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1:00 PM
The UI language is perfect default for picking your UI language.
The locale isn't.
 
@ScarletAmaranth Well, I've thrown some pics these past few days. Full diffuse and glossy GI (but high end only PCs, and not of the highest resolution because memory constrictions), and deferring back to just diffuse global illumination in real time with a special SSR method and scene probes preconvolved (stored as equirectangular textures, higher than just 128x128 per cube face, also less seam computations).
 
How would you get the locale?
 
C lib functions, I guess.
 
> In computing, a locale is a set of parameters that defines the user's language, country and any special variant preferences that the user wants to see in their user interface. Usually a locale identifier consists of at least a language identifier and a region identifier.
 
@ScarletAmaranth to visual for me. I hate having to "find out" where on the screen my file stuff is today.
 
1:01 PM
All I know is that those applications are broken. Would file a bug if I cared.
 
If Windows is not matching the locale correctly, that's its fault
 
Paths FTW. Filespecs and globs FTW. Scripts FTW. History recall FTW.
 
@ElimGarak imma dig out some of those pics :P
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Uh no
 
Returns the language identifier for the user UI language for the current user. If the current user has not set a language, GetUserDefaultUILanguage returns the preferred language set for the system.
 
1:01 PM
Locale is not a one setting
 
sounds legit, so what's the problem?
 
@CatPlusPlus Never said it is
 
Dig deeper for the rest.
 
user406009
1:02 PM
Maybe we should start Kyrostat again.
 
It's not a problem with Windows
 
How so?
 
user406009
Elect Elim as our glorious supreme leader.
 
Why would you think it is?
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Windows is set up just how I want it. Nothing wrong with it.
 
1:03 PM
1 min ago, by ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ
> In computing, a locale is a set of parameters that defines the user's language, country and any special variant preferences that the user wants to see in their user interface. Usually a locale identifier consists of at least a language identifier and a region identifier.
 
Stupid applications make the wrong choice. Everything wrong with them.
 
1 min ago, by ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ
If Windows is not matching the locale correctly, that's its fault
 
Ugh that fucking Wikipedia quoting again
Matching the locale to what
 
Is that the wikipedia definition?
 
What does that even mean
 
1:03 PM
@Lalaland I have some bad memories regarding Kyrostat, just as we were heating up, I lost someone close. Also, the attention span of Loungers would require a ten fold stretching for something of the scope of Kyrostat. Loved the brainstorming sessions, though.
 
There are distinct settings for UI language and number formatting, date formatting etc
 
Under that definition, my "locale" consists of English language and German style numbers and dates.
 
In POSIX locales and Windows
 
@Lalaland no
 
@Lalaland You can't start something up that isn't dead.
 
1:04 PM
So, fuck those applications for being broken.
 
Jul 21 '12 at 19:23, by Domagoj Pandža
nagila hava, nagila venish me ha.
Welcome back
 
@CatPlusPlus Matching the locale returned by "C lib functions, I guess" match the one the user set in its preferences.
 
I thought you can set the locale & the preferred language when you install windows on your machine?
 
@sehe Sup.
 
:D
 
1:04 PM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ What
 
do not attempt to build a group to do something then do it. Start doing it then see who you can inspire to join you.
 
Just because I want to see "€1", doesn't mean I want to see "Speichern".
 
@ElimGarak Oh. Shit. You're Dom.
 
@CatPlusPlus What don't you understand? Come on cat, be cooperative, jesus.
 
1:04 PM
I see the problem and that's "I have no idea how i18n/l10n works"
So good luck with that
 
@ElimGarak Ive skimmed over the recent stuff - is the picture with a monitor that shows WIN Metro from the engine as well?
 
yesterday, by sehe
It just hit me. Is Elim a Domagoj incarnation?
 
@ScarletAmaranth Yup, but that's pretty old. From January, when Windows 10 didn't get its final UI. Also, that's programmer art. Hardly representative of what can be done.
 
Maybe he can say "we".
 
