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21:00
You know shit's gone bad when you start wondering when the next exploit to java will be found that will let me get back access to my server :'(
You can block threads and unblock them at arbitrary points.
@thecoshman No rescue option?
user3010322
Wha tthe fuck
user3010322
rebase opened up vi
user3010322
and.... then brought me to a weird screen
user3010322
I'm scared. ;~;
21:01
interactive rebase?
are you new? :v
@thecoshman Like, using your provider's website to upload rescue keys and login?
@R.MartinhoFernandes that might just be an option...
still hoping my SD can be recovered enough to get keys back
@ThePhD It's alright, just check that everything is ok then :wq
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't understand, couldn't you do that with a mutex?
@kbok What's the "unblock a blocked thread" operation called in a mutex?
user3010322
21:03
AH
user3010322
I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I'VE DONE
user3010322
ABORT, ABORT!
just delete the repo and contemplate existence
Or "block until told otherwise"?
user3010322
Event?
user3010322
21:05
They're called Events in Windows
@R.MartinhoFernandes unlock?
user3010322
WaitEvent, I've named then in my engine.
user3010322
The variant on that is Semaphores, which only unblock the thread when the count is... equal to 0? Or something like that.
user3010322
(Might be when it's greater than 0, unblock)
@kbok That only works for threads that tried to lock after you locked.
A condition variable lets threads block even if no one else is holding the mutex.
21:07
Oh, I see
@ThePhD No, those are some different abominations.
user3010322
Oh. I see.
> Do not invent your own synchronization mechanisms, for you shall only come up with unnatural abominations of the kind used in Windows, resembling the half-man, half-bear and half-pig we materialized to strike terror in people’s hearts.
@kbok you may want to read about monitors.
> He said onto the townsfolks “I saved a bundle by not buying properly color-coded wires; and yet my lights turn on when I flippeth the switch. My wiring is correct and just right for my needs, and I did not have to worry about blue wires and green wires and brown wires. I use the book of Good Wiring Conventions as TP in my outhouse, for I have no use for any rules.”
@R.MartinhoFernandes Thanks, will do
user3010322
OKay
21:12
@R.MartinhoFernandes ..as distinct from the pristine, glowing auras surrounding Linux synchro primitives - the ones with the built-in and documented 'spurious wakeup' failure mechanism:)
@R.MartinhoFernandes Would be cool to have that kind of class
@kbok Ah, the parable of Jebediah the Electrician.
user3010322
by nuking EVERYTHING and then repulling everything,
user3010322
it all looks okay.
precondition, monitor class, invariant etc
21:13
@Rapptz It's mutex + condition variable.
Oh I meant the pseudo-code
  private int balance := 0
  invariant balance >= 0
public method boolean withdraw(int amount)
     precondition amount >= 0
user3010322
Ain't that what concepts are supposed to do at Compile Time?
user3010322
Well, uh
All classes in Java and C# are monitor class. :<
21:15
is that a bad thing?
Oh, wait, not quite. But close.
@ThePhD No.
@Rapptz It balloons every single object with a mutex + condition variable for no reason.
I guess
Even C# value types?
21:16
Not those.
you mean structs?
But you can still use them in Monitor.Enter and Monitor.Exit.
Yes
With disastrous consequences, but you can.
user3010322
Heh.
user3010322
21:17
Boxing.
user3010322
!!!
user3010322
I FIGURED IT OUT
user3010322
AAWWH YEAH
user3010322
Templates to the rescue.~
You know, you should answer questions sometime
21:19
This looks ok, but it is really really nasty: ideone.com/OrVezM
user3010322
But then I'll have to leave my poor rep ghetto. And actually participate in society.
user3010322
And if I get high enough rep, I'll get disgruntled and angry.
user3010322
And bitch on meta like an old man. :c
@Rapptz Basically, Monitor should have been a non-static class that you instantiate when you want a monitor, instead of every object having a monitor in it and Monitor having static methods that use magic to access it.
Not all high-rep users are grumpy
21:21
C# copied this nonsense from Java.
@R.MartinhoFernandes What's wrong with it?
@kbok I do my best to make up for any who aren't though.
