Conversation started Feb 12, 2020 at 21:32.
Feb 12, 2020 21:32
Topic 2: How should we implement the strike? Do we lock the main room? Do we simply let the requests remain unvoted on? Do we do something else?
I'm for freezing the room for a week and move all of us to the Ministry
Proposal: let discussions run free, and support people who come to ask about their questions, but trash any CV requests indiscriminately
I mean: a strike, is a strike.
M--
M--
I am not for locking the room neither for letting the requests pouring in. Is there a way to not allow any requests for a week?
user10957435
I thought the letter from the ROs said the room would remain open.
Feb 12, 2020 21:35
Aside from the letter, I don't think we should lock the room, as nearly (not quite) 50% of voters voted either present or against the strike, and it can still be a place to chat, congregate in general, and perhaps more importantly, to post cv-pls as regular in order to have some kind of comparative "this many requests went unacted upon" metric.
@Chipster There has been discussions among ROs
@Chipster yes, my insane proposal didn't find consensus :( I'm retrying it here on personal title ...
Topic 1: Stars/voting. 12-4-4 for strike
user10957435
In one sense, letting the room stay open with requests not getting handled would show just how much we do.
@M-- We don't have an automated way to control it, but we could trash requests as we see them come in, as John Dvorak mentioned.
Feb 12, 2020 21:36
I will make a proposal as a point of order, not a recommendation
user10957435
@Kyll That makes sense.
@TylerH I'd expect there was some overlap between "present" and the other voting options.
Proposal: Room stays open but there is no RO activity
With requests being present as usual, it might be hard to communicate to visitors they shouldn't act on these requests
@StephenKennedy Holidays!
Feb 12, 2020 21:36
If we had enough time, a bot could be written to trash them, but people could easily change the format of the requests to have the bot miss them
@Kyll and fully paid too!
@Chipster that was what Samuel posted on Github: It would be great if we can get some stats on how SOCVR is currently performing/contributing (e.g.: average number of questions closed for a week in the past year?) since I gather that's how long the strike is being planned for), and the possible impact on the site should most of the members participate
@Chipster That was my bad. Never circled back to it during the RO discussion. Didn't mean to be so definite
@Makyen That's unfortunate; in order to be given any weight it must be assumed all votes for present were unique in that such voters did not also vote for one of the other options.
Maybe should have made a Microsoft Form...
As well as Tripleee: *I'm wondering how exactly we should collect data during the strike week. Would it make sense to post cv-pls:es etc in SOCVR normally, and just dissuade people from actually casting close votes?
(Though then it's hard to prevent anyone from breaking the strike, as it were.)

Having a record of "these are posts I would have nominated for closing" would seem like good data to collect during the strike anyway.*
Feb 12, 2020 21:37
There's a script that trashes any handled requests. I don't imagine it would be hard to modify to trash everything, and to run in a loop rather than manually
@JohnDvorak yeah, that crossed my mind as well
Would numbers change anything?
@JohnDvorak except if someone doesn't tag their request as [tag:cv-pls]
Sam
Sam
@Kyll Typical. I come back just at the moment we all have to go on holiday.
@TylerH then it'd be down to the ROs
Feb 12, 2020 21:38
@StephenKennedy No. ROs, are still responsible for the room maintaining conduct within the code of conduct. We should not imply that will not be maintained, if the room remains unfrozen.
@rene How far back can the handled requests skip run? Would it be possible to make an edit to count how many requests were made over the week
@Kyll I think it does, yes. You can use statistics to make it look important
Move cv-pls requests to a dedicated room. That way they can be cleaned up when the strike ends, and you can see how many requests there were.
@NickA it can run till the start of time
M--
M--
@TylerH maybe trash any messages with a SO link in them (there's a downside to this I bet, I just don't see it)
Feb 12, 2020 21:40
@rene corrolarily, does increasing the bot's window cause nasty IP timeouts for the runner?
user10957435
Write a bot that moves the messages our of the room and pings the user with a link to a page saying why we're on strike.
I like the moving of message idea. A lot.
@Makyen Isn't that what moderators are for? (moot point as proposal only has 1 star anyway)
@rene I'm under the impression that the message is the most important.