@ElimGarak well there's your problem, too big a scope.
 
1:06 PM
Who of you madmen are on twitter?
I need your nonsense constantly.
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ The C lib functions can't handle it. They're kinda garbage and so are the applications that use them.
 
@ElimGarak programmer art best art; just proceduraly generate everything!
 
(In POSIX it comes down to not using LC_ALL like an idiot when there's more specific setting set)
 
@thecoshman Have you guys actually limited the scope in the meantime or is Nooble joking?
 
1:07 PM
> The international support built into Windows empowers you to implement many scenarios with less engineering overhead than ever before.
 
user406009
@ElimGarak The project has been deader than dead.
 
First time I see something about empowerment in a non-feminist studies context.
 
@Lalaland That sounds like the Lounge I remember!
 
Kyrostat is dead. RIP
 
@EtiennedeMartel Empowering the toddlers
 
1:08 PM
But in my time, it was the most organized thing ever attempted here. Which was impressive for a while. Lots of energy. We were all pretty lazy, prior. Making fun of Telkitty.
 
@ElimGarak we've done basically nothing
 
@ElimGarak Little changed, honestly.
 
user406009
I think we should try again.
 
who the hell is lalaland?
 
We did
Twice
 
1:09 PM
@ElimGarak to be honest I am surprised she's been avoiding plonklists for this long
 
Also different projects
 
If at first you can't succeed, try again harder.
 
@thecoshman what planet are you on?
 
Kyrostat isn't dead.
 
Kyrostat will forever be not dead
 
1:09 PM
he's been here for days
 
Blah blah.
 
@TonyTheLion yeah, but is it some new guy?
 
user406009
@TonyTheLion Years.
 
@thecoshman I remember him from before.
 
user406009
I take long breaks between activity though.
 
user406009
1:10 PM
One year on, one year off sorta thing.
 
@Lalaland I've tried taking a break...
and failed
 
Kyrostat will forever live in our hearts. So long as one of us is still alive, Kyrostat will live on.
 
@Lalaland then I reserve the right to not give a fuck
 
@TonyTheLion IRTA as taking a bartek
 
Coming up on five years in the Lounge
We should celebrate 5 years of Lounge.
 
1:10 PM
@Lalaland So you switch jobs every year?
 
Coming up on 1 year of Lounge.
 
Sometimes, this place is really entertaining. Taking a break is good.
I never expected such a community deep inside SO.
 
one does not need to nuke oneself to take a break tho :P
 
I never took a break. You're all weaklings.
 
If I didn't, I'd come back tomorrow.
 
1:12 PM
Latency.
 
I never expected such a community deep inside your vagina
 
bartek -> bratek -> bretak -> break
levenstein distance : 3
 
I took a break once. For a week. People thought I was dead.
 
wolfenstein distance
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, we were super worried.
 
user406009
1:13 PM
Anyways, I've been much more active since I started working on my extension.
 
It was a shame, though. I was just starting to roll on math.SE... This thing is still standing:
17
A: "Wild" exponents of $e$

Domagoj PandžaWrote a few articles on the subject, so I took the time to edit this answer to be even more intuitive. Again, in the interest of readability and usefulness to newcomers, rigorous formality has been rescinded for the duration of this post. The normal distribution, informally also known as the G...

 
user406009
It makes checking the starboard more fun.
 
Shit, I liked long answers. Break was the best thing to do.
 
@ElimGarak Whatever happened to not revealing your identity?
 
@Nooble Because sehe caught on.
 
1:14 PM
elim is domagoj?
 
@ElimGarak you didn't think that someone might catch on?
 
> SecretInternetDude
 
@ElimGarak You're wrong. Pi is 4 is kinematic situations.
 
@TonyTheLion I knew someone would catch on, I wanted to return, but have some fun too :P
 
1:15 PM
@ElimGarak :)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes as far as I care, this is now robot 2.0
 
Also, coshman:
namespace {
const std::string PROGRAM_FOLDER("/kyrostat");
const std::string USER_DATA_APPEND("/.local");
const std::string EXE_LINK("/proc/self/exe");
Ha.
A remnant.
 
fuck everyone who doesn't construct with curlies
 
@ElimGarak huh which what?
 
