I'm past caring if any further RFCs pass.
 
Based on the discussion on list some people were pretty confused about what exactly would break.
 
@MateKocsis Thanks I was doing that late in the night cause I couldn't sleep initially
 
8:52 PM
It's very nice from you that you compiled that long list! I supposed that you just didn't have time to go through and check all the items. :)
There are quite a few extensions where there are not much left. But still, there's gazillion of work left :/
 
I'm not inherently opposed to another syntax being accepted, but I don't think it's good for the project to arbitrarily rush through an RFC to re-vote on the same syntax that leaves out BC break details as well as most of the arguments that came up during discussion.
 
what arguments are being left out?
 
9:08 PM
@beberlei E.g. Tyson's examples of how the same code can be executed in confusingly different ways on PHP 7 and 8 with the #[] syntax (for example, causing a parameter to be removed on PHP 7).
 
@Girgias @MateKocsis By the way, I'm on vacation next week. Any PRs that I need to urgently review tomorrow? ^^
@lisachenko It's probably related to the switch to using PHP 8 T_NAME_* tokens internally, but I don't know what specifically about that would break things
 
@TheodoreBrown "Changes lexing of remaining tokens" is about that, he proposed that early in the discussion and we included that.
 
There are no examples to make it clear, though.
Another thing left out is the easier grepability of @@ which was a factor for some people preferring it in the last RFC.
 
you need a convention to be able to grep for @@ attributes as well, because you can rename attributes through use statements @@Foo can be any Foo, or any use Bar as Foo;
 
I generally treat all the greppability arguments as ignorable
 
9:13 PM
Also omitted is the downside of the grouped syntax where it causes unnecessary diff noise when moving between single/multiple attributes on separate lines.
 
Yeah, grouped seems like an unnecessary complication
 
but the grouped syntax was accepted by 76% of voters in a different RFC
 
It was,
I'm not annoyed by it,.
Hell I might've even voted for it.
 
Specifically for <<>> because that's rather verbose otherwise.
 
"verbose" :eyeroll:
 
9:15 PM
I'm just going to add "no grouped attributes" to our coding standards. Next. :P
 
You kids. In my day we typed 100 characters up link in the line noise both ways, just to say "hello world"
AND WE COMPILED IT
 
can people click the 'reopen' button on here please, so I can answer it.
 
Even the simple distinction that #[] and @[] break useful syntax while @@ does not is left out of the RFC.
 
Relative definitions of useful.
"Valid and functional" would be more accurate.
 
I feel like the only person who has really made useful arguments in this whole discussion is Tyson :)
 
9:19 PM
They're ALL trivial to fix if old code uses them though.
 
@Sara Okay, let's go with that. :)
 
Trivial in the "a 6 line shell script could fix them" kind of way.
 
And of course, not all these arguments are important to everyone, but for some people they are factors worthy of consideration.
 
Hell. One line.
`find . -name '*.php' | xargs -L 1 -- sed -e 's/@@/@ @/g' -i`
 
plus they all appear at compile time, so are not likely to cause sutble bugs
 
9:22 PM
A bit more than that 'cause string literals, but basically that.
 
@NikiC yet he has voted for @[] and not for <<>> :P
 
The argument about #[ causing surprising and subtle bugs swayed me a bit
 
@NikiC You may be right. I don't think anyone has even engaged with Tyson's points yet.
 
@NikiC I just remembered the iconv/mbstring INI setting thing, but that seems to have sailed again for this release cycle. And I would need to do some work on it again from your last comment. But I'm kinda in vacation mode as well so have fun. :D
 
I'm mostly just sore than nobody has laughed at ANY of my jokes on list.
 
