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12:00 PM
@nwp don’t forget to bring up the fact that in the language const(T)[N] is in fact identified with const(T[N]) as ammunition fodder (briefly borrowing the qualif(x) syntax from D)
in Rust-land this topic is usually called 'interior mutability', or rather in our case the lack of it. Since there the perspective is flipped, with immutability being the default.
 
Also you can maybe use iterators, although this wouldn't be clear-er then a template.
 
Ben
this is no longer mildly entertaining. bye.
 
@nwp Yeah, templates are the way to go
 
@orlp Offsets are used with virtual inheritance, though.
 
http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2016/06/25/no-more-excuses-stand-up-for-immigrants
/cc @R.MartinhoFernandes this just popped up on my twitter feed (courtesy of Konrad)
 
12:18 PM
Hey, have you guys ever had a problem with the cereal serialization library crashing when operating on volatile variables?
 
12:35 PM
Have you tried using milk?
4
 
@Mikhail what
 
user6225166
lol
 
Also is GLFW's MinGW-w64 static library binary compiled wrong?
 
user6225166
cereal serialization library what's that?
 
@GNACBetombo Who are you???
 
user6225166
12:38 PM
a developper why?
 
@GNACBetombo Haven't seen you around before
a curious cat must be curious
especially if one is a red-blue splotch blob
 
@VermillionAzure When I have a volatile variable in my structure, libjson gives a run-time error when trying to load the file.
 
user6225166
i have entered this room a mont ago i think
 
@GNACBetombo Ah, I see I've been busy over the past month so maybe I wasn't here
 
@Mikhail lol, example or it didn't happen
 
12:41 PM
@Mikhail Why would that matter, though?...
 
I have no clue, as to why it happens, but I can't have volatile variables in my structures...
 
@Mikhail What do you mean by "volatile variable in my structure?" The declaration?
 
yeah, literally like volatile bool flag
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure that explain all
 
@Mikhail Ah...
@Mikhail What if you volatile the entire structure? Hm...
 
12:44 PM
by casting?
 
@Mikhail I'm going to shut up now.
@GNACBetombo So you're Italian?
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure hein? do i like an Italian? i am chinese
 
@GNACBetombo I thought BICI is in Italy?
Or is that the wrong BICI?
 
user6225166
yeah i think it's wrong BICI. because BICI is in Madagascar. i live in madagascar
 
@GNACBetombo Ah.
 
user6225166
12:48 PM
@VermillionAzure
 
user6225166
how did you get this information?
 
@GNACBetombo What do you mean?
 
user6225166
*got
 
user6225166
get
 
user6225166
this info. where i work BICI
 
12:49 PM
@GNACBetombo Uh... It's on your profile.
"Developer at BICI"
Also, I'm sort of disappointed because BICI isn't even on Wikipedia...
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure . yeah its not big. just founded early.
 
@GNACBetombo English Translation? And is it a government organization?
 
nwp
turns out converting int argc + char *argv[] into gsl::span<gsl::string_span> is not so easy, I need a vector<gsl::string_span>
maybe I should use a vector<string_span> instead
 
@nwp wait wait wait
what.
 
look at the big picture, and stop writing boiler plate
 
user6225166
12:52 PM
@VermillionAzure not at all. just a simple SARL.
 
@GNACBetombo Indonesia? Philippines?
 
@KretabChabawenizc Madagascar...
 
How do you know
 
@GNACBetombo I never realized you guys speak French
 
Also that's close enough
 
12:53 PM
5 mins ago, by GNAC Betombo
yeah i think it's wrong BICI. because BICI is in Madagascar. i live in madagascar
^ yup
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure yeah we speak french better.
 
@GNACBetombo Welp that sucks for me because I don't speak French.
 
I wish I did
 
Sexy as phuket thai?
Yes.
 