1:17 PM
@ScarletAmaranth std::string fuck <% "you" %>;
 
@ElimGarak oooh
yeah, I've not touched that in ages
 
@ScarletAmaranth Curlies are evil.
 
@Potatoswatter why is it so hard for people to just switch to T{} ...
@R.MartinhoFernandes curlies are the best thing since sliced bread
 
@ScarletAmaranth because it doesn't always work
 
fuck curlies
 
1:18 PM
I switched to not C++
 
> Perl 5.2%
 
@ScarletAmaranth Because that's evil.
 
I use my curlies whilst fucking…
 
user406009
@CatPlusPlus Rust?
 
hahaha no
 
1:19 PM
it sometimes even makes you not implicitly convert, yey - yeeey...
 
lolrust
 
yeeey
where is the hype?
 
> sometimes
 
user406009
It's basically like a revised version of C++.
 
Died along with other dinosaurs
 
1:20 PM
That's pretty much all that is evil with curlies in one word. "Sometimes"
 
I am still hardcore C++, it was a bit boring following the updated specs without you guys, tho.
 
user406009
Same general principles, but without backwards compatability issues, so they can fix the little inconsistencies.
 
I wish that was true
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah perhaps, but seeing curlies switches me to "this is initialization" rather than why am I calling /d eclaring something here kind of mindset
 
It's annoying and looks like poop
 
1:21 PM
Where's AgainstASicilian?
 
Hopefully far away
 
Braces look like aggregates. Parens look like function calls. Use braces when aggregating values together. Use parens when listing the parameters to a function.
 
@ScarletAmaranth So it's just aesthetics? Pure evil.
 
Fixed up things you pointed out, is this good enough for API reference?
 
@Lalaland lol
@Lalaland It's basically almost, but not quite, entirely unlike C++.
 
user406009
1:22 PM
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes that and implicit un-conversions :P
 
If it's related to C++, it's most likely bad
 
@CatPlusPlus isn't everything related to C++? oh I see what you did there...
 
user406009
C++ and Rust are both object oriented, statically typed, GC-less languages.
 
user406009
I consider that similar enough in purpose.
 
1:23 PM
lol
 
lol OO
 
My family has been here a long, long time...
 
Also lol GC-less
 
user406009
@CatPlusPlus Are you claiming C++ isn't OO?
 
You Blew it
 
1:24 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Would you like to help review my new batch of proposals? You had some opinions earlier…
 
C++ is O.O
5
 
user406009
@CatPlusPlus I guess I should have been more specific "optional-GC".
 
@ElimGarak Is this becoming a meme?
 
@Potatoswatter I could have a look around Thursday, maybe.
 
C++ is like torture, you know its wrong, but sometimes you got no choice.
 
1:25 PM
@Lalaland It has primitive sugar for bits of OO that even C can manage fine
 
So, somebody stole a cap from my car's wheel. Who do I talk to get another one?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Sure. I should set up a webpage instead of bugging folks on email and chat :P
 
@ElimGarak report to the police. buy a new one, put it on, finished
 
@TonyTheLion Except you can use LSD instead and get even the truth about the origin of the universe
 
@Potatoswatter was the "moving from initializer lists" I saw a few days ago here yours?
 
1:26 PM
Really annoyed when that happens.
 
@TonyTheLion "yes sir, we'll get right on that..."
 
@sehe, it was the social anxiety & seeming to have been here long time ago wasn't it?
 
@ScarletAmaranth Yep. I've revised it a bit further if you re-load the same link: bit.ly/mov-il (PDF)
 
@ElimGarak Don't. Remove the 3 other ones. They're useless
 
I like to mov-il mov-il
 
user406009
1:27 PM
@CatPlusPlus If you want to get really pedantic, most languages are just "primative sugar" around parts that could have been programmed manually in C or Assembly.
 
user406009
And I guess OO was wrong there. Rust doesn't support OO.
 
