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12:23 AM
For a long time I ridiculed OSX for putting code for system menu into each application (such a clumsy design). All this time I kept forgetting how windows makes each application split its command line arguments...
 
 
4 hours later…
4:45 AM
@Model Hello. Just so you know, people probably would prefer "everyone" instead of "every1"; it's not important and I don't particularly care, but some people equate spelling effort with respect. But do what you want. :)
We should try to write succinct sentences, but we must balance that with convention and correctness, to meet on a common ground of understanding. People have an easier time reading "everyone" compared to "every1" because the latter isn't canonical English. That doesn't mean we aren't getting the same information, sure, but it lacks clarity for most people. Keep in mind if lexical shortness was our goal, then our language would be much smaller, encoding words into single letters.
@Model No problems. You can write however you'd like, just a warning on clarity and perceived effort.
@Model It's 32-bits unsigned, yes. Also see: wolframalpha.com/input/?i=0xF0F0F0F0+in+binary.
A single hexidecimal digit is 4 bits.
F is four, 0 is four, etc. F0 is eight bits, four of them is 32-bits.
No. Give me one second.
Okay, makes sense then?
0x1B is 0x1 and 0xB, 0x1 is 0001 and 0xB is 1011, so 0x1B is 00011011, 8-bits.
 
5:03 AM
@GMan: I'm looking for a post: where was the fine-grained member function access control technique that used a "key" struct discussed?
Nevermind. Found it.
 
8
Q: Is this key-oriented access-protection pattern a known idiom?

Georg FritzscheMatthieu M. brought up a pattern for access-protection in this answer that i'd seen before, but never conciously considered a pattern: class SomeKey { friend class Foo; SomeKey() {} // possibly make it non-copyable too }; class Bar { public: void protectedMethod(SomeKey); }; ...

I thought Matthieu had asked the question, which was why I failed to find it.
Thanks
 
@Model Yup, you're correct now.
@JamesMcNellis Ya. My interview is next Thursday, by the way.
 
@GMan Phone screen or interview interview?
 
@JamesMcNellis The latter. D:
 
5:06 AM
Do you know with what group yet?
 
Nope, it says I'll be meeting a handful, though.
 
Well, good luck. It's just like answering questions on SO except that you can't say "that's a dumb question, I'm not going to answer that."
 
@JamesMcNellis Haha, all right. :)
 
 
1 hour later…
6:17 AM
so what happened with all tinas posts? Did she get banned or something?
 
Als
@jalf: Tina is Model now :)
 
@Als yes, but her posts are still all (removed), and she seems to link to /users/0
 
@jalf its weird, seems they were all removed...
maybe she's gone
left SO
 
Als
oh they were visible when i just came in an hr ago
The conversation here doesnt indicate anything for her to leave
 
6:47 AM
Consider this expression: 1 + eps, where eps is a float. How to I tell my compiler that 1 is a float too, IIRC in Java you can write 1f.
 
@Nils 1.0f
 
ah stupid u have to write 1.0f
:)
 
Maybe 1.f also works, try it out.
 
that wasn't even the problem.. got a wrong eps

const float eps = 10e-9; // works w 10e-8
printf("%1.12f\n", eps);
printf("%1.12f\n", 1.0f + eps);
 
@Nils Note that due to the way variadic arguments work, printf cannot handle floats, only doubles. Since you have to pass a double anyway, you might just as well just write 1.0 + eps, thus doing the addition already as a double.
 
6:59 AM
ah but there is no precision loss when converting from float to double so I don't have to worry any further about this, right?
 
@Nils shouldn't be for that conversion
 
@Nils double(1.0f + eps) may very well yield a different result than 1.0 + eps, especially if eps is a very small value!
To be on the safe side, assume you know nothing about floating point arithmetic ;)
 
so how should I print floats then?
 
sbi
0
Q: What happened to that user?

sbiWhile we never were very fond of Tina (renamed "Model" since, I think, yesterday) this state of affairs (all postings removed, and the avatar linking to a somewhat laconic "no user data available" message) is disturbing. What happened to her?