C# copied everything from Java and then added some more
user1804599
Except checked exceptions. :P
yeah, looks like SD card is completely boned
user3010322
21:23
@kbok Integers naturally don't carry around the garbage associated with every object having monitors and stuff.
user3010322
So, if I'm not mistaken, that integer gets boxed into object temporarily,
user3010322
and then that gets used in the function call?
user3010322
Which, I'm not sure if that boxed variable is accessible to you the next time you try to do the same thing?
user1804599
Boxing an integer makes a copy of it (duh).
@kbok Value types don't have monitors, but Monitor.Enter takes an object parameter. The result is that the int gets boxed and then the monitor of the box is entered. On the Exit call the int is boxed again and the monitor of this new box is exited, without ever being entered.
user3010322
21:24
Ahh, I was right!
user3010322
std::default_allocator is a thing?
user3010322
Nope, just std::allocator
user1804599
std::deallocator
Ah, boxed. Okay.
Hmm, why doesn't FF render my svg file :<
user1804599
21:27
kboxed
user1804599
@R.MartinhoFernandes Because it is a web browser, and web browsers suck.
hmm, fairly sure my provider will let me access my server through a rescue mode, but I just CBA right now
Chrome doesn't either. Dammit.
it's going to require me to think about things
@R.MartinhoFernandes Use Opera (linky?)
21:31
Inkscape opens it but it doesn't contain what I put there :<
@sehe It's local.
@JerryCoffin :D
user1804599
inb4 hexapoda logo
yawn
@R.MartinhoFernandes I understand. I meant, can I try it for you?
user1804599
Add SVG version.
21:32
and probably namespace too
Ugh, this thing sucks then.
That's in onebox: http://i.imgur.com/QtDQM3c.png
And here's in the browser (at 300% and small browser window) http://i.imgur.com/BghpSLA.png
Where's your doctype?
user1804599
SVGs don’t need doctypes.
plus an invalid ID
@rightfold so?
21:34
www.unicode.org/notes/tn39/
user3010322
Ooph. I forgot how to access userdata. :c
HTML doesn't "need" doctypes; doesn't mean you shouldn't include one
user1804599
It does.
user1804599
Otherwise it is not valid HTML.
we already mentioned the doctype
<svg xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg" version="1.1"></svg>
user1804599
21:36
XML namespace ≠ doctype.
I'm just guessing that's what he means
SVG doesn't have doctypes like HTML.
@rightfold what the fuck are you on about
@Rapptz er, yes, it does
never seen one
@Rapptz And? So? Therefore?
@Rapptz All examples here say otherwise w3.org/TR/SVG11/struct.html
Are C++ mutexes and Python Locks the same thing?
I farted repeatedly.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's in the file, actually.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hah, so it is :D
21:38
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Okay. This is confusing
Chrome renders it "interestingly" then, changing the XML a little too
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It displays a semantically equivalent view of it.
You'll notice how it also expands the entity E1 used for style.
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's what I meant
Anyway, fixing the ID doesn't make the SVG render in Chrome
@BartekBanachewicz How do you do the graphs?
This generator is crap.
Already dropped it.
user3010322
21:40
@Rapptz Do you have any functions that do lua_checkudata ?
What "generator"?
user3010322
I'm not sure if you wrapped it up already...
no
how'd you solve the name issue?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit The one I was trying. SvgGdi.
did you use typeid?
I did that and I felt dirty.
21:41
I only considered it because it derived from System.Drawing.Graphics, so I could reuse some code I already have.
user3010322
I'm using typeid and I'm combining it with demanglers.
yeah see I didn't want to do that
user3010322
It's more okay to use the demanglers on GCC because they're shipped as part of the library
user3010322
On Windows, you need to include DbgHelp.lib
user3010322
Thankfully, that shit is shipped with Windows, so it's pretty okay too.
21:41
also, __cxa_demangle is required to be shipped as part of the Itanium ABI.
I don't like it tbh
it just feels wrong
so all conformant Itanium ABI compilers will ship it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that the "generator" is at fault here
user3010322
I don't either, but the only other option is to take is as a parameter.
whereas Windows does not require any such.