@Lalaland No that has little to do with that
 
@chmod711telkitty :3
 
Suspects, but these have a higher IQ.
 
user406009
1:28 PM
Still, Rust and C++ both are competing for the same place.
 
@Lalaland lol ITT yet another one that talks about Rust before knowing anything about it.
Hype FTW.
 
OO is about messaging and loose coupling, C++ defaults to static single dispatch I mean come on
 
It still supports messaging
And loose coupling
 
hahaha "loose"
 
Snapchat is all about messaging and loose coupling.
 
1:29 PM
@CatPlusPlus multimethods suck... just saying
 
OO is about buzzword and enterprise
 
user406009
@Mr.kbok Having code and data together can be useful.
 
user406009
Makes some API's easier to understand and use.
 
You don't need OO for that
 
GitLab backups are incompatible with different patch version numbers.
 
1:31 PM
They're not any more together than free functions and their arguments are
 
Fuck Rubyists.
 
No! Ruby is a gem!
 
Alright, GitHub is back.
 
don't push it around
 
Also, somebody inform GitHub that placeholders are not replacements for labels.
 
1:32 PM
Hipsters dont care
 
user406009
I think being able to say tree.find(x) is more intuitive than find(tree, x). Even if it's just syntactical sugar.
 
Mostly irrelevant
 
user406009
Similarly, lambda functions are sometimes more intuitive, even if they are no more powerful than free functions + std::bind.
 
anyone wants to bet on when will LRiO come back
 
Should be find(x, tree)
 
1:33 PM
Makes for an easier autocomplete trigger and that's about it
 
user406009
@chmod711telkitty Perhaps he's already here and we just don't it.
 
user406009
Under a new name.
 
Lambdas are about actual physical code locality
 
user406009
@CatPlusPlus So is OO.
 
Uh no
 
1:34 PM
Similarly, using TSP in your code flow because you need to execute a series of statements and you inserted too many gotos is a sign of high code quality
 
@Lalaland Lambda functions are more powerful because they can see locally defined types.
 
@chmod711telkitty Never.
 
There's no difference in locality between struct x { int v; int whatever(); }; and struct x { int v; }; int whatever(x*);
 
my code is O(N^2) but reading it is NP-complete
 
@MarcoA. travelling salesman problem
 
1:35 PM
Also OO is not about that by any stretch
 
user406009
And there is no difference between: int foo(int blah) {// whatever;} std::bind(foo, blah) and [blah](){//whatever}
 
@Lalaland There is
 
C++ having fields is already not OO enough
 
The first one has unmatched parens
 
I think when we started Kyrostat, everyone was just all high from getting lambdas and shit implemented, so they managed to throw them in every chance they got. And someone defined placeholder input handler lambdas in one of the files, before we even had shit.
 
1:36 PM
I'm bored
 
eat some more salad
 
Also tired
 
@CatPlusPlus How much wake time?
 
I've slept for like 2 hours
 
1:37 PM
32 hours here. And I have some heart issues, so I shouldn't be doing this shit. But I'm mentally retarded.
 
user406009
Guys, sleep is important.
 
@ElimGarak Ok.
@Lalaland Nah.
 
why are you not sleeping?
 
> I'm mentally retarded.
5
 
Don't sleep now, that would be a waste of time.
 
1:38 PM
We had a meeting with accounting advisor in the morning
 
user406009
> Because people are wong on the internet.
 
Bad schedule streaks are bad
 
@ElimGarak here you are
I'm so funny today, perhaps I should die in a fire
 
@MarcoA. That would be funny too.
 
I slept 10 hours yesterday & going to do the same today. I might have hay fever or possibly caught a flu. My nose & throat are killing me. Building one new house is enough, I will not personally do another one in a long long time. Such hard work
 
1:40 PM
People are selling EA roguelikes for 20€
 
Those construction dusts
 
Oh… is anyone else attending Kona?
 
