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@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm rewriting it geez!
 
typedef struct{
BYTE pred;
BYTE succ;
BYTE currentMessage;
BYTE RWindex;
BYTE Fcount;
BYTE subCommand:5;
BYTE messType:5;
BYTE status:5;
BYTE source:5;
BYTE dest:5;
BYTE auxData;
} FRAME0_HEADER; // 9 bytes
 
Ooh, shiny C-structs.
 
The thing is, I'm not sure how to do what I need to do any better. There are 17 different message types.
 
@MartinJames Yeah, I still don't get it. You can just do FRAME_0_CANDATA x; driver_fill_shit(reinterpret_cast<BYTE*>&x).
 
4:02 PM
template <typename TTo, typename T>
TTo stack_cast(const T& value) {
    new char[1024 * 1024 * 512]; // this is your punishment
    return static_cast<TTo>(value);
}
5
 
driver_fill_shit gotta be my new favorite C function name
 
@CatPlusPlus I like it. :D
 
It's at least as safe, and it doesn't require a new union for each and every type.
 
@CatPlusPlus Perfect
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes also doesn't have UB in it
 
4:03 PM
@BartekBanachewicz In your honour, I'll find an appropriate function in my project and rename it.
 
Also ugh bitfields.
 
Bitfiiieelds
 
@CatPlusPlus you know, ~saving memory~
because driver.
 
It's not for saving memory, it's for deserialising in the most crappy way possible.
 
@BartekBanachewicz You know that the controller this code runs on has 16K of RAM, right?
 
4:05 PM
@BartekBanachewicz The bit fields are in the spec he's coding against.
 
Embadded code.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, just wanted to write that
 
Also, the overall protocol is defined and fixed by even crappier C code on the peers.
 
@MartinJames I seriously don't get why the programs have to run on such underspeced shit
 
@BartekBanachewicz Because that's what they pay for.
 
4:06 PM
I mean, if I need an embedded controller to do X, I will pick one that won't require me to use stuff like bitfields
 
Loves Mobile, hates underpsec'd shit.
 
@BartekBanachewicz It's highly likely that they all do.
 
Hm.
 
@ThePhD my phone is more powerful than your previous PC
 
You can use masks by hand if you are allergic to bitfields.
 
4:07 PM
:3c
 
@BartekBanachewicz Backwards compatibility - can't change the protocol. I can extend it, but no changes to existing.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes well it's not really about bitfields of course
@MartinJames yeah, I understand the fact that the other side might be speaking in weird stuff
 
Like Android with its 32MB VM size (if you're lucky) is that much more memory.
 
@BartekBanachewicz the ubuntu edge is going to be awesome :3
 
4:08 PM
1990 all 'round.
 
@CatPlusPlus Well, it's about 2000 times more!
 
@CatPlusPlus where did you get this 32 MB from
seriously.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Uh
 
ITT Bartek is about to get reality shock.
 
That's how much one process gets.
Your phone might have 1GB total, but that's not available for one thing to use.
 
4:08 PM
I highly doubt that games running on my phone are using 32MB only
FFS, textures for them weigh over 800MB
 
@CatPlusPlus 16 mb i think
 
@CatPlusPlus that's not possible. unless "thing" is some weird unit I don't know about
 
If you wanted real horrors, I could post some of the C code in the peers that I also have to maintain. Luckily, I don't hate any Loungers that much :)
 
> The only built-in way to change heap size of an app is by setting android:largeHeap="true" in the AndroidManifest.xml. This will generally increase heap size from 48 to 128. Keep in mind this approach will only work on 3.x tablets. Otherwise, you'll need a rooted device, which is obviously not something you would want to rely on as a developer.
 
4:10 PM
lemme fire up a game and see ram usage
 
@BartekBanachewicz thing = VM instance.
 
23
Q: Android heap size on different phones/devices and OS versions

Eric NordvikDoes anyone know if the heap size on Android phones is a constant value according to what is set in the OS version or if this is a setting which the phone producers can decide on? Is the heap size proportional to the amount of RAM on the phone? I've only found articles where people say that the...

> Mobile devices typically have constrained system resources. Android devices can have as little as 16MB of memory >available to a single application. The Android Compatibility Definition Document (CDD), Section 3.7. Virtual Machine >Compatibility gives the required minimum application memory for various screen sizes and densities. Applications >should be optimized to perform under this minimum memory limit. However, keep in mind many devices are >configured with higher limits.
 