21:42
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Why not?
user3010322
@DeadMG That's good to know.
I'm okay with that but I didn't know of a way to turn that extra parameter with state into lua_CFunction
user3010322
Precisely.
link LLVM and JIT it.
@DeadMG shame a conformant typeid can tell you that the type's name is "Foo Bar Bloody Robbins Puppy Is A Poor Room Owner"
21:42
pussies
@R.MartinhoFernandes Never mind.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Not under the Itanium ABI.
FWIW, even if the output is strictly valid but renders wrongly in most places, I'm still dropping it because that's not useful for me.
@DeadMG Unfortunately, yes, the ABI states that name() must return the address of an NTBS, unique to the type, containing the mangled name of the type. So I cannot troll you any further.
trust me, I know all too well what the Itanium ABI says on all too many things :(
trying right now to refactor Wide to dodge having to be Itanium ABI compliant.
21:44
@DeadMG I will not ever trust you.
Let's see if Mono.Cairo produces more flexible output.
hmmm
alright, this will be about the fifth attempt at this refactor, and if it fails, I am going to finish posting this question.
@DeadMG refactor Wide to doge having to be Itanium ABI compliant.
user3010322
Pull a Microsoft
1
Q: Will my code safely check for an underflow?

Hailiang ZhangI wrote the following C++ code to check for an underflow. Not sure this is a good practice or not. #include <limits> #include <iostream> int main() { float d = 1.e-29; std::cout<<"d: "<<d<<" underflow? "<<(d<std::numeric_limits<float>::min())<<std::endl; d = 1.e-59; std::cout<<...

21:47
such type, very members, much layout in inheritance graph order, so primary bases
seriously, fuck primary bases.
fuck them so hard.
they annoy me.
public SvgSurface(string filename, double width, double height)
FUCK YOU
user3010322
<3
That's the only constructor?
What a piece of shit.
also, the more ABI details I can make Clang do, the less I have to code into Wide itself.
You don't need to be a genius to not ask me for filenames for this shit.
cairo_surface_t *   cairo_svg_surface_create_for_stream (cairo_write_func_t write_func, void *closure, double width_in_points, double height_in_points);
Argh, I don't wanna use the C API.
user3010322
21:51
:3c
user3010322
What's the worst that could happen?
user3010322
Oh god
user3010322
No, not the freezing again
user3010322
Nononono I just fixed you behave, behaaaaaaaaaaave. ;~;
@ThePhD I don't want to write bindings for everything.
user3010322
21:52
Fuckin' intellisense. ._.
If there was a public SvgSurface(IntPtr) constructor...
I could only bind this cairo_svg_surface_create_for_stream and then use the rest of the existing bindings.
But no.
user3010322
Why don
It's filename or GTFO.
user3010322
't you just hack up the library?
right
user3010322
21:52
I'm sure it might be easy to create a secondary overload
I was hacking it inside out.
that might explain why all the previous refactorings failed.
need to start from the start.
user3010322
Ugh...
user3010322
I really don't want to reset my whole computer for this...
Man, this guy's on fire: meta.stackoverflow.com/a/252072/922184
2
Crusade to destroy all non-SO enthusiasts who post on SO. aha
2
Oh well, the base class has most of the functionality, so I guess I can write my own NotRidiculouslyCrippledSvgSurface in ten lines or so.
21:55
Try making the example self-contained. This makes it a lot easier for people to help (I think the SO frequenters well-versed with Spirit enough to bake this into working code can be counted on the fingers of one hand). — sehe 4 secs ago
I'm calling it exactly that.
@Xeo What else are you watching this season?
user3010322
Hm. I have an idea to stop the glitches. If it works, I'm a genius.
> recall the fable of Jebediah
> the Crisp, who cut corners
It's KSP's Jebediah.
21:57
@Mysticial IIRC he only watches Mahouka and NGNL
Why use Monitor and not lock in C#?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Have you checked if there isnt magic values for "filename", like what sqlite does?
Xeo
Xeo
@Mysticial Just what @Stacked said
it's a moneytor
@Xeo lame
21:58
@kbok Sqlite what. Oh my.
But no, there aren't.