I'll probably take a sleep soon. Been working on preparing data sets for generating a sufficient approximation for some soft shadow calculations (from analytical area lights)
 
Any chance of splitting a room? Rooms in Kona are not cheap.
 
ITT: people wonder why I suck at programming competitions if they schedule them at 3.00 a.m. my time
 
1:41 PM
Rasterization is really not the future of realtime graphics. Dayum.
 
"programming" "competitions"
 
int main.... oh damn I forgot the parenthesis.. int main)(... oh what's wrong now?
 
@Potatoswatter Depends, are you a homicidal maniac?
 
@Neil Only one way to find out.
 
@Neil Perhaps, but at the conference I'll be busy with other things.
 
1:42 PM
@ElimGarak I'm fine with not knowing, honestly
 
yay that's me
@MarcoA. TIL <unistd.h>
 
Man, AC/DC got old. And their rhythm guitarist, Malcolm Young, got diagnosed with dementia. So sad.
 
@ElimGarak lol if your browser doesn't support placeholder
 
oh now I've recalled a random fact; you learned the free bird solo some time ago :P
 
1:45 PM
ITT: great women voices
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ It's a design consideration. Once input starts, placeholder goes away, context is lost. And it looks ugly in the end.
 
@MarcoA. How about this.
 
@ScarletAmaranth Who? Someone plays guitar here, as well?
 
@ElimGarak I mean you
 
Ah, but that was a long time ago.
 
1:46 PM
well, you were in the lounge then :P
 
@ElimGarak <-
 
@ElimGarak Problem if you're a rhythm guitarist with dementia.
 
@chmod711telkitty It was the eloquence and ability to ramble on graphical rendering without breaking a sweat. Yes
 
Yup, also got some new sweet pickups from seymour duncan. Made my Strat even more strat.
 
@CatPlusPlus And you still have to explain what parts of RealOOP™ are missing from C++
 
1:49 PM
Figure it out if you care
 
But the most difficult one I still haven't even closely mastered is this
 
@TartanLlama you know? It isn't my kind but it's definitely not bad at all
 
I want to go to sleeeeep
 
Hello, I didn't find a chat room of linux & I don't know if Ihave the permission to post here: am trying to install Google-chrome in Ubuntu 14.04, and I got these errors http://hpics.li/28c10b9, any ideas?
Thank you !
 
Also that sound on a live stage. Man.
 
1:49 PM
The only thing you said that wasn't just a "no" towards @Lalaland, was this:
21 mins ago, by Cat Plus Plus
OO is about messaging and loose coupling, C++ defaults to static single dispatch I mean come on
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ loose coupling, of course
 
user406009
Cat's talking about smalltalk style oop. The problem is that people have different definitions of oop.
 
To which I asked how is C++ missing one of those, to which you didn't reply.
 
Cat's talking smacktalk.
 
So there's nothing for me to figure out.
@unordered_meow How so?
 
1:50 PM
Jan 30 at 2:30, by Borgleader
"Hi I have a question about my retirement fund"
"Sir this is a convenience store..."
"I know but it's the only thing open at this hour"
 
user406009
Look at smalltalk @ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Adding a protected/private member to the class triggers recompilation of every translation unit that includes the header
 
@Lalaland And then there are people who invented OOP ;v
 
That's tightly coupled
 
@MarcoA. The vocalist also did a collab with Mike Patton and Dan the Automator which was kind of a trip-hoppy fake 70s porn soundtrack.
 
1:51 PM
not very OO
 
@TartanLlama lol
 
(yes, you can work around it. So you can in C)
 
Anyway "having" and "being able to support" are two very different things
 
C is objective, said Apple.
 
@AndyProwl the most active chatroom actually
 
1:52 PM
@unordered_meow That has nothing to do with OOP per se, and more with the terrible compilation model C++ has.
 
