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1:00 PM
So, how good is VS 2015?
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@LightnessRacesinOrbit You add income through transactions
My paycheck varies each month too so repeating transactions aren't much use
@BartekBanachewicz to be fair, these last two weeks with Scala made me really like it. Sure - it's missing some stuff (Enums and ADTs Grrr...) and it has some cruft (singletons? Xml literals? Really??!) but overall it's very pleasant.
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@LightnessRacesinOrbit do you have a base to work off of?
1:01 PM
@Xeo What do you mean?
I also enjoyed swift when I was coding it. It's a decent language (save me the ranting).
(Horrible tooling though)
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Like, a base amount you're guaranteed to get?
Sort of
But not really
Varying tax fucks that up royally
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mh
@BenjaminGruenbaum if it's similar to F# then I wouldn't like it. Fuck all that, I just couldn't reason about mutability
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1:02 PM
Well, I basically have a scheduled transation (every month) with my income, and mark that as "Income for <next month>"
mutable code is hellishly annoying
ooh I found an import button
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YNAB detects that "Income for <month>" and adds that income to the available budget for that month.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You might also wanna go through their tutorial thingy
@BartekBanachewicz you can't reason about mutability? We live in a mutable world. Mutable state and impure functions is very natural to reason about if you don't leak it. There is a reason most programming languages and most code is written a language with explicit mutable state and assignments.
@Xeo I went through the walkthrough
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1:03 PM
ah, ok
You don't really need to import anything
why is male circumcision on minors legal?
Just start with the current balance and budget that
(By mutable, I assume you mean stuff like var, mutability is what makes code work after all - all code mutates something, it mutates its input to its output - Haskell has mutable state. I assume we're talking about controlled vs raw mutable state)
1:04 PM
@orlp Cos religious freedom something something
(I think that last message by me was obvious, and I shouldn't have posted it. Just wanted to make sure we're on the same page)
@orlp because who are you to decide for the parents how to raise their child?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit that same argument would apply to female circumcision
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's not part of raising a child, it's mutilating their body
@orlp in your opinion it's mutilating, it's not mutilation in their opinion.
> Mutilation or maiming is an act of physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body.
it's mutilation
Whether it degrades anything is subjective.
I'm not a fan of circumcision, but I'd rather live in a place it's legal than in a place where parents can't decide how they want to raise their child.
1:06 PM
Fuck religions and everything related
@BenjaminGruenbaum so you're in favour of female circumcision being made legal on female children?
ah this is better - assigning my transactions (going back just a few months to start with) to categories now and will go from there
@BenjaminGruenbaum because the wishes of the parent is more important than the freedom of choice of the child?
if you wanna cut off parts of your penis as an adult, I'm perfectly fine with that
Female circumcision is irreversible unlike male circumcision, and it also degrades sexual pleasure. However - if two educated people choose to do it and it does not rob the child from being able to write their own life's book - then yes.
but forcing it on your child - I can not comprehend how that's legal
@BenjaminGruenbaum male circumcision is irreversible
1:08 PM
Ugh
@BenjaminGruenbaum and degrades sexual pleasure
@orlp a child doesn't have freedom of choice. They're a child. They're a person and have human rights but parents decide on lots of stuff for them.
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah, 30 years ago someone designed C and it went downhill from there
this isn't going to let me graph the breakdown in my paycheque the way I'm used to but we'll see
@orlp yes, it would
@orlp both of these are false. I'm sure it's reversible (although not fun) and research measured and found out it does not reduce male pleasure.
1:09 PM
mutability is okay when it's controlled
Guess if two educated people beat their child it should be legal too
not when it's default
@BenjaminGruenbaum loooolwut
@orlp you're forcing things on your child every day. What food they'll eat, what their interests will be, what friends they'll have. Children have very limited independence.
@BenjaminGruenbaum cutting off the foreskin is not reversible, and I need a citation on that research
1:10 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'd rather live in a place where parents cannot decide for themselves to permanently cut pieces off their child without that child's consent just because they want to.
That's extremely retarded argument that fails to account for severity
@BenjaminGruenbaum A child has rights though.
@CatPlusPlus that's a strawman. Beating up a child hurts their human rights. Circumcision does not.
@BenjaminGruenbaum Force feeding your children is illegal.
1:10 PM
lol
A right "that every child should have the opportunity to grow and develop free from preventable illness or injury."
@LightnessRacesinOrbit but you choose what to serve to them.