Btw, this kind of crap was mentioned in that article you so loved so much.
 
Native heaps are measured differently, but that only increases the risk of sudden OOM syndrome.
 
4:11 PM
(Also fuck writing shit with JNI just to get more memory)
Also OpenGL textures are apparently not counted, which is a testament of how well designed Android is.
 
@CatPlusPlus that is amazing :3
 
lol, so you can use OpenGL like one of those extended memory things one used in DOS.
 
Sweet.
I'll write that down.
 
Imma rewrite my epub processing to use OpenGL textures.
 
That sounds both awesome and depressing.
 
4:14 PM
@CatPlusPlus GPGPU Android Phone Reader
 
What would one do if one wanted to write something in a managed language that wasn't C#?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's not 32MB
 
Does OpenGL ES have glMapBuffer?
 
@BartekBanachewicz have you used OpenGL ES 1.0 without extensions? ;A; vbo's made me cry
 
@BartekBanachewicz That's also assuming you have the entire phone to yourself.
 
4:14 PM
That's not Android, either.
 
@EiyrioüvonKauyf OpenGL|ES is now at version 3.0 and that's the only version I am interested in.
(Work stuff doesn't count)
 
@BartekBanachewicz So, the version very few devices use.
Nice. :D
 
@BartekBanachewicz WAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaait. That was not the picture I copied.
 
@BartekBanachewicz the (open source in this case) project wanted to use 1.0 for the largest range of compatability
 
4:15 PM
@EiyrioüvonKauyf and?
 
@BartekBanachewicz mhm nothing
 
@ThePhD and?
 
@ThePhD Who needs market coverage.
 
It was two pictures side-by-side :S
 
4:15 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes still not android
 
@CatPlusPlus not me, certainly
 
Meh.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's still not 32MB
 
if you don't care abou distributing to a large number of devices, then sure.
@BartekBanachewicz memory warning at 40.
 
That's still not Android. :cripes:
 
4:16 PM
@ThePhD I am happy we understand each other :)
also I got the update today's morning
 
@BartekBanachewicz It's still cripplingly small.
 
so I can already start porting Minicraft to ES3 :3
 
Lol.
Bartek, in super-powered device land.
 
.... in his super powered device land with compatability
 
38
A: Android heap size on different phones/devices and OS versions

spatialistSome more device info extracted from build.prop files (adb -d pull /system/build.prop): Phones (Android Version): HTC Wildfire (2.2.1) = 16MB HTC Wildfire S (2.3.5) = 20MB HTC Salsa (2.3.3) = 20MB HTC Desire (2.3.3) = 32MB HTC Desire S (2.3.5) = 32MB Samsung Galaxy S GT-I9000 (2.2) = 48MB Sa...

 
4:17 PM
@ThePhD I don't care if anyone else (with inferior phone) will run it
 
The main difference is that in Android the limits are always there, while on iOS you can get "a lot" if you have nothing else running.
By "a lot" I mean a whopping 200MB; nah, that's probably too risky. Better play it safe and keep on at the last warning: 146.
 
Also @CatPlusPlus I finished my RasterFont system.
So I just need to do BMFont loading (like, 2 lines of work) and then we'll have RasterFonts!
 
@ThePhD yay link the github
 
Yay, Rasterrasterraster!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I keep forgetting you are talking about android 2
 
4:18 PM
@EiyrioüvonKauyf Fuck your open source in its open mouth. D:<
 
No, that's Android 4.
The heap limit didn't go anywhere.
It's still there in API18.
 
and?
damn you're boring.
 
:lol:
 
apps use over 32MB get over it finally.
 
4:19 PM
the fact you say "it's 32MB" doesn't change the fact THAT THE APPS FUCKING USE MORE RAM
 
:laffo:
 
@ThePhD tyvm
 
@CatPlusPlus ikr
 
@CatPlusPlus and if the fact that the app is able to use more ram doesn't prove that you can use more ram then I don't know what to say
 
Have you written anything on Android, ever?
 
4:19 PM
ok how can i do a fixture in Boost without using the memory leak operator. euh i don't want to use shared_ptr it's overkill
 
@CatPlusPlus no, why should I? this OS sucks.
 
Thenshutup.
 
what does it change if I programmed on it or not?
seriously.
 
Because maybe you'd know what you're talking about.
 
@BartekBanachewicz That kind of was the general idea the Cat was hinting at.
 