 
@Nils printf is fine, I just wanted to point out that there is no point in doing float arithmetic and then converting the result to a double when you can just do double arithmetic in the first place.
 
7:03 AM
@FredOverflow but a double precision is more precise (IIRC 128 bits mantissa) where a single precision (float - IIRC 52 bits mantissa)
@sbi I am very disturbed :)
 
@Tony Actually, it's 53 bits vs. 24 bits.
 
@FredOverflow oops, I knew I was off
 
@FredOverflow sure
Writing code which does geometric computations correct in all cases is no the easiest thing it seems..
 
Define "correct".
 
7:06 AM
correct'ish
 
it says the account is suspended
 
> The suspension period ends on Aug 11
 
aha; @sbi's question is still valid though. I hope it wasn't just for being a bit of a pain here in the chat.
 
Wow, what did she do? Cause another earthquake?
 
7:08 AM
@FredOverflow If only we knew what she did....
@jalf should hope not, cuz never intended for her to get banned
lol
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Tina Memorial Topic Line
 
@jalf she will be missed, for her immense persistence
 
sbi
@jalf Oh. My. God.
I'd never thought I'd see the day.
 
@FredOverflow Good question, right now correct is if it behaves the same way as the well tested code running on the CPU :)
 
@sbi well, she could be a bit of a pest, but I haven't seen anything from her that deserved a ban or suspension
 
7:12 AM
@jalf I don't think I've seen anything either, except for the fact she easily incited rage and other emotions in people...
 
of course, it's possible she went on a murdering rampage on one of the sites
 
sbi
@jalf At the meetup here in Berlin, balpha said that whole IP address ranges are banned from SO, for the sheer amount of stupid questions coming from them. So there sure seems to be a school of though banning users that aren't contributing, but drain the other users for energy.
 
@sbi WOW that's intense
@sbi there's at least one user I think that should be banned, but hasn't been I think
 
@sbi The more I learn about it, the less I like SO line of conduct.
5
 
sbi
@AProgrammer You're preaching to the choir here. :)
 
7:16 AM
@AProgrammer Well, users asking only questions that incite rage in others is not very contributive to SO, or have I missed something here?
 
@Tony no, but does that justify a ban?
 
@jalf I think in some extreme cases it probably does... but only in those extreme cases
 
I don't think you need to actively contribute to SO in order to be allowed to use it
 
sbi
@jalf I guess SO was too successful and grew too fast for its own good. There's too many newbies here asking dupes, and too few old hands to clean up the palace.
 
Tina's wasn't justified if you ask me
 
sbi
7:18 AM
@Tony Nobody said she was suspended (note: that's not banned) for posting stupid questions, though. That's just a thought we're entertaining.
 
@jalf no, but if you're "contributing" by asking questions that are only there to annoy or make wrong, that isn't contributing and IMHO should just not be tolerated
@sbi true, to this point we don't know why she has been suspended
 
@sbi a 4 month suspension though
at that point, it sounds like a ban in my ears
 
sbi
I don't think balpha implied that the questions were deliberately annoying. I thought he meant that they were of the kind that should be closed within minutes, but the sheer volume prevented that.
As we've all seen, Jeff's doing just about anything if he thinks it will keep up the quality of the site.
 
@Tony yeah, I'm just pointing out the difference between a negative contribution and zero contribution. The former should obviously be prevented
but merely "not contributing" isn't a crime
 
@jalf should be nothing wrong with that, I agree
 
7:31 AM
@FredOverflow That's an example of incorrectness: pastebin.com/9CDHGxST
 
@Nils Whats incorrect in that if I may ask?
 
@Tony I don't think that inducing rage was Tina goal. It was already hurting her more than us.
 
@sbi hey, guess who just closed your question ;)
 
@jalf FYI
Posted by Jeff Atwood on April 6th, 2009

Are you familiar with the Penalty Box?