@rene Me too
@JohnDvorak No, @Makyen programmed it
Sam
Sam
Feb 12, 2020 21:41
@rene Me too too
If we're to ping people who post their requests - one ping per user, please
especially if we don't want them to stop requesting!
How many fly-by users do you have? Pinned message + frequent semi-trashing would convey the message in no time to most users
@Chipster Wouldn't that just stop some users from posting during the week and skew the result?
@JohnDvorak Yes, that would be easy. It would also be possible for it to watch each message as it was posted or edited.
At the same time we don't want users that wouldn't normally request to start doing it more frequently, or to ignore the request frequency rules in place, as that would skew results
Feb 12, 2020 21:42
and if you name the temporary cv-pls storage area similarly to the graveyard most fly-by users won't click it to handle requests there
user10957435
@Scratte True. Didn't think about that.
@NickA why would they?
Proposal: make the temp-trash a private room, to ensure it won't be visited to bypass the strike enforcement
@AndrasDeak Just a possibility
@JohnDvorak oh definitely
Feb 12, 2020 21:43
if skewed stats is our biggest problem I guess we're done here ...
We should really revive Closey
not trying to stop the discussion ....
@NickA I've run it back to the beginning. It only starts to have a problem if you want it to display several thousand messages for move-review in the popup.
@Makyen But a singular count without movement would work straight forwardly?
@Kyll I hear you're on it
Sam
Sam
Feb 12, 2020 21:44
@Kyll I could make a small bot just for this.
@rene That was before a lot of crap happened
Sam
Sam
Closey's going to take a while.
I think we have typically under 1000 requests during the span of a week
Sam
Sam
Assuming we don't want to modify an existing script.
@NickA Yes, you could gather statistics. However, I thought there was already something else that did so, or at least that it was done at least once in the past.
Feb 12, 2020 21:45
I volunteer to shitpost all week to make it less obvious that requests are being moved
I knew I could count on you
Proposal: loosen the onebox rule significantly during the strike week
So 1000 requests a week is the impact we make by not handling them from within the room
@JohnDvorak If we use a room other than the graveyard, then the chat system will show a banner that they have been asked to join the new room the first time that a message is moved, and they will only get that banner once.
user10957435
@JohnDvorak what would that do?
Feb 12, 2020 21:47
@JohnDvorak I probably get a heart-attack, but yes, that is an option
@JohnDvorak I (jokingly) suggested that and rene said the very same thing to me
@Chipster compensate for the lack of regular content with blurry images of flowers
@Chipster to make clear the room is in a different mode
user10957435
@JohnDvorak Oh I see...
user10957435
@rene That's also a good point.
Feb 12, 2020 21:49
I'm not sure that would accomplish anything: clear to whom?
@JohnDvorak Only a moderator can set up an actually private room.
Regulars would see the pin, non-regulars can be pinged
@Kyll to both regulars and casual visitors
@Makyen bot that kicks everyone who speaks? :thinking:
I think you should aim for "not at all obvious that anything has changed", because if people notice that then they will indeed start posting more requests, or even worse, follow the requests to the temp dump
talking about fly-by users, of course
Feb 12, 2020 21:50
that ^
Hence my 0.25-serious suggestion about posting a lot to the room. Gaping silence invites a reaction, but if there's stuff in the room with moved-request messages interspersed it's not immediately evident
yeah, I can see how that will work.
Still sad my freezing proposal didn't make it
It was too cold
@rene I mean, I can see it working too
What about freezing for a day?
@JohnDvorak hehehe
Feb 12, 2020 21:52
@Sam It would be quite easy to modify the URRS to just move any messages posted that are identified as requests. It already scans every message posted. Dropping in the move code from the Archiver would be easy.
I think rene just wants to avoid any responsibility for a day...
This room was placed in timeout for 2 minutes; Meeting end
This concludes this room meeting. A summary of conclusions will be written and placed on the SOCVR website in the near future.
We'll keep this room open for another 30 minutes, then lock it until the next meeting. Thanks all for participating!
(thanks for tolerating me)
(thanks for being around!)
@YaakovEllis Thanks for coming. Seriously!
 
Conversation ended Feb 12, 2020 at 21:54.