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12:15 AM
Hi, I have a C++ question but I don't know if it's best for SO or for code review SE
I'm basically asking why some very simple features I expected to find in the ranges library aren't in the standard, and if that was a deliberate choice from the committee or if my understanding was wrong somewhere.
Worrying that this might be subjective and not factual.
Would this kind of question be best on SO or elsewhere?
 
12:37 AM
 
1:09 AM
@JerryCoffin wsj.com/articles/…
 
 
8 hours later…
9:38 AM
@jrsala better ask on Reddit r/cpp and enjoy the flamewar
also ranges features are incredibly complicated to specify in a manner that makes them maximally useful and hard to misuse
every single range or view takes a lot of time to review, so they just shipped whatever seemed ready for C++20
with more to come
and enough blog posts and proposals have already been written about how the ranges features that shipped in C++20 are subtly broken, hard to use, underpowered, etc.
 
 
4 hours later…
1:23 PM
So ranges are basically an expert feature.
 
1:52 PM
@StackedCrooked wut?
@Morwenn because people wanted a functional language... and didn't get that
 
@StackedCrooked depends on which features, but ranges chaining with operator| seems particularly tricky in its current form
 
@Morwenn which is pretty much my guess of what was the issue
 
yeah, but it's the feature that most people felt exciting
That article gives an idea of the kind of issues you quickly encounter: brevzin.github.io/c++/2020/07/06/split-view
 
@Morwenn Yeah this makes sense, honestly it strikes me that types that support ranges should be able to do a using view = <view type constructable from range>
but w/e
 
2:41 PM
I don't get it
 
in a map you dont have to compare @Mgetz — ΦXocę 웃 Пepeúpa ツ 2 mins ago
wut
the map is doing compares
@Morwenn don't worry about it, just my crazy headcannon of a way to get things that are visiting things in a split range to use views
 
 
3 hours later…
5:30 PM
@Morwenn Calling them "people" is a disservice to our species, most people just wanted to std::sort(my_vector)
 
yeah but there's already cpp-sort for that
 
BTW the article you linked to is very good
If I remember correctly, there is something like boost split for a python like way of tokenizing the string
 
Barry is love ok <3
 
Recently did a lot of string tokenization, and to KISS I've been increasingly jumping to c-style string manipulation for tokenization tasks, just find the delimiters and fscanf the ranges. No memory copied :-)
Not sure if it will pass code review though
 
I just use Python tbh
 
5:37 PM
can't hear you over the sound of my performance
 
can't hear you over the sound of actually getting something in prod 8)
C++ is very as a base layer to implement interpreters and VMs for other more usable languages amirite
 
Sometimes the useability is directly linked to library availability, or the availability of a REPL
But in general, sure.
although large python code bases are often fucked due to static analysis issues
company I work at apparently, unironically conducts interviews in TCL
 
6:11 PM
> although large [...] code bases are often fucked due to [...] issues
 
I'm sorry, I'm going through bikeshed withdrawal, I'm overflowing with opinions about function signatures but I don't really work with my coworkers
 
I thought you'd want your bike protected
 
6:39 PM
Also, shedding bikes is very unhealthy.
Heh, reminds me of Spirited Away.
 
Pretty sure if you have few extra bikes, loosing them is the right way to go
 
Yeah, but not through your skin :)
 
7:00 PM
Technically, formally, speaking, its important for you to understand, that its still through your skin, even if the bicycle is removed from an orifice - as the bike was initially circumscribed by your skin, and upon removal is no longer inside the skin (hence through the skin).
 
7:14 PM
Well, I'm happy to get rid of he bike.
It was really bad for my skin.
 
Technically, you didn't really get rid of the bike, only moved it to another location
 
7:47 PM
@Morwenn thanks, glad to know there's more to come
 
@StackedCrooked Road rash can be quite painful.
 
I had to look that up.
My dad used to tell me horror stories about motorcyclists falling from their bike and sliding on the road until their flesh was gone.
I mean in the spot they were sliding on. I don't mean all of their flesh...
 
@StackedCrooked to quote an emergency room doctor "We have a term for motorcyclists: Organ donors"
 
I mean, if they sanded their organs away while sliding on the road, then probably they're dead.
Oh wait.
Organ donors
Yeah, they're really good at that.
Here in Belgium everyone is an organ donor unless they opt out.
So we have plenty of organs from those.
 
8:41 PM
@StackedCrooked I think in this case, the operative point is the move from "willing to donate organs if I should die" to "you start harvesting the organs, we'll start looking through the lists to see who receives them."
@StackedCrooked Even with lots of people signed up to be donors, there are rarely enough organs. Most people die of old age, in which case their organs are rarely good candidates for transplanting. Desirable transplants mostly come from people who were young and healthy right up until they died, which largely means people who died in accidents.
 
But no mention was made of a more fundamental reason why Belgian surgeons have a more plentiful supply of organs available than do British surgeons: Belgian drivers kill more than twice as many people, per unit population, as do British ones.
 
user7659542
9:10 PM
@Mikhail Curious about the numbers in ex-USSR countries
 
user7659542
Buying driving licenses there is common practice
 
user7659542
source: I have done it
 
user7659542
I ended up taking more lessons in my home country and retaking the exams. But it is common practice
 
Bribes are almost a required surcharge, but why did you choose to drive without knowing how to drive...
 
@traducerad Depends some on which former Soviet country you measure. Fatalities per 100.000 people is listed as 9.6 for Romania, and 18.9 for Russia (but only 5.4 for Belgium, and 2.9 for the UK). Also depends on exactly what you measure (e.g., deaths per unit of population, or deaths per distance traveled--if the same number of people drive a lot more, you obviously also expect to see more accidents).
[but only a few countries report deaths per distance traveled]
 
user7659542
9:27 PM
@Mikhail cost. Where I live driving licence courses start at 2000e, which is extremely expensive
 
user7659542
so that way I could get all the official licenses and would then just follow a couple of courses here and there untill I feel comfortable
 

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