4:21 PM
Maybe.
Possibly.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I am aware of the general idea. I merely called bullshit at 32MB he randomly threw out
and then I agreed with you wrt old devices.
 
Return the approximate per-application memory class of the current device. This gives you an idea of how hard a memory limit you should impose on your application to let the overall system work best. The returned value is in megabytes; the baseline Android memory class is 16 (which happens to be the Java heap limit of those devices); some device with more memory may return 24 or even higher numbers.
 
My designs suck and my code is horrible. I'm going to watch the fish in my refurbished, non-leak pond and try not to join them :)
 
> some device with more memory may return 24 or even higher numbers.
so it's not the OS thing. It's the device thing.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yes our production app totally has no trouble because it runs out of memory on devices in 16-class.
Nosir.
 
4:23 PM
@CatPlusPlus then you should optimize your beloved memory usage better
I love the irony.
 
@BartekBanachewicz The devices have 1GB and 2GB of RAM.
Not 24 or 48 or 256.
 
:laffo: I'm not even going to bother quoting you.
 
@CatPlusPlus I have plenty quotes of you saying how memory usage is irrelevant
plenty
@R.MartinhoFernandes eh, that's the crappy branded os, aye?
 
Not sure what that means.
 
I'll ask differently: who is really responsible for setting memory limits on a device?
 
4:25 PM
@BartekBanachewicz the memory god in RAMland
 
The OS sets limits on the processes.
 
and that's based on what?
 
The device Universe sets limits on the OS.
@BartekBanachewicz Whatever they thought was better.
 
@BartekBanachewicz the whims of the OS, the amount of memory used by other apps, the amount of memory available on the device
 
because y'know I am pretty sure my N4 would handle fairly big apps
 
4:27 PM
If the developers jumped through hoops for it? Sure.
 
nah, just ootb
 
@jalf On Android it's actually fixed beforehand.
@BartekBanachewicz What out-of-the-box?
 
0
A: What is the name of this operator: "-->"?

user2623967Sorry it is not an answer but after reading this answer I remember days then just started learning C. And remembered operator --+--. So I had so tricks to make my code to look more pleasant and headache to read. Some forever loops: while (x--+--x)//infinity if x is even while (++x==x++) while (x...

^^ nuke it
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes oic
 
Just write an empty Android app and ask the VM for 100 MB.
Come back later.
 
4:28 PM
> I remember days then just started learning C. And remembered operator --+--. So I had so tricks to make my code to look more pleasant and headache to read.
 
@jalf AFAIK all JVM set hard heap size limits on processes, even the desktop version. (But on desktop you can easily override it to be whatever you want upon launch)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes hm, okay, perhaps that would be only for native apps.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes so if it needs more memory, it just kills a few apps? There's no "please reduce your memory usage" warnings apps can react to?
 
Xeo
@jalf NEVER STOP THE KILLING! NEVER!
 
@jalf IIRC it kills the apps "on standby" first.
 
4:29 PM
@Xeo Dammit.
@jalf It kills your app if it goes overboard (or maybe it just throws you an OOM and you may proceed if you're a good boy; not sure). But there's developer.android.com/reference/android/app/… for preemptive action.
 
WTH? He cleared the delete vote by deleting it and undeleting it.
 
Xeo
lol
Well, makes sense, no? :P
 
Let's see if he does it again.
 
@Insilico That's if it's running low on global memory (i.e. cannot keep all the heaps alive).
 
4:31 PM
@Mysticial So the answerer found a loophole in the delete process?
 
@Mysticial If he does flag it. I voted to delete.
 
You still can't exceed your maximum heap size.
 
If he does it again, he's clearly abusing it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I see.
 
Xeo
@Mysticial Can you even vote to delete the same question twice?
 
4:32 PM
@Insilico Perhaps it's not the first time? :P
@Xeo yes
 
Xeo
Ok
 
It takes three people to delete a post, right?
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Teehee
 
Whatever. NIPPLE SALADS.
6
 
He just deleted it again. See if he undeletes.
 
4:33 PM
@Insilico Unless it's deleted by a mod.
 
Xeo
@Mysticial Link?
We just need 3 votes before he deletes
 
@Xeo Same one I linked above.
 
I'll cast the third vote if it gets undeleted again.
 
That question (along with the branch question) are pretty notorious for baiting non-answers. I'm been pretty hard-handed in nuking the ones on the --> one. But softer on the branch one since I answered it. But maybe I should step it up there as well.
 