If something's implemented in library but not standard library it makes the paradigm unsupported remember~~~
 
@thecoshman up where?
 
Geez, how long does cdn.rawgit.com need to update?
 
@Sino still it's the most active convenience store
:P
 
@CatPlusPlus Yes, very relevant in this discussion.
 
1:52 PM
@ElimGarak I used to do speed metal
 
It is, because C++ has no messaging out of the box
 
We are definitely talking about "supporting natively" vs "supporting"
 
Even dynamic dispatch is not really it
 
then somehow I got hired and had no more time to do anything
 
@ElimGarak Next.
 
1:53 PM
lol
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ that's ruins the "loosely coupled" thingy cat mentioned
 
@CatPlusPlus How so?
 
Python is the future ! C++ will die --> just saying
 
IT SUPPORTS IT IT JUST NEEDS 5000 LINES OF CODE TO DO IT
 
objective language
sweet
 
1:53 PM
What 5000 lines of code?
 
user406009
No. Python has a different market than C++.
 
@Sino Completely different paradijims.
I like spelling it like that.
Ahhh.
 
Python's market is EVE Online's spaghetti game logic.
 
@unordered_meow It doesn't break them, though. Recompilation is only a thing if you consider compilation in the first place.
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Not interceptable, not overrideable, not transparent enough to be done over network
 
1:54 PM
@Nooble IRTA "completely different pijiamas"
 
paradjinns
 
@Nooble Did you win Nooble2016
 
he wan it
 
Has Python 3 even overtaken 2 yet? It's a little misleading to say it's one language.
 
@Sino I won it alright. Now I'm the president of the Lounge.
 
1:54 PM
See, Python is still in a civil war.
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ That's correct too.
 
@CatPlusPlus What do you mean by "interceptable"? Also they can be overriden (assuming you are talking about virtual member functions) and with "transparent enough to be done over network" you mean...?
 
@MarcoA. Nice, I am mostly on the blues rock / hard rock side :D
 
I mean what I wrote
Good luck~
 
1:56 PM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Trivially transformable into RPC, basically.
 
@Griwes To which question are you answering?
 
Pretty much why I got a 60s Fender Stratocaster, but opted in for a 5-way switch instead of the classical 3-way from that era. Sunburst finish. Really warm and shit.
 
user406009
@CatPlusPlus those features are mostly incompatible with C++'s goal of low overhead.
 
hahahahahha
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ That's what "transparent enough to be done over network" mostly means.
 
1:57 PM
C++'s main goal is being garbage
 
@Lalaland So, what you're saying is C++ is incompatible with OO by design?
 
@CatPlusPlus Hey.
 
Shocking
 
Cat's main goal is criticizing everything without a reason.
4
 
@ElimGarak strato is a good guitar, never wanted a Fender since it's really not a metal guitar (I prefer Ibanez) but for blues rock it should be one of the best choices
 
1:57 PM
If I was a The Last Airbender character, I'd be a coffeebender.
 
user406009
I don't consider interceptable method calls an oo requirement.
 
He just spews opinions without actually caring to defend them.
 
"Hahahaha C++ is meant to be garbage." five minutes later "C# for the win".
 
user406009
I mainly care about data being combined with methods.
 
Hiding behind a "figure it out".
 
1:58 PM
When I give reasons everyone ignores them anyway
 
user406009
As that part is legitimately useful.
 
@Lalaland Madness over methods.
 
@ElimGarak I've been doing lots of stuff with this
SAS36FM
 
@CatPlusPlus You gave reasons for "C++ is not fully OO"; "C++ is garbage" doesn't follow from that.
 
user406009
And rust is quite darn close to oop support.
 
1:59 PM
lol
 
No, it follows from many other things, but it's not very important
 
user406009
It has most of the useful features.
 
@Lalaland lol
 
You're just mad because I called your favourite toy garbage
3
 
1:59 PM
@CatPlusPlus lel
 
Go through the transcript and see how frequently I say that C++ is doing something badly recently.
 

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