@BenjaminGruenbaum uh
And if you're forcing interests and friends on your children then you're doing parenting very wrong
You choose what school they'll go to.
1:10 PM
Yeah because picking your kid's school is just the same as chopping off a piece of their body
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@BartekBanachewicz choosing what school they go to doesn't cut off body parts that do not regrow
THAT IS LITERALLY THE SAME THING
Quote from 1989 Convention on the Rights of the Child.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you don't do it explicitly, but it's done implicitly.
@rubenvb I read that last week :P
1:11 PM
TOTALLY SAME
if you're seriously suggesting that doing an unnecessary cutout of human flesh isn't violating human rights then there's something seriously wrong with you
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@BenjaminGruenbaum putting a tattoo on the face of your child should be legal, because children have no choice?
and because they can get a tattoo removal if they really want
What about cutting their hair?
1:12 PM
I am glad it is not I who is under attack his/her opinions today. :)
@BenjaminGruenbaum hair isn't flesh
jesus christ
it's not even remotely similar
@CatPlusPlus wrong religion
@BartekBanachewicz Circumcision is done at a very young age. Children can't actually choose. It's also a religious topic.
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1:12 PM
Guys
here's an idea
Get a room
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: What is a chat room, a miserable little pile of terrible opinions [c++] [c++11] [c++14] [c++-faq]
@BenjaminGruenbaum yes, religious topics forced on children are disgusting
and should stop.
Religious topics were forced on you too.
Brainwashing is totally a-ok
@BenjaminGruenbaum my religion requires your children to give up a kidney, since they don't need two anyway
1:13 PM
A-OK
People should actively show all major religions in their full pride to all children.
With a nice disclaimer that these aren't science.
@orlp a kidney provides useful body function. Foreskin doesn't. People with one kidney can't participate in several activities.
And then all is well, because nothing is forced on them, yet they can choose what they want to believe and see for themselves.
A kidney transplant is also not cosmetic.
^ there you go.
1:14 PM
Unfortunately, religion is coupled to economical priorities and is so misused.
But hey, /rant
@BenjaminGruenbaum and that was fucking retarded.
@BartekBanachewicz Why the heck would you post that here?
I really, really wish they weren't
:cripes:
@BenjaminGruenbaum why not?
1:15 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum don't worry, the scar is only cosmetical and can be hidden with makeup if they really want to
That's not what I'm talking about, but ok :P
@Abyx because it's the stack exchange chat system, and they've made it very clear that they're not interested in that sort of stuff being posted here.
@BenjaminGruenbaum just a parent acting on his freedom to mutilate his children
nothing wrong with that, no?
@BenjaminGruenbaum use this then - chat.stackoverflow.com/chats/leave/10
@BenjaminGruenbaum because that's ultimately what's wrong with forcing religion on anyone. children in particular
@BenjaminGruenbaum that's religion so it's ok
@Abyx or you know, not. The alternative is that we don't post these sort of things here and you'll deal with it.
1:17 PM
also I don't see what's exactly wrong with that picture
@BenjaminGruenbaum what sort of things?
@Abyx it makes certain people uncomfortable with the irrationality they live with
@Abyx pictures of knives pointed at crying children with the implication they're about to get cut.
@orlp no one acts rationally, pretending that people who are not religious are rational is not something I'd do.
@BartekBanachewicz Wait. Did you just pull a "think of the children"?
1 min ago, by Benjamin Gruenbaum
@Abyx pictures of knives pointed at crying children with the implication they're about to get cut.
@R.MartinhoFernandes no?
1:18 PM
FFS DUDE
1 message moved to Trash can
Don't onebox stuff with gore. Think of the children!
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm afraid I'll have to deny your invitation. "R. Martinho Fernandes has invited you to join Trash can."
:D
@R.MartinhoFernandes I just pointed out that forcing religion on children is worse than forcing religion on adults.
which is still wrong.
Educating children that religion is stupid isn't a better alternative imo.
No one does that.
There is always a tradeoff, by not circumcising your child you're still forcing a life choice on them.
1:20 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum just leave them alone god damn it
That's retarded
@BenjaminGruenbaum what
@orlp How certain of you.
I'm not for circumcision, I likely won't do it to my kids. I still think people have the right to do it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes No one should do that*
1:20 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum there seems to be a lot of reports of various undesirable side effects of circumcision. Lowered sensitivity and such. "Serves no purpose" seems like stretching the truth a bit. And even if something serves no purpose, that still doesn't give others the right to chop it off you without your consent.
Religion is a choice.
Children are not in a position to make choices.