The penalty box (sometimes called the sin bin, bad box, or bin) is the area in ice hockey, rugby football and some other sports where a player sits to serve the time of a given penalty, for an offense not severe enough to merit outright expulsion from the contest. Teams are generally not allowed to replace players who have been sent to the penalty box.

It’s not something we looked forward to, but as of tonight, we’re instituting a penalty box on Stack Overflow. …

 
Hi.. How do we compile C files which include <openssl/sha.h>
 
7:43 AM
@Maverickgugu the same way you'd compile any other C file? What's the problem?
 
@jalf some thing like
$gcc file.c -lssl
 
@Maverickgugu well, what happens when you do that? Looks correct to me
 
@Maverickgugu Install the package providing the header file.
(Or if it is, add a -Idir with the correct directory containing the openssl one)
 
sbi
@jalf Oh boy. I guess that answers the question. But I think that, if even we here, which were mostly affected by her behavior, think this is over the top, then it might, indeed, be. I know better, though, than to tell that to Jeff.
 
Undefined symbols:
"_SHA1", referenced from:
_main in cccwlEwg.o
ld: symbol(s) not found
collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
 
7:49 AM
@sbi I think, unfortunate though it may be, we will have to just accept it as is
 
That was the error i received when i compiled the program.
 
Wild guess: you are working on windows and trying to link together objects compiled with gcc and with VC++.
I don't think it is supported (but I'm not a Windows programmer).
 
No.. sorry forgot to mention.. I'm working on a mac..
 
@sbi I don't know better. ;)
 
On the whole Tina/Model non-contributing users... I agree with jalf in that there is a clear distinction between users that do not contribute (actively) and users that contribute negatively. I have asked only 3 questions in SO (and one is outwardly stupid, one other is just an open discussion, so I guess that means 1 question?), but I have learnt a lot from other people's questions, so they have passively contributed...
 
7:58 AM
@Tony particle bounding between two cells, but I'm not exactly sure why this is
 
I find some users anoying, and I did not have the best interaction with Tina, too demanding for me I guess, I got into some sort of argument for mentioning sex (hey, we can say it now SEX SEX SEX!), but there are other users that I find more annoying and have not been suspended, there is nothing we can do...
 
@DavidRodríguezdribeas The research needed to answer questions which are at your limit teach you more than you could learn by asking any question.
 
@DavidRodríguezdribeas yep now I agree "there is nothing we can do" is annoying
 
@AProgrammer Back to C++: the error is a link error, and as such unrelated to headers and the -I flag. The answer is to install the packages that provide the libraries and a combination of -L and -l flags, where -l is -(lowercase L)
@Tony I did not say that, did I? :)
 
@AProgrammer The hardest thing I find about answering questions is that it sometimes feels you are up against experts whom can answer without any research and far better then you, so their answers will get the votes/accepts, even though your answer was also correct
 
8:03 AM
@AProgrammer Both the research at your level, and for questions that are beyond your limits (or in a different field from your particular experience), the insight provided by others.
 
@DavidRodríguezdribeas you implicitly implied it with some Nth degree of indirection
lol
 
going to work now
see ya
 
@DavidRodríguezdribeas Yes. That information was provided after my answer. I'd have expected a missing library instead of missing symbols if the problem is a missing library. But it can very well be missing information from @Maverickgugu.
MIssing pertinent information is the hardest problem in such kind of questions. (It is a problem for the asker who often don't know what is pertinent, it is a problem for those trying to answer who have to guess or ask and ask for complement of information).
@Tony What's important is what you learn. Not the reputation you get in the process.
Did I already mention that I wonder if that reputation system isn't doing more harm than good? It leads people -- including me -- to do some stupid things to get some or because it won't be rewarded by some.
 
@AProgrammer fair point :)
@AProgrammer Yes, it becomes more of a rep battle at times then a learning process... that inner rep whore in people takes over.
 
8:27 AM
Has Tina been banned?
 
@StackedCrooked dude, read up on the transcript
 
Lol, "Closed by J.A."
 
this looks like a nice tutorial on asm
 
> also just for everyone's FYI, Tina is a man. @adam – Jeff Atwood
How does he know? Even or odd-ness of her IP-address?
2
 
@StackedCrooked perhaps they have more data then we do?
@StackedCrooked where's that from?
 
cpx
8:37 AM
I wonder if they posted her geographical location.
 