I can't speak thai
 
12:55 PM
whoosh
@GNACBetombo Oooh btw do you know about the different Chinese ethnic subgroups?
 
user1804599
@orlp I once accidentally opened and drank from a can in the supermarket, then awkwardly put the open can on the checkout
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure i know about it. there are many. but the main is the Han etni i think
 
@GNACBetombo Ah, so about as much as me then lol. Yeah I actually don't know much about it either...
Meh I've actually never met somebody that does... hm...
 
nwp
@Bassie is there a list of those episodes including the melting oven?
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure me the same i have just seen some topic about it on the news or documentary. before i through that there weren't another etnic group. just one chinese people
 
1:01 PM
@GNACBetombo Really?... Interesting...
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure yea.
 
@orlp for example, declaring B and C virtually inherited from A means that B has an offset to A and C has an offset to A. if D inherits from B and C, D will inherit the vpointers from B and C that point to A.
 
@JossieCalderon still all implementation details :)
 
Yes. And I asked this chat room if that was important to learn. No response. So I learned it anyway.
 
Also, they may be de-virtualized
 
user6225166
1:03 PM
@VermillionAzure but i think japonese culture is far more interesting.
 
@GNACBetombo Eh... I guess...?
I dunno I don't like Japanese culture despite being Japanese-American
 
user6225166
there is so many thing that i can learn from.
 
Like how to work 11 hours a day and still not get shit done?
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure really japanese. your lucky
 
@GNACBetombo I guess lol
 
user6225166
1:06 PM
@VermillionAzure you live japan our usa?
 
@GNACBetombo The US. Hawaii specifically lol
 
user6225166
Waw. you are alway on holliday so. i want to be at your place . such a nice place lol. i have heard about hawai but never gone there.
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure can you speak japonese?
 
@GNACBetombo lol no
@GNACBetombo The weather is nice but the cost of living is ridiculous
 
user6225166
@VermillionAzure ridiculous? cheap or expansive?
 
1:23 PM
@ScarletAmaranth And I'm sitting here hungry.
Need to go to shop but I'm too lazy.
 
1:38 PM
@Mikhail as the one arguing against "immigration can have tangible benefits" and asking people to look at the big picture, you shouldn't be supporting your argument with examples.
 
1:51 PM
What exactly is the point of TempleOS?
 
What's the point of Windows?
 
TempleOS is ugly, though.
 
Maybe that's its point
 
^ @ScarletAmaranth Oh no, One Piece is doing it too now. @Xeo @Mysticial
 
What's it?
 
1:55 PM
Tsundere stuff.
 
yeahhh
I know
is that a filler tho?
definitely feels like a filler
even tho there is some background of Bartholomeo in there
 
I agree.
 
at least we might learn something about bartho
it's still funny that Doffy can't beat Luffy
and then a random pirate reks him (or would rek him, if it weren't for bartholomeo)
 
So, like Han Solo towards Luke?
Seems like normal character development
It's seen almost everywhere
Sawyer and Jack in Lost
The two protagonists in The Nice Guys
Joy and Sadness in Inside Out
 
Joy is IMHO the least interesting in Inside Out
which is a bit of a shame considering she's "the main one"
 
2:02 PM
Jessy and Walter White
@ScarletAmaranth She is played by Leslie Knope though <3
 
@Shoe is she supposed to be hot, or you just like her personality / is nice?
 
she is nice
Parks & Rec protagonist
 
@Griwes Decisions for CppCon come out soon!~
I'm excited.
 
Ron Swanson & Laslie Knope
 
user6225166
are you talking about one piece mina?
 
2:14 PM
Dr House & X, for every X in the set of people
@ThePhD Are you doing your talk in the end?
 
@Shoe If it gets accepted, yeah.
Today's the deadline to know.
@blelbach Will we get an e-mail when our talk is formally accepted today, or something else?
 
