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Good morning ;) Доброе утро. labas rytas. Dzień dobry.
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh right. Is he feeling ok?
@Klasik no ಠ_ಠ
@thecoshman why?
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... I'm sure.
@thecoshman Why wouldn't he?
11:02
@R.MartinhoFernandes he put effort into something 'pointless'.
@sudorm-rfTelkitty Its a flying boat
yeah, I think I need to start over with my thinking on this.
which one: the plane or the swan :p
@tony hello Tony :)
11:12
heeeeeeellllooooo
@Jefffrey ou nice to meet you :)
@sudorm-rfTelkitty oh man, that's a lot
"safer than the car" my ass
Are you joking?
kinda
Car crashes are commonplace.
That says a lot.
They're "normal".
11:14
fatal car crashes are not
They are too.
there's no such a thing as a non-fatal plain crash
sure, if you are in plan crash it is more likely to be a fatal one, but you are so much more likely to be in a car crash, even a fatal one, even if you are not in a car.
tl;dr cars are dangerous
That's far from exhaustive, obviously.
yes, you have to consider that for long flights the amount of time you would be required to do in car is exponentially longer (therefore more risks)
11:16
It only lists somewhat notable ones.
what's a 'high death tool'?
@thecoshman Seems to be "double digits".
@R.MartinhoFernandes why quote? are they some how dubious double digits? like 01 deaths?
but you also have to consider that there are a shitload more cars than planes
@thecoshman There are a few sevens and eights.
@Jefffrey That's one of the things that makes them unsafe.
You don't board more than one car at once.
11:19
@R.MartinhoFernandes true, but I'm talking about comparing the number of car crashes to plane crashes is not fair
obviously
@Jefffrey you seem to be glossing over the face that very few people die from planes without being in the plane. Few incidents aside (alright, calm down america) it just doesn't happen.
@Jefffrey yes it is.
Adjusting the values for the number of cars/planes because it gives you pretty useless results.
"If we had tons more planes, you should avoid flying because it's dangerous"
nope. brain just isn't working to day.
11:20
Or "if we had tons less cars, cars would be incredibly safe"
@R.MartinhoFernandes no, I mean that 10 plane crashes a year and 10 car crashes a year are not the same thing, you have to compare (total planes / planes crashes) and (total cars / total car crashes)
which seems pretty obvious
When people say "planes are safe", they usually mean "travelling by plane is safe".
@Jefffrey And those ratios are meaningful how?
user1804599
_.throttle is so nice.
@R.MartinhoFernandes they tell you how much are you risking ?
guys I know that tree control don't have indexes as list control, but then how I can write condition? (if selected what I want do something)
11:22
I think the most useful safety metrics here are things like "what are the chances of me being in a fatal accident if I board a car/a plane".
@Jefffrey total planes and total cares are irrelevant for that. You only board one plane or one car at a time.
But, even though you board only one car, all the other zillions of them are still around.
@R.MartinhoFernandes you are a fatal accident either way :P
Hmm....
Is it possible to get IETF RFCs in some form that is printer-friendly?
@R.MartinhoFernandes possibility of an event is = ( number of times A event happens / total number of tests )
@R.MartinhoFernandes I can agree with you that it's not accurate applied to this problem, but it's certainly more accurate than comparing only the number of car crashes per year and the number of plane crashes per year
@Jefffrey And the number of cars is by far not an accurate measure of that.
Guise... I'm flying soon, this is not helping
11:26
Do you know that in the UK, during rush hour, most cars are actually parked?
@R.MartinhoFernandes on the road? in a traffic jam
@TonyTheLion No, parked.
In a parking lot.
Number of cars is just wrong here.
@R.MartinhoFernandes total number of cars = estimated (average) number of cars currently on the road during a 24 hour period
you take the number of cars every minute of the day for a month and you do an average of those numbers
11:28
And what is the meaning of those numbers?
then you calculate how many people per car are there
I guess something along the lines of 2/3 considering busses
and you get the number of people that are (in average) on the road per year
Cars are extremely wasteful.
and what about the huge amount of people who die whilst walking along the road?
11:29
then you do the same for planes
The average number of passengers is less than 2.
and finally you compare how many of those people died in both cases
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, that's ok, it's irrelevant to the point in question (which is how would I go about calculating the risk of planes and cars)
then you apply this:
6 mins ago, by Jefffrey
@R.MartinhoFernandes possibility of an event is = ( number of times A event happens / total number of tests )
@Jefffrey But as you can now see, the way you would go about it is not related to the number of cars.
and you get the chance that you have to die in a car or a plane
Only to the number of people travelling.