4:37 PM
Still deleted at this point.
 
How big is long in Windows 64?
 
32
 
> Windows 64
Currently, latest version of Windows is 8
 
It's 8 squared.
 
ooooooh
 
4:44 PM
For when you install Win8 on a VM running on Win8.
 
so 64 is a long way to go. Who knows what CPU width's may be by then
1024 bit CPU's
lol
 
Ok, Mike Seymour beat me to it.
 
I very much doubt that
 
@TonyTheLion I doubt it.
 
I'm just dreaming
 
4:45 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes With what compiler? With Microsoft's it's always 32 bits. I don't have it on my laptop to check at the moment, but if memory serves, the (64-bit) port of CLang to Windows makes long 64 bits.
 
128 bits is an unbelievably ginormous range.
 
64bits is pretty fuckin' huge too
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yep.
 
@DeadMG Yeah, but I'm playing it safe :P
 
lol
 
4:46 PM
I don't even know how we'd utilize 128bits if it ever comes out
 
well
 
@TonyTheLion In space.
 
we would certainly need a fundamentally new memory technology to utilize even 64bits.
 
@TonyTheLion With sufficient memory, you could then unroll all the loops:)
 
4:47 PM
:P
 
Because everything gets better IN SPACE!
 
Oh noooo TVTropes
 
and the robot is back to the TVtropes links
 
I'm staying away from that
Its been a while
Did you get my email puppy?
 
4:48 PM
oh gawd
 
I did
 
You emailed a puppy? You attached it?
 
I actually had a really strange thing happen to me today
 
4:50 PM
You woke up in the morning?
 
well, that.
 
You had an epiphany?
 
and...?
 
but I also decided that instead of simply playing World of Warcraft all day, I might actually load up Visual Studio and take a look at Wide some more.
 
@DeadMG 64 bits is big enough that simply counting from 0 to 2^64 - 1 is impractical (e.g., with a single core running at, say, 5 GHz it sill takes over 100 years).
 
4:51 PM
Jeez
 
@DeadMG That was it?
 
@JerryCoffin A quantum computer could count to 2^64 relatively quickly if it had a few qubits.
 
@DeadMG class/race/faction?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes What were you expecting?
 
"A really strange thing"
 
4:52 PM
@Borgleader Virtually all of them/mostly night elf/isn't this kinda redundant?/isn't server actually quite a bit more important?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, it is a really strange thing.
 
@DeadMG i see/NE ftw/not if you're pandaren/not since you can group and play with players from different servers
 
not all of them
 
ITT Puppy is addicted to WoW
 
especially since I don't recall where you are from, but definitely not between regions
 
Oh thats true... (I'm on NA)
 
4:54 PM
@TonyTheLion Nah, I only took a 10-day free trial. It ends today anyway.
 
I mostly play GW2 these days though
 
damnit
why did I have to compile Clang with the CRT dynamically linked.
 
if people want to mock misinformation it's here
 
@MooingDuck that nothrow behaviour thing is old as heck (VS6 IIRC)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes it's still in VS7, 8, and 9 IIRC, though they changed it slightly. It only kicks in if you link with a particular library.
 
Ell
4:58 PM
ima try wide again
 
the real question is, do I have the balls to rebuild Clang to statically link the CRT
 
@MooingDuck You mean nothrownew.obj?
I wouldn't put the word "default" anywhere near the idea of linking to that.
It has not been the default since VS7.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes eh, fair. too late now though
 
@MooingDuck And FWIW, it will probably still ship for the foreseeable forever.
 
goddamnit
why don't LLVM and Clang include the platform in their output directory?
 
Ell
5:11 PM
Gists doesn't worrrk >.<
The indent size was at a default of 17
@DeadMG Do you have any clue why wide wouldn't build even when c++11 is specified?
 
object name(arg1, arg2); is valid right ....? -____- something is being weird
 
@Ell Try just adding #include <utility> to the Optional header.
 
Ell
Ohhh yeah
aha it builds
 
what, all of it?
 
Ell
Nope :/
It can't find clang files now. Not sure why, I've added --llvm-path
 
5:24 PM
what's most likely is that building LLVM on non-Windows gives a different file structure to the one on Windows
 
Ell
It seems okay though, following paths manually
 
yeah
 
Ell
It can't find Specifiers.h when I can find it in the given path
 
I think that you added a /build to the end that shoulnd't be there
 
Ell
Yeah, I removed that and it still errors
 
5:26 PM
also, shouldn't those paths be given in quotes?
 