Ven
@nwp that's so retarded I don't even know where to start
I'll just stay with "stop reposting things you've seen on facebook and think are smart"
 
2:29 PM
@nwp There's also the concept of perceived quality. An employer gives a task to a guy that takes half of what you take to do the same job. He writes the program, but it's an unmaintainable mess and the costs of fixing bugs is exponentially worse than yours.
But the employer chooses the immediate benefit of paying less now, because he doesn't understand how important it is to write unmaintainable code.
The perceived quality is what makes the random guy with no formal education take the job that you should have gotten.
And you won't go to work at that price because you have to pay your uni tuition.
And if you try to explain that to the employer he will think you are desperately trying to scam him
 
Ven
^
 
This phenomenon is not specific to immigration of course, but immigration accentuates it almost linearly to the amount of people you welcome in
 
Ven
also, someone with nothing to lose will accept to work unpaid overtime, etc, etc.
 
Yeah, also that
And I'm not say don't welcome people in. I'm just giving you another point of view on the matter.
 
@fredoverflow I agree.
 
2:43 PM
@Shoe immigrant demographics are primarily of people without education and people with the highest education.
It's an upside-down bell curve.
There aren't many with just enough education to fake their way in like that.
It's garbage collection or garbage collection research
5
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes boo
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ouch
 
3:08 PM
The UK in particular, has saved some 9*10^9 pounds in higher education this century due to immigration.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes How much did it lose due to emigration?
 
@Borgleader dunno.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Saved another 1000*10^9 pounds by charging home students stupid amounts
 
As an immigrant, I'd have my say in this, but not sure what you all are on about
 
well in that case, I'd have to apologize for how terribly my country seems to insist on treating you
 
3:14 PM
Also with immigration I was talking about immigration from poor countries where there is the ISIS threat or other war situations.
Not about german or italian people coming to work there
 
the only immigration under discussion is from the EU
 
I'd be surprised if the upside down Bell curve was still holding the former group
 
we basically refused to take in anybody from Syria etc, if memory serves
and leaving the EU will obviously only affect EU-based immigration.
 
Well, not really. Under EU they would eventually be able to force you to take a portion of the syrian immigrants
 
nah
they dropped that plan because the British were far from the only ones against it
a lot of other countries e.g. eastern europe were also against the plan
 
3:17 PM
And you cannot force it on the UK anyway. Not being in Schengen means that.
 
well, arguably you could just grant them all German citizenship
 
Then new pacts will be enacted
 
;p
 
That world be extremely unpopular everywhere
 
there's a pretty high bar for treaty change
 
3:19 PM
The fundamental problem is that you can't let "border countries" deal with that alone
 
you're saying that as if it would actually matter to the UK, really.
fundamentally I agree with you and it's clearly necessary for everybody to take their share of refugees
but the political practicalities of the matter are that it's not gonna happen
 
It's gonna happen, or we'll all suffer from this
 
yeah, you'll all suffer from this.
 
Letting border countries die will affect you too, you must understand this
 
like I said, you're fighting the wrong battle.
the problem isn't that I disagree.
the problem is that a bunch of countries disagree.
 
3:21 PM
Once the Trade Federation conquers Naboo, it will come looking for you too
 
but really
there's plenty of that kind of thing going around in Europe
Britain are hardly the only people putting their own interests ahead of the Union
 
Of course
EU is not based on friendship
lol
The whole point of an alliance is to divide and conquer problems
 
well, actually, the EU pretty much was based on friendship, more or less.
but really, half the problem with the EU is that it's so in and out
they control too much without enough solid democracy being involved, have economic union without political union, and EU law supersedes national law but the members can't act in the Union's best interests.
 
Wait, have you become pro brexit?
 
no.
but only a fool says that the EU isn't fundamentally flawed and can carry on indefinitely in its current form.
 
3:25 PM
yea the EU is pretty flawed
I agree with puppy
 
I'd be a lot happier if they just went straight to United States of Europe.
 