8
A: Is mentioning sex ok or is it not?

Adam DavisIt's worth pointing out that the conversation about sex started here: http://chat.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/573133#573133 The ongoing C++ discussion where Tina was asking for some programming help was railroaded. Further, when she requested that they stop talking about it, they refu...

 
@StackedCrooked if that's true, then why would she or he pose as a women?
it disturbs me :(
 
@Tony well, all "she" did was pick a username ending with -a
 
@jalf yea but what's the point of deceiving people as to your sex?
oh there we go again... sex... damn :(
 
English skills weren't exactly tina's strongest point, so do we even know that the intention was to deceive?
2
 
8:43 AM
@jalf I don't think we will ever know
 
afaik, the current theory is that he/she is from korea or somewhere. Do they have the same cultural "thing" that names ending in -a are female ones?
 
tell me
 
@jalf only Koreans prob know that
 
might just be a straightforward english spelling of his actual name, for all I know
 
in msvc
 
8:44 AM
@jalf I think he/she was muslim though. I don't think she is from Korea...
 
you can put more than two words per line, @ChrisBecke ;)
 
why is the case insenstive string compare function (c not c++) stricmp vs either _stricmp, or strcasecmp
 
@StackedCrooked he/she/whatever linked to some paper with asian-looking squiggles scattered around it though
 
cpx
She often used the word 'yar' which is happen to mean 'buddy/friend' in Indian Language.
 
could also be pirate speak
 
8:45 AM
@jalf And when Tony said: "I can't read chinese" she responded with "Ignore the chinese". While it was actually Korean.
 
yarr!
@StackedCrooked shrug, watevah ;)
 
would this work: ideone.com/Bhey3
 
In religious discussion she once posted a link to "Mathematical wonders in the quran"
 
@StackedCrooked I didn't know it had math in it
 
my point is that he wasn't from a western country, so she might not immediately correlate western names with a specific gender
 
8:47 AM
but then again I'm fairly ignorant on the quran
 
cpx
The 'Quran' is the religious text of Islam
 
@cpx I do know much that much :)
 
cpx
I googled :)
 
@Tony Sure, I wouldn't see why not.
 
@StackedCrooked sometimes I'm not sure about this "when does some change made in a function become visible outside"
 
8:50 AM
Because the argument was passed as a reference: "void func(foo& f)"
 
@StackedCrooked that's what I thought, thx for confirming
 
sbi
Regarding Tina's sex, if what Jeff says is true, I find it appalling that he publicized that information, while s/he never corrected us, obviously wanting us to consider him/her female. It's everyone's right to chose an identity and those in the know about their real identity should not announce it to the world. It makes he wonder what Jeff might publish about myself, should he happen to get annoyed enough by me.
3
 
@sbi hmmm....
that scares me thinking about that
 
9:06 AM
What if he starts posting all my secret preferences..
 
what if they suddenly posted my real identity, I wouldn't really appreciate it, tbh
perhaps IRC still rules!!
 
11
Q: Real world use-case for the `at()` indexing function in the C++ std library?

MartinC++'s container vector, deque, ... provide the at(index) accessor function in addition to operator[index] to access container elements. The difference between this member function and member operator function operator[] is that deque::at signals if the requested position is out of ran...

RFC
(Specifically about ildjarn’s answer and the comments)
 
@KonradRudolph ildjarn is citing an opinion, not fact
 
@StackedCrooked And can you elaborate, please?
 
@KonradRudolph Perhaps relying on at() isn't the best way to error checking, but it is a valid way nevertheless.
Well, that's also merely my opinion.
 
9:15 AM
@StackedCrooked Maybe you have time to read the comments (sorry, they are a lot, I agree) to see if your opinion is already expressed there somewhere? I’m interested in facts (in particular, where would at be useful?)
 