Ell
I didn't think they did, but I'll try. Also, I think my boost path is wrong
but that doesn't seem to be a problem as of yet
Quotes doesn't change anything
 
try changing from a relative path to an absolute one
 
Ell
Tried that too
also, in for k, v in pairs(llvmincludes) do, is k the index?
 
yes
I can do that too
@Ell So GCC just complains that it can't find the include file, right?
 
gx_
stackoverflow.com/review/suggested-edits/2569700 How's that "too minor"? It removed a totally unrelated footnote which the OP forgot to remove after copy-pasting over two pages (he removed the page number and copyright notice
 
@gx_ Hi! Who are you?
 
gx_
Hi Etienne, my message was sent after pressing Enter too early...
 
@gx_ that's an amazingly minor edit
 
gx_
I'm a guy who doesn't like broken Standard quotes...
 
5:43 PM
@gx_ is that really an unrelated footnote?
 
gx_
Yes it is. It is about noexcept, which is the subsection before casts in C++11
 
gx_
I also got a reject for "attempt to reply to or comment on the existing post." so I posted a comment stackoverflow.com/questions/10770044/… some days ago, no reaction from OP
 
@gx_ huh, you're right
 
someone is mad
 
5:46 PM
@rubenvb stackoverflow.com/questions/17941355/… I'm afraid cv_* is a bit sensitive, and he might have thought I 'scolded' him for posting the link to the other question. I didn't mean to coerce him to remove his comment, which is why I posted an edited comment.
 
@gx_ it seriously looks like you randomly just removed a sentence, it almost made sense both ways
 
ohai
@gx_ Did you describe that in the edit comment?
 
gx_
@MooingDuck I'm not a native English speaker, but when I first read the quote (and re-read it) I just couldn't understand it (I was like "...wut??") so I checked the Standard(s) and found out why..
 
@sehe ohai bear.
 
gx_
@sehe "fixed Standard quote", maybe too short :s
 
5:49 PM
@MooingDuck You beat me to it
 
@gx_ well, it almost made sense, if there was commas...
 
@gx_ Yup. It's a shame, but you can't expect each and any reviewer to scrutinize the standards quotes. You'll know once you have had the experience of fielding edit reviews yourself.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Is GL_ARB_debug_output an extension or part of the core?
 
@Tuntuni Core since 4.3
 
@gx_ sadly, I probably would have voted the same. Sorry, the system isn't perfect :(
 
5:51 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Ahh, like that.
 
gx_
@sehe @MooingDuck Ok, thank you for replies. But the problem remains, will this quote remain broken forever?
 
@gx_ Pay attention ?
 
hmmm @sehe can i ask a mini question
 
@EiyrioüvonKauyf Depends. But shoot :)
 
gx_
@sehe sorry what?
 
5:54 PM
4 mins ago, by sehe
@MooingDuck You beat me to it
 
@gx_ when I said "huh you're right" I fixed the question myself
 
gx_
Damn... ^^' Thank you!
I had forgotten that <number>k+ users can edit directly
(and left the question page)
So this lounge is useful hmm? =)
 
does C++ have a function for generating the next "combination" from "N elements pick M."? next_permutation doesn't quite do that
@gx_ quasi
 
@BartekBanachewicz lol look at my Google activity report - sic
 
5:57 PM
@Tuntuni like how?
 
@gx_ And lazy. Best to get 10k+ quickly
 
@sehe I don't even. And they called me a stalker.
 
@BartekBanachewicz That it's part of the core since 4.3. Jason McKesson is using it as an extension in his framwork.
 
@sehe so i have class foo with function blah. and right under blah i did (void)(&blahalias)(size_t, int) = blah. "reference to non-static member function must be called" hmm what does this mean -.- i would prefer not to use boost::function also this is clang . this might be a clang specific thing wait no it's not
 
@BartekBanachewicz Hey, it's your stalkee :)
 
5:58 PM
@sehe yeah, you totally typed in a few hundred queries because I forced you to :>
 
@BartekBanachewicz I typed in 1 line
 
oh, I don't really know how those stats work TBH
 
@EiyrioüvonKauyf what happens when you use a pointer instead of a reference
 
@Tuntuni yeah, he obviously don't want people with older hw to feel kicked out of the club
 

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