Xeo
Xeo
@Mysticial Why?
It's a thin wrapper over cairo_surface_t * cairo_svg_surface_create (const char *filename, double width_in_points, double height_in_points);
@Xeo :)
Xeo
Xeo
I didn't see any other good stuff.
Why there is no thin wrapper over cairo_svg_surface_create_for_stream I don't understand.
21:59
Though those two are the best ones this season AFAICT.
user3010322
9GB Hibernation file...
Xeo
Xeo
Well, except Brynhildr
user3010322
Windows. ~_~
Xeo
Xeo
But I'll just read the manga
user3010322
:O My explorer.exe just took a dive.
21:59
@ThePhD That's isn't bad. I sometimes need a 30GB hiberfil.sys.
@Mysticial Wow. That's toxic
I disagree. People have different opinions of what constitutes a bad question. If people use their time to volunteer help, they should not be punished for disagreeing with your opinion of what is "worthwhile". If the question is bad, it should be downvoted. That - in itself - will drive less traffic to the answers as well. — sehe 2 mins ago
user3010322
@Mysticial How much RAM do you have again, and how much do you use? >.>
How do you hiber, cotton-nate-Joe
@R.MartinhoFernandes Enjoy reading this
user3010322
Whatever, I don't need a taskbar
user3010322
22:01
That's for losers.
Leave my taskbar alone, you heathen..
hmm
@sehe yeah it is. I agree that SO is flooded with bad questions from bad users. But he's definitely a bit far extreme on how to deal with it. :)
I should catch all semantic errors even if you don't generate code.
Oh, I see the 'bad questions' meta is still rumbling on. I may be ratted enough to answer myself later.
user3010322
22:10
... Wat
user3010322
Lua doesn't tell me what to do about the memory it told me to allocate
user3010322
... Do.. do I just leave it there?
user3010322
There's no lua_freeuserdata
@ThePhD There's a GC
user3010322
Even the examples don't show anything...
22:11
@GeorgeStocker We know the difference between can and should. Do you know the difference between intention and perception? — sehe 5 secs ago
The extremely contrived way of holding user data is there to let you not worry about freeing memory
@Mysticial I'm really worried that the voting is in favour? And the comments are even more polarizing... :(
'Cos I'm pretty pissed off with being taken for a joy ride by the repwhores and those morons who want Google text rewritten to avoid the anti-plagiarism scripts at their uni.
@ThePhD __gc metatable
user3010322
22:13
I get that, I get that function call
user3010322
but once I'm inside it, I free the data i have
user3010322
but what about the call I made to lua_newuserdata
lua handles that
user3010322
T** s = static_cast<T**>( lua_newuserdata( L, sizeof( T* ) ) );
user3010322
It's got it under cntrol?
22:13
yes
user3010322
I guess so. :c
@ThePhD My main workstation has 32GB. My big one has 64 GB. But I can't hibernate on the big one anyway.
user3010322
@Mysticial Geez. Packing big firepower.
Xeo
Xeo
@ThePhD Compensating etc.
Damn, I wanted to get some Japanese done today, and it's already past midnight again. sigh
Wot? You mean he has a really small... power supply?
22:17
@sehe I basically boils down to 4 different camps with different interests:
1. The "enthusiasts and caretakers" that want to keep the site clean and with good content.
2. The help vampires who flood the site with bad/duplicate questions who only want their question answered and care nothing for the site.
3. The "repwhores" who answer everything they can (or can't).
4. The ones who just stopped giving a shit.
@Xeo Or maybe he grew up used to having big things.
They aren't mutually exclusive. But 2 and 3 love each other. 1 hates both 2 and 3. 3 hates 1 for treating them badly.
Xeo
Xeo
@Mysticial #4, reporting in!
Fuck 'em all.
user3010322
Where's camp #5 - chat leech ?
user3010322
22:19
I deserve a category for me too!
@sehe I agree with his statement, although not his reasoning behind it.
> "If the answer encourages bad behavior, it is definitely not useful." - disputable, and many times highly subjective. There are good means to discourage bad behaviour. Analogously, would you say that not running over a pedestrian who runs the traffic-light is "encouraging bad behaviour"? I say, stop trying to control and judge others. — sehe 43 secs ago
The Tribute in here is great. I can feel the dire miasma of the linked-list questions blowing away.