11:32
forgot about the people really. How many flights crash per year, how many cars are fatally crashed per year? you're talking maybe a dozen flights compared to thousands of car crashes. Sure, try to factor in the time spent fliyng per year compared to the time spent driving. I'd say you are still showing that cars are by far more accident prone.
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, I'll give you that
it's easier to get the number of people traveling
@thecoshman Is that a useful metric?
What does it tell you if you want to make a choice based on it?
I just went the way of counting the cars and then calculating the average of people per car to get to the same point
@thecoshman Deaths per mile, deaths per hour, deaths per passenger are useful. Crashes per year is mostly sensationalistic.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'd say so. I don't see how the number of people traveling matters. It's the form of travel itself you want to look at. Fatal crashes tend to be fatal for all involved. If you worry about numbers involved, would you not end up showing that two forms of transport that crash just as often, the one with less people is 'safer', because less die per crash, but it is just as likely to crash.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I meant crashes where people die.
11:35
@thecoshman But crashes per year tells you nothing useful!
Rate of crashing.
This is awesome. ^
user1804599
Always travel by bike.
user1804599
Most agile.
11:36
@R.MartinhoFernandes I said factor in the miles travelled per year too
@R.MartinhoFernandes which was my point from the beginning
@thecoshman Now you just made the "per year" bit irrelevant.
so you are talk avg(crashes)/avg(travel distance)
were you trolling me or something?
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, but you can't take 'for ever' as safety standards change.
11:37
@thecoshman Er, "per year" is "forever" as well.
well, I'm hungry, brb
Unless you meant to use "number of crashes in 2013" as a metric.
@R.MartinhoFernandes sort of, yeah.
@Jefffrey Nah. But you started by being surprised about the absolute number of plane accidents listed.
@thecoshman Then you're dumb.
It's silly.
"100 planes crashed in 2013. That means travelling by plane is safe/unsafe."
Really?
@R.MartinhoFernandes of course not
I'm not exactly giving this my full attention.
Trying to think of this other thing, but clearly that isn't going to well either.
I'll give you that crashes per year may be a useful metric if you work in the plane business.
It's also important whether you should only consider trips where both are viable means of transportation.
i.e. should you count trips to the pub on the other side of town for the car numbers?
well, it's going to a dirty figure anyway
do you factor in malicious attacks?
11:43
do you factor in population densities?
@thecoshman Factor what?
no wonder they call it "taking a trip" when taking some drugs are concerned ... in case you get into an "accident" & never come back ...
:p
Malicious attacks are already in your crash data.
Nothing to factor.
Should you count the trip to the airport?
well, I guess 'am I going to die from this flight' act of god or twat doesn't really matter :P
I've seen results that actually give more risk to the drive to the airport than the flight itself.
11:44
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, that probably just a play on the 'planes are safer than cars' thing.
unless you are saying you've seen some data that has shown that X% of people drove to a flight, and landed safely and y% died on the drive there.
Still, other things to consider are the location you are travelling.
@thecoshman it was using deaths per mile.
I'm sure there are some places where planes are more deadly.
I am by no means an expert in C++, but couldn't they use generics for this? — T. Kiley 2 hours ago
generics
@thecoshman And it's a matter of not reading more than is written there too :P. A high risk for a short time vs a low risk for a long time sort of thing.
Say, if deaths/mile is 5 times higher for the car trip, but the plane trip covers 10 times more distance, you'll see twice as many deaths in flight as in the trip to the airport.
So what is the probability I survive an 11 hour flight? :P
11:50
Incredibly high.
that's just the average though :P
you bastard
lol 11 hour flight, good luck bro
11:52
tell me you love me before you go :3
@TonyTheLion Airliners have a rate of ~4 deaths per million of flight hours.
you just have to hope 4 died in the last million flight hours
@R.MartinhoFernandes Wow.
@Jefffrey :/
ow ow ow, hot tea is hot
user1804599
11:56
@TonyTheLion extremely high.
@jalf Cold tea is horrible, though.
user1804599
If the plane crashes, it's not a flight anymore. :P
@R.MartinhoFernandes yes
@rightfold You're slow, late and terrible.
When are you going on an 11 hour flight?
user1804599
11:57
@TonyTheLion Ik was nog niet uitgepraat, mongool.
@rightfold hahaha
@jalf When I go on holiday across the Atlantic at the end of the month
@TonyTheLion Sweet, sounds like fun
(the holiday, not the flight)
bring earplugs
yea well, if I could teleport, I would
but that don't work
yet
11:58
@jalf They speak loudly on the other side of the Atlantic?