9:23 PM
I wish I'd pushed forward with my declare(target_version=xxx) .. would have made this entire thing a non-issue by making attributes opt-in
 
use PHP2020;
 
Attributes only available in P++ :D
 
@TheodoreBrown i have interacted with his points plenty, and my (and his) reasoning for voting for @[] in favor of a more crass BC break to avoid the subtle problems with #[]
 
@Sara use edition 8.0;
 
<?p++

@@ConstantFolding
function md5(string $in): string {..math math math..}
 
9:27 PM
@beberlei Okay. I may have missed your responses in all the emails. This is another reason the RFC needs a discussion section to summarize these considerations.
 
Honestly, must as I appreciate the fact PHP uses classic, open tooling, sometimes I miss the proper threading and message annotation we'd get from a forum site of some kind.
 
9:40 PM
It would go a long way to increasing confidence in the outcome if voting is deferred until the 2 week discussion period is complete, and the RFC is updated to cover these different arguments with examples (esp. Tyson's examples and an example of the extra diff noise caused by adding/removing a second grouped attribute on its own line). Also there should be examples of the BC breaks. After that if voters still determine the syntax should be changed, so be it.
 
Probably wouldn't make much difference at this point, almost 60 people have voted, would you just scrap all their votes and tell them to vote for probably the 10th time?
The most reasonable option would be to extend the voting period, if you can change people's minds, they can change their votes.
 
I think it will make a big difference, if not in the final outcome, then in the confidence it is the right one.
 
I suspect you'd have a hard time pitching that when you voted against the the primary vote, which itself was accepting that we needed more confidence in our decision.
 
Why? I'll vote Yes in the primary poll if the RFC fairly presents all the arguments.
 
If you presented your arguments in the form of a wiki page, keeping it strictly to language-level technical considerations, you'd probably find Derick responsive to copy-pasting it into the RFC.

But do keep in mind that grepping and outdated blog formatting not working isn't a language level technical consideration.
 
10:06 PM
@Sara Conversely forum sites lead people to writing shorter, less elaborate replies, as mails are much more formal in peoples minds, effectively causing longer discussions due to people needing multiple posts to make a point, which, in the end, while providing a nicer interface, doesn't it make any easier to grasp the gist of what's being said.
 
@MarkR If the vote is deferred I can try to write some examples of the technical considerations. Otherwise it wouldn't do any good to add them to the RFC now after most people have already voted. @Derick
 
@Sara I do though agree that, if the current quality of the mails were to be translated 1:1 to a forum, then I'd definitely prefer the forum.
 
@NikiC Oh, have fun! It's well deserved :) There's not any urgent PR from my side. :D
 
@Sara no punch cards? :D
 
How was your interview? :D
 
10:20 PM
Larryspupt ・ *General Issues ・ #79974
 
used up the full hour, I think that's a good sign :D
 
Great
 
they'red looking forward to JIT >.>
 
Red flag!
 
who knows, maybe their product will get a performance boost from it
 
10:22 PM
So far it's taken me 12+ hours to work out how to add 4 numbers together, I think I need to quit
 
$a + $b + $c + $d? .... but I'm guessing there's more than that involved...
 
DateTime::createFromFormat returns static type ・ *General Issues ・ #79975
 
Positioning non-overlapping thumbnails on a timeline based on a nested offset. Should be easy, but it's wrecking my brain.
 
10:40 PM
@MarkR this is not simple :-)
 
cmb
11:07 PM
@Girgias, thanks for maintaining the resource2object task! Nitpick: fileinfo resource to object conversion is not about opaque objects – perhaps put "opaque" in the title in parens?
 
@cmb GitHub always displays the name of the issue creator whoever edits the description ^^
 
cmb
I don't want to edit the title without George's consent. :)
 
I mean, there's the "Girgias mentioned this pull request" notification in each of the linked PRs even though for example this time I linked it to the issue :D
It's similar to the other ad about the "new" features of PHP 5.6
 
cmb
Ah! Then thanks to you for co-maintaining that task! :)
And yes, probably most production code will never be compatible with PHP 7, let alone PHP 8. :'(
 
11:23 PM
Eh, depends really. PHP probably still has 20 years of mainstream life left in it
Depending on AI
 

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