For a moment there I perceived that pro-brexit narrative in the form of "EU is trash, throw it all in the dumpster"
Of course EU is flawed
Everything is flawed to an extent
 
I would have stayed in the EU and tried to get reform
 
I voted Remain but it's hard to to make a very convincing argument for staying
 
instead of leaving, and now you have no power to change anything
 
3:26 PM
@TonyTheLion We tried that and the EU more or less told us to fuck off.
 
try harder
 
and that was only about one issue, immigration.
 
Reforming EU is like a game of Nomic
 
One can simultaneously admit that the EU is a mess, and admit that Brexit will almost certainly be an even bigger mess.
 
Have you ever tried that Tony?
 
3:27 PM
No
@JerryCoffin yea
 
yeah
that's the problem with the EU
 
You never get your stuff done the way you want and you always have to compromise in order to move forward
That's politics
 
the EU is a fucking mess and desperately needs reform that basically isn't even starting
but brexit is also just so bad
 
Nomic was such an eye-opener for me in how I perceive politics
Is "eye-opener" a thing in English?
 
@Puppy so what do you perceive the worst thing about brexit?
@Shoe yes
 
3:29 PM
well
the most obvious problem is that I think it's highly unlikely we'll actually get the benefits we wanted.
if we want access to the single market, it's likely we'll still have to accept free movement of people.
 
right
 
like, there's bad tradeoffs, and there's tradeoffs where you get nothing in exchange for payment.
it seems like getting the benefits we wanted basically sum up as "The EU gives us a really sweet deal"
but we couldn't get a good deal from the EU even before telling them to fuck off and calling into question their very existence.
 
yea, I too doubt we'll get a better deal from them by leaving
 
so far as I can see, we'll basically have to leave the single market, which will be a massive economic blow.
 
right, that would be very bad indeed
 
3:33 PM
and all of our manufacturers still have to manufacture EU-approved products to sell them in the EU, except now we have no influence on what the regulations are.
so frankly, I just don't see that Brexit will even accomplish the intended goals
let alone having achieving them be worth the cost
 
it probably won't
try telling that to a brexiter
 
the EU has the means, opportunity, and great motive to fuck us over.
 
somehow they're convinced this was the best solution
and by leaving we've lost a lot of bargaining power
 
I think that bargaining power is the least of our problems
did you read the news w.r.t. negotiators?
 
@Puppy As the tiny bit of silver lining in that deep-grey cloud: they probably have more motive to get UK products at low prices than to fuck over the UK, which is likely to keep the raping in check, so to speak.
 
3:35 PM
Cameron really mis-estimated the way this referendum would go
@Puppy not sure if I read what you're on about
 
@TonyTheLion In order to negotiate new trade deals with basically everybody to replace the EU ones, we'll need about three hundred trained and experienced trade negotiators.
and currently, we have about twenty, since the EU did all that stuff for us.
 
christ
I cry everytim
 
so apart from anything else, we are currently incredibly undermanned and inexperienced in a shitload of absolutely critical negotiations that would be exceedingly difficult even in the best circumstances.
 
> In the USA, the concept enters serious discussions of whether a unified Europe is feasible and what impact increased European unity would have on the United States of America's relative political and economic power.
Why would USA be afraid of USE?
 
USA wants to be world power
USE could become that easily if it were a thing, I suppose
 
3:38 PM
because USE would probably instantly become one of the world's foremost powers.
 
I doubt that we would be even close to becoming a world power
 
@Shoe While I'm sure there must be at least a few people in the US who worry about it, I don't think it's something that most Americans have ever really considered.
 
a really simple example is economics
 
yea Americans are too self-centered for that
 
the GDP of the EU is pretty much equal to the USA, even though the EU includes many impoverished areas like Eastern Europe
 
3:39 PM
@TonyTheLion /cc @JerryCoffin :P
 
then there's manpower
EU: 500 million population, USA: 330 million population.
 
basically
 
@Puppy Holy shit
I didn't know that
 
China: 1.3 billion
 
then you can also consider social factors, such as the EU not selling assault rifles to people in mental institutions
 
3:40 PM
To the extent that the US is concerned about other "world powers", I'd guess there's a lot more concern about China than Europe.
 