@R.MartinhoFernandes No, but the probability of screaming children on a flight is proportional with its duration, for some reason
oh yea
I have noise cancelling headphones
and good music
On cross continental flights, it's not a matter of if, but of how many and how close to you they're seated
good
So where are you going? "Across the Atlantic" is kind of broad :)
LA - San Fran
12:00
Sweet
bit of sunshine
Humans live for some 700k hours. If you lived all your life on a plane, you'd die 2.8 times during that time. Conclusion: what the fuck am I doing.
8
nice math skills
Standard robot feature.
So, has anyone teamed up for the Jam?
I can't take part during Saturday and I'll maybe want to sleep on Sunday.
there has been a second lounge game jam?
I've missed one of the first two
aww just what SG13 is doing? I wanna use the std 2d graphics library
12:33
@Abyx there weren't serious about it, were they?
@Jefffrey well they are serious. at least there is a study group
I'm not taking part in the Jam
what, you're not tasty enough?
meat jam, huh?
@DeadMG hahaha
12:46
nobody wants to eat tony jam cause he's not tasty.
can't be fruit Jam coz not sweet enough >_<
you know, it suddenly occurs to me that that has all manner of wrong ways to read it.
user1804599
:/
also, I farted.
12:55
I took an epic shit this morning.
I don't do epic shits anymore
Do you even poop?
yes, even I have to do that from time to time.
just not as frequently as a normal person
yea
Have we really nothing better to converse about than poop?
I mean, its kind of shitty.
I'm kinda feeling like shit so
I had the temerity to consume food this morning
but at least I didn't wake up in horrible pain like yesterday.
12:57
@Jefffrey Probably the first one. It was announced half an hour before it started. List here: loungecpp.net/w/Category:Game_Jams
DeadMG won!
?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol @ v
We didn't pick a winner. It was fun.
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah possible
@R.MartinhoFernandes I can claim victory as much as I want.
I won an award, that's something.
12:59
Me too!
Worst code fuckup!
:S
congratulations on your win my friend
I won nothing and lost nothing
I am hereby victorious in my own right
you just are victory?
Yea, I am victory
what?
user1804599
13:03
lol
+1, better than the conspiracy of the metacharacters :) — Casimir et Hippolyte 21 mins ago
user1804599
@sehe dat API. :v
should have boost::regex_match(std::string&&) = delete;
i have done the same thing that reading a file line by line then used the string::find function to find the substring but i am checking for the other way with Boost. Thanks — user3400364 5 hours ago
In the interest of completely spoiling clueless askers and "Learn A New Boost Algorithm Everyday" here is "the other way" [sic] with Boost. Think of it as simplistic grep that works better for larger patterns — sehe 20 secs ago
@DeadMG In fact, just take the string by value always. The thing is likely that it takes a "Range". And that would require sfinae to unmatch reference types
user1804599
I am going to try YouTrack.
user1804599
13:13
JIRA is terrible.
if you call the constructor of a type, like t(...), should I highlight that as a function call, or just leave t as a type?
well I guess you call the constructor, so
Er
@DeadMG Hmm, highlight as a constructor!
@R.MartinhoFernandes What, have a distinct highlight just for constructors?
@DeadMG Not sure if it's a good idea but just throwing it in the bucket.
hmm
nah
a constructor call is just a function call.
they don't get their own highlight
also I need to introduce highlights for analyzer primitives you can call, cause right now I can only do a function highlight if you call a user-defined function.
user1804599
13:38
YouTrack is about ten times as fast as JIRA is.
and generally
handle errors for OR
cause right now the only error you can get is the string "Fuck" or debug break.
and more generally, purge all runtime_error from my codebase.
preferably debug breaks too.
and also display more information in quickinfo, like parameter/function local/member variable/etc.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think so :P
13:46
I should probably do a round of prodding on the FILE_NOT_FOUND folks about the unconference.
@R.MartinhoFernandes maybe... at the end of the day though, it's up to them if they want to be 404 saps.
14:05
Full Metal Havok More Sexy N Intelligent Than Spock And All The Superheroes Combined With Frostnova.
April fool's coming soon @_@
what do his friends call him?
// silly white space (and no I did not nearly swap the w for an s)
willy white space?
14:12
what?
Dunedin is a city in New Zealand?
Xeo
Xeo
This is great.
That place really is Middle Earth. (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%BAnedain)
A New Zeland man
Recently rejected names include King, Princess, Majesty, Knight, Justice, Anal, Mafia No Fear, Lucifer, V8, 89, full stop and *.
lol, *
select * from names :))
user1804599
14:20
Dat query.