Do not force choices on them.
@BartekBanachewicz leaving them alone is a life choice too - not telling them about religion also sets their world view.
@BenjaminGruenbaum That's just facts
@orlp you force life changing choices on them every day. It's your job as a parent to guide them and yes, sometimes choose for them. Obviously as they grow you do that less and less and rely on their education and the choices you've made earlier to pay up.
Not being religious is also a choice.
@BenjaminGruenbaum This is not true.
1:22 PM
Wait what.
@orlp Nothing is true!
How is it not a choice?
@R.MartinhoFernandes think of the people at work with their bosses looking over their shoulders!
The default state is not being religious.
@BenjaminGruenbaum ...and? what's exactly is wrong with? there is intent to harm those children
1:22 PM
@jalf as an infant, you can't consent to anything.
@BenjaminGruenbaum I fail to see how that gives anyone the right to chop bits off you
@Abyx you don't see what's wrong with posting this picture here?
If you're drunk as fuck you also can't consent to sex. That doesn't mean people are just allowed to have sex with you if they feel like it
!!afk have to work
@BenjaminGruenbaum yes. it's fucking real life. nothing wrong with it
1:23 PM
@Abyx Oh. You can see intent through the pixels. Amazing.
@jalf Only if you're a child wait what
@CatPlusPlus :D
woops
@R.MartinhoFernandes nope, I just know that it's some sort of a religious ceremony
and you are behaving like some sort of caveman who sees a surgeon cutting people children
> Swing your partner by the hand
Have a baby if you can
But if the voices your head
Say to sacrifice your kid
To satiate your loving God's
Fetish for dead baby blood
It's simple faith, the Book demands
So raise that knife up in your hand!
sigh
1:28 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Religion is an answer to the question of existence. Not being religious is not a choice. Until one chooses an answer to that question you are in the state of "not being religious". Note that I consider "atheism (there is no reason)" and "agnosticism (we can not possibly know)" choices as well. But a child has not made up its mind yet, thus is without religion, and has not made a choice to do so.
meh I can imagine what would happen if someone would post a picture of an obstetrician pulling a baby
Yes, I wouldn't want people to post that shit out of the blue without any qualification whatsoever.
@R.MartinhoFernandes If you ask an 8 year old that was not forced into a religion "do you believe in god", likely you'll encounter answers like "I don't know" or "what is god?". This is the default state of being without religion I mean. This is not a life choice.
@Abyx There are several precedents, btw, so rant away.
@orlp Well, fair enough. I think Benjamin meant atheism, though.
@R.MartinhoFernandes If he meant atheism then his comment was totally orthogonal to the discussion and I do not see why he'd bring it up.
Other than the wrong assumption that I'd be suggesting we bring up our children as atheists, which, for the record, I find just as bad as bringing up our children as any other religion.
1:35 PM
@orlp Then you'd just be in violent agreement.
@R.MartinhoFernandes could you rephrase that? I'm not sure what you mean with that (what's violent agreement, and agreement with whom)
@orlp It's when two people actually share an opinion but fail to communicate it properly to each other, and thinking they disagree they argue about it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes and I'd be agreeing with whom?
Like Scott said, overloading on a T&& is problematic (line 34). What is the solution? Tag dispatching?
18 mins ago, by Benjamin Gruenbaum
Not being religious is also a choice.
@StackedCrooked Why is it problematic?
1:42 PM
I needed to define an extra copy constructor with signature Function(Function&) to avoid triggering Function(F&&)
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@StackedCrooked restrict the F&& overload
enable_if on template signature?
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See is_related from Robot's wheels
@StackedCrooked Wat
@R.MartinhoFernandes If you rewrite that to "Atheism is also a choice." then yes I'd agree with him on that exact point, however the discussion in which he brings this up he seems to be using it as a suggestion that not telling your children about religion is forcing atheism on them.
which I disagree with
1:44 PM
@Xeo Restrict what. There's nothing to restrict.
@StackedCrooked No, you don't.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Being choosy is also a religion
You misunderstood the advice.
There's zero need for the Function(Function& rhs) overload
@R.MartinhoFernandes At one point there was a need for it ...
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@R.MartinhoFernandes The universal ctor from F&& steals all non-const copy ctor calls.
It seems to be gone though.
1:45 PM
Function(Function& rhs) and Function(Function&& rhs) never go in the same candidate set, because what they match is disjoint.
1 min ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
You misunderstood the advice.