The point is, the OP is trying to get a "generally usable guideline". You cannot generalizingly say "all answers to bad questions should be downvoted". If that were true, "bad" questions should simply be insta-closed.
hm
I feel that's missing a certain distinction.
the original questioner explicitly states that they are too broad.
so the impression I've got is "Questions that really should be closed but simply haven't been yet because not enough people with close vote powers have seen them yet".
22:22
Dammit, cannot find libcairo-2.dll
@Mysticial Who would be the last? (Would they be important to the site? I would not consider them users, actually)
as opposed to merely "Questions I think are bad".
Learn how to debug you fucking bastards:(
I'm going to give two different answers in these two situations.
I think that's fair enough.
Xeo
Xeo
22:24
6 mins ago, by Xeo
@Mysticial #4, reporting in!
@Xeo I saw that
Xeo
Xeo
welp, time to sleep
@Mysticial Definitely feeling #4 here.
else I'd, y'know, get out and answer questions or review edits or someshit like that.
What's the difference between a mutex and a critical section?
Windows mutexes are interprocess, and critical sections are intraprocess.
the interprocess mutex almost always requires a kernel-mode context switch for virtually every operation, IIRC, so it's much slower.
22:29
iirc critical section is windows terminology for mutex
@Mysticial IMO, split into 1a. Enthusiasts who want good content, and 1b. Caretakers who want to remove bad content.
although, i also read the critical section is more advanced than the typical mutex (starts as spin lock and decays into mutex.. iirc)
they do have a brief busy loop
it saves much time when there isn't much congestion on the lock.
Oh, mutexes are inter-process? Is this why they have security attributes?
yes.
22:31
Okay
they can also be named and other interprocess stuff.
critical sections can't do any of that- they are your basic "My program needs a lock to synchronize threads".
So POSIX mutex = Python Lock = Windows critical sections
@DeadMG I've never known how to deal with the cruft of the review queues. That stuff is killing my interest, so I don't pay it any attention. I selfishly trawl the tags that I want to learn more about.
@kbok equating, mmm. But basically, yeah
0
A: Why is Stack Overflow so negative of late?

Mysticial Why is Stack Overflow so negative of late? I hate to pile on, but I couldn't resist summarizing the problem. And I apologize ahead of time for any potentially offensive language that I might use. Basically there are 4 camps of users on Stack Overflow: The "enthusiasts and caretakers" who ...

^^ There we go.
Feel free to comment on what camp you're in.
> 1 and 2 have all the moderation powers, but only 1 cares to use them.
that should be 1 and 3.
22:34
fixed
@Mysticial ポジティブがいいです。
> 2 and 3 love each other. They should get married.
lol
@StackedCrooked and have lots of 2.5 babies? :P
yeah that would be something
@DeadMG afaik, they are only interprocess when they have names.
2 and 3 are like the adam and eve of prime numbers
but they never managed to have any prime offspring
22:42
All linked-list posters should die of degenerative disease that sets their DNA to null over 5 years.
Begging for a diagram :) (Also love the self-referential entrance: "I hate to"... :)) — sehe 9 mins ago
@sehe We need to get @R.MartinhoFernandes on it!
> the problem is - this site attracting them in great numbers. With all these shiny badges and rep points that never attract a mature person but always make a teenager inspired.
touché badge awarded
So, the DLL file gets found and mapped correctly, but LoadLibrary still fails?
In the early days SO had a very different atmosphere.
It was like a dawn of a new age.
Or something.
To hell with SVGs, then.
@EtiennedeMartel On what?
@sehe The diagrams, of course.
He's an expert at drawing diagrams.
There you go
Aha, someone in the Anime room is also making a diagram.
^^ Still WIP
@Mysticial lol
22:58
@sehe Not as cool as @R.MartinhoFernandes's free hand stuff.
@sehe I give you permission to edit that into my answer.
Cheers :)
I should frequent that room more often.
I have question /1 on the anime SE after all :P

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