@KonradRudolph Can "best practices" ever by classified as "facts"?
@KonradRudolph Gonna check out the comments though.
 
@StackedCrooked – of course they can. That’s why they’re best practices
 
Als
9:29 AM
Wooh--Just read Tina/Model/He/She got banned.....
:( Anyone knows for sure..why?
 
@Als How do you see that?
 
sbi
2
Q: What happened to that user?

sbi Possible Duplicate: Avoid the Streisand Effect - be clear about the reason when suspending an account While we never were very fond of Tina (renamed "Model" since, I think, yesterday) this state of affairs (all postings removed, and the avatar linking to a somewhat laconic "no user dat...

 
as far as I read the log, the user was completely purged. At least the chat history linked to in that one meta thread doesn’t contain any more mention of him/her
 
Als
@KonradRudolph: I read the transcript here..and I have been here when He/She was...But I think its a negative on SO....I mean she/He was childish persistent and vague but dont think did anything to get banned
 
sbi
9:32 AM
@KonradRudolph What's good is in the eye of the beholder, and so is what's best. Especially in C++, coming from C over a period of 25 years, we should know how what's considered best practice can change dramatically.
 
Als
@sbi: Your thoughts? considering you know her/him pretty well from in here
 
sbi
@Als I have upvoted @jalf's comment reply to Jeff's comment. And look what's currently at the top of the starred posts.
Oh, and I also starred this:
2 hours ago, by AProgrammer
@sbi The more I learn about it, the less I like SO line of conduct.
 
The user of dubious gender who shall not be named was banned?
 
@sbi Hmm ok. But is it ever bad practice to mask buggy behaviour with exceptions? In Java that discussion is even more vibrant and the consensus is overwhelmingly that exceptions relating to buggy behaviour shouldn’t be handled …
 
@sbi unfortunately there is nothing we can do.... (pun intendend)
 
9:34 AM
until august.
 
sbi
@ChrisBecke Unless you're looking at this from an iPhone, this can't have scrolled off your window yet.
 
@ChrisBecke Xeo, no he/she was not banned
 
I see the link you gave yes.
 
he/she is also a mystery, gender wise
 
Jeff seems fairly sure of the gender.
 
sbi
9:37 AM
@KonradRudolph No matter how good my arguments were that a program that had a bug should crash, the guys and gals over in product management didn't want us to crash, even in the direst of situations. If the app crashes while printing, their arguments went, so abort printing, but let the users save their frigging data.
@ChrisBecke Yes, he seems. And he should have kept his mouth shut about it. It's none of our business which sex some user is.
 
@sbi of course, if it crashed printing, its probably because the data is corrupt such that the user should not save it
 
@sbi oh I have that same problem, "it shouldn't crash" is what management says, however in certain circumstances that's the only sane thing to do
 
sbi
@Tony Did I mention my arguments were good? :)
 
I would also like to know why the account was "suspended for a day", until august.
 
@sbi gone out of my mind or something... lol :) hope you didn't read my last response, totally screwball
@ChrisBecke good point! Since when do days take month's to expire?
 
sbi
9:42 AM
I remember BC4 having that feature where you could save the project when it crashed. That was sometime around '94. It once bit me badly, when the project it saved was totally garbled, overring up my good project file. I told that to the pm people, and their argument was that we then should make sure we don't override the original data.
Whatever I brought up, their response was, essentially, "try harder".
 
@sbi that is fail!
 
sbi
And in a way, they were right, because they were seeing it from a user's perspective, and it's their task to bring the user's persepctive into development. Users don't care whether you've done the best thing you could do in case of an error, if that means their data is lost.
 
@sbi getting a user's perspective when being a developer can be really hard I find, users just don't think as we do.
I guess that's why they are users after all...
 
sbi
@Tony Users don't deserve using out software. They are too stupid.
 
@sbi couldn't have put it anymore bluntly really...
 
9:46 AM
users also have a rosy, if not outright naive view of the world and don't like to be told "everything is fucked. the best thing to do right now is restart as fast as possible to ensure none of this fuckedness gets persisted to disk"
 
sbi
Anyway, I do have work to do now.
 