Even though man power is less and less important? :P
 
it can be important.
@JerryCoffin Well, arguably, the USA and USE would be mostly aligned on most issues, so arguably, although the USE I think would be a bigger power than the USA, they would not be in competition so much.
and the other thing is that since most of Europe is already heavily developed, they have little room to massively expand.
 
@Puppy Yes, I think that's the perception here as well.
 
So where do I sign for this USE thing?
 
whereas China is currently quite underdeveloped, so in the future, their economic power could increase massively compared to today.
@Shoe It'll probably never exist, seems like EU politicians don't have the balls to finish the job, and now that Brexit, it's much more likely you'll be signing to try and stay in the EU as it stands.
 
3:43 PM
@Puppy A lot of eastern Europe has a lot of room for a whole lot of development (but its development is unlikely to be at anybody else's expense).
 
@JerryCoffin Not sure if they have high enough populations to make a big total difference.
 
How does something like USE even happens
 
whereas China has 4x the USA's population, so developing all those people would make a massive difference.
 
I guess through something like EU
 
yeah
the EU is like, USE but they left out most of the important parts.
 
3:44 PM
Like central political institutions?
Single army
 
I don't think single army is that important
although in the field of nuclear arms, it would be very significant what would happen to them in that case.
 
user1804599
set of independent nation states master race
 
@Puppy Between Poland and Romania (for example) you have nearly the same population as the UK.
 
@Bassie So you are against USE?
 
but the most important thing would be a proper unified political structure
a European Parliament that is not a total joke
 
3:46 PM
Why is the current one a joke?
 
well, it's more-or-less toothless
almost all the power of the EU is in unelected bodies like the European Commission
and basically all significant change is still based on a set-of-nation-states shared-treaty negotiation job.
if the European Parliament had a PR system and actually had power, it would be much better.
 
PR System?
 
proportional representation
 
Based on population?
 
nah
 
3:49 PM
km^2?
 
it's where basically everybody votes, and then you assign seats based on the number of votes.
 
oh I see
But shouldn't there be a representative of every country at least?
or is the european parliament above countries?
 
it's above countries (in principle)
currently elected by first-past-the-post system
 
4:17 PM
@Puppy I've seen it described as the UK's total trade.
 
it's about 50% of all our trade, if memory serves.
more than enough to send us back to the economic stone ages
so yeah, this just in: brexit dumb
 
Oh. Shit, that's what I meant.
Forgot to type "half" there, somehow.
Was confused by your reply until I re-read what I wrote.
 
I think
the fundamental problem is that we don't understand our economy very well
 
Or anything at all, to be honest.
 
seems to me even simple shit like what money actually is is pretty poorly defined.
and it's not always clear to me what constitutes actually making money vs just shuffling money around.
 
4:23 PM
But you're a smart curious frood.
Voters often aren't.
And then you don't need experts.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Did you see the john oliver on brexit? Very good
 
I really wanna watch today's one.
 
I usually DL it after getting back from work
 
My gf is a big fan and we always watch it Monday evenings.
I'm in Sébastopol right now.
 
It's one stop after Strasbourg.
Paris metro system vOv
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Call an Uber :P
 
Speaking of Uber. It seems like they're headed towards ditching their cabbies.
 
yeah
I don't see why I'd want to pay a cabby for what an automated car can do for cheaper
and also not having to interact with another human being is a plus
 
They're investing in self-driven cars.
They disrupted the cab market, and now they're going to disrupt their own market, in a way.
 
4:42 PM
Uber's position is a bit odd
I think the cabbies have a point that they're basically operating a cab service but dodging the regulations
 
Well they are.
 
 
1 hour later…
user1804599
5:59 PM
@Shoe holy shit yes
 
user1804599
cultures too distinct
 
user1804599
can't unite
 
user1804599
you already see this in all the different interests by all the different countries in the EU
 

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