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@R.MartinhoFernandes So? template<typename F> Function(F&& f) that one steals everything
@Xeo that's indeed my problem
@Xeo That's not what he was about.
kek
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That's not what Scott was talking about, yes
But that's the problem @Stacked has :P
1:47 PM
@Xeo No, it was what Scott was talking about. It wasn't what Stacked was talking about.
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1 min ago, by StackedCrooked
@Xeo that's indeed my problem
uhm
Fuck you automatic inertia scrolling.
Scott's advice is about universal/forwarding/cheese references, not rvalue references.
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@R.MartinhoFernandes who ever said anything about rvalue refernces?
Oh. Wait.
I misread line 34 as 40. Somehow.
I blame the nosebleeds.
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1:48 PM
~
wait just so I understand it correctly, there is a crucial difference in && when it's being used for a template argument and a concrete type, right?
I'll be in the corner.
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@orlp yes. unfortunately.
isn't that the source of most confusion about it?
the wildly different meaning it has when used in a deductive context?
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1:50 PM
6 mins ago, by Xeo
See is_related from Robot's wheels
@R.MartinhoFernandes Wat :p
Sorry. I'm not ok, today.
I think I have nose cancer.
Wait, that's a thing.
meh, I got Far Cry 3 anyway
Today I sleep 2/3 of all I slept the rest of the week. Progress.
+ all DLC for 7 eur is a steal
so how would you write a forwarding constructor for a type that can and wants to accept objects of the wrapping type?
Er, you don't care, then.
I slept 11 hours last night ...
15 this week.
that's like me last week
maybe 20 hours in 5 days
sleep camels ...
2:06 PM
@chmod711telkitty I'll sleep that much tomorrow (today?)
My boss has taken to commenting on issues with image macros.
I have to be onsite today (Sat) so that means I can't get up too late
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lol
The Robot's type traits are really awesome. I should really add them to the codebase.
4
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> IsRelated<Function<R(Args...)>, F>
You can just say Function there
2:21 PM
@Xeo yeah, I removed it and then readded it, then made a typedef for this_type, and removed that again
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lol
I hesitate a lot.
There is literally nothing NSFW about this
user1804599
WHAT THE FUCUUUCK
user1804599
def build():
    pass
def deploy():
    result = build()
but semi naked anime girls are NSFW?
user1804599
It says build is referenced before assignment when I call deploy. :S
2:37 PM
@CatPlusPlus SUITABLE get it?
user1804599
ugh
user1804599
I assign a new variable build later in the function.
user1804599
Fuck function-scope variables.
aaaaaa food people can be so annoying
2:39 PM
@CatPlusPlus Better safe than sorry
Making order online, first call is the food place "we haven't got this thing can we make this thing instead" OKAY FINE, second call from the site support "food place accidentally clicked 'reject' but everythiiiiiing's fine"
PayPal noted a refund so I don't fucking know how the fuck is this supposed to work out
cat, you stopped eating delivery people already?
Now I have to go to the ATM to have money just in case because jeeeeeeeeeeeeesus
2:42 PM
I remember last time when you robbed 3 bank atms in a roll ... unsuccessfully
As usual expecting other people to be competent is just Too Much
dear diary
today I was totally unproductive
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dear diary
today, I wasn't \o/
So yeah PayPal credited my card back so the order is unpaid
Or they're super incompetent and nobody noticed it's unpaid
Which is a comedy option
I need to be sleepy soon, had antihistamine pill to counter hayfever & allergies. It usually makes me sleepy, but not tonight. I need this antihistamine anyways - I am highly allergic to something onsite - red rushes all over if I don't take the pill. I suspect the source is the tree that was cut down
2:46 PM
I give it 50/50
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lol
Dear diary,
FUCK YOU.
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poor diary
At least I address it like people, with starting capitals and punctuation.
diary, dairy ... so close, why??
2:52 PM
@orlp I have those days where I'm supposed to be doing fuck loads of work and get nothing done
> It's just one of those days, when ya don't wanna wake up Everything is fucked, everybody sucks
> You don't really know why, but you wanna justify rippin someone's head off
@caps Shitty Gravatar Exception: please pick nicer gravatar
Dear diary,
Haskell.
I wrote an entire program using almost only LINQ in C#
<3
@TonyTheLion Meh
@caps I find your lack of effort, disturbing :P
If I could, I'd find today's favourite colour's parents, kidnap them, lock them in a basement, and them send them to today's favourite colour's mailbox one cubic centimetre at a time. No ransom.
2:57 PM
What?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Mine wasn't that extreme
but cool

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