I have that users issue with some of my family, whom understand nothing techy about a computer, and get frustrated about certain behavior or why certain things are the way they are, but how does one explain it to them without going techy. Remains a challenge
 
@Tony make sure they buy Apple
 
@ChrisBecke LOL, that would prob get them completely starry-eyed as they are now used to windows
 
Gonna leave for a while. This chat is way too distracting lol.
 
9:52 AM
Things to UnLearn when moving from Windows to Apple:
Needing to run AV software.
Needing to confirm elevation when installing software.
Needing to confirm "Update this <Software>" dialogs that adobe, ms, sun, and devious malware authors all pop up.
Needing to know the difference between popups that need to be clicked "ok" and those that should be closed.
Needing to "install" software by any process more complex than dragging the App icon onto the Applications folder.
"Start"
 
Als
@sbi: Today I have all your posts starred :)
 
sbi
10:08 AM
@Als I's in plain view that not all of my posts have been starred, but I'm in a generous mood, so you're back on the list. :)
 
Als
@sbi: haha Gracias :)
 
10:22 AM
Goddammit, Jeff is really starting to bother me
 
Hi.
 
Als
@jalf: What happened?
 
Has anybody noticed that VS2010 compiler sometimes seems to not-export some inline defined member functions even when the class in question is dllexport'd?
 
Als
@wilx: Hello
 
sbi
@jalf What's he done now?
 
10:25 AM
just reading his responses to the tina/model thing
 
sbi
@jalf Where?
 
I pointed out that when "ordinary people" can't see why a user has been suspended, there's virtually no accountabilty, which seems at odds with the philosophy of the site as so-called community-driven
and he makes the stellar point that "moderators can see what other mods did", hence there is accountability
 
sbi
@jalf Where?
 
in the question he linked yours to as a duplicate
26
A: Avoid the Streisand Effect - be clear about the reason when suspending an account

Jeff AtwoodIn general, it is a private matter between the moderators and that particular user. Note that other moderators have access to annotations on the account that will provide more context for the suspension. I believe it is the reponsibility and right of the user who was placed in timed suspension t...

 
Als
@jalf, @sbi: Is it clear at this point of time as to what is the EXACT reason of suspending Tina/Model?
 
sbi
10:28 AM
@jalf Yeah, just found it.
@Als He hinted at 'particularly the part starting with "when users exhibit a pattern of either.." '.
 
@Als not exactly, but Jeff hinted that it was the "makes no effort to learn" section of the suspension rules
 
Als
@sbi, @jalf: Thats not really true is it?...I mean i dont think thats true
 
@Als what, that she made no effort to learn? You have to admit that she spent, what, several weeks asking a wide variety of generally trivial questions, and she wasn't very helpful in figuring out how to resolve them
 
sbi
@jalf What really gets me about this is that we brought Tina to Jeff's attention as a completely tangential matter to some other point, then he steps in and suspends that account, and most of us are now perplexed at what he's done and generelly express the sentiment that this is not what we wanted.
 
@sbi yeah, same
 
10:31 AM
and what would be the point of suspending the account?
 
sbi
@ChrisBecke I suppose we're now not bothered by her anymore.
 
its not like tina was hard to ignore
 
@ChrisBecke in theory, I believe it was originally intended as a slap on the wrist
 
Als
Yes, The persistence which she/he showed to resolve her issue was alteast commendable
 
a warning to hopefully improve your behavior
 
10:32 AM
until august?
 
but I'm having a hard time imagining a 4-month suspension as having any other effect than driving her away
@ChrisBecke exactly. Chalk it up to another case of Jeff following his own rules even after he forgot the rationale behind them
 
Als
It's basically like saying you are not welcome anymore. She hasnt been in here for 4 months till now i believe
Only the account gets suspended or all activity though those IP?
 