It is thought that beneath the ice sheet Greenland may be three separate islands. Whether the places where the ice-bedrock boundary reaches below the sea level are land or sea is a matter of definition. The usual definition is that Greenland is one major island.
Hmmm.
uh oh, what are you planning now? melt the ice sheet and watch war break out among the ~60K people over the islands?
If you notice what's missing from the starboard, please re-add
@melak47 The Greenland ice sheet is 7m of sea level.
Melting it would cause a lot more damage than "The Battle of Greenland".
Also, fuck, I'm trapped in wikipedia. This hasn't happened in a long time.
14:36
TVTropes is still alive too
if you want to change trap :P
I like "m of sea level" as a measure of ice sheet volume, even though it's not very regular (another sheet of the same volume and mass as the Greenland ice sheet would not equate to 7m of sea level after melting the first one).
@rightfold jira is awesome
user1804599
Nah.
user1804599
It's cluttered and slow.
Not sure how you use it but it was pretty nice. Far from slow.. only slow when our design team was downloading porn I guess
but that's unrelated
user1804599
14:42
It requires a hundred clicks to find the issue you want.
You can make custom filter and saved them... and the keyboard shortcuts
user1804599
And the Agile board functionality was glitched as hell.
user1804599
Similar to Gmail.
user1804599
You move things, refresh and they're not moved.
I use jira at work and well it's ok but I can't say "it's awesome"
14:43
when did you last use it?
user1804599
Today.
user1804599
Just switched to YouTrack about an hour ago.
7 months ago it was great
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix it isn't slow when it's running on sufficiently powerful hardware, no.
Let's just say it feels a lot like Java in terms of hardware reqs.
I don't know... it worked pretty well with around 500 issues in the agile board
I had to write queries to not have to scroll for years but it was fine
14:46
I had to write queries to not have to scroll for years but it was fine
rofl.
user1804599
@jalf that applies to everything. :P
One month since Lightness Pyramid
user1804599
I should only find out how to customize the dashboard.
the widgets you can put on your dashboard were useful except the Burndown graphs weren't working because our manager was to lazy to create project versions etc
It took all of five minutes to set up during a funny conversation in the SO "lounge" chat room. Perhaps I'll find a use for it once I've got done everything else that's on my todo list.
sureeeee
14:48
@rightfold Yes. But it applies a lot more to Java software. :)
@LightnessRacesinOrbit link?
user3010322
This most likely won't build by itself and is provided as-is and completely unsupported. Feel free to use it for your reference, incorporate it into your projects or send us modifications.
user3010322
=[[[
user3010322
But, at least it's there!
I think I'm starting to like firefox tab groups
14:51
Maintenance is for schmucks, not game programmers.
That said, that thing is outdated as heck, so.
Argh, QString is retarded
whole qt is retarded
Its const char* constructor assumes the input to be ASCII
because no C++1y
14:52
@jalf It can't really do much else, honestly.
Oh, and it's not marked explicit, so you get lots of fun "invisible" surprise mangling of your strings
@jalf Ahahahahahaha, NO!
const char* is completely broken
I've been over this with someone here.
ISTR it was you, @jalf, but maybe I'm wrong.
@ThePhD it's shit anyway
14:53
@DeadMG it could use an overload with an utf8_tag
It is defined as doing the as the fromAscii function.
But!
@DeadMG It could do lots of things. It could make it explicit. Or it could not define the constructor at all, and force you to specify an encoding. Or it could guess an encoding from your current locale
That's a far cry from being "assumes the input to be ASCII" since fromAscii does not, in fact, convert from ASCII.
@R.MartinhoFernandes yep, it probably was
Note that, despite the name, this function actually uses the codec defined by QTextCodec::setCodecForCStrings() to convert str to Unicode. Depending on the codec, it may not accept valid US-ASCII (ANSI X3.4-1986) input. If no codec has been set, this function does the same as fromLatin1().
14:54
@R.MartinhoFernandes true, but that doesn't help much :p
It's like a really bad joke.
but it's cute!
fromLatin1 does at least do what its fucking name says.
@ThePhD that thing combines everything valve decided isn't going to work for them
Jan 16 at 10:54, by jalf
hmm, yeah, might have to see if I can lobby for QT_NO_CAST_FROM_ASCII. That seems like the least broken option
@jalf Yep :)
14:58
Yeah, but I'm going to rant about it repeatedly every time I encounter the problem :p
why doesn't std::any exists yet?

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