It has to be something else though. Other people have been far bigger pains in lounge<c++> coff
 
@Als I'm not sure. But I suspect that if she creates a duplicate account, her IP will probably be banned as well if it isn't already
@ChrisBecke but no one else have been brought to Jeff's attention on meta
 
sbi
Instead of being bothered by Tina's questions (which I sometimes ignored for days when she was too annoying) I'm now increasingly bothered by the way Jeff rules like an absolute monarch about his realm, while all the time still thinking and saying he's following community-set guidelines on a community-driven site.
4
 
Als
10:35 AM
Darn, It means if you get noticed you might get banned!
2
 
@Als hard to interpret it any other way, yeah
which means that commenting on his posts on meta is probably a really bad idea, if you want to keep your account
 
sbi
@Als Yep, I thought exactly the same. That's really bothering me. I grew up in such a system, and I most definitely don't want to be back to this.
 
which is where I'm ahead of the game. My contributions might not be at the level of litb's, but even so I suspect that if I get suspended it's a bigger loss for SO than it is for me.
 
I do feel a bit ive suddenly found myself in a repressive state, like china, or america or something.
 
same goes for @sbi and, well, most of the people in this room
 
sbi
10:38 AM
@jalf Yep. In fact, that's the only reason I haven't replied to his comments today.
@jalf You wish. I have been sent a warning mail already.
 
Als
@jalf: I would agree to that...counting me as exception...if i get banned its only my loss..and probably you guys get saved from my blabber
 
@sbi yeah but so what? What do you lose by getting suspended? You'll gain a lot more free time. SO loses one of its relatively few users who were qualified to answer C++ questions
 
sbi
@ChrisBecke Indeed. (Did I mention I know that feeling?)
 
I know you might prioritize differently, but tbh I just don't care if he suspends me
 
Als
Don't starr my post guys, I might get banned! lol
 
10:41 AM
not saying I'm intentionally going to bait him into doing so, of course, just that I don't want to be intimidated over something so trivial as access to a website
 
@jalf I will be somewhat dissapointed. technically SO seems better than any other programming help forum formats, including newsgroups.
social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums is just a major step backwards 20years
 
sbi
@jalf Which is why they haven't outright banned me. The goal is to make me shut up, not to kill me. But I am pretty sure that, when I get too annoying, Jeff wouldn't even blink. He's said here that he doesn't know much about C++. It's very likely not one of his dearest tags.
 
@ChrisBecke yep. But if I find myself suspended and wanting to ask a question on So, I'll just tweet one of you to post it for me ;)
@sbi all true, but he'll still be hurting his own site most of all
 
sbi
@jalf Which became dear to us, too.
 
expert sex change? no
msdn forums? aweful
 
Als
10:44 AM
But at least the moderators could provide the information as to why a particular user was banned..It's not too much to ask i believe since it is a community forum.
 
comp...c++ etc. only people who know more than me even know where to find that anymore.
 
@sbi myeah, but it won't stay dear to me if I don't like the direction it's headed in
 
sbi
@jalf Well, let me say this: The moment one of you guys gets suspended for openly voicing your opinion, whether I agree with that opinion or not, I will leave this site under vociferous protest for the time you are suspended. If this site feels like a police state, the only way to deal with it is to behave as if you're opposing a police state.
8
 
Hmm, have I missed some dramma?
 
sbi
@wilx Tina got suspended, because I mentioned her as not being the most contributing chat user.
 
Als
10:49 AM
@sbi: But the point is You didnt want her suspended..
Or did you...The big pause raises me that doubt though you already said you did'nt
 
Tina is hot topic... that's my conclusion
@Als as far as I can tell nobody wanted her suspended
that was never the intention
 
Als
Bottomline: Don't bother the Moderators with anything...One might get banned for just coming under scanner
 
sbi
@Als No, I didn't. (I was away from my place, that's why there was so long a pause.) I freely admit that I hoped Alf would come back and be patient with Tina, but that was out of pity as much as out of annoyance.
 
@sbi talking about people dissappearing from here, @DeadMG hasn't been here for ages too :(
 
hmm, I think there's a reasonable chance I might find a warning in my inbox soon... ;)
just left a few more comments